OzVMX Forum
Clubroom => General Discussion => Topic started by: magoo on May 08, 2009, 08:59:21 pm
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Been talking to a few of my Northern and Southern buddies over the last couple of weeks and I can't help but ask, what are we doing wrong in N.S.W. as far as entries are concerned? Viper and QVMX are regularly getting well over the 100 rider mark at regular club days, where here in N.S.W. we're lucky to get half that.
I've got a couple of theories, the main one being flaggies. In N.S.W. we can't get any local volunteers to flag where the Viccos and Qld guys just ride without having to worry about flagging, therefore having a smooth flow through the meetings. I also think that our focus on the older bikes who don't support the club by turning up is an issue. QVMX last week with 35 PRE "85 250s ( that's right, 250s only) and 20 pre '90's must be food for thought.
Whadda you guys reckon
P.S. This is not an attack on anyone or any club, just trying to constructively bring on some debate, new ideas.
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pre 85 and pre 90 definately generates alot of interst from guys in there late 20's and above. Its the era where for some of us, we have our first memories and they are easier to obtain a bike to enjoy this form of fun, less stress and cheaper form of racing 8)
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One could ask what areas we wish to increase/encourage and how do we do this?
What can the club do to encourage or advertise to the classes you wish to fill thus increasing attendance and filling the start gates.
Damn fine example is marks notion of a 100cc shitter class. it gets guys into the sport for nothing and a bit of fun.
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Magoo could it be that NSW is still recovering from the bullshit and bitching within that hurt the club a few years ago. Also Qld has 5 tracks within 1 and a half hours of Brisbane, what's the situation in NSW?
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One thing that I don't like about Heaven events is the stupid closed pits set-up, where your bike(s) are parked away from your vehicle & tools etc. I travelled a long way to go to two Crawford River Classics (& won't be doing it again) and was told that it was an M.A requirement to have a closed pits . How come then they don't seem to worry about this at vintage events in other States of Australia ? Just seemed to be more rule nazis in NSW . But a lack of quality vintage friendly tracks close to Sydney is probably the main reason for lack of numbers .
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I've got a couple of theories, the main one being flaggies.
Get the guys on there 100cc involved.
cheers
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Whats a "closed pits" Hang on we have a "closed pits" at Conondale for the Nats but it's only the 3mts behind the start line. The rest is car park.
Noel
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One thing that I don't like about Heaven events is the stupid closed pits set-up, where your bike(s) are parked away from your vehicle & tools etc. I travelled a long way to go to two Crawford River Classics (& won't be doing it again) and was told that it was an M.A requirement to have a closed pits . How come then they don't seem to worry about this at vintage events in other States of Australia ? Just seemed to be more rule nazis in NSW . But a lack of quality vintage friendly tracks close to Sydney is probably the main reason for lack of numbers .
Whats a "closed pits" Hang on we have a "closed pits" at Conondale for the Nats but it's only the 3mts behind the start line. The rest is car park.
Noel
Mixed disciplines,using mixed tracks -is there any pre85 or pre75 or pre80 tracks only ???
cheers
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One thing that I don't like about Heaven events is the stupid closed pits set-up, where your bike(s) are parked away from your vehicle & tools etc. I travelled a long way to go to two Crawford River Classics (& won't be doing it again) and was told that it was an M.A requirement to have a closed pits . How come then they don't seem to worry about this at vintage events in other States of Australia ? Just seemed to be more rule nazis in NSW . But a lack of quality vintage friendly tracks close to Sydney is probably the main reason for lack of numbers .
CRC is an open (or at least Multi-Club) event, meaning that the closed pits nonsense does apply.
As NSR3 suggested, there are ways around that. Definitely seemed to be the way last year's CRC worked.
On Magoo's original question, I think that JohnnyO nailed it. Heaven was hurt by the 'events' of a few years back*, and there are still a lot of people holding a grudge against the club despite the changes that have occured since.
The flagging thing doesn't worry me. Yeah, I guess I'd prefer to not have to think about it on race day - but I can also see the big picture so I'm always prepared to go out and do my bit. I'd be surprised if people stayed at home because of this?!
