OzVMX Forum
Clubroom => Competition => Topic started by: Tossa on August 09, 2013, 07:32:33 pm
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JUST Announced on MA siteMotorcycling Australia (MA) wishes to advise that the ACT Motorcycle Club has withdrawn their bid to host the 2013 Classic Motocross Championship, scheduled for the 2nd and 3rd November 2013.
Applications from clubs to host this championship in 2013 have been re-opened effective immediately and will remain open until Monday 19th August 2013. Please note, that for all clubs wishing to apply the event must be held on the date as originally scheduled.
For further information regarding the cancellation of the event or applications to host this event in 2013 please contact Matt Kearsley on 03 9684 0503.
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It's not April fools is it?....you have to be kidding....how farked are you guy's down there? :(
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http://www.ma.org.au/
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??? maybe lakes NSW can hold it ,better track , second time lucky ???
makes us down here look bad alright davey
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Why !!!
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Rumour mill says the track wouldn't be ready
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I walked the track two mths back needed heaps of work , but herd things were going all good with the track prep ???
someone spat it ???
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Your gotta be kidding me... ???
If thats a true story im embarressed to call myself a New South Welshman. :o
Im over this im moving to Queensland..
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Lakes will never be able to hold it Mick, pardon the pun but I guess the karmagutsa track has Karmagutsa?......you people need to hold your heads in shame. :( We have just run a meeting with a 182 riders and over 500 bikes....what the?....now you know why we have won the State of Origin 8 times.
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Your gotta be kidding me... ???
If thats a true story im embarressed to call myself a New South Welshman. :o
Im over this im moving to Queensland..
Can I come to 8) they get twice the numbers we get ,
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Darwin may have a better chance to run it , than us down south way.
Bloody shame again... Tassie , lakes , now canberra
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Your gotta be kidding me... ???
If thats a true story im embarressed to call myself a New South Welshman. :o
Im over this im moving to Queensland..
Can I come to 8) they get twice the numbers we get ,
Hey Mick you wouldve had an absolute blast on ya TT500 in the open
Pre 78 class last weekend at Conondale.I know i did and i cant wait till next years race.
Not only that but it was an absolute thrill to watch my high school heroes
like Glen bell, James Deakin and the King bros goin for it hammer and tongs. never seen anything like it.
Put it on ya bucket list Mick its a must do before you die....
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DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME WITH ALL THE POO POOING AND GARBAGE NOW, PUT WHATEVER THOUGHTS, EFFORTS AND POSITIVITY YOU CAN MUSTER INTO MOVING HEAVEN N EARTH TO MAKE IT HAPPEN!! READ THE RELEASE, YOU HAVE 10 DAYS TO MAKE IT HAPPEN!! ;)
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I thought it was a piss take when I read the heading, 21013 classic MX Championships cancelled. :'(
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Pissed over here in WA, container arranged deposits paid, working on accommodation and other things, damn going to have to give them theier money back. Anyoine know a good race horse running tomorrow!!
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What date is it? Was there supp Regs out for it?
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no Sup Reg 1-3 Nov.
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no Sup Reg 1-3 Nov.
Thanks
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Can someone go around to Firko's place and make sure he's OK....the poor bugga's Rabbito's are coping a pasting from Melbourne (funny how they cant win a game with Inglis out) and when he reads this he will have a heart attack.....maybe just call an Ambo instead.
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This is bullshit! You southerners have got some serious issues!
Looks like all the titles from now on will be Qld Titles..
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There's also the fact that the Mr Vintage Motocross is history as well after 2 poorly attended meetings.
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There's also the fact that the Mr Vintage Motocross is history as well after 2 poorly attended meetings.
Yep I don't get it, NSW has gone from hero to zero in the VMX scene over the last decade.
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Although I have no active involvement in Vintage MX in Canberra, I was following the progress of the Classic MX titles with interest and was looking forward to attending the evnt (as a helper/spectator, not a competitor). So I am gob-smacked by this outcome - I haven't even heard a hint of this before now.
Here is a press release issued by the club today.
MEDIA RELEASE
ACTMCC Withdraws Bid for
2013 Australian Classic Motocross Championships
The President of the ACT Motorcycle Club, Mr Kevin MacGregor has announced the club has withdrawn its bid to host the 2013 Australian Classic Motocross Championships.
Mr MacGregor said “The ACTMCC has a long and proud history of presenting successful state and national titles. So is with a great deal of regret and careful consideration that the club has reluctantly advised Motorcycling Australia of this decision”
“The ACTMCC has worked closely with Motorcycling Australia to prepare for this event and has undertaken extensive work on the redevelopment of the Kumagutsa circuit, with final preparation of the circuit planned at the end of winter” he said.
Mr Macgregor acknowledged the concerns raised by a few members of the classic motocross community about the preparedness of the Kumagutsa circuit. Mr MacGregor said “this was a little disappointing given the ACTMCC’s successful history, unwavering commitment to rider safety and professional events team”.
Mr Macgregor went on to say “these concerns resulted in Motorcycling Australia being required to provide a higher level of scrutiny than the ACTMCC has previously experienced. This in turn resulted in cost overruns and in this difficult economic climate additional corporate support was unable to be secured to ensure the success of the event”.
“The ACTMCC withdrawal will enable Motorcycling Australia to focus on the remaining bids to host this event. We wish the host club and the event every success” Mr MacGregor added.
Mr MacGregor also thanked the sponsors that had committed to the event and advised the ACTMCC would be in contact to annul their agreements.
Kevin MacGregor
President
Approved for release 9 August 2013.
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Yes pathetic, although I do wonder how much the negativity on this forum influenced the outcome.
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MEDIA RELEASE
ACTMCC Withdraws Bid for
2013 Australian Classic Motocross Championships
Mr Macgregor acknowledged the concerns raised by a few members of the classic motocross community about the preparedness of the Kumagutsa circuit. Mr MacGregor said “this was a little disappointing given the ACTMCC’s successful history, unwavering commitment to rider safety and professional events team”.
Mr Macgregor went on to say “these concerns resulted in Motorcycling Australia being required to provide a higher level of scrutiny than the ACTMCC has previously experienced. This in turn resulted in cost overruns and in this difficult economic climate additional corporate support was unable to be secured to ensure the success of the event”.
Well I think these two paragraphs go a long way to explaining the reasons.
Those that did their best to cast doubt on this event seem to have succeeded. And that would include the crap that was posted on this forum by some.
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If there's problems beyond the track not being ready, I'd say that ACTMCC politics had more influence than these forums.
Apart from anything else, the discussions on OzVMX featured a heavy focus on the suitability of the main MX track - if it was simply about MA being heavy on the Kumagutsa track, the club has an alternative that is certain to satisfy MA.
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If there's problems beyond the track not being ready, I'd say that ACTMCC politics had more influence than these forums.
Apart from anything else, the discussions on OzVMX featured a heavy focus on the suitability of the main MX track - if it was simply about MA being heavy on the Kumagutsa track, the club has an alternative that is certain to satisfy MA.
So Nathan do you think the club should have kept pouring money into Karmagutsa just to have some bitch run to MA and tell them that the track would not be up to holding a title?
Judging by the naysayers on here the second track option would appear to only have a future of undersubscribed classes and cancellation due to lack of numbers.
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Is 3 months enough time to organize another venue.
Were there any other clubs that put in for it ?
Queenslanders do a great job but you need to get over yourselves.
Would love to go to WA, anyone keen over there.
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There must be more to it than this forum.
Why do people get hung up about negative posts before there event? At least people are passionate about, and talking about your event and then it's up to the club to prove them wrong.
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I'm not the least surprised but let's forget the blame game for a while and try and do something positive to get this happening, preferably in NSW. I'm absolutely disgusted right at this moment and embarrassed for my State. As Johnny O said, NSW led the way a decade ago but somewhere along the way the focus was lost. Can HEAVEN run it at Buladelah? Hunter at Barleigh Ranch? Is there a country club with the balls and self belief to have a go?
I feel for the West Aussies right now.
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If there's problems beyond the track not being ready, I'd say that ACTMCC politics had more influence than these forums.
Apart from anything else, the discussions on OzVMX featured a heavy focus on the suitability of the main MX track - if it was simply about MA being heavy on the Kumagutsa track, the club has an alternative that is certain to satisfy MA.
So Nathan do you think the club should have kept pouring money into Karmagutsa just to have some bitch run to MA and tell them that the track would not be up to holding a title?
Judging be the naysayers on here the second track option would appear to only have a future of undersubscribed classes and cancellation due to lack of numbers.
Eric can correct me:
The ACTMCC is basically two clubs in one - the dirt track part and the larger MX part. While they mostly work well together, the CMXNs/the Kumagutsa track have been a source of friction.
I don't know the details (thankfully), but I believe the Kumagutsa track is run by 'the dirt track people', and the 'MX people' were very jittery about the state of the track.
Some of the higher ranking MX people were openly expressing scorn at the "she'll be right" responses they were getting, and I got a clear impression that there were some significant personality clashes.
The club had an escape route (use the main track). That they haven't used it, suggests to me that the problem(s) are more than just about the Kumagutsa track.
I am not an ACTMCC member, and have not been since 2007. The only person involved in this that I know is Ekka, who's been a mate for several years now.
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There's also the fact that the Mr Vintage Motocross is history as well after 2 poorly attended meetings.
Fluck......I missed this first up because I deliberately didn't want to read Joan's jingoistic 'Queenslander' bleatings. I wasn't aware of Mr VMX being canned. I'm so flucking disappointed I feel like taking up drinking again.
