Author Topic: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread  (Read 91690 times)

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Curly3

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #120 on: March 18, 2013, 11:23:24 am »
From what I've heard a lot of the top riders run trials tyres front and back on their modern 450's at Temora, doubt there'll be anything at the Classic titles putting out more ponies than one of them.
Please don't shoot me I'm just the messenger and trying to talk the meeting up for the sake of the sport.
We shouldn't forget that there are a lot of guy's in our sport that haven't been involved in DT for very long and all this talk about track surfaces and tyre choices and ambulances being called if you get it wrong might discourage a few from entering this event.
I should point out again that I won't be riding this year but I will be there for sure.

Offline firko

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #121 on: March 18, 2013, 11:24:10 am »
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Am I not entitled to my opinion??
Of course you are and so am I. I'm merely stating mine without insulting anyone, that's the difference.
Cemoto, I presume your rant was aimed at me so I'll reply. I think you miss my point about restriction. If MoMs told me that I had to run with trials tyres only I'd gladly go with the flow but they don't and flat track tyres have been a part of our sport for 30 years so why the big deal? This is an Australian Championship and whether you like it or not, money doesn't come into it. It's a contest to see who can win with 1: their available talent and 2: on the bike they've developed using the legally available technology and the bike owners skills at setting up the bike. I get a little pissed off at being called a cheque book restorer, for one I've never had a cheque acount and 2: I do all of the work on my bikes myself except some machining, only because I don't have a lathe or mill. You don't know my financial or social circumstances other than the fact that I'm a self funded retiree....nobody pays me, government or business. I do it with the money I worked my arse off for 50 years to get enough to take early retirement, so don't throw that rich boy, cheque book bullshit at me buckaroo. You are obviously not up to speed in the process here. I/we are discussing this situation before the GCR's are written up. Saying that Ultimately the final should decision should be with the steward of the course" is just pain wrong and not in his table of duties. You say that not everyone has the cash to get rid of their Chen Shins is very true but it's been true since the day two motorcycles decided to race each other around a paddock. Back about 15 years ago I was using a daggy old Dunlop trials tyre and a 10 year old Carlisle 19" on front because I couldn't afford a Michelin, I ran 20 year old shocks on the bike because that's what I had but I didn't whinge about the blokes up ahead of me using Michelins, Dunlop K190's or Goodyear S/Ts and the latese Works or Ohlins shocks, I just raced for the sake of racing, not caring one iota what the rich blokes were doing. ...I was buying my motocross tyres second hand off the local bike shops modern race bike team FFS. My whole argument is about choice and nothing to do with safety, or cheque books.

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The thing i cannot understand is we are unable to run classes yet we can have support classes ,as for the age groups ,what a joke that is ,there is never enough entered to have a race always canned or combined . Lets get it back to the way it used to be .
I couldn't agree more, the split was a much needed commodity in Vintage Motocross but due to lower entry levels and slightly different class structure it's not neededin DT at this stage. Some folks on here are confused in thinking that clubs are forced to split the divisions but that's not the fact at all. If they want to run everything from pre 60 through to pre 90 it's their perogative.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2013, 11:30:44 am by firko »
'68 Yamaha DT1 enduro, '69 Yamaha 'DT1 from Hell' '69 DT1'Dunger from Hell, '69 Cheney Yamaha 360, 70 Maico 350 (2 off), '68 Hindall Ducati 250, Hindall RT2MX, Hindall YZ250a , Cycle Factory RT2MX flat tracker, Yamaha 1T250J, Maico 250 trials, '71, Boyd and Stellings TM400, Shell OW72,750 Yamaha

Offline gdr

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #122 on: March 18, 2013, 11:32:45 am »
So why are the clubs that put their hand up leave it to the last minute to tell us that thay are only running classic . Looks like another year with no Nats for Evo ect .
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Offline firko