The point about 'supporting older bikes' is an interesting point that I need more time to think about.
My 'shooting from the hip' response is to wonder how the club could move away from the older bikes without causing an almighty shit-storm from the owners of those bikes that do turn up (myself included). I'm strongly in favour of the club running a pre-90 class and I'd definitely enter it if the option was there... But if I had to chose between racing my pre-70 bike or my pre-90 bike, then the older bike would be my preference.
I'll stop typing and start thinking now. :D
*I wasn't around for that, thank god - but I can still see it.
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Sorry i was talking moden nats. Not going there for VMXNats.
??? ???
Noel
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Is there more than one club other than Heaven or are they the predominant pre85 class's etc club in NSW. ???
cheers
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Heaven was hurt by the 'events' of a few years back
what happened?
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Maggo come back and face the onslaught ;D
cheers
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Is there more than one club other than Heaven or are they the predominant pre85 class's etc club in NSW. ???
cheers
They're basically the only club that runs VMX events in NSW.
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Is This Just One More PUMP UP To stir the Pot
Nsw Is Doing all wright. .
I Hate It when People Bag a CLUB from WHAT HAD HAPPEN IN THE PAST !!!!!!!!!!
So leave it in the Past Please .
At the time it may have been the best that thay could have done and Just Because Some One Did NOT Like somethink ..
Or it did not go the way thay want it....
thay get upset and go on and on Bagging it whit out check to see if thing have change or not .
Some time thing are that way for the fairess for all club members !!!!!!!!
or it may just be the best thay can do with HELP thay get at the Time ...
MA NSW is Much Harder on thing than any other Sate and Mr Magoo you should know
this as you are on the the Board of MA NSW ???????
and you can not compair QVMX , BMCC or Viper to Heaven .
You can not even compair Viper to BMCC
or QVMX to BMCC thay are all diffrent !!!!!!!!!
Why is Other Clubs so Concerned with Heaven Mr Magoo !!!!!!!!!!!
and Why has other clubs Copyed some of the thing that Heaven are Doing !!!!.
If Some one Has a Fault with Heaven You can E mail Me
I would Love to Talk to them .
Because thay must be diffent people to what I have been Talking too.
Or are thay the People who Sit down in the shade and
DONT PUT ther Hand Up to HELP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dennis Myers
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G'day all
I rode 8 Heaven events last year and had a great time every one was friendly and helpful
If you want to ride and have fun come along . there are MA rules to follow at any meeting.
if every one helps out flaging etc the meeting runs well every one has fun ,if you sit there and winge/expect every thing to be done for you events like these will not happen?
I raced at Nowra last year with 150+ entries the meeting was stopped half way through to get more people to flag with people/parents sitin around reading books & complaning about the stopage?
YOU ONLY GET OUT OF SPORT?LIFE WHAT YOU PUT IN
get out and enjoy the ride
Cheers
DG 26 ::)
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Distance between events definitey has a efect on numbers . not much any club can do about that?
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I've been around VMX since 1986 and have a reasonable idea of what the sport is about.
The reason VMX hasn't progressed in NSW as much as it has in Victoria and Queensland is that there's too many gunnas and whingers and not enough doers and positive thinkers. If I had 10 bob for every great idea that "will change vintage motocross for ever" that wasn't followed up by the instigator moving quickly into the background, waiting for someone else to do the hard yards, I'd be living in Point Piper and playing polo with Jaimie Packer.
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I said from the outset that this was / is not an attack on anyone or club and i stand by that. One problem is the inability of people to differentiate between constructive debate and criticism. It has been a habit of people to attack anyone who asks a legitimate question to shut them down. Again, I'm not having a go at anyone.
I am aware Dennis that it is way more difficult to run meetings in NSW partly due to the Speedway act and having to deal with the Department of Sport and Recreation. Also lack of tracks, though Dargle and Oran Park (yes, it's still open)are close by Sydney. Flaggies is another issue which I touched on before. There are 2 clubs running vintage only meeting with Penrith and Heaven and Manly did a couple of Vinduros last year as well so it's unfair to start attacking one club, or any club for that matter.
