MX tracks and double jumps.

[Freakshow]

Bigger jumps have also lead to killing off our local classics.   i took my old girl out to our club practice track the other day, did one lap, rattle myself and bike to death, parked it and jumped back on the 07 YZ, which was like being on a armchair after the previous lap.    

I hope we go back to offering grass track and natural terrain with maybe a drop off or bump jump.    I cant think aa sain person here that would bring out there classic to kill it on a modern cut track, its just not worth it so they get parked.  mine is. :'(

[Freakshow]

MAV's own MX track at Broadford has several sets of doubles on it

After leaving this heated discussion I was greeted with the news that Gator had totalled himself on said tabletop.
Going by the press afterwards, everyone had a ball....... [/color]

Thats Gator always taking one for the team .... ( like the time he did the fatty)

GAtors is it on you tube yet ?? ?

[motomaniac]

I guess my answer is motocross is motocross and SX is SX.

If they are putting SX type obstacles on MX tracks why do they have a seperate licence endorsement for SX.

If young blokes want the challenge of a more technical track with bigger jumps and gaps to clear thats fine by me, but there is already a place for it - SX. Why stuff up the existing MX tracks so they end up being neither one thing or the other.

Bloody good point .The seperate SX licence was a great idea but what is the point if the regular outdoor tracks have the same obstacles.

[Viper666]

Track safety is a given.

I cop a lot of criticism/flak/shit over Monza. Newsflash, I didn't design or build it. That said I understand where some of you are coming from. But, and that's a big BUT (Not mine yet), no matter how bad or good a track is, whether it's wet or dusty, rutted or smooth, big jumps/no jumps, off camber corners or berms. Eveyone has the choice of riding or not, there is no rule that says you have to clear or even attempt to clear a jump, you should ride to YOUR  ability. For fug sake stop whinging and just fuging ride or sit and watch with a beer or the poison of your choosing. No track is ever going to be perfect for our bikes/sport or indeed everyone.

For instance the jumps that most of youse  are going on about, I LOVE, but I cant ride round an off camber corner (Can't ride out of sight on a dark night). Do you hear me crapping on about banning them? NO! Come to think of it I'm no good at ssssttttuuuuuttttteeeeerrrrrsssss/whoops, sandy sections, ruts, corners of any desciption, braking bumps, bumps, holes, MUD (I really hate mud), dust, did I say sand?, clay, hills, puddles. So bring on a track that's dead straight and flat with a shitload of jumps and I just might win a National. Maybe not.

My point, dont really have one just like the sound of my own keyboard, is JUST RIDE. Go fast on the bits you like, slow down on the bits you dont.
I know there a $5 trophy to be won at the end of the day but is no good if it's sitting on the shelf in a hospital ward.

For all our whinging and whining no club is EVER going to change a track for us dinosaurs. They may cut sections out, like thay are going to do at Barrabool, but they will never make whole hearted changes. Live with it. Ride or dont ride, choice is yours but for the FUG sake stop complaining.

Barrabool is not my favourite track but I cant wait to have a ride Sunday. It will be my first real ride since Wonthaggi last year. I'm just happy we still have tracks to ride.
There's enough arseholes out there trying to kill the sport without us imploding.

This thread was started on safety and rightly so. Where does safety start? With yourself.




Whoops, just fell off me soapbox. Too many last night.

Me & me mate will be at the Bool Sat arvo raring for some bench racing bullshit if anyone's up to it.

Viper666


PS Monza will be as flat and as smooooooooth as I can make it but the jumps stay!

[Mick22]

there is no rule that says you have to clear or even attempt to clear a jump, you should ride to YOUR  ability.

Yeah there is a rule, if you can't clear doubles etc you can't get a SX endorsement. You can't just turn up to a SX and roll over the jumps at your own ability...you'll get black flagged.
This is for good reason, as it is downright dangerous having guys rolling any sort of multiple jumps when there are guys clearing them.

I have landed on a  guy over doubles and it was not a pleasant experience for either of us, less so him. I agree safety in usually largely in your own control on a track but as soon as you have gaps to clear and a mix of riders jumping and rolling, there is a problem. For the record I enjoy doubles etc but only if they are well designed and everyone is doing the same thing

If i'm having a whinge its that history is repeating itself as the whole reason the SX licencing and MX track regs were brought in were to minimize the types of injuries which have become common Vic MX tracks over the last 6 months. From memory wasn't there an incident at Monza that was the catalyst for the changes back in the early 90's.