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #123 on: March 18, 2013, 11:42:23 am »
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From what I've heard a lot of the top riders run trials tyres front and back on their modern 450's at Temora, doubt there'll be anything at the Classic titles putting out more ponies than one of them.
Please don't shoot me I'm just the messenger and trying to talk the meeting up for the sake of the sport.
We shouldn't forget that there are a lot of guy's in our sport that haven't been involved in DT for very long and all this talk about track surfaces and tyre choices and ambulances being called if you get it wrong might discourage a few from entering this event.
I should point out again that I won't be riding this year but I will be there for sure.
I won't be racing either Steve but my bikes will be there with a couple of mates aboard. Your point about the modern 450's and their tyre choice differs from Grasy's (The modern bikes all run wet slicks (the top few) ) I differ about nothing putting out more ponies than the 450's too. I know for sure that Jim will want to race his new Yetman Triumph and that big mother would be punting 65 HP, I'd like to think my 70hp 750 Yamaha Shell would be finished and might enter it......I could go on with further examples, when ridden aggressively, trials tyres don't last three laps on those bikes. Even Jonesy's Black Betty needed a tyre change half way through the program at Wagga. My little 250/360 flat trackers will undoubtedly work fine with trials tyres but my argument is (as well as freedom of choice issues) that some bikes will eat up those tyres pretty smartly.

How long would a Michelin trials tyre last on a 2V Jawa slider? Not very long I'd imagine. I know they won't be forced to use them but I'm using it as an example of how the big trackers might eat 'em up.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2013, 12:01:57 pm by firko »
'68 Yamaha DT1 enduro, '69 Yamaha 'DT1 from Hell' '69 DT1'Dunger from Hell, '69 Cheney Yamaha 360, 70 Maico 350 (2 off), '68 Hindall Ducati 250, Hindall RT2MX, Hindall YZ250a , Cycle Factory RT2MX flat tracker, Yamaha 1T250J, Maico 250 trials, '71, Boyd and Stellings TM400, Shell OW72,750 Yamaha

Offline Grasy 6

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #124 on: March 18, 2013, 09:08:28 pm »
This is why the club puts in sup regs you have to confrom by them not the GCR's  A club has the right to submite a submission to MA to host an Aust Title Coist of aboout $ 2400.00 (it takes about 2 months out of our life to run these events, GMSC has hosted  two NSW Classic Titles  & two Aust Classic Titles as pre our submissions, I did the paper work) When the submission is approved whinge all you want but it will not change . As I have stated before most of the people whom do the raniting do not even ride .Have a good look at the forum comments I think I can see 4 riders whom have a comment the rest are just bike collectors. I only have 22 myself but I do ride them LOL. See u riders not Collectors at Temora.

Offline gdr

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #125 on: March 18, 2013, 09:19:19 pm »
Bit hard to go Grasy when there is no class .
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Curly3

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #126 on: March 18, 2013, 09:33:17 pm »
Try 3k a permit Dave, try to run both and it's 6, then there's the around $60 ea rider ins levy.
I'm not gunna FFFF around anymore, these are the cards we've been dealt.
My personal opinion is that the " Classic " side of the coin is in the box seat, we now, finally have a format set in stone instead of it changing every year, let's promote it and make it work.
Any club even remotely thinking of taking on the " Classic " titles from now on will know exactly what they're taking on.
" Post Classic " will however be changing classes until MA decide to introduce a " Post Modernest " event, how many of us will still be involved then? Hopefully all of us.
Here's a novel idea, let's make the most of what we've got, time to move on.

Curly3

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #127 on: March 18, 2013, 09:38:52 pm »
GDR, don't take this the wrong way but would your home track be interested in holding the post classics?
We do need to spread the word wider than just NSW & QLD.
My opinion is that the split was inevitable, it just happened to be last year.
Was it handled correctly, not at all but we've now got it.
Home track advantage. ;)

Offline gdr

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #128 on: March 18, 2013, 09:57:49 pm »
Steve we only have Broadford ,I think it is to to late once again to have a club put their hand up now .
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Offline firko

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #129 on: March 18, 2013, 10:11:02 pm »
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This is why the club puts in sup regs you have to confrom by them not the GCR's  A club has the right to submite a submission to MA to host an Aust Title Coist of aboout $ 2400.00 (it takes about 2 months out of our life to run these events, GMSC has hosted  two NSW Classic Titles  & two Aust Classic Titles as pre our submissions, I did the paper work) When the submission is approved whinge all you want but it will not change . As I have stated before most of the people whom do the raniting do not even ride .Have a good look at the forum comments I think I can see 4 riders whom have a comment the rest are just bike collectors. I only have 22 myself but I do ride them LOL. See u riders not Collectors at Temora.