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Tomorrow Nat ;) I'm loaded up on the honey in shed cleaning up the vintage bikes to sell the lot of them .gunna get into shooting I think , the first item on the agenda might be a cane toad :)
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Tomorrow Nat ;) I'm loaded up on the honey in shed cleaning up the vintage bikes to sell the lot of them .gunna get into shooting I think , the first item on the agenda might be a cane toad :)
I guess thats one way of solving the problem ::)
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There's also the fact that the Mr Vintage Motocross is history as well after 2 poorly attended meetings.
Fluck......I missed this first up because I deliberately didn't want to read Joan's jingoistic 'Queenslander' bleatings. I wasn't aware of Mr VMX being canned. I'm so flucking disappointed I feel like taking up drinking again.
Mr VMX was never really actually "on" for this year. After speaking with the race secretary for the last two events the club was not interested in running it again but are keen to see another club take it on. Our club considered having a go but because of a serious deficiency in officials etc we decided that we are not ready to have a go at an event of this size just yet.
So if there is anyone out there that would like to see this event continue and has the required resources I'm sure Mr VMX could be resurrected quite easily. It is possible that last year's sponsor is interested in supporting the event again.
So make sure if your in the market for a Mazda head to Maitland and tell them Mr VMX sent ya ;D
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If I'm reading correctly, the demands put on the club by MA was a contributing factor suprize suprize , they almost stopped the Conondale Classic and to me it looks like they got this one, well done Motorcycling Australia, I feel for the club trying to hold the event...
I think MA need to take a real big step back and take a good look at them selves. IMO
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There must be more to it than this forum.
Why do people get hung up about negative posts before there event? At least people are passionate about, and talking about your event and then it's up to the club to prove them wrong.
Agreed Noel, there has got to be more to it that. I'm farking shattered, had it all planned out. Was sponsoring a young male and female riders on my YZ400D and YZ250D respectively (the YZ400D being rebuilt front to back at a cost of close to $5K), recently purchased a CZ400 and CZ250 and was also going to ride my other YZ250D. And I had Popeye helping organise a sidecar to ride as well.
I woke up this morning in a good mood but this has killed the day for me. I am seriously pissed off after their promises that it would be all right. Maybe MA did have a part in it and after hearing (I think) John say that the Conondale Classic was "this close" to not going ahead because of their (MA) involvement, I suspect a fair bit of blame lies there.
Anyway, enough negative BS, let's get on with the job of doing it in QLD. John, Noel, I'm willing, as usual, to be of any assistance I can to help this event occur in QLD this year. Let's just do it.
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How disappointing for us again two failed Nats in one year.
I know the discussion on here would have had nothing to do with this decision from MA and sadly MA and safety at all costs mantra these days will continue to cancel events. The old she will be right on the day stuff doesn't work anymore regardless of how factual it is.Laws regarding who is responsible for certain actions mean that track licensing cant be a casual deal anymore.
If you dont like it put your hand up and become MA board member.
Vote 1 Queensland. You guys have the great venue do you have the will to do it? Calling Col to put on your superman outfit.
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It appears that there is plenty of support in Qld for events but stuffed if I'm travelling up there on a regular basis! I feel a National Championship, to be fair, should be run over two events at opposite ends of the Nation (be it Qld & Vic or WA & NSW), yeh I know, if we can't run one event how the hell are we going to run two ;-)
I am sick to death of MA & MV (can't discuss other state bodies, although things look good in Qld) slowly killing motorcycle sport in this country! I see the thousands that flock to AFL or V8 Supercars, our sport has just not been managed correctly.
I think we need to go back to a post of mine from a couple of weeks ago where I brought up the subject of the AASA motorsport controlling body which is basically Benalla Auto Club (Winton Raceway), the Australian Roadrace Championship, 'Formula Extreme' is run under the AASA banner and Terry Oneil who runs the Championship and gets television broadcasting for all rounds & classes. The MA Roadrace Championship doesn't get air-time!!!
I know the guys at the Winton (Vic) Motocross Club (run under AASA) welcome vintage MX riders/racers, they would prepare their track to suit what ever we wanted, their track is right next to a camp-ground with permenant toilet/showers, which is also right next to Winton roadrace circuit. The Wintn Club has quite a few VMX riders already.
I have been given a name & number of a chap at Benalla Auto Club to speak to regarding MA clubs switching over to AASA, it is Adam on 03 5766 4235. I suggest that vintage mx club Committee members get onto this guy and make things happen.
As President of Mitchell Recreational Motorcycle Club, I have been speaking to a guy called Heath, who is the President of Winton MX Club, he has welcomed our rec club members to their monthly mx ride days and he has said that he will do what ever it takes to make VMX riders happy there.
THE TIME FOR COMPLAINING & BITCHING IS OVER, THOSE THAT CARE ABOUT THE SPORT, LET'S MAKE IT HAPPEN !!!!
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John, thanks for leaving SA out of your future model. Seems were all speculating at the reasons why this has happened, it would be nice to know why from the club involved to try and move forward and prevent it from happening again. Feel for the club as it would of been a painful decision with a lot of stress then and now.
Old saying, organize - dont criticize.
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I'm absolutely disgusted right at this moment and embarrassed for my State.
Why is NSW copping it, its the ACTMCC ,that ain't in NSW,only surrounded by it,Pedantic I know ;)
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I'm absolutely disgusted right at this moment and embarrassed for my State.
Why is NSW copping it, its the ACTMCC ,that ain't in NSW,only surrounded by it,Pedantic I know ;)
I thought the same Smed :-\
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My post seems to have got lost will re post
Why not run VMX on your own?
Get the land (some speedway act makes it hard in NSW?) get third party insurance and organise. MNZ tried to stop us going on our own in NZ, our lawyers quoted laws that stop monopolies and stop fair trade and competition and we never heard from them again.
Small clubs here run non MNZ trailrides and get 800-1,000 bikes turn up, if that was needing a licence and you to be a club member etc you would get 100 bikes
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Seems were all speculating at the reasons why this has happened, it would be nice to know why from the club involved to try and move forward and prevent it from happening again. Feel for the club as it would of been a painful decision with a lot of stress then and now.
Old saying, organize - dont criticize.
Agreed. Whatever happened it obviously wasn't from a lack of entries like the PC Nats because the sup regs weren't even out yet. So obviously a club or club/MA issue.
Whilst many of us would love to know the truth (if anyone from the club is able to comment) I'd rather focus my energies on seeing if we can get the event to go ahead in QLD here. Not for any other reason than this is where I know we can run large events given the opportunity. I'm keen to get involved and would suggest a few of us get together to see if it's possible?
Noel (Sunshine Coast Club)?, Tatey (QVMX)? , Lisa (BMCC)? Anyone else interested?
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John, thanks for leaving SA out of your future model. Seems were all speculating at the reasons why this has happened, it would be nice to know why from the club involved to try and move forward and prevent it from happening again. Feel for the club as it would of been a painful decision with a lot of stress then and now.
Old saying, organize - dont criticize.
Wasn't leaving you out, you were central of all the states, I would think you riders would be the winner in a Nation-wide two round national Championship.
You are correct of course with "organize don't criticize" .... I'm onto it ;-)
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I've been away from the sport as a rider and/or entrant since the 07 Coffs Nats so I was looking towards the Kumagutza event with renewed vigor and enthusiasm. Because my worn out old body prevents me from racing motocross any more I was sponsoring a West Aussie brother and sister on my DT1MX and Boyd and Stellings TM400 and Tony Clarke from Bendigo on my Cheney Yamaha 360 for pre 70 and excitedly looking towards the pit boss role 8).
I'm genuinely disappointed that the meeting has fallen on its arse at the 11th hour and even more disappointed that it seems from what I read on here, that I may have had something to do with the meetings demise as I was one of those evil bastards who dared to question whether the track would come up to scratch. I'll cop it on the chin if my criticism of the track (at the time) was a genuine factor leading up to the demise of the meeting but if the club is looking for scapegoats to blame for their own shortcomings I won't be quite so accepting. At the time I showed concern as the track really was atrocious, and I was one of many that were quietly concerned. I became less worried upon seeing the You Tube vid of the track after some work, I believed then as did everyone else that everything was back on track. How wrong I was. And no, it wasn't me or anyone I know that allegedly dobbed the club in to MA.
I'm going out the shed to get the bikes set up for the DT Nats. It's all we've got left ::).
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why not run it as a state title instead.
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Firko, don't beat yourself up about it, the 3 commissioners all read whats on this forum, they know whats going on and if I remember correctly months ago, people where trying to contact the club for information about the event to no avail and I think that along with peoples worries about the state/condition of the track as to be safe and ready in time is what got the 3 amigo's involved. They would have had to pass MA guidelines anyway so maybe the club decided it was too hard? I don't know?, but for anyone on this forum to blame the forum or any person on it as to the demise of the event is absurd. I think what Nathan said about the club/s fighting (dirt track/MX) may have something to do with it, afterall, last years Dirt Track Nats wasn't a sqeaky clean, no drama's affair and out of respect was kept of this forum.
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maybe the club decided it was too hard? I don't know?, but for anyone on this forum to blame the forum or any person on it as to the demise of the event is absurd. I think what Nathan said about the club/s fighting (dirt track/MX) may have something to do with it
I reckon so. I haven't paid too much attention to the nats but it seems to me the initial reaction to the ridiculous entry fees gave a warning. Obviously MA jump in with glee for any nats (or state titles for that matter) and rape and pillage with additional fees for who knows what ? But it looked as though the club hadn't thought or attempted to secure any outside sponsorship to defray these extra (and no doubt crippling) costs and by golly the riders were gunna pay for the lot. Using the track preparation as a reason is a major cop-out, track guidelines haven't changed and are readily available, and with still a couple of months to go there's plenty of time to knock up a vmx-friendly track anywhere and even hold a small, low-key test event there.