Back to my original question, why, well over 120 riders at the first Viper meeting, 130 riders at Coles Creek, which I might add is a fair drive from Brisbane and other than the CRC, any normal club day wind up with 60 or 70. And it is fair to a degree to compare clubs / States as we are supplying exactly the same product with different results. Why?
As for the closed pit thing Mark, they dropped it a couple of years ago. I followed up on the ruling and the fact is it is NOT an MNSW / MA ruling but one that can be put in place by the Steward on the day if he sees fit.
And Firko, once again, you're 100% right, again.
P.S. I just noticed your angry emoticons Dennis, don't get angry with me for asking a question, and yes, I'm on the Classic Commission in NSW so I do my bit as we all should in another way. And you are right when you say there are people who sit in the shade whinging and doing nothing, there always has been and always will be.
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Your right Mark
To many idea's men , blowhards or gunna's or what ever you wish to call them. Always moaning about numbers , MA this , flaggy that , this tracks to rough , this jumps to high ,its to dusty , its to muddy . back stabbing their clubs / officials , talking up their unlimited abilities at every possible chance etc etc , yet never making a positive contribution to their club or sport.
Lack of quality facilities is probably major contributing factor.
It is what it is , so get used to it .
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Just on the flaggies question, I notice the QVMX events usually employ the local SES unit.
I'm sure they pay/donate for these people but there's no lack of numbers.
Is that part of the problem - relying on volunteers to do the flagging?
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Shit, I've been put in my place. I'll get used to it and shut up from now on. Sorry.
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I dunno, I think it's a fair question.
My take - I don't think it's due to the history of HEAVEN (and this thread wasn't meant as having a go at HEAVEN) nor to the whingers/gunnas/not doers.
Victoria has several vintage clubs who hold regular race meetings all over the central/southern part of the state. You could be assured of a ride most months at one of these clubs and there's a good chance that a race will be on near your home. Qld is similar in that it has two clubs in the SE with several tracks from the Sunshine Coast to the border. Again, there's a good chance there's a race near you. Even Coles Creek, 1.5 hours drive from Brisbane, has the benefit of being slap bang in the middle of an area that was a real part of the dirtbike scene in the 70s/80s. I'll bet you that the demographic of riders at a Coles Creek round is different to a Tambourine round.
NSW however has only a couple of tracks in regular use - Canberra and Bulahdelah. We do have Clarence too. Canberra and Clarence are modern tracks and I think that doesn't help. I know I am not that keen on riding my 75 RM125 around those tracks. I can do it, and I have fun, but I do look longingly at the photos from VCM, QVMX and BMCC.
Equally, these couple of tracks aren't really well situated. Bulahdelah is a long drive for south coast, Canberra or Snowy Mountains area riders. Canberra is better for those, but then it's a fair haul for Sydney and north coast riders.
I know some of those events are two days, but I am not sure that really helps as it's not always easy for people to get two days off regularly to go to a dirtbike race. I can barely do that for an event here in Canberra.
So, my opinion? Tracks too far away from the majority of riders, tracks that don't suit the majority of riders. I reckon that if a club held a good natural terrain grasstrack twice a year at a track within 1.5 hours of Sydney on either the Canberra or South Coast side, made it a one day event on a Sunday, and guaranteed the riders plenty of rides, and then got out there and promoted it, you'd get a lot more turn up. I wonder how a vintage event at Coopers Gully would go, for example.
As for HEAVEN, to some extent I think that 60-70 riders might be about it for now. I would like to see a greater effort to promote HEAVEN as a club - to that extent a more personal touch on the website, more regular website updates and maybe a newsletter would all help. But I am conscious it's hard to find people to do those things.
PS: By the way, I just thought I'd go on record and say that having ridden vintage events in both Qld and NSW, and also having attended several Classic Dirts, I think the HEAVEN events are as good as any, so I don't think Dennis need feel that this thread is knocking all the great work put in by the club. Magoo's question was more about what is needed to get more riders to whatever vintage events are on around this way.
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Heres my twenty cents...
Up until two years ago I was a semi regular NSW Heaven member and I raced in events from around 2000-2007 before returning back to NZ.
