Author Topic: 2010 VMX Tri Series  (Read 34699 times)

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Offline DJRacing

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #75 on: September 05, 2009, 09:16:18 am »
I think we whinge to much about travelling, we should all take a leaf out of TM Bills book. He has riden in Australia more times than most club members. I am sure that Bill wil be at all the Tri series when the dates are set.
Is there any chance of New Zealand being one of our stops?


Ji





If you guys want to ride here (NZ) we will make it happen, no if's, but's or can't do's, they are only the stutters on the way to success.

As the words from a great song starts off ..... "Let there be lights, and there were lights,... Let there be sound, and there was sound, ...  Let their be guitar............     you guys know the rest, nothing ventured nothing gained. Yes there will be hurdles to climb, T's to cross and I's to dot but did anyone think that it would suddenly materialize into an event after a couple of pages in this forum? Some of you sound like the organizers are asking you to do the work, when all they are asking if you would turn up and have fun racing..... why is it that on this forum the negatives are so easy to look at when it [this forum] should be used to find away around the problems that these guys face, when they are trying to give you more.... you give them grief .... turn the grief into problem solving solutions and you are well and truly on the way to something that has the potential to be awesome.
If at first you dont succeed, give up and drink beer

Ji Gantor

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #76 on: September 05, 2009, 09:27:32 am »
Thank you brother.
I will try my best to include NZ at every opportunity.

Keep well
Ji

Offline VMX247

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Best is in the West !!

firko

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #78 on: September 05, 2009, 11:10:39 am »
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I believe what Firko and a couple of others are saying, but at the same time what they 'are saying is' here are the problems, logistics, how can this problem be solved?
Exactly DJ! I think you'd find that Bahnsy and I are in favour of the Tri Series going ahead but, in my case anyway, could see that in the enthusiasm to get the thing up and running the many problems involved in setting up a series like this were being overlooked.

Back in 1986 when I had this dumb idea to promote a race for vintage motocross bikes I recieved more negative opposition than positive help. My own club, Penrith laughed at me both openly and behind my back, the ACU said it couldn't happen, and the industry thought it was a wank on the same level as demolition derbies. I was feeling pretty lonely out there but knew I was right and that my vision would one day come to fruition. In amongst the naysayers one bloke, Geoff Eldridge got behind me and with his encouragement and ability to attack problems laterally we broke down every one of the so-called barriers preventing vintage motocross from going ahead. Months of work at ACU level saw me able to convince them to introduce the one day licence system which then opened up the door to attract the many first timers we needed to set up vintage motocross. The One Day Licence system is my proudest achievment as it allowed all that followed to actually happen. After two years of solid work by a small but keen group of 'true believers' the first ever official vintage motocross meeting was held at Amaroo Park in April 1988 and the rest is history.

I mention my own experience here to push the point that if you're keen enough the Tri Series will happen but it's not going to be a walk in the park. The barriers that I've described in earlier posts are real, they're serious and they need to be addressed before any thoughts of dates or venues are discussed. Just as we broke down our barriers one at a time 22 years ago, you can too but you'll need a solid core of serious thinkers and problem solvers and guys not afraid to give up their time and energy to work on this. It's cool to be a Daydream Believer but that doesn't get the work done.

The format needs to be kept simple, as accessible as possible for as many racers as possible and costs involved kept to a minimum. As keen as the New Zealanders like TM Bill and DJ are, they're exceptions and to talk of including NZ in the series before it even gets off the ground is extremely premature and I feel that it's an unneeded complication at this time. If the series proves to be a success and the economy picks up then perhaps NZ could be included but until then the KISS principle needs to be followed. 

I still have my reservations as to being able to attract and maintain a core of 15-20 racers that are prepared to travel up and down the East Coast. We're talking about thousands of kilometres of travel, thousands of dollars in fuel, accomodation and expenses twice in a year, not counting the extras of CD and the Nats. It'll take a keen and financially secure racer to become involved. The travel logistics can be overcome by trailer pooling, sharing tools and spares to limit the amount of stuff to take, containering and trucking the bikes and other ways. It's not an impossible hurdle but it needs to be addressed. The fobbing off of the travel logistics as insignicant by some posters is perplexing to me. I ask them again, Are they financially capable, able to get the time off work and able to justify the comittment to their family?