As DC has pointed out, the rattlings on this forum are merely that : something similar happened with the historic roadrace nats at Winton in 2006, the Classic Motorcycling Australia forum burst into flames with all sorts of tales of doom and gloom, hints at skulduggery and threats, but when the meeting came NOTHING happened as a result. To suggest that the forum carries weight with those making decisions and caused them to bail out is fanciful in the extreme. But if it's been caused by an internal rift, I think the club should come clean and publish the real reason.
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Would be great if the heaven club could run it at buladelah ;) top track and heaps of room for camping , great for spectators to watch.
and only 5mins from the town ship of buladelah for motels etc.
One hour north of Newcastle. 8)
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The sooner we get away from MA the better, there are a couple of local clubs up here in South QLD that have done so and they wish they had done it years ago, they are finally more financial, double there membership and entries, improved there facilities beyond anything they could have before, just a pitty more clubs don't do the same.
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No argument here. MA's main threat is that they repeatedly say nobody else will match their insurance : how many have tried to shop around and match or better it ? Presumably only AASA, don't know much about them except they arrived with a hiss and a roar as a proposed saviour, and ended up being mostly Winton-centric. From my dealings with the Ronke crew, I felt it was better left untested, but probably a suit with a clue and some time on his hands might be persuaded to do the exercise : I have always felt MA's insurance threat to be a bluff, and that they relied on motorcycle racers to do what they've always done : not be bothered checking.
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AASA buys their insurance from the same broker in London as CAMS, AMSAG (and presumably MA).
The cost of adequate insurance is hard to avoid, regardless of who you get it through.
In the case of AASA vs CAMS, CAMS is a bloated organisation* with far too many suckling on its teat, and is ridiculously risk-adverse for a motorsport sanctioning body, and an obsession with control. And poor customer service (although they've gotten a lot better in recent times).
For these reasons, it is easy for AASA to offer a superior product to CAMS.
I know lots of people love to hate MA, but MA's sins are far less - presumably this would make MA's product closer to AASA's?
I've had a bit to do with AASA, and have no hesitation in saying that they would be worth a phone call. They tend to say "tell us what you want to do, and we'll tell you how much it will cost", which freaked out those who were used to the CAMS style of "we will tell you what you're allowed to do, and how much it will cost".
*As demonstrated by their incredible ratio of staff:turn-over.
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You are correct of course with "organize don't criticize" .... I'm onto it ;-)
John if there is anything I can do to help, let me know. otherwise good luck :)
I have friends down NE Victoria way (that's where my YZ400 is right now being prepped for this years Classic Nats) and the young male and female riders I was going to introduce to vintage are there as well. I know they are keen and are the sort that would be willing to get involved and help out if needed.
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http://www.ma.org.au/index.php?id=973
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MA is their own insurance company MAIL (Motorcycling Australia Insurance Limited), they are based in the Isle of Man, David White is one of the three Directors, the other two are based in the UK. That's why David White flies to the Isle of Man on MA business.
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Where and when is the MA held AGM? check constitution you must be able to attend
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MA is their own insurance company MAIL (Motorcycling Australia Insurance Limited), they are based in the Isle of Man, David White is one of the three Directors, the other two are based in the UK. That's why David White flies to the Isle of Man on MA business.
Wow I wonder what "week" he goes there??
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Does any one go to AGM and challenge the executive??
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what are the approximate MA costs for a Vintage Nats please?
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Guys,
It is easy for everyone to blame MA, you really need to think before you write on this or any forum, MA have offered to help in any way possible and we have not put any constraints on the club. The track needed a lot of work at the start and to our surprise was told that the track is not licenced and they have not applied to have the track licenced. We sent track guidelines to the club and even though they have undertaken a lot of track work there is still a huge amount of work to go to make the venue comply to regulations. The letter we received from the club is considerably different then the one highlighted on this forum. The track has been let go over many years and although the club has done a lot of works the venue needs a lot more work and money to be able to hold an Australian Championship there in the near future and we thank the club for there honesty with MA and wish the club well and hopefully the club will apply to hold a championship again in the near future.
Now guys lets think logically we want another club to take on this years championship hopefully the same weekend would be good as a lot of people have booked holidays etc. There must be other clubs in NSW that could take on the championships. Please lets lobby our clubs and see if we cant get the 2013 Classic Championships back on track.
Regards
Shane Fraser
Fatboy Racing
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I think reading between the lines (and I have no real insight but being in Canberra am a bit closer to the action) that the problem is a bit of all that we've read.
As Nathan observed, the club is really two clubs in one and the DT side is the one pushing the VMX titles. Now, the Kumagutza track DID need a lot of work but Fred and his team have certainly done the majority of that.
However, there have been concerns expressed and I understand that was raised with MA who (rightly) have looked into the situation. I cannot comment on how that went, but clearly they have raised the bar a little in terms of how much more work was needed, more than the club had anticipated.
I would guess that the cost of that work, given the result will not be a hugely profitable event, is more than the club can bear.
So, it's a little of everything. I always felt that the club had taken on an ambitious job but as Firko notes they were having a good shot at it. Sadly, it hasn't panned out.
So, rather than bag the ACTMCC or MA, the best thing is to move on and see if another club can step up. There's still time.
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The points Fatboy Shane makes raise a lot of questions regarding the Canberra club. The most obvious is....if the track was in such poor condition and unlicensed what possessed them to apply for a Championship meeting using that track? Dear old Blind Fred could see that the track was little better than a poor enduro loop that needed a big infusion of topsoil, grooming,rock removal, irrigation, tree removal, ambulance and official access and much more, adding up to a lot of money. I had a peek at the facility while there for last years Classic Dirt Track Nats and remember my retired from vintage racing mate exclaiming "it'll never happen" upon seeing just a small section of the track in the pissing rain. I argued the old Aussie "she'll be right" but deep down in my gut feelings of fear and doubt were beginning to fester. If as Nathan says there are two factions within the club...the DT faction that proposed Kumagutza as a suitable venue and the reportedly larger Motocross faction that runs the main motocross venue, what the fluck is happening at the club to allow one faction get a 'Pie in the Sky' idea like the Kumagutza bid past the club board or committee? Then, when it all goes pear shaped for them to throw blame at this forum for "stirring up the possum" and whingeing about someone "dobbing them in to MA" is reprehensible. The Canberra club went in blind and over their heads and that has cost our sport more than they'll ever know or care.
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I would have thought that part of the application process for holding a championship event would include the proposed venue having to hold a license for the track from the get go ::)
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and what are the MA fees to run a National event - excluding percentage of riders fees etc - straight up front costs?
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I suspect that the only people that can tell you that would be MA
http://www.ma.org.au/index.php?id=706
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2.5 K Ross for each National, use to be 4.5 K before the split. We (QVMX) are holding the post Classic Nats next year at Echo Valley, Toowoomba around Easter time. There are still a lot of unanswered questions regards the poor attempt by the ACT club.
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While the ACT club bailing on the event is both disappointing and frustrating ( especially for the WA crowd ) digging them out anit gonna change it .
When they applied to run it were there other clubs who were turned down in favour of the ACT club getting it ? and if not why not ?
I would have thought any Vintage club would be honoured to run a nationals and would be queuing up for the rights to run one . If that's not the case then people really need to look at why not. What is putting clubs off applying to run national events ?
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BUMP
I would have thought any Vintage club would be honoured to run a nationals and would be queuing up for the rights to run one . If that's not the case then people really need to look at why not. What is putting clubs off applying to run national events ?
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I don't think "factions" is the best word - makes it sound nastier and more poltical than I think the real situation is (even if it is technically correct).
Ekka is vastly more qualified to comment than I am on the other stuff.
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We ran last years CMX titles at a profit and we had to design a track on land run by MQLD and the track was not licenced when we first applied.
We worked for 12 mths to get every assett of running last years CMX titles correct, how is it now at the 11th hour they are cancelled.
The ACTMCC has been a shit fight between the dirt track and Motocross for ever and I know because I was on the commitee. Why aren't ACT motocross putting there hand up to use the existing MX track. I rode a pre 78 bike on the track before the big changes of late and they just avoided the stutters, the track was fine to ride and table tops are easy on old bikes you just land on top if your too slow.
If the venue was moved back to QLD at Wyaralong again or some other track would the other states support it, I know WA would because they are committed to the titles already, just need to point the truck a bit north.
I want to know who was coming to ACT and would now travel to QLD.
BMCC ran the CMX titles last year with 161 riders and everyone praised the event and track. We should be able to get at least 150 so we can salvage the CMX titles.
Nothing has been decided but its just a thought and would mean my outlay to build a pre 60 bike wont be wasted. ;D
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BUMP
I would have thought any Vintage club would be honoured to run a nationals and would be queuing up for the rights to run one . If that's not the case then people really need to look at why not. What is putting clubs off applying to run national events ?
......costs.......alot of work by volunteers....and little to no profit for the host club
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We ran last years CMX titles at a profit and we had to design a track on land run by MQLD and the track was not licenced when we first applied.
We worked for 12 mths to get every assett of running last years CMX titles correct, how is it now at the 11th hour they are cancelled.
The ACTMCC has been a shit fight between the dirt track and Motocross for ever and I know because I was on the commitee. Why aren't ACT motocross putting there hand up to use the existing MX track. I rode a pre 78 bike on the track before the big changes of late and they just avoided the stutters, the track was fine to ride and table tops are easy on old bikes you just land on top if your too slow.
If the venue was moved back to QLD at Wyaralong again or some other track would the other states support it, I know WA would because they are committed to the titles already, just need to point the truck a bit north.
I want to know who was coming to ACT and would now travel to QLD.