[2 shocks]

Goodaye Neale, well said & as much as I'd hate to admit it, I agree with you mate 100%. Makes me wonder if some of these guys who are whinging about track conditions, actually rode back in the day, when the club owned a water cart, that was it. I raced from 71 to 78 & somehow got put into A grade around about 76. Sure we didnt have doubles & stuff, but most of the tracks were as rough as hell. Wonthaggi around 3pm on a sunday arvo, in a Vic Title or Aussie Title or Gippy Centre was as rough as you'd ever want to see. And also remember back in those days the starting grids were always chocka block, sometimes with 2 rows. Just think about it lads, we're not racing for sheep stations, if your not capable then dont tackle things that are above your ability.

PS Neale, still in Vietnam, so if you want to do a bit of bullshitting, take your lap top. Just paid the hotel bill for 4 nights $86.00 & beer is still .80c a stubby.   

All the best Ken - Maico #54

[number8]

Goodaye Neale, well said & as much as I'd hate to admit it, I agree with you mate 100%. Makes me wonder if some of these guys who are whinging about track conditions, actually rode back in the day, when the club owned a water cart, that was it. I raced from 71 to 78 & somehow got put into A grade around about 76. Sure we didnt have doubles & stuff, but most of the tracks were as rough as hell. Wonthaggi around 3pm on a sunday arvo, in a Vic Title or Aussie Title or Gippy Centre was as rough as you'd ever want to see. And also remember back in those days the starting grids were always chocka block, sometimes with 2 rows. Just think about it lads, we're not racing for sheep stations, if your not capable then dont tackle things that are above your ability.

PS Neale, still in Vietnam, so if you want to do a bit of bullshitting, take your lap top. Just paid the hotel bill for 4 nights $86.00 & beer is still .80c a stubby.   

All the best Ken - Maico #54

I dont think any one is complaining about how rough the tracks were or are now,the difference between the tracks of 71-78 are way different to what you see these days the issue that was raised was the way they are designed and lay out with there man made obsticales that are causing concern,and it would be good to see those "starting grids" full again,and maybe we would if there was a little more thought put into them,

#8

[motomaniac]

Rough is good , you might get off but its generally not the sudden hit as when you mess up on a double or something.
One of my Favs down here was Traralgon- a few jumps where made but the interesting parts of the track were the natural sections - the uphills , down hills , offcambers around trees etc.
When I saw that track again after some years of not racing I nearly cried.
Its still a good ride, mainly because I like the soil but it ain't the track it used to be.
Just glad that I was around to see , Belly, Melton,Hogan Leisk and co battle it out when it was a real mx track.

[Viper666]

Ken, you're a bastard!

I was talking about MX tracks and believe any tracks with SX type obstacles shown have their licenced revoked until removed.
The trouble is, this is not a shot at you fatboy, some inspectors dont know their own rules.
For instance, the Venue standard rules state a minimum gate height of 500mm, no mention of maxium, the 2009 GCR's state 500mm minimum 600mm maxium so when we did our new 40 gate setup we made them 530mm yet when we got inpected the guy said they had to be 500mm. This is very minor and would not compromise safety but rules are rules. This is how doubles, stutters etc have crept into our tracks by being lienient on the smaller rules and then the onflow effect. We had a double few years back, simply took the guts out of a small tabletop, piss easy to clear but MV made us fill it back in and rightly so. How would it be if a scuttineer decided he couldn't care less if your brakes worked?
Where humans are involved there will always be mistakes and I am all for a bit of give and take (Contradicted myself a bit)but as stated in this thread keep the SX stuff in the SX tracks.
The only way to fix it is to protest, like that brave soul did (125cc), because if MAV dont know there are illegal "obstacles" out there they can't rectify them.

By the way, I am not talking about anyone in particular here (Whinging, whining), just people in general.
It's just that I've noticed that the "Fun" is going out of our sport and I'd hate to see it die. If we do nothing but focus on the negatives, it will. Afterall isn't that why most of us ride these awful machines, fun?
Before you say that the tracks are taking the fun out of it, bullshit. Fun is what you make it.
One of the best days racing I ever had was at Outrim a few years back. The front straight was under 6" OF WATER and the rest of the track wasn't much better but I had a ball. This is coming from the guy who HATES mud. Sure I could have sooked, left the bikes in the trailer then bitched all day about how far I'd travelled to be a spectator(Smythesdale). Wasn't the club's fault it pissed down rain the night before. I made fun out of a shitty situation and glad I did.