Therefore I am not afraid of retribution from some of the usual suspects,which is why when this topic comes up, most NSW racers stay quiet for fear of revenge and or persecution....face it boys you know thats fact.
I personally think that the issues halting NSW VMX relate to the folowing:
1)Geograhical barriers i.e. Lake Glenbawn is a good 5 hour drive from Sydney.
2)Bad Blood;a lot of real good buggars quit the sport because they were abused by a certain unnamed person, who perhaps had the best of intentions, but basically insulted people on race weekends trying to enforce power/rules.When you marry this with the shit stirring and general crap that went on back in the days of Mark and Magoo being at the wheel, a lot of people switched off.As an aside I still kick myself that I didnt stand up and try and defend Mark and Magoo, who really helped make a difference along with Brad and the Glove etc.
3) Split Rounds;I also think that the whole race day experience in NSW is hampered by having to split the racing into a up to pre 78 round and then the up to Pre 85 round.There is far too much down time and not enough racing, so when you factor the expense of either buying a MA season licence or day licences plus petrol accomodation etc for most rounds it is just not worthwhile.
How do we fix it?
I believe that more effort should be placed in trying to find tracks closer to Sydney and look to get independent flaggies so the split round format is canned.Some of the good buggars I have mentioned also need to get over it and come back into the fold.Egos need to be put to one side and everyone needs to get together and get it sorted.
Anyway I hope you guys can work it out,but luckily for me,I am back in Gods own country, where ego free laid back racing (and lots of it) is the rule and not the exception.
Cheers
Craig Taylor
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Well written Craig, I couldn't agree more.
I'm not a member of HEAVEN so I can't comment on the current officers but have observed and have heared from others that they're on the right path to rid the PR damage left behind by previous club management. There have been a lot of mistakes and political crap in the past and sadly some of it sticks. Let's hope the current good people at the helm can avoid the mistakes made by their predeccessors and finally rid the club of that bad ju ju.
The other club dabbling in vintage in NSW is Penrith club and quite frankly these days they're just going through the motions. The current executive have been at the helm since I resigned as secretary and president in 1993 and I'm certain they've had enough. Even though I'm not the most popular person in Len and Christine Tickners christmas card list, I must admit that they've given fantastic service to not only Penrith club but to Nepean Motorsports Club, MNSW and MA over the last 15 years. Unfortunately the effort in running a successful Kawasaki dealership, MNSW and Penrith club must take up a lot of their time and something must suffer from all of that involvement which to my observation seems to be Penrith Club itself. In my time in the seat we ran three or four vintage motocrosses and three or four vintage dirt tracks per year, usually with over 100 entries per event. For the first few years of the Tickner tenure that race scedule and popularity continued but as the years progressed their enthusiasm faded in proportion along with the entries to the point that motocross was dropped from the program a few years ago and there are now far fewer vintage dirt track promotions at Nepean.
For any venture to stay fresh and progressive there has to be an influx of new ideas and enthusiasm. Being at the helm for 18 years has drained the current Penrith executive of what enthusiasm they may have had in the beginning. It's time for new blood to take control of the proud old club and steer it back to where it was in the mid 90s, the best vintage club on the east coast. All clubs have their ideas men and bedroom entrepeneurs but when the call is on for them to back up their ideas and verbal enthusiasm with actual hard work, these punters disappear into the mist, only to emerge when the same old hard workers have picked up the shovel again. Penrith club is a victim of that very situation, the Tickners, Bill Pengilly and the other small band of stalwarts continuing to carry on doing the tough work while the majority of the members enjoy the fruits of their labour without having to contribute. For vintage racing to progress and for Penrith club to remain a viable promoter of vintage racing, new enthusiastic people have to nominate for positions at the next AGM. It's time for fresh minds prepared to do the hard work to take control of the club and start reviving the clubs vintage racing promotions that saw Penrith at the top of the heap and the sport booming only a short decade ago.
Unfortunately as I said earlier, there are more gunnas and whingers than actual doers so I sadly predict that the same old same old will remain at Penrith club and vintage racing will remain stagnant because of it.
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These same old committee die hard's can be burnt out and obsessive people across VMX Australia.
Which can seem/appear and is very threatening and off putting for all the new people to entry.