BMCC ran the CMX titles last year with 161 riders and everyone praised the event and track. We should be able to get at least 150 so we can salvage the CMX titles.
Nothing has been decided but its just a thought and would mean my outlay to build a pre 60 bike wont be wasted. ;D
I will come. from SYDNEY
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Barronvmx, i thought last years track was the best vmx track Ive ridden and would not hesitate to come back.[from SA] It would be hard to help from here but would be willing to arrive a few days earlier to help what ever club or venue is chosen. I now its not much but if everyone offers some sort of help we can still have the best CMX nats yet.
Lets move on cos I dont want to have to wait till Pt Augusta SA next year to catch up with everyone.
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When would you look at running the event Barron ?
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The event has to be run on the same date no matter which club runs it as this has been allocated by MA.
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There are some people getting ahead of themselves here.....
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yes I agree, Keep the false promises off here keyboard racers.
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Folks, here is the perspective from WA. Our container is booked but the destination is movable within reason. We have not yet paid for the container that has to be done by the first week in October and depending on the final destination the cost may be more or less. I don't know how many of our guys have paid deposits for accommodation,air fares etc but as far as I am concerned we could point the container in any direction. I spoke to Shane Fraser on Saturday and had bit of a chat. I can assure you all that the commissioners will be working very hard to secure another host club to run the championships and I would like to think that you all will support them as they are there for the sport.
I also suggested that maybe we could assist that club in any way we can for instance it could be possible for us to bring our club's PA system( with the approval of the VMXWA commitee), to cut some costs, for example. I feel that to let this years event fall over could lead to loss of momentum in the the whole nationals thing which obviously would be detrimental to the sport. So come on guys enough MA bashing, leave the ACTMCC guys alone what's happened has happened and no amount of analysis or soul searching is going to solve anything. Let's get positive and get this whole thing back on the tracks.
Yours as always in vintage motocross
Nick Maxfield
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The sooner we get away from MA the better, there are a couple of local clubs up here in South QLD that have done so and they wish they had done it years ago, they are finally more financial, double there membership and entries, improved there facilities beyond anything they could have before, just a pitty more clubs don't do the same.
More info on this?? Who provides the insurance and governing body?
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Please note that my comments are an expression of interest not what is happening nor has the club BMCC discussed this idea.
I just am passionate about the sport and I'm so pissed off with the Canberra out come that I like most want a solution.
Please note that I am no longer BMCC club president and do not decide which direction the club will go.
If any club is willing to take on the CVMX titles I am willing to give my advice and experiance to assist in the 2013 Classic motocross titles.
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Folks, here is the perspective from WA. Our container is booked but the destination is movable within reason. We have not yet paid for the container that has to be done by the first week in October and depending on the final destination the cost may be more or less. I don't know how many of our guys have paid deposits for accommodation, air fares etc but as far as I am concerned we could point the container in any direction. I spoke to Shane Fraser on Saturday and had bit of a chat. I can assure you all that the commissioners will be working very hard to secure another host club to run the championships and I would like to think that you all will support them as they are there for the sport.
I also suggested that maybe we could assist that club in any way we can for instance it could be possible for us to bring our club's PA system( with the approval of the VMXWA commitee), to cut some costs, for example. I feel that to let this years event fall over could lead to loss of momentum in the the whole nationals thing which obviously would be detrimental to the sport. So come on guys enough MA bashing, leave the ACTMCC guys alone what's happened has happened and no amount of analysis or soul searching is going to solve anything. Let's get positive and get this whole thing back on the tracks.
If only we all had the passion and dedication of the West Aussies ::). The Canberra Nats has fallen in a big hole but the Sandgropers are still willing to pitch in to get it happening elsewhere. I'm also prepared to offer any skills I may have to get the 2013 Nats up and running again and I'm sure many of you reading this are willing to do the same. The first and most obvious challenge is to find a suitable venue that fits the criteria. There are a lot of tracks out there and a lot of clubs with the ability to promote a meeting of this magnitude...we just have to think laterally and somehow put paddock A and club B together to get things happening. As I'm not a member of any club I can only speak as an individual and offer up "what if?'' hypothetical alternatives. HEAVEN has their annual Canowindra Cup meeting set down for October 19/20 so would it be feasible for that date and venue to converted to the Nats? Or to maintain the Nats lodged date, keep the Canowindra Cup meeting in place but reuse the venue a fortnight later for the Nats? I fully understand that there are a lot of limitations with the track layout and most probably with its availability but on the plus side the venue has all of the needed facilities and the town has plenty of accommodation. Sometimes compromises offer up far more pleasant results than ever envisioned.
Then there is Buladelah and Barleigh Ranch...both proven tracks that can handle this event. However, I'm being a bit cruel to HEAVEN or any other by throwing this at them, I wouldn't blame them one bit for not wanting to get involved. There's very little to be gained by any club running the Nats, in fact it's very easy for a club to lose money on these events so I'd also propose that if a club does decide to pick up the cancelled date, they get some financial dispensations from MA. It was very easy to type these words but I'm well aware that the reality is a lot harder but the discussion has to start somewhere.
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The first thing you need is money.....get someone to chip in 10-20K and then it's all of a sudden more appealing to a club to take it on......helps take the stress out of "what if we loose money"....end of the day...money talks, bullshit walks...less than 3 months to pull something off is a big ask.
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The first thing you need is money.....get someone to chip in 10-20K and then it's all of a sudden more appealing to a club to take it on......helps take the stress out of "what if we loose money"....end of the day...money talks, bullshit walks...less than 3 months to pull something off is a big ask.
I agree, it's a bit of an ask to expect it to happen but what are we supposed to do, curl up in the fetal position and hope it all fixes itself? We need to at least try and get something happening if just for the self esteem of vintage motocross. The cancellations of both Nats has done serious damage to our sport that's going to take a lot of glue to fix so why not start now rather than expecting it to all fall back into place next year? If we lose the pre 78 momentum we may never get it all back.
On a personal level I'm disappointed for eighty something year old Bill Watson who was coming over from W.A. to race at probably his last Nats. The old fella is a legend and a great old warrior for our sport and deserved a better career send off than this.
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The first thing you need is money.....get someone to chip in 10-20K and then it's all of a sudden more appealing to a club to take it on......helps take the stress out of "what if we loose money"....end of the day...money talks, bullshit walks...less than 3 months to pull something off is a big ask.
It would be great to think that our small part in motor cycling sport meant enough to the powers that be that a state body and MA could work together to finance this show somehow, year in, year out, without the hosting club having to dip into their own finances. I think it's more than enough that the host provides the manpower to make it work.
Even a small gesture like negating all the licensing fees for the club would help. Something. Anything......
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canowindra,pharrrkkkk,firko,it's in the middle of a trotting track,it's a showground ffs,tracks mapped out with20ltr plastic containers full of water connected to 3k's of bunting,& theres no jumps (bonus ;D),the deputy mayor Greg would spin,(but he can walk the talk 8)),the golf club would freak (catering),how about Clarence, up the big hill from sidinee, :P
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Funny you should mention Clarence Matcho.
I'm not far from your thinking. Just up the road a bit further to Oberon.
I don't know if the track still exists but I rode the Amcross series there in 2002. Brilliant fast and flowing track with no big jumps etc. From memory it was around 2.5k's long as well.
Last time I rode at Clarence it had a few doubles in it. I don't like the idea of taking them on on my B50!
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),how about Clarence, up the big hill from sidinee, :
For the reasons that Canowindra is unsuitable because it's so simple, Clarence doesn't cut it because it's a stuttery jumpy dustbowl. Two down, next please ::)
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heavens done clarence twice in the last couple of seasons,it's not bad,(if it don't rain on racedays),the guys groomed it couple times for heaven,ie took the nasties out,ok it can have trackwatering issues,what track hasn't,but it's layouts cool,theres fair bit of camping room,ammenities would be overwhelmed,extra backup portos??,blah blah,just my thoughts, :P
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Lake Glenbawn?
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Lake Glenbawn
There is nothing close for accommodation and you have water problem, It's a bit like why I never thought Coptom dam near Inverell would work as well,
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What about Junee. Not far off the Hume, plenty of hotels and accommodation.
Once again, I rode the Amcross there and they had an awesome undulating grass track on the side of a hill.
Just thinking out aloud....
I'd be willing to help out any way I can from here in Vic with correspondence or the like.
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Oberon is no more. A real shame because it was a fantastic natural terrain motocross track and would have been an awesome venue for Pre '78's.
Firko's right Clarence is a totally unsuitable due to the serious lack of water and track layout. BTW try and hire it today and you'll suddenly think MA's fees are cheap in comparison ::)
Lake Glenbawn is currently in a million pieces as it undergoes a complete rebuild.
Which leaves us with???
Canberra - On the Motocross track. Already in place. People who have booked transport/accommodation etc are already going there and it can be easily modified to suit vintage bikes. Just need to get KTM555 on the bobcat ;D The question mark is whether the motocross side of ACTMCC is interested in bailing out the Nats or possibly can another club be found to run the event there?
Other possibilities include and this includes some long shots;
Mt Kembla - Great Track possibly a bit too modern for the old bikes
Lakes - Great Track and can be used successfully for vintage bikes as HEAVEN has proved numerous times. Also has a club that can get the job done and is as keen as anyone to promote national events at their track.
Appin - National level motocross track that is well and truly doable for Pre '78's
Picton - Can only be used a couple of times a year and is probably not an option but it would be so great to ride
Mt Lambie - Don't even know if it still able to be used. But a great track and close to Lithgow for accom etc.
Panorama - I reckon this would be a good track to look at too and is right in Bathurst. Not sure if there are taxis racing there at this time of year though!
Anyway just some thoughts.