The problems I was forced to deal with 22 years ago made me more determined to get my dream happening and I'm sure the obstacles that confront the Tri State Series will be dealt with one at a time as I had to. Don't however fall into the trap that many do that "problems will sort themselves". They rarely do. I've seen many 'great ideas' come along in 20 years including an earlier attempt to set up a similar series that I was deeply involved in and they all fell down because problems weren't addressed when they were needed to be addressed. The Tri State Series will happen if those behind it believe in it enough to dedicate their time and energy to it. One kink in the thread and it'll fall on its arse.

colmoody

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #79 on: September 05, 2009, 06:43:04 pm »
Is it to early in the game to suggest that maybe a poll as to this subject be put on to this site re this topic.

Questions might include the following.

1) Your name and in what state do you reside

2) How many rounds of the Tri State would you compete at

3) Which would they be

4) How many bikes/classes would you anticipate entering

And so on. It's early days yet but now might be as good as time as any to ask the question. Maybe the questions might be different, so if you are of a mind to put this up feel free to change/rearrange them. If I knew how I would do it myself. If you think it's a dumb idea say so.

squirtmoto

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #80 on: September 05, 2009, 07:47:38 pm »
Magoo and I first discussed the idea of a tri-state series a couple of years ago ;D and since then we have now got it to the point of looking like a reality. The biggest hurdle was always going to be the travel. ::) We thought that the easiest way to make it easier on all was for riders to drop their worst round results!  Riders can then choose to attend what ever rounds they wish. This way the QLDers and VICCO's would only have to travel interstate once and still be eligible for series results ;)
The choice of venues was also discussed at length, and we thought that choosing a venue as close as possible to each of the borders would be that way to go such as
Vic: Albury-Woodonga,Shepperton
Qld: Echo Valley, Warwick
NSW any where they can
Involving a modern club as the host club rather than a VMX club would be benificial in a number of ways
1. It takes away the drama's of the VMX clubs organising venues and support
2. The hosting club could run "Lites on Open" senior support classes for amateur club riders. Giving them the incentive for their club members to ride and financial support through extra entries.
I for one would support this series "Boots and All" so instead of picking the eyes out of this, bring some productive Ideas forwrd to help get this up and running :)




Offline BAHNZY

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #81 on: September 05, 2009, 11:17:52 pm »
Why is it that when you offer the real life issue’s that you are seen as being negative? Is there a hint of tall poppy type syndrome creeping in?  As Firko has noted there are some significant issues that need to be addressed, understanding the market is probably a good start.
If for example, individuals understood the Victorian “market” then they would know that there is NO club in Victoria that promotes Evolution and/or Pre85. (Although Bendigo now has introduced a Pre85 class) They would also have researched and identified that VIPER runs in exactly the same way, and has for nearly 11 years as;
Involving a modern club as the host club rather than a VMX club would be beneficial in a number of ways
1. It takes away the drama's of the VMX clubs organising venues and support
2. The hosting club could run "Lites on Open" senior support classes for amateur club riders. Giving them the incentive for their club members to ride and financial support through extra entries.


This may not be right, why would it have to change? An "interclub" can have up to 5 invited clubs.
Yes they can but my understanding is that they are to come under the one SCB.
This is how the Thumpers started.
Yes but that was almost 2 generations ago. A lot has changed since then.
You must be able to make it an inter club challenge/ series rather than a national event.
When you involve 3 different SCB’s and the National CB then be prepared for the politics.
I know i can pack the car and drive down to Victoria and ride a club day when ever i wish, so why cant it be done the same way?
Because, in most cases you are steered in the direction of a one day club membership to overcome the technical point. This is now frowned upon by the MA and the SCB’s as it as not seen as promoting the sport in positive manner. The SCB’s want riders to belong and participate in a club, not take out a one day membership. Some (actually a lot) of clubs in Victoria have banned the one day membership. Feasibly you could join the 3 clubs but you would be up for 3 annual memberships plus the usual levies.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2009, 10:32:22 am by Bahnsy »
Rod (BAHNZY) Bahn

Offline motomaniac

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #82 on: September 05, 2009, 11:27:32 pm »
Fug me .How long is a generation thesedays?I thought that women were waiting longer to have kids .

Offline VMX247

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #83 on: September 05, 2009, 11:28:27 pm »
Bahnsy,sorry that it's become so very complicated- the only way would be run at an OPEN event level  :(  :o
cheers S&A WA
« Last Edit: September 05, 2009, 11:30:55 pm by VMX247 »
Best is in the West !!