This is where you have to stand up just like the Anzacs and be counted and have some b.....
Fight the good fight for VMX 8)
cheers
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Craig good to have you back in NZ- we do suffer with 7 meets in 7 months on rolling green grass and some tracks as far as 40km away,bugger
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give it to them VMX 247 :D :D. As flaggies need nore recognition, without us , there is no racing ;)
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It should also be noted that the Hunter Motorcycle club is conducting vintage dirt track and has formed a vintage sub committee. It is currently/predominately VDT with about a dozen members fronting up to about 4 rounds and riding in conjunction with junior meeting.
It is good fun and for the Hunter riders, is only half hour north of Newcastle at Barleigh ranch. We have been combining the riding pre 78 and pre 85 so lots of laps and nobody gives a rats arse where you come as all in good fun.
If you are interested in coming fo a ride and great day out come along.
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l would like to see a State of origin, that each state has their riders team as a 4 man team, pick their colours, and class, and have a round in each state. and a grand price at the end of the series that will go to their club, which will be a sheild, ???? and sponsore gifts will go to the winning team. points are added up at the last round. open for ideas
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some of the things we do up here in qld
are we get ses volunteers to flag
and we pay them
works great they all have a radio and when they have all called in clear
we let next race go
the other thing is we race but we dont race
in other words for fun no lapscorers no trophys
still gate start or bungee and still checkered flag
only exeption state champs and conondale classic etc
last club day 130 riders 195 bikes :o
cater for all classes pre70, womens, through to pre 90
depending on numbers
maybe you guys in nsw need to find new tracks
closer to sydney maybe try approaching land owners
we pay our landowners app $500 for a meeting
most jump at that
i think what magoo is saying is why nsw has flattened out
in vintage when vic and qld are booming and what can be done to fix it
fair enough question :D
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These same old committee die hard's can be burnt out and obsessive people across VMX Australia.
Which can seem/appear and is very threatening and off putting for all the new people to entry.
This is where you have to stand up just like the Anzacs and be counted and have some b.....
Fight the good fight for VMX 8)
cheers
So right!!!!!
As VMX247 knows in the west the club has asked members to nominate one meeting during the season that they will flag, and so far has been excellent. We of course have the diehard volunteers like Alison and others, who are out there come hell or high water and are brilliant.
I wonder about the comment of not having a track within one hour and half from Sydney is a bit misleading, as far as I can remember you would still be in the suburbs of Sydney if ypu had to travell from one side to the other. The VMXWA home track is a minimum of 2hrs south of Perth, with others closer and some further away.
Clubs can only be run by those people willing to give up their time to do this and all clubs end up with a core element that they depend on to come through. It is a pity but I don't think that has changed over the years. A club is only as strong as it's committe, volunteers and members. Strength is given by direction and the exchange of ideas, not dictatorship
Racing Pre75 and Pre 85 on the same track has it's own inherent problems, other than redirecting the track at certain points to allow for obvious differences, appears to be the only way to go. This talking over a whole season, not just one meeting, as the degredation is an acumulation of several meetings'
I myself have done something ridiculous and nominated to ride in the Pre 75 class at the manjimup 15,00 against pre 85 bikes, in between modern bike races. How stupid, I will finish last, die a violent death as a pre 85 bike runs over me in one of the holes left by the modern bikes. All gifts and flowers can be sent to the Manji Hospital to'that stupid old fart'
But I am doing what we all do, bloody enjoying riding VMX
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maybe interclub DT and MX with Penrith, Hunter,and Heaven for a try just for locality reasons, Kurri has a MX/minibike track and a DT complex and a speedway track currently under construction, all extra options and extra tracks, also by mixing the clubs up, each club would not have to flag at others events taking a bit off the committees from each club, or maybe I should shut up ::)
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There are heaps of tracks close to Sydney and Canberra. IE: Mt Kembla, Nowra, Picton (grass), Canberra, Oakdale, Appin??? all within 2 hours that I know of.