I am of course willing to assist any way I can to get the Nats going again.
Cheers
Shaun
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Mt Panorama is a great, forgotten venue but the last time I took a look at it was pretty much washed away and neglected. A pre 75 meeting was held there in around 1992 and even though it was pretty challenging it was a success. We (Penrith club) tried to get MacArthur club to rent us Appin for a meeting back in the 90's but ran into (now long forgotten) obstacles. It's a great track and was recently used for a round of the Aussie MX championships (I think).
I don't think Mt Lambie exists any more, Mt Kembla has been altered too much from when it was used for VMX in the 90's, The Lakes would be great but do you think they're over the Post Classic shemozzle? Picton is a red tape nightmare to the point that Heffo had to even placate the local churches by not starting racing until they'd finished their services.
This whole shitfight can be alleviated if the Canberra Nats moved over to the other 'modern' track. As Shaun and others have previously said, it's a great track that can easily be modified to be a little kinder to limited suspension bikes. Is it worth approaching the club to ask if that option is within their realm of possibilities?
.........Any more?
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Forget about Lakes you can't camp there. And if you think camping is not an issue, remember Lakes was cancelled due to lack of interest/entries and we just had 180 riders at the Conondale Classic and EVERYBODY camped there. It is a definate factor in getting people to come!!
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Canberra - On the Motocross track. Already in place. People who have booked transport/accommodation etc are already going there and it can be easily modified to suit vintage bikes. Just need to get KTM555 on the bobcat ;D The question mark is whether the motocross side of ACTMCC is interested in bailing out the Nats or possibly can another club be found to run the event there?
Cheers
Shaun
I like this idea and it might be achievable in the short time left?
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The main track at Canberra is the obvious answer.
There's a lot of dirt at the venue, that could be used to soften the upramps of the bigger jumps, without wrecking the track for the club - just put the dirt down, wear it in, then take it away again after the CMXNs. You could even put plastic down on the existing upramps I you thought it was worthwhile.
Is Buladelah off people's lists for a reason?
The Cooma, Young, Holbrook, Leeton and Wagga clubs all have land available for grasstrack MX - could be an option!?
Cooma's modern MX track is ugly - a much less appealing option than the main track at Canberra.
Don't know off the top of my head if the other clubs have established MX tracks.
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I wondering if Broadford would be an option, with all the facilities there, down in Mexican country.
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Broadford with camping?
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They camp there for HBBB
They also held the nats there a few years ago
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Broadford with camping?
Broadford is full of camps ;) Oh you mean somewhere too erect a tent
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Still needs a host club.
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I understand what you mean, the thing about Broadford is it's already set up. I don't know the cost of use etc, but at least half the work is done , so to speak. It was just a thought
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Not really.. the Nats that were held there previously... had a "host club".. but really Drakie was doing the leg work... perhaps MA could pitch in and help out in this hour..??
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Not really.. the Nats that were held there previously... had a "host club".. but really Drakie was doing the leg work... perhaps MA could pitch in and help out in this hour..??
I wondering if that is just a pie in the sky thought and MA will just say, stiff bickies, not our problem, no money in it for us
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When the Nat's were held at Broadford, my roadrace club 'Preston' was the host club, that's how I got roped into doing the commentary.
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Okay I've spoken to the President of Winton MX Club, he is very (very) happy to run a vintage event which can be advertised as a National Championship. They are happy to prepare the track how ever we like it, they also have the machinery & staff to upkeep the track during the event if needed.
I will speak to the top guy at Benalla Auto Club (the owners of Winton MX & roadrace track) tomorrow about them taking it on, the President of the club thinks he will jump at it.
Winton has all the facilities to be able to make this happen, they have a fantastic camp-ground with permanent toilets & showers. Being at the north of Victoria trims a few hours off any track further south and has the chance of better weather.
I've also spoken to two committee members from different MV affiliated clubs (that shall remain nameless) that are happy to assist.
Stay tuned :-)
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Jeez John, you're right on to it. Good on you mate.
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Thanks for your efforts so far John, love ya work.
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Good going John If you need a Flagy for the weekend give me a yell
can go from wed/ thursday if you need me .
The Stig
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The Winton President also said that they could be ready by the November date.
I will confirm race licence requirements, I feel there could be a way that AASA insurance cover may also cover MA licence holders, I think I rode at a Formula Extreme (AASA) roadrace with an MA licence.
If all this comes together, I will need some guidance from those that have run vintage events in the past, to confirm things like: what classes, length of races, scrutineering & stuff.
I will have more info once I have spoken to the guys at AASA.
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Thanks for your efforts to date John, like many others I have organised annual leave around the November dates and have been shattered by the announced cancellation. Fingers crossed things can fall into place with Winton .
Regards Terry.
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Winton would be the place to be, as I suggest to you john in another post, the Classic scramble club may help with guidance to run at winton, our club is also looking at other insurance.
worth a phone call to the CSC Secretary which is Ross Martin. on 0416 132 150.
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Good work John. A few of us have been chucking around possibilities while you've actually achieved a possible result. It'd be worth running it past the commission though just to make sure it's possible from an official standpoint and that there's no repercussions over AASA involvement. I know MA aren't exactly the flavour of the month but whether we like it or not they still have the say on whatever happens. If this comes off we as a sport really have to support this event if only to show our solidarity and appreciation to those involved for pulling the event out of the shit........But, let's not jump ahead. There's a lot of work to do yet.
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confirm things like: what classes, length of races, scrutineering & stuff.
have a chat to Col Metcher. supersenior on here. :D
pm sent
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Good on you guys!! A positive "can do" attitude is emerging in VMX land. Keep up the energy and let's hope for a viable outcome. Us West Aussies really want to come and race. We are many miles away but if we can assist in any way just ask. If we have room in the container I am prepared to offer my bobcat for track prep work and guess what. It's a pre 80 model!!!
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Has any one asked MA all these questions?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
as shareholders you would have to be answered!!!!!!
Any one looked at the constitution?????
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Thanks for everyone's input. I know Ross Martin, he is a nice guy and fair but he is still part of MA, I think anyone from the MA side of things (state bodies) will be totally against any of this, I think they do not have any legal way of stopping this snowball effect but they will see their danger in losing control & money and would try and discredit us and use scare tactics.
I do not want to hurt MA or any of the state bodies, I just want justice for riders everywhere. I have tried going down the correct channels but what is needed is solidarity from all members, maybe it might be easier now with improved communication via email, Facebook & forums?
I will get legal advise and as much information as I can find to be sure we are doing the right thing.
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Great Work John,
I'll catch you at CD10 mate, but if you need any help on the weekend, i'll stick my hand up for a corner etc!
Best of luck, I hope this gets sorted!
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Thanks for everyone's input. I know Ross Martin, he is a nice guy and fair but he is still part of MA, I think anyone from the MA side of things (state bodies) will be totally against any of this, I think they do not have any legal way of stopping this snowball effect but they will see their danger in losing control & money and would try and discredit us and use scare tactics.
I do not want to hurt MA or any of the state bodies, I just want justice for riders everywhere. I have tried going down the correct channels but what is needed is solidarity from all members, maybe it might be easier now with improved communication via email, Facebook & forums?
I will get legal advise and as much information as I can find to be sure we are doing the right thing.
I recall black race meetings back in the day and as a rider I believed you were risking our Racing license if MA (or ACU as it was back then I think) found out.
Is that potentially the case here John or have I got that all wrong? Is what you are proposing going to have MA approval or will it operate outside MA auspices?
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I use to think that also but I have since found out that is not the case. I have just spoken to one of the top guys at AASA (Adam Ronke), legally MA cannot stop you from riding at a AASA event, he was saying that CAMS tried to call their bluff a couple of years ago, they went to court and AASA won. CAMS or MA cannot restrict riders in what correctly organized & insured events that riders want to compete at.
Plus, to black-ban any riders would be to lose thousands of dollars from entries & licences, so they may try and call your bluff but no way would they shrink an already dwindling rider base.
Adam also advised that he is very happy to run a vintage event at Winton on November 2 & 3 and that he will allow Winton Motocross Club to control it and he will supply the insurance via AASA. He said that just as per the Formula Extreme roadrace championship events, riders are cool to ride with their MA licence.
Winton have a huge car event coming up in two weeks, I will sit down with Heath the President of Winton MX Club and we will put together guidelines for the Nov 2/3 event then sit down with Adam after his big car event.
I will start a new thread for this event for everyone to be able to see how it's coming together.
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Awesome, thanks for the comprehensive response John :)
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MA used to frown upon outside organizations running events and used to threaten banning riders but I’m pretty sure restriction of trade practices stops them doing it these days. (I guess John just confirmed that)
Things to consider…
It was an official Australian title event that just got canned.
WA have good large meetings & Qld. has just had the Conondale Classic but they are not something that inspire people to travel, mostly due to cost & time off work.
NSW seems to have trouble with entrants for their Mr VMX meetings
Anyone can put an event on and it will most likely be a good event but will interstaters travel for a non title meeting? (assuming AASA can’t give official status to the event??)
May as well call it a world title like the US does with their events.
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May as well call it a world title like the US does with their events.
Agreed, even though we won't invite the rest of the world to play, we should definately call it the world title :)
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If nobody else runs a 2013 Australian Classic Motocross Championship and the event is called the '2013 Australian Classic Motocross Championship' ..... it is the 2013 Australian Classic Motocross Championship.
Of course MA will frown on it, it's taking a slice of their small miss-managed pie.
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Sorry but it would not be the official Australian Classic Motocross Championship.
The last thing I would like to see is our section of the sport split in two as has happened with Road Race and Sidecars. It ultimately will make VMX weaker.