Offline DJRacing

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #84 on: September 05, 2009, 11:45:04 pm »
Ok I can see your points on having to deal with governing bodies, rules, regulations but there must be another way around this.
A question;  Can a vmx club put on a race day and have riders from another state just turn up to race?
                 If that is possible, then could that club include an "invitation races" for the riders wishing to        compete in 2 or more round of the tri-series?
Just a thought.
If at first you dont succeed, give up and drink beer

Offline Nathan S

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #85 on: September 05, 2009, 11:52:13 pm »
Why is it that when you offer the real life issue’s that you are seen as being negative?

Because it was presented in a negative way.

Imagine this scenario...
Person A: I reckon I've got a good idea. I want to..."
Person B: Nup, it'll never work, you've got it all wrong, and besides MA won't let you.
Person C: What a great idea! I like it. Are you sure you're going to get enough entries? MA hasn't been real happy about people doing that, but it might be possible to...".

It doesn't matter whether Person B is right or not - they ARE being negative.

We all know how much time and effort both you and Firko have put (and continue to put) into the less-glamarous aspects of the sport. It would just be good to see you come to this discussion with some solutions or at least some positive thoughts toward finding solutions to the problems you have recognised. (edit: Like DJ just did! :) ).
The good thing about telling the truth is that you don't have to remember what you said.

firko

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #86 on: September 06, 2009, 07:08:32 am »
And like I did if you'd read my post closely Nathan.  ;)  but..............
Quote
It would just be good to see you come to this discussion with some solutions or at least some positive thoughts toward finding solutions to the problems you have recognised. (
It's a tall stretch to be positive about what I consider to be a fundamentally flawed concept. As I've repeated ad infinitum, it'a a good idea spoiled by the tyranny of distance. There's too much travel and expense involved for the working man...full stop. But seeing that you seem to need me to offer some hope let's sort out the travel logistics.

If a core of 10-20 riders from each state are needed to make this a success, why not hire a container, load the 20 or so bikes, tools, spares and riding gear needed and ship them to each event. Then, hire a 20 seat mini bus to ferry all of the riders to the event where  they could be billeted with locals. Voila!.....Ttansport and accomodation solved in one fell swoop.

Now, this may seem a silly idea, and sure as f*ck it is....however it's still better than anything else I've read so far. I haven't seen too many problems solving ideas from the "lets go for it" side of the discussion either.  ::)
« Last Edit: September 06, 2009, 07:42:39 am by firko »

Offline Nathan S

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #87 on: September 06, 2009, 07:59:47 am »
Here's my solutions:
1. Put bikes in ute.
2. Drive ute.
3. Unload bikes.
4. Race bikes and have fun.
5. Put bikes back into ute.
6. Drive home.

The biggest problem I can see is that I haven't allocated time for drinking beer... Shit, you're right, the whole thing is doomed! :D

Seriously, I'm not really seeing the drama. Car pooling is particularly easy to organise on the 'net, flights are dirt cheap, etc etc. From a rider's point of view, its only as difficult as you want it to be. I'm already thinking about who to talk to about travelling being buddies, where I might be able to blag a space on the lounge room floor, etc.

From an organiser's point of view, there's already over a dozen guys who have publically expressed a positive interest in the series, so they're well on the way to the 10~20 rider core that's needed.
The good thing about telling the truth is that you don't have to remember what you said.

maicopunk

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #88 on: September 06, 2009, 07:19:08 pm »
A question;  Can a vmx club put on a race day and have riders from another state just turn up to race?
                 If that is possible, then could that club include an "invitation races" for the riders wishing to        compete in 2 or more round of the tri-series?
Just a thought.

I reckon DJ has nailed it.  Why can't the Tri Series consist of the Crawford River Classic, the Connondale Classic and a Viper round at Barrabool for example. Interstate riders have already travelled to these events for a number of years and joined the host club. They are already on the calendar so they shouldn't dilute the entries of existing major race meets.

Obviously it would need the approval of the host clubs and the race program may need to be adjusted to accommodate the Tri Series races (assuming they run as standalone races). Or the Pre85 race at Crawford River, for example, could be scored for the HEAVEN series and the Tri Series. If someone cleans up at Crawford River then travels up to the Connondale Classic and does the same then they would probably be motivated to travel to Victoria to pick up a trophy.

Offline marshallmech

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Re: 2010 VMX Tri Series
« Reply #89 on: September 06, 2009, 10:08:33 pm »
Bahnsy there is a senior national one meeting licence avalible in the GCRs
I was going to get one for the Tassi nats but didnt end up going .
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