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Clarkey do they race vintage at nowra ? I thought it was just set up for modern bikes.jimson
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Clarkey do they race vintage at nowra ? I thought it was just set up for modern bikes.jimson
Nowra-hey I was just reading about this track in ADB Vol 1 No 1
Do they allow women to attend,race,flag or shoot photos . ;D
Probably not a good write up for today's magazines ;) ;D
cheers
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They're nearly all modern tracks aren't they?
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They dont race vmx but they have a good Amcross track that is good for vmx. As for modern tracks Kembla is used for modern and vmx??? Maybe someone from the Heaven Club could look into it???
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They dont race vmx but they have a good Amcross track that is good for vmx. As for modern tracks Kembla is used for modern and vmx??? Maybe someone from the Heaven Club could look into it???
you could maybe look into it and then give the Heaven president a ring ;) ;D
no harm in askin 8)
cheers
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Heaven already uses/used Kembla, it is probably more modern and although not totally pre 78 friendly, it is ridable even tho a few members will not ride there on the early bikes due to it can break frames and shocks on the early stuff, more a pre 85 track :)
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The idea of approaching landowners for use of a paddock for $500 sounds pretty good. I regularly look longingly at some nice bit of cow country and think about riding on it. How does the MA/ insurance side of things work. Does the track have to get MA approval first ? Do the regs' in this regard change between States?
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The idea of approaching landowners for use of a paddock for $500 sounds pretty good. I regularly look longingly at some nice bit of cow country and think about riding on it. How does the MA/ insurance side of things work. Does the track have to get MA approval first ? Do the regs' in this regard change between States?
Level three Steward can inspect the natural terrain/paddock/cow country.
All states should be the same under the governing body of Motorcycling Australia.
Event insurance would be covered by MA with MA offical's/paperwork in attendance.
cheers
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l would like to see a State of origin, that each state has their riders team as a 4 man team, pick their colours, and class, and have a round in each state. and a grand price at the end of the series that will go to their club, which will be a sheild, Huh? and sponsore gifts will go to the winning team. points are added up at the last round. open for ideas
This could be run in conjunction with the Nationals..........
cheers S&A
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*click*
We're doing nothing wrong in NSW. Sure, some things could be improved, but there's no magic button that will fix everything - because we don't need anything more than a tune-up.
Warning: Immininent use sweeping generalisations, particularly using the word "we"!
The problem in NSW is that we all want everything to suit us 100% perfectly, 100% of the time. And we tend to stomp off in a huff if we don't get it. And we aren't even willing to accept that other people's nirvana might be different to our own, so compromise is not even on the agenda.
We 'enjoy' the politics, the power squabbles and the act of 'making a stand' far too much - for too many of us, they've become their own source of perverse enjoyment, and we have lost sight of the common goal.
This is not intended to be a shot at anyone in particular, and everyone (including me) is guilty of it to some extent. But for a variety of reasons, NSW is the worst for it (and not just in the world of VMX - it really seems to be a sad part of our state's identity!).
Have a look at the history of these forums - people from other states all seem to be able to keep the big picture in sight, whereas us NSWelshmen seem to be the ones that are super-quick to get nasty.
So changing the tracks, the people on the committees, or the phase of the moon might help, the real 'fix' has to come from all of those people who would prefer to leave their bikes in their sheds than spend a couple of hours with a flag in their hand (or whatever else it is that they dislike so intensely that they aren't involved).
Disclaimer: I know some of the history, and I know why some people got the poops. I also reckon that I'd have responded in a similar way, in some of those cases. But at what point do you let go, and move on with your life? At what point do the original problems slide into irrelevance, and your behaviour/attitudes become the damaging ones?
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This is what l did when l was looking for a track for vintage., l would go to a small town that has a school, fire station General store, may have a caravan park Etc. Talk to the owner of the general store asked a couple of land owner, tell them that it will be used for one meeting only per year, offer them some money for the days lease, tell that its all above board their will be a 20 million dollar MAV Insurance cover, the canteen can be run by the schools or Fire Bridgade, the corner stewarts are volunteers by the service clubs, rotary etc, they have free lunch, gold coin donation at the grate. or pay for the program, the host club will need to advertise in the local newspaper, and do a poster run to near by towns. Make the track like a Europeian Track, local ambulance or st john on the day also free lunch. And after the day is over thank everyone you will then have a track every year after that. all is well service clubs make money, club makes money, Farmer is happy,all happy. That is how the Classic Scramble Club has been so successfull all these years. Be a Team Player. regards David.A
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So far we've had heaps of positive feedback with little finger pointing which is good. For VMX to go forward we need people turning up and it is across the board, just ask Donnie in Coffs Harbour how much hair he had before he tried to get people turning up to his brilliant events. I know for a fact very few old time racers have sold their bikes, we just need to get them out and riding.