Go ahead and run your AASA event but please don't try and pass it off as an Aussie title meeting.
I actually like the idea of calling it the World Championship of VMX. The rest of the world can be invited it is up to them to show up ;D
Cheers
Shaun
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It will not be the official MA Championship, it will be the official AASA Championship. It is a one-off event, I do not see a split of riders, I just see one event filling-in for one that got cancelled.
And it's not my AASA event, I'll probably be too busy working to ride it, I am working for this event for you guys.
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Excellent work John , your passion and drive are amazing . Wishing you every sucsess with this venture regardless of what you call it . If there is no alternative event i cant see why you cant call it the Australian classic motocross championships .
I can see Shauns point but the MA way doesnt seem to be to user or club friendly and i dont imagine MA have a patent on the name .
The world champs sounds great too , i would imagine you would get a few from this side of the water if we dont have to jump through the MA / MNZ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ trap :)
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I'll put it to all involved, if we call it the World Classic Champs, we might no get anyone from OS for this year but if they run another next year it could be fun.
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It will not be the official MA Championship, it will be the official AASA Championship. It is a one-off event, I do not see a split of riders, I just see one event filling-in for one that got cancelled.
That's why you might as well call it the world championship. As it would not be recognised by any governing body as a title event it doesn't really matter what you call it. I am not trying to have a go at you just trying to add a bit of perspective.
As Firko has said the original nats was a big club day and was a great success. I personally can't see the problem with reverting to that format. And I also want to add my congratulations on your commitment to get something done for the good of our sport.
Cheers
Shaun
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Thanks for everyone's input. I know Ross Martin, he is a nice guy and fair but he is still part of MA, I think anyone from the MA side of things (state bodies) will be totally against any of this, I think they do not have any legal way of stopping this snowball effect but they will see their danger in losing control & money and would try and discredit us and use scare tactics.
I do not want to hurt MA or any of the state bodies, I just want justice for riders everywhere. I have tried going down the correct channels but what is needed is solidarity from all members, maybe it might be easier now with improved communication via email, Facebook & forums?
I will get legal advise and as much information as I can find to be sure we are doing the right thing.
[/quote]
Hi John, Ross Martin has retired from MA mate, he just the Secretary for the CSC. so he is worth a call we are also looking into new insurance for the club and memebers. cheers dave.[/color]
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Sorry but it would not be the official Australian Classic Motocross Championship.
The last thing I would like to see is our section of the sport split in two as has happened with Road Race and Sidecars. It ultimately will make VMX weaker.
Go ahead and run your AASA event but please don't try and pass it off as an Aussie title meeting.
I actually like the idea of calling it the World Championship of VMX. The rest of the world can be invited it is up to them to show up ;D
The very first Nats at Dargle in 1992 was run as a big Penrith Club day and that meeting is looked upon by those who raced as being the first Australian Classic Motocross Championships. The same thing occurred a few years later with the West Wyalong Classic Dirt Track Aussie Championships, it wasn't ratified by MA as a championship but nobody gave a toss. History still accepts that event as the first one, just like its motocross brother at Dargle. That's why we named the first event the Vintage Motocross Nationals or Vintage Nats....as opposed to the Classic Motocross Australian Championships. The generic Vintage Nats name has stuck as an unofficial alternative name for 20 years.
I think that if the Winton meeting comes off most of those who race there will regard the event as a proper title even if it is by proxy. Peer respect is way more important to most riders than their name on a list at MA HQ but I accept that there are those who feel that official MA status is important. The worry I have with all of this is any threat of repercussions from MA preventing racers from entering and the West Aussie contingent losing interest because some among them may balk at the costs and effort involved to race an unofficial title.
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If MA don't have name patented you can call it what you like.Has any one asked MA for answers,seen balance sheet to see where money is spent? Checked the constitution?
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Sorry but it would not be the official Australian Classic Motocross Championship.
The last thing I would like to see is our section of the sport split in two as has happened with Road Race and Sidecars. It ultimately will make VMX weaker.
Go ahead and run your AASA event but please don't try and pass it off as an Aussie title meeting.
I actually like the idea of calling it the World Championship of VMX. The rest of the world can be invited it is up to them to show up ;D
The very first Nats at Dargle in 1992 was run as a big Penrith Club day and that meeting is looked upon by those who raced as being the first Australian Classic Motocross Championships. The same thing occurred a few years later with the West Wyalong Classic Dirt Track Aussie Championships, it wasn't ratified by MA as a championship but nobody gave a toss. History still accepts that event as the first one, just like its motocross brother at Dargle. That's why we named the first event the Vintage Motocross Nationals or Vintage Nats....as opposed to the Classic Motocross Australian Championships. The generic Vintage Nats name has stuck as an unofficial alternative name for 20 years.
I think that if the Winton meeting comes off most of those who race there will regard the event as a proper title even if it is by proxy. Peer respect is way more important to most riders than their name on a list at MA HQ but I accept that there are those who feel that official MA status is important. The worry I have with all of this is any threat of repercussions from MA preventing racers from entering and the West Aussie contingent losing interest because some among them may balk at the costs and effort involved to race an unofficial title.
Why not just call it the Universe Classic Motocross Championships, it would have just as much significants. By continuing down this track all that it means is if someone is still trying to get the official Australian Classic Motocross Championships up and running again they may now decided otherwise. Why can't it be run at Winton under MA sanctioning. And please don't tell me that can't occur. The V8s are running there very soon and that isn't a AASA meeting.
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I've been out in the shed working on my bikes and giving this as lot of thought. As much as I want to see the 2013 Championship happen, I now think that the Winton option comes loaded with too many negatives. The first and what I consider the most important is the potential to divide our sport into pro and anti MA factions that can only cause problems down the line. In my earlier post I stated that the Winton idea was sound but that was the little man in me crying out for something-anything to happen. The other little man in me is wary of the AASA, probably with no good reason, but whether I'm right or wrong the doubt is there and I wonder how many others harbour those same doubts. Another thing that's been bothering me is the West Aussies coming all this way for a meeting without 'proper' championship status. OK, while the first Nats in both VMX and VDT were both big club day unofficial meetings, they were still MA sanctioned events which added a lot of brownie points as far as "championship" status. The Western Australians deserve some respect by presenting them with a Championship that comes with official MA status. I know that some of you are thinking "why go to so much effort just for a few entries from the other side of the island"? but those of you who've witnessed how much they've contributed to this meeting over the last couple of decades will know that the meeting's very success hangs off their being in attendance....it's that important. This event needs every bloody entry it can scrape up and it's a sad fact that a fair percentage of riders won't support the event because of its non MA status.
So, as much as I admire the Johnny O's rabid enthusiasm and ability to get things moving, I think the move to an AASA event at Winton is destined to fail which is detrimental to the sport and unfair on John for the work that he'd no doubt put into it. I personally think the best option is to do whatever needs to be done to use the main track at Canberra whether it be convincing the ACT club to run it or what I think is a better option, another club hiring the track and working in with MA over a reduced licence fee....seeing that they've kept a portion of the ACT fee.
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So, as much as I admire the Johnny O's rabid enthusiasm and ability to get things moving, I think the move to an AASA event at Winton is destined to fail which is detrimental to the sport and unfair on John for the work that he'd no doubt put into it. I personally think the best option is to do whatever needs to be done to use the main track at Canberra whether it be convincing the ACT club to run it or what I think is a better option, another club hiring the track and working in with MA over a reduced licence fee....seeing that they've kept a portion of the ACT fee.
I am wary about wading too far into this debate as I am conscious of the efforts of those involved (and differing opinions) but it is with absolutely all due respect for what Johnny O is trying to achieve for us, not him, but for us, I have to agree with Firko on this point. I want to see the Classic Champs go ahead but really only as an official MA sanctioned event. That is why, a few pages back, I supported the option of running the event on the existing Canberra track. If we can get the club to agree to that approach, surely it would be beneficial to all involved? And surely then Johnny O could ride in the event instead of organise it and miss out on all the fun :)
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There are Pro’s and Con’s with any decision but trying to get the ACT club to still run the event is clutching at straws.
Don’t you think that if they were really that interested in running these nationals they would have turned to ‘plan B’ by themselves??
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Hey I don't want to step on anyone's toes, if another club is interested in running something please let me know and I'll stop what I am doing.
I don't think anything could be worked-out with regards running an MA sanctioned event at Winton, sure V8's might not be running under AASA but we can't compare V8's to classic mx.
With regards the WA guys coming over, if they are all booked to come, and are happy to come even if the event is not an MA Championship, I don't see any issues?
Sure thing call it a 'National', if there isn't an Australian Championship run in 2013 then this will be looked back on it as it I think.
There is not much time left of this year for any club or MA to make something happen, sure hope someone can prove me wrong. I appreciate Winton MX Club, AASA & Winton Motor Raceway agreeing to do something with no notice.
I agree that having two series running at the same time splits the rider fields and is not good for the sport, just as the Australian Superbike Championships do, but having a one-off National event will not be splitting anything, we just get to have a fun event with interstate riders that we wouldn't have been able to have.
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There are Pro’s and Con’s with any decision but trying to get the ACT club to still run the event is clutching at straws.
Don’t you think that if they were really that interested in running these nationals they would have turned to ‘plan B’ by themselves??
Good point Geoff, but with their initial enthusiasm, I wonder if they even considered it? I haven't seen anything from the ACT club yet, is it worth a call?
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or what I think is a better option, another club hiring the track and working in with MA over a reduced licence fee....seeing that they've kept a portion of the ACT fee.
As I wrote earlier.
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Hey I don't want to step on anyone's toes, if another club is interested in running something please let me know and I'll stop what I am doing.
