are there too many class's in VMX

[firko]

What about ..first moto 6 laps ..that gives you an opportunity to "recover" if you have a first lap bingle..everyone knows how important a good result in the first moto is to the overall finishing...second moto 5 laps ...getting on in the programme and us oldies (yes over 50's) are getting tired ...third moto 4 laps.... These should be for the pre 75 races only

Brilliant in its simplicity. Common sense at work, good one Brian. 

[vmx42]

What about ..first moto 6 laps ..that gives you an opportunity to "recover" if you have a first lap bingle..everyone knows how important a good result in the first moto is to the overall finishing...second moto 5 laps ...

A good plan. I should be right to go by the 6th moto. 

[worms]

gentlemen i have a vision!

if we take the current format of 3rnds of say 3 lap races with the 30 odd class's that translates to 90 start grids, over 3 days.

My idea would be to see the titles run 2 rounds of 15 min plus 1 lap,

thus we would have max 60 start grids which you could condense back to a 2 day format.
each title would have a min race time of 30 plus minutes, instead of the 18 min average and at the same time take pressure of the organising club, less starts, more time between starts, easy format. if the comp runs behind time the sec day you reduce back to 12min plus 1 lap format
Secondly we add some value back to what is being raced for, a National Title.

you could even run up to pre78 one day at 12min plus 1 x 2 rounds and then the next day run 2 rounds of the later class's at 15min plus 1 lap,
I'm not saying I'm right, i can just see( after running the Nats) it needs more, than more of the same.

Cheers Worms

[Rossvickicampbell]

hang on - am I missing something here - lets say 90 start grids at 10 minute total race time (could be less yes) - equals 900 minutes over 3 days - equals 5 hours total racing a day over three days . 60 x 15 minute races also equals 900 minutes over 2 days equals 7 1/2 hours per day.

yes less starts, in between races etc but still same total now over 2 days?

Could it still be done worms?

[worms]

yeah because you loose so much time with extra starts, i'm still crunching it, most nationals wind up with about 26 class's in the end, so i do think you could do it.

i will work on it,

ok i thought about it and yes you could!

hang on the only thing to bring it back would be how many class's need qualifing

Cheers worms

[SAABCOMBI]

Track design, which will mean the starting grid, should be able to start a race while the currant  race is about to finish, start straights need to be longer too. it should work well if its thorought out properly.

[worms]

we did that at conondale and it worked fine.

cheers worms

[090]

The '07 nationals (at Coffs Harbour)were up to pre '78 and as all the nationals I have attended are really a three day event. Anybody would think this stuff is rocket science. A split nat's is a given. Pre '78 should also be a no brainer. I remember a couple of bad accidents at Coffs yet we were finished half way through Sunday, which included an all in race at the end. So pre 78, 5 or 6 lap races as it has to be a fair dinkum race but realistic of our age at the same time. 20,30 or 40 min's is just rubbish talk and a waste of a post.
I would like to know if anyone that actually races on here actually trains as well. You need to train and ride a fair bit to race for twenty minutes at some sort of pace.

[SAABCOMBI]

Connondale was fine, and l have alway said that, l loved Connondale. its trying to convince the guru in Victoria to listen, and their are certain people that think they know best in clubs and they won`t listen, if l only had 50 acres or more to play with l would design the best vintage race track in Australia, location location play`s an important roll and paddock layout.

[E74]

The '07 nationals (at Coffs Harbour)were up to pre '78 and as all the nationals I have attended are really a three day event. Anybody would think this stuff is rocket science. A split nat's is a given. Pre '78 should also be a no brainer. I remember a couple of bad accidents at Coffs yet we were finished half way through Sunday, which included an all in race at the end. So pre 78, 5 or 6 lap races as it has to be a fair dinkum race but realistic of our age at the same time. 20,30 or 40 min's is just rubbish talk and a waste of a post.
I would like to know if anyone that actually races on here actually trains as well. You need to train and ride a fair bit to race for twenty minutes at some sort of pace.

You are absolutely right Brad, I use to train like a bastard, was in my mid-late 20's and was still absolutely knakered at the end of a 10min +1 lap moto at the thumper nats during the 90's

3 laps is just silly, but 5-6 laps for guy's our age and average fitness levels is a realistic.

[worms]

if you have the 5 or 6 lap theory, your in that 12 to 15 min time zone anyway, the problem with just saying a number of laps is that no 2 tracks are the same.

all it needs is a definition of what consitutes a race from MA, and seeing they dont know or cant tell us, we need to give them as a group something to work with, taking out the lap theory out of it and making it a time frame takes all the guess work out of it, we all know what to expect, no matter what size/ length track/ wheter it's slow or a fast flowing venue.

090 is right, a 3 day venue is the best, 2 rounds of racing at 15min plus 1 lap is on the money( I think).

I for 1 dont want more of the same,

Cheers Worms

 

[worms]

looks like this thread is dead in the water , oh well, looks like i need to place that order for the " I beat a 3 Lapper" shirts

Cheers Worms ( aka head in the sand).

[firko]

What did you want out of this Trev?
1:Honest open debate on an interesting subject? or 2:Everyone to agree with you?
The funny thing is, the title of the thread, are there too many class's in VMX was hardly mentioned at all. It's turned into a debate over how long a race should be, something that can't be properly addressed until the Nats is split anyway. For the sake of debate though, I reckon the race length has been well covered...15 minutes+1 =too long. 10-12 minutes+1 more suitable to older bodies on old bikes.
Now, what about those pesky classes that need to go Trev. Let's really open a can of Worms .

[worms]

just a positive way forward, opinions about how we value the titles, how we define their worth for past and future events.
I dont mind really what format races, how many rounds we have, how long each race is, it would just take our governing body to clearly say this is whats required to hold that title, it's MA's title and with alot things within VMX there is so many grey areas, like folding footpegs, cross bar pads, cutoff dates, carryover models, period correct items, OEM, what size pants you must wear!. oh well, it may well come down to the first cnr wins oneday.

now class's, either split the comp or run 2 rounds instead of 3, but make the races longer.

tell me why some clubs run pre 85 sidecars but not pre85 solo's, either you reconize it or not?

is that enough for a Friday?

head in the sand worms, get it "sandworms",

Cheers Worms

[pirie593]

I would like to know if anyone that actually races on here actually trains as well. You need to train and ride a fair bit to race for twenty minutes at some sort of pace.

Brad, you seemed to be on the pace for 20 minutes at Farleigh without training...