The grass track close to Sydney would be a great idea if it can be done. Some of the Sydney tracks can't be used like Appin is only used by the MacArthur club and Picton can only be used twice a year, both of which are Macarthur club events. They won't hire it out and Wollondilly Council won't allow any more thn 2 events per year. Kembla is really harsh on the old bikes and old bodies. Would splitting the eras, something like vintage and post vintage? Just a thought.
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Interesting thread!
For the states that pay Flaggies......how much does it cost you? has this been going on long?
Also here in Tas., I believe that you can't just pay the landowner.....you also have to pay the local council (quite a bit apparently)
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Interesting thread!
For the states that pay Flaggies......how much does it cost you? has this been going on long?
Also here in Tas., I believe that you can't just pay the landowner.....you also have to pay the local council (quite a bit apparently)
flaggies for an open modern event is usually a donation ranging from $200-$1000.
$25 a flag point usually,free lunch and cool drinks.
Other events, its bring a mate and I've seen the racing stop due to not enough flags on the track.
ps:Loved Crawford River Classic promo video on youtube-looks like a bonza. :o
cheers
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Been talking to a few of my Northern and Southern buddies over the last couple of weeks and I can't help but ask, what are we doing wrong in N.S.W. as far as entries are concerned? Viper and QVMX are regularly getting well over the 100 rider mark at regular club days, where here in N.S.W. we're lucky to get half that.
I've got a couple of theories, the main one being flaggies. In N.S.W. we can't get any local volunteers to flag where the Viccos and Qld guys just ride without having to worry about flagging, therefore having a smooth flow through the meetings. I also think that our focus on the older bikes who don't support the club by turning up is an issue. QVMX last week with 35 PRE "85 250s ( that's right, 250s only) and 20 pre '90's must be food for thought.
Whadda you guys reckon
P.S. This is not an attack on anyone or any club, just trying to constructively bring on some debate, new ideas.
To answer Magoo's question bluntly.
NO Pre "90" class
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As has been previously stated,most of the VMX riders in Qld are concentrated around the Southeast with another club around Capricornia( I think) and most have ready access to several natural terrain and one inner city track.You guys appear to be spread out a lot further.Am I right in assuming most of the riders come from the Sydney/Canberra regions?Do you have a natural terrain track around Goulburn or do they have a motorcycle club with their own track you could utilise?As Holeshot said the SES are happy to do flagging for us,we seem to have more trouble getting officials and are looking at ways to rectify this.Our club doesnt have a championship but that doesnt seem to have discouraged riders and may even encourage more.There are also a few guys with bikeshops heavily involved up here and that helps with keeping everything networked as well as repairs to older bikes.We are always on the lookout for alternate venues as well as evidenced by last weekends practice day at Cooroy which attracted about 50 riders.These are just observations about what happens up here.
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My Answer, MA-NSW, bunch of useless farkin twits with no idea whatsoever, to busy shinning up there badges to be interested in motor sport, until of course they can assert their authority. (sorry I have long term issues with the total incompenence of this organisation ::))
Anouther is that most NSW are in the Sydney basin, and it is imposible to hold an event reasonably close to anywhere so someone always has to travel long distances and it all becomes too furking hard.
My suggestion is similar to Damo's, do you remember how big the Thumper Nats were in the mid nineties ?
It was based aroud C grade riders on less than competitive bikes (4 Strokes of that Error)
with twin shock support classes
Maybe a pre 90 and a pre 95 4 stoke class is what is needed, it shure would drag some of the old thumper natters out of the woodwork, it may even get them interested in vintage racing?