I don't think anything could be worked-out with regards running an MA sanctioned event at Winton, sure V8's might not be running under AASA but we can't compare V8's to classic mx.
With regards the WA guys coming over, if they are all booked to come, and are happy to come even if the event is not an MA Championship, I don't see any issues?
Sure thing call it a 'National', if there isn't an Australian Championship run in 2013 then this will be looked back on it as it I think.
There is not much time left of this year for any club or MA to make something happen, sure hope someone can prove me wrong. I appreciate Winton MX Club, AASA & Winton Motor Raceway agreeing to do something with no notice.
I agree that having two series running at the same time splits the rider fields and is not good for the sport, just as the Australian Superbike Championships do, but having a one-off National event will not be splitting anything, we just get to have a fun event with interstate riders that we wouldn't have been able to have.
John I am certain that most of us can see you are only trying to help our sport. From what I have seen of your posts and your involvement, that has always been the case. Full credit to you for that.
In the interests of full disclosure and not doing anything behind anyones back, here's what I have done this afternoon:
1. Called a member of the ACT MCC and discussed the issues. An interesting conversation but not one that will be repeated here. I'm a nobody in relation to this matter (worse .. I'm a bloody Queenslander but ex Vic so not all bad :)) He told me what he thought were the issues. I asked if they had considered swapping to the modern track and making some changes. He thought this would be achievable and would speak with his club President about that option.
2. I then called Matt Kearsley from MA (the right person to talk to apparently) and asked him if he thought that would be okay to do. Matt was very helpful and said he would call the ACTMCC club president and see if that was a viable option.
Early days but after speaking with these two parties, both of which seem to want the event to go ahead and seem to want to help, I have got my hopes up that we might yet meet in Sunny Canberra.
Anyway, I have to tear off now to another meeting but I hope this is okay with you Johnny O. Like I said, full respect for what you are doing but I just had to try something.
Cheers
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That's cool, thanks. I guess I'll put AASA & Winton Club on the back-burner and we'll see if something can be organized between MA & the ACT club, I hope they can work something out.
The guys at AASA & Winton have been fantastic, I might look at doing something with them in the future, that way we all get to see what sort of show they can put on and we can gain confidence in them.
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As suggested earlier John maybe Mr VMX might be an option. Itwould be great to see it continue.
Cheers
Shaun
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Can someone enlighten me on the Mr VMX event ... classes, time of year, one or two days? I'll discuss it with the guys at Winton and make it happen :-)
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I love to see MR VMX event go ahead this year. IMO a perfect event for John to test Winton with. Has a degree of prestige and it can be marketed.
If such a event was held I would do what I can to get bums at the start line.
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Can someone enlighten me on the Mr VMX event ... classes, time of year, one or two days? I'll discuss it with the guys at Winton and make it happen :-)
There's threads from the previous two years, but in a nutshell:
Pre-75,
Pre-80,
Pre-85,
Pre-90.
No riders under 30, races are all-age-in, but two age groups are scored seperately based on the median age of the riders.
Four races, back-to-back with minimal time between the two.
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Can someone enlighten me on the Mr VMX event ... classes, time of year, one or two days? I'll discuss it with the guys at Winton and make it happen :-)
There's threads from the previous two years, but in a nutshell:
Pre-75,
Pre-80,
Pre-85,
Pre-90.
No riders under 30, races are all-age-in, but two age groups are scored seperately based on the median age of the riders.
Four races, back-to-back with minimal time between the two.
Either pre 80 was changed to evo or evo was also included as another class.
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Can someone enlighten me on the Mr VMX event ... classes, time of year, one or two days? I'll discuss it with the guys at Winton and make it happen :-)
There's threads from the previous two years, but in a nutshell:
Pre-75,
Pre-80,
Pre-85,
Pre-90.
No riders under 30, races are all-age-in, but two age groups are scored seperately based on the median age of the riders.
Four races, back-to-back with minimal time between the two.
Either pre 80 was changed to evo or evo was also included as another class.
Gee just what we need a meeting with different classes, what wrong with
Pre 75
Pre 78
Evo
Pre 85
Pre 90
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First Mr VMX in 2011 was Pre75, Pre80, Pre85 & Pre90
2012 was Pre75, Pre80, EVO Pre85 & Pre90. The reason for the addition of EVO was that in 2011 the Pre85 class was over subscribed.
No class was near full grids in 2012. The meeting has merit and is a great event. The 2012 entry was lower than 2011.
The reason for the 'odd' classes was to try and give a different spin on the classes with traditionally large entries classes. That is not a judgement that it was good or bad just the thinking behind it.
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QUOTE
First Mr VMX in 2011 was Pre75, Pre80, Pre85 & Pre90
UNQUOTE
Aren't we getting away from the CVMX by going up to pre90 again? And surely there must be an inclusion for pre65 and pre70. Alot of our elder statesman will be turned away if these two classes are not included.
Johhny O has put in alot of effort to get something viable happening and at the 11th hour he gets shot down in flames because some here think it necessary to have MA involved just to have a "sanctioned" title. Who gives a toss if your name appears in a book of MA's or not? As has been stated, all the brethren will know who is champion. And with the miracle of the internet, the results will be on line for the rest of time. It will be part of VMX's history forever more.
The way I see it, MA has done very little, if anything, to work on a way to get the show happening. ACTMCC has done nothing to offer an alternative either, well, without prodding from Simo. Without trying to lay blame on anyone, they dropped the ball the first time.
I'm no expert when it comes to the legalities of running a so called "black event", but surely we as a stand alone sport (VMX) can chose to ride where we like. As long as there is some type of licencing and insurance in place, everybody should be happy. I can't see MA threatening to take away existing licences. Who would be left to ride at any of their sanctioned events if they started revoking licences?
The Classic Scramble Club has offered to help (as far as Dave#6 is concerned) and with Ross Martin now resigned from MA, his help would be invaluable. He has helped run races all over the world and should pretty much know the ins and outs of what is required.
We don't have much time left to get this organised and as far as I see it, Winton MCC was good to go. There were no "if's or maybe's, Johnny O just needed some help to dot the I's and cross the T's.
Now we are back to square one and left uncertain as to whether or not ATCMCC and MA can get their collective act together in time.
I'm with Johnny O......
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Johhny O has put in alot of effort to get something viable happening and at the 11th hour he gets shot down in flames because some here think it necessary to have MA involved just to have a "sanctioned" title. Who gives a toss if your name appears in a book of MA's or not? As has been stated, all the brethren will know who is champion. And with the miracle of the internet, the results will be on line for the rest of time. It will be part of VMX's history forever more.
The way I see it, MA has done very little, if anything, to work on a way to get the show happening. ACTMCC has done nothing to offer an alternative either, well, without prodding from Simo. Without trying to lay blame on anyone, they dropped the ball the first time.
We don't have much time left to get this organised and as far as I see it, Winton MCC was good to go. There were no "if's or maybe's, Johnny O just needed some help to dot the I's and cross the T's.
Now we are back to square one and left uncertain as to whether or not ATCMCC and MA can get their collective act together in time.
I'm with Johnny O......
Sorry to selectively quote you TBM but I just wanted to focus on a couple of your very valid points.
I agree entierly that Johnny O has done a great job on our behalf and give him full credit for that. I am not trying to undermine anything he is doing in any way and have PM's him personally to discuss that in the interests of being completely open and up front.
I must admit that I too share your concerns and am worried that MA and ACT MCC won't be able to come to a resolution and we're left with nothing. Subsequently it was not my intention for Johnny O to cease all work on an alternative solution, maybe slow down a bit for a few days, but not cease work altogether and yes I'm aware that time is limited. I'm only one voice and as mentioned before an absolute nobody in this sport.
I'm not concerned by titles or championship names or trophies or even who wins or not, my only concern is that I can see a rift developing in our sport and I firmly believe that can be detrimental to our sport in the long term. We might not see it today, this week, this month or this year but in years to come, I think history has proven that break-away series do not do anything to help the sport and just split people and their passion.
I don't think any of us know the full story behind MA or ACT MCC in this instance and I'm not going to guess why or what happened. I'm also not interested in blaming anyone, I just want to do what I can to see if we can remain as a united sport, run under one set of rules across this country for as long as that is possible. Who knows what the future holds but I will follow up with the person I spoke to at ATC MCC and provide as much feedback as I can to keep as many people aware of the situation and more importantly keep Johnny O's option B alive as long as we can.
Thanks
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Johhny O has put in alot of effort to get something viable happening and at the 11th hour he gets shot down in flames because some here think it necessary to have MA involved just to have a "sanctioned" title. Who gives a toss if your name appears in a book of MA's or not? As has been stated, all the brethren will know who is champion. And with the miracle of the internet, the results will be on line for the rest of time. It will be part of VMX's history forever more.
Nobody's shooting Johnny down in flames, what he's done is great and it shows he's a 'get it done' kind of bloke. However my opposition to the Winton proposal rests purely on its ability to attract the biggest field possible. While I'm hardly MA's biggest fan, I simply feel that to attract the most potential entries official championship status needs to be in place. I know that goes against things I've written earlier but what John's advocating is a far different scenario than the 'big club day' I spoke of. There's a lot of activity going on behind the scenes right now so lets relax for a couple of days and see what eventuates. If the Nats does go ahead in its original MA Championship form, it's not all doom and gloom on the work that John's done. The idea put forward on here to reignite the Mr VMX meeting to Winton with AASA sanction might just turn out to be a great idea.......Let's calm down a little and see what comes out of negotiations elsewhere.
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Considering we have a forum member called "Johnny O", can we avoid confusion and not refer to "John Orchard" as Johnny O? Please?
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I really like what John Orchard has done. If we were sure that there was not going to be any form of MA-sanctioned CMXNs this year, I would be mega enthusiastic about it.