Jeez Grasy that's a bit harsh mate, I've been in the vintage side of this sport for 24 years, as a rider, promoter, national level scrutineer, bike entrant and yes...collector*. I've kept my argument civil and insulted nobody but now I'm being criticised by Cemotobull for being a cheque book racer (whatever that is) and you for being a collector as if that's something evil. I'd have thought that seeing I wrote the original rules for classic dirt track, ran the very first meetings for both classic motocross and dirt track and promoting the sport through the media since 1988 would give me some right to have an opinion. Even though I disagree with the reasons for the decision, I'll abide with it and run trials tyres because I don't believe it's worth creating bad blood over this. I'm not the only person to disagree with this decision by the way, There is quite an underswell of discontent but it's just that I'm one of only a few willing to make my objections public and not whinge behind the toilet block ;).

*I stopped racing in 2000 for purely medical reasons but have still stayed involved in the sport when most others who stop racing are never seen again. I'm intending to ride a few club days this year to see if my arthritis can handle it again. Maybe then I might get some cred as a 'racer' and be seen as something more than just a 'collector' :-\.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2013, 10:14:30 pm by firko »
'68 Yamaha DT1 enduro, '69 Yamaha 'DT1 from Hell' '69 DT1'Dunger from Hell, '69 Cheney Yamaha 360, 70 Maico 350 (2 off), '68 Hindall Ducati 250, Hindall RT2MX, Hindall YZ250a , Cycle Factory RT2MX flat tracker, Yamaha 1T250J, Maico 250 trials, '71, Boyd and Stellings TM400, Shell OW72,750 Yamaha

Offline jimg1au

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #130 on: March 19, 2013, 06:25:25 am »
had a good talk with grassy last night now i understand the trials tyre idea.its a classic aust championship so it should have classic lines. not a bunch of guys on 17s with wet weather slicks.its the speed factor yes slicks are the best for hard packed oil tracks. everyone with trials front and back will be fair but you need to have much less air. the track is hard so most bikes wont be sliding in corners anyway.grassy tells me he has more tyre ware at nepean than at temora so thats good enough for me.now to find some 19 trials tyres for the front of my champion. a tip how many people who are going have ridden a trail bike on the road with knobbies. it will be the same feeling at temora riding with knobbies on the front
jim
i have changed my thoughts now to be onboard with the idea of trials tyres

Offline firko

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #131 on: March 19, 2013, 10:02:47 am »
So do I have to change my front tyre as well? And who mentioned 17" wheels?  I thought we were discussing 19''. If it was 17" we were discussing I'd be in total agreement.
No more argument from me, I've tried to make my point but I'll accept what comes. Ironically I've got two new Mitas tyres ready to go, what do I have to run on the front now? Is my newly donated K180 Dunlop disallowed?
« Last Edit: March 19, 2013, 10:49:27 am by firko »
'68 Yamaha DT1 enduro, '69 Yamaha 'DT1 from Hell' '69 DT1'Dunger from Hell, '69 Cheney Yamaha 360, 70 Maico 350 (2 off), '68 Hindall Ducati 250, Hindall RT2MX, Hindall YZ250a , Cycle Factory RT2MX flat tracker, Yamaha 1T250J, Maico 250 trials, '71, Boyd and Stellings TM400, Shell OW72,750 Yamaha

Offline JAP 454

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #132 on: March 19, 2013, 10:53:06 am »
Who mentioned 17" wet weather slicks being allowed ? not me or Firko. the point was that tyres similar to  K70s should be allowed, nothing more and if they're not classic tyres I don't know what is !!
Me last word, have a good time at Temora
Foss

Offline gdr

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #133 on: March 19, 2013, 11:27:23 am »
If you got the bike ,just go and enjoy yourself Foss
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Offline JAP 454

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Re: 2013 Classic Dirt Track Champs - Main Thread
« Reply #134 on: March 19, 2013, 11:42:45 am »
Naah, mate, thanks for the thought, but I'm retired from racing, like Firko, on medical grounds. I was gunna put a young bloke on my two bikes, now there's no class for the Slider and I'm not gunna put him out there on the Glenn Gall bike with a tyre that won't suit that bike on that surface, in my opinion.
Disappointed is how I feel,
Foss