Flagging has always been the biggest issue with Club racing, has anyone ever thought about approaching bush fire brigades local to the tracks beig raced at?, I would pay $20 extra to race if there were bush fire brigade flaggies and their brigade was getting it as a donation, knowing them as I do they are a very dedicated group and always trying to raise funds, this could work out as a win-win situation.
5c worth,
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How was hawaii
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Farkin Unreal!!, You could prop me up on a beach in maui with a MaiTai in my hand for the rest of my days and you would hear no complaints!
Unfortunately I had to come home, but..... I did come home with a three station margeritaville magarita machine!!
(http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n208/hemiy09/MargaritavilleTahitiFrozen.jpg)
Did I mention that I am building a sports bar in my shed??
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Same thing for us regrding Maui and
No you didnt mention the sports bar , i guess we will have to wait until you invite us up for the grand opening.
Three burner margarita machine, at the Olympic margarita drinking championships that is gold medal material .
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Farkin Unreal!!, You could prop me up on a beach in maui with a MaiTai in my hand for the rest of my days and you would hear no complaints!
Gotta admit I've also got a soft spot for Hawaii and Maui and Kaui in particular. One of lifes little pleasures is hitting happy hour at Moose McGillicuddys and getting stuck into a couple of half price Mai Tais. It really sets you up for a night on the Kahului party strip. I know it's a bit like Surfers Paradise but I like Waikiki as well.
That's a first division margarita blender Darren, the Rolls Royce of such devices! If you're going to CD6 we're debuting a new blender to the world to match the previous years Maico and Jawa speedway themed gizmos and will also have an electric backup unit ;D. Drop in for a Margarita, Mai Tai,Banana Daquri or even a soothing Pina Colada ;).....
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I hope you guys have a great big box of those little umbrellas to put in your drinks.
Nothing says VMX more than big, boofy blokes sipping on their cocktails!
This is getting out of hand!!
VMX42
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Yep, as a matter of fact we sure have those little brollys for the Mai Tais, printed up Klub Kevlar coasters and those twirly straw things too.
Nearly every pit at an American vintage race has the margarita/blender/exotic beer/chili thing happening after the races. It's all about cameraderie and good times.
Out of hand? ??? Never. :-*
(Which brings this post straight back to the thread focus. In my opinion one of the things that's currently wrong with the sport in NSW is that the cameraderie/fun has declined over the years. Anyone who has memories of the old Condo Greybeards two day event and the early Nats will surely agree that the fun factor is way down these days. All we're trying to do is to revive those good times. It's not about the cocktails, it's about the cameraderie)
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2 out of 4 ain't bad!!
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Dukes bar at Waikiki , Sunday afternoon , live music and half price drinks.
Incredients for a very slow Monday.
Coasters and umbrella's :o i say yeh yeh yeh , let the goodtimes roll
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Firko,
Step down carefully from the soapbox. It was a joke, remember them!!
VMX42
jeeezzzzzz!!!!!!
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The best bar in Waikiki used to be the old Rose & Crown English Pub. The Long Island Iced Teas were as strong as Shell A.
It was Hawaii HQ for visiting footy teams from all over the world and one wall featured team photos of all of the teams of all codes that had enjoyed the pubs hospitality. All off the photos were your standard footy team photos except for one, unobtrusively buried in amongst the others which featured Smithfield Old Boys Rugby Club standing stark naked, fat old managers and all. A number of these stylish young Aussies also had woodies. There's nothing that shouts class better than a footy player on their end of deason trip. ::)Sadly the pub gave way to development and a bit of Waikiki history went with it.
Jeff....Of course I knew you were joking. I wasn't arcing up at all, perhaps you overlooked the little love kiss smiley? My little spiel was purely to give the post some connection to the to the original thread. If you picked some angst in my reply it wasn't intended. I'm all love and sweetness these days.
We've also got those little swizzle sticks and toothpicks for the pinapple chunks and Marachino cherries. So much more civilised than a case of Vomit Bombs and gristle snags on the barbie.
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Geez, I hope you blokes are bringing lots of extra electrical generating power with you to CD6, what with all these new fangled electrical mixers etc... :o
And I happen to be very partial to a Marguerita, thanks E74. With salt around the rim of the glass of course... ;)