The big worry is that an MA event will get up and we will end up with a conflict, the the detriment of both events - while there's still the possibility of an MA CMXN event getting up this year, the Winton event can't/shouldn't be locked in.
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MA will NOT act against riders who ride in non-MA-sanctioned events. That crap died in the 80s, and they're not stupid enough to try to pick at that scab at any time... The fact that its at Winton makes a sure thing even surer.
Similarly, there's no issue with the event being called the "2013 Australian Classic MX Championship" (or any of the dozens of variations you could come up will, including using the word "vintage" like was all do anyhow).
While I'd be deadset against two competing title meetings, even if there ended up being an AASA title and an MA title, neither will have the right to declare their event to be THE title. You'd end up with the "MA CMX Championship" and the "AASA CMX Championship".
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Considering we have a forum member called "Johnny O", can we avoid confusion and not refer to "John Orchard" as Johnny O? Please?
You are correct, my bad. Sorry :)
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I believe that the nominations are reopened to the end of the week for the Nats so lets see what comes of that first as if other clubs are looking at taking it on they would need this time for commitee meetings etc to take place for a club to decide and put forward there interest. I know time is running out but hopefully this has stirred up a few clubs enthusiasm to host an MA sanctioned event.
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AASA.. 10 pages to look through.
Who are they,for those us who dont know ?
cheers
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Alternative insurance broker, basically.
The actual insurance comes from the same source as CAMS, AMSAG (and almost certainly MA).
They are generally much happier for event organisers to make their own decisions, rather than get so caught up in their own sense of self importance.
They also tend to be cheaper, because their staff go on far fewer junkets, and are much less interested in swanning around in nifty blazers at the GP (that's a dig at CAMS - I don't know if MA is blighted with the same nonsense).
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Johhny O has put in alot of effort to get something viable happening and at the 11th hour he gets shot down in flames because some here think it necessary to have MA involved just to have a "sanctioned" title. Who gives a toss if your name appears in a book of MA's or not?
I wasn’t trying to shoot John down in flames, just stating what people need to know. Some response’s here gave the impression they thought the AASA would be running the event for MA.
As for who gives a toss about going into the record books, well that is something everyone has to answer for themselves.
There are a lot of guys that will travel for a National title event but not that many that will travel for a glorified club day and if the glorified club day fails to attract the best from all states then the winners won’t be viewed upon as true champions.
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Hey Guys,
won`t make you guys feel any better, but just wanted to share
from our website
Lakes seriously tried to make something of the poorly supported Australian Womens MX Championships for 2013
The announcement that we were to run this event, as a club, was made by MA on the 26th March this Year
On the 17th of August, IEG announced that they would be hosting the Australian Womens SX Championships the week prior to our date.
Lakes MBC fully support the promotion of Womens SX as well as MX, however cannot envisage this happening on consecutive weekends.
As MA have not yet replied to our emails, we assume this is another case of the Private Promoter taking priority over Affiliated Clubs.
Looks like Lakes Members may be treated to an additional ride day, run as a Club Day under Competition permit (gate starts)
Rob
0438 512183
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QUOTE
Considering we have a forum member called "Johnny O", can we avoid confusion and not refer to "John Orchard" as Johnny O? Please?
UNQUOTE
My apologies to both Johns and anybody else I may have confused.
I realised the era as soon as I posted my blurb but by then it was too late.
Cheers,
Mark
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Easy mistake to make, my roadrace nickname is Johnny O, I use to test bikes for Trail & Track in the mid 80's as Johnny O and used Johnny O as my mx nickname back then and my Facebook name is Johnny Oh (coz they wouldn't let me have a single letter surname).
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Okay so I have an update. After (foolishly) stepping into this issue by making a few telephone calls earlier this week to a ACTMCC club representative and to Matt Kearnsley from MA, I did commit to following those up and make any updates public to the forum.
I spoke with a representative from ACT MCC yesterday and then followed that up with a call to MA rep Matt Keansley to confirm the story. Both of these gentlement advised that the 2013 Classic Nats originally scheduled for the ACT track are definately not going to go ahead in Canberra.
I can't say much more except that the window for other clubs to put their hand up has not closed and I don't believe it will do so until this Friday. I suspect we will hear more of this by the end of the week.
So I guess that leaves us waiting until the end of the week or early next week to hear of a possible alternative club and venue. I just hope it's closer to QLD and not further away ;) ;D
So at the end of the day, I will publicy apologise to John for getting involved where I probably wasn't welcome. My intentions were not to look a gift horse in the mouth and stop him from organising what could be the only saviour for the cancelled ACT meeting. Rather they were well intentioned in that I was keen to not see our sport split and was equally keen to continue having our premier events run under MA Auspices. So to John and they people he was working with (on our behalf) I say Sorry.
At the end of the day I just hope that the 2013 Classic National event does go ahead.
Regards
Craig
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Thanks Craig, I welcome your input and efforts to find out all the facts. I will keep communicating with Winton MX Club and will meet with them to start laying-down some plans for running a VMX event. If MA and another affiliated club get their act (pardon the pun ... ACT? lol) together then I will help Winton run another event in the future.
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I will keep communicating with Winton MX Club and will meet with them to start laying-down some plans for running a VMX event. If MA and another affiliated club get their act (pardon the pun ... ACT? lol) together then I will help Winton run another event in the future.
100% John, if this is the outcome of your search on venues ..What a cracker !! 8) you've found another VMX friendly venue for future events...well done to you !!
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Considering we have a forum member called "Johnny O", can we avoid confusion and not refer to "John Orchard" as Johnny O? Please?
Yes there are 2 of us, a few years back when I picked my user name the only other JohnnyO I knew of was 80's US motocross star Johnny O'mara and he didn't use this forum so no worries I thought... Anyway I think everyone on here now knows who' who...
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So who at MA gave the Nats to ACTMCC in the first place?
Surely they asked "OK What track is it on" " We will just come have a look and see if it is acceptable before we grant permission"
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the 2 johnnies :o
is it "o" johnny or johnny "o"
Ive never been so confused :D
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So who at MA gave the Nats to ACTMCC in the first place?
Surely they asked "OK What track is it on" " We will just come have a look and see if it is acceptable before we grant permission"
To be fair to everyone, I think that when the approval was given to use the Kumagutsa track, it was on the reasonable understanding that there was time to bring it up to scratch.
From there, I think the expectations of the relevant parties began to seperate.
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I think these events are let over 12 months in advance. If so are we to assume that no MA representative has bothered to enquire about the venue progress in just on twelve months and then giving only 5 business days for someone else to stump up. Unfuknbelievable.
With sound business practices like that I will tell the wife not to expect too much from MA if I drop dead at a meeting.
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I think everyone should cool it.
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After months building bikes and arranging accommodation, time off work etc,are you suggesting I just wait till Tuesday to hear it is not going to be run.
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Have faith in the VMX community, there a hardy lot. :)
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Unless you have something positive to contribute , that's what I'm suggesting. A lot of work is going on ( off this forum) to retrieve this unfortunate situationand the position should become clearer in the next few days. None of us want to see this year's Nats fall over.
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I contribute plenty.
It makes me angry putting on a bike show to encourage people to the sport just so they can see our governing body fall arse over head. The bloke that let these titles has to be accountable. Full stop.
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I contribute plenty.
It makes me angry putting on a bike show to encourage people to the sport just so they can see our governing body fall arse over head. The bloke that let these titles has to be accountable. Full stop.
+ 1
To true Ted
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+2
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Ted,
your out of line and have no idea what your on about; who the hell do you think you are attempting to lay blame. All the governing body does is allocate the event then its up to a club to run it. The governing body approved the application that was correctly made by a member club of good standing. The Commission stood behind the club.
The club couldnt pull it together; its a bummer but they couldnt make it happen. If you had any clue what it takes, what work goes in, the crap that you have to put up with you would be a lot less ignorant.
I feel for the club.
Dave Tanner
I contribute plenty.
It makes me angry putting on a bike show to encourage people to the sport just so they can see our governing body fall arse over head. The bloke that let these titles has to be accountable. Full stop.
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Im with you Dave and Col.
Ill say again, don't criticize - organize or if you haven't got something nice to say, don't say anything at all.
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just this once Dave, I'm going to agree with you.
and supersenior50, acctually, I agree with Col quite a bit 8)
Cheers Worms
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I'm with the 3 T's....Troy, Trev and Tanner.
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Mr Tanner,
You state that all the governing body does is allocate the event. Well that they did.
They allocated it to a club with no track. Was there a feasibility report done to determine whether this track could be built?
You also state I have no idea what it takes or what work goes in. No I have never built a MX track. But like I said 2 months ago, unless you have the full resources of Abi Group this track was never going to be built.
I also feel for the club. They always give us a great track ( main track ) to ride on. At least they had a crack at it.
I stand behind what I said. The governing body should not of allocated the event without guaranteeing its survival.
Respectfully
Ted Brack
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Throwing the blame game in at this time helps nobody. Lets help get the event up and running again and stop blaming good people for others bad decisions.
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Throwing the blame game in at this time helps nobody. Lets help get the event up and running again and stop blaming good people for others bad decisions.
Amen.
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Seriously there must only be a slim chance of these titles going ahead now, I've never seen a club hold a championship with so little time to prepare..
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Seriously there must only be a slim chance of these titles going ahead now, I've never seen a club hold a championship with so little time to prepare
Maybe John but there's a lot of backroom work going on to try and save this thing. We need to hold on and give them our support. I've got my thoughts on the 'blame game' but now is not the right time to point fingers. Let's see what comes out over the weekend.
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On that note we'll shut it off till Monday.
Late Sunday.