As I said the "Bool" is not my favourite track but come hail, sunshine, rain, wind, whatever I am looking forward to a great weekend. The whole package, Saturday night bullshit, Sunday catching up with mates, (Cheque's in the mail you two) more bullshit, maybe I'll ride, maybe I wont but I'll have Macca's sweet dulcet commentry to get me through the day. Let's hope he's made another DVD for presentation night.
That's what it's all about to me, the whole kit & kuboodle. (Spellcheck wouldn't work on that one!)

As for that incident in the 90's I actually wasn't involved with the club then but I think you're talking about the kid who died. His throttle jammed and he flew over the berm at the top of power hill (NW corner) and into a tree. We were made to pull the berm further back but that's all that happened. His parents errected a "memorial park" up there because even in their great loss they did not blame anyone or anything they just knowed their son loved his sport.

Viper666

[Nathan S]

Worst crash I've ever had was on a rough bit of grass track....

The ACT track recently became a jump-fest, presumably to please the promoter of the National titles - but no doubles, and the whoops aren't too bad. I don't think its particularly dangerous, but the track is a lot less fun for me now - its gone from being my favourite 'modern' track to a track that I'm completely indifferent about.
I haven't bothered to renew my membership, and I know that their over 35s, over 45s, ladies and old bikes classes have all died in the arse.

[Viper666]

I agree Nathan that the way it's going it will push the "Oldies" away but unfortunately we are not the future, we are the past.
In a perfect world all MX complexes would have a classic grass track, VMX track, a beginners track, both Junior & Senior, a intermediate track, an A grade track and a pro's track.
The Vic government's new land rezoning has just about stuffed PonyX and classic grass tracks.
We should all buy the "Bool" their the only ones with enough room for that.

Viper666

40 hours and counting

[ba-02-xr]

As I said earlier I dont agree about some of the stuff that is put into SOME modern tracks. But you guys that are bagging certain tracks sit back & think. Have you gone to the track guy & offered intput & offered to come out & help with track work. If the answer is yes & you got told to piss off. Well shit, there is nothing more you can do. If the answer is no, well you dont have anything to complain about & stop bitching. There is no reason a track needs to be dangerous. I am a club pesident & our track is easy enough that on training days we have 4 year olds on pee wee 50s going around the whole track. But Tye Simmonds is a regular at our track & he loves it. Its safe for old slow farts like me but the young kids have got there own chalenges. All on the same track. I will admite I wounld not RACE a pre 78 bike around it but I would ride 1. After 78 would be fine. I have raced a 83 KTM on it.

[NR555]

One of the best days racing I ever had was at Outrim a few years back. The front straight was under 6" OF WATER and the rest of the track wasn't much better but I had a ball. This is coming from the guy who HATES mud. Sure I could have sooked, left the bikes in the trailer then bitched all day about how far I'd travelled to be a spectator(Smythesdale). Wasn't the club's fault it pissed down rain the night before. I made fun out of a shitty situation and glad I did.

I was spectating that day.  Great to watch too!  That track was so bad, my brother got 3rd in modern on the CZ!  The only guys in front of him were Malcolm Watson & Peter Boyle.  Momentum all the way...

[motomaniac]

One of the best days racing I ever had was at Outrim a few years back. The front straight was under 6" OF WATER and the rest of the track wasn't much better but I had a ball. This is coming from the guy who HATES mud. Sure I could have sooked, left the bikes in the trailer then bitched all day about how far I'd travelled to be a spectator(Smythesdale). Wasn't the club's fault it pissed down rain the night before. I made fun out of a shitty situation and glad I did.

I was spectating that day.  Great to watch too!  That track was so bad, my brother got 3rd in modern on the CZ!  The only guys in front of him were Malcolm Watson & Peter Boyle.  Momentum all the way...

Mate you are bringing back memories, another great track and often muddybut that was when it was at its best.Was it a Gippy centre event or VIPER or?It must have been a few years ago if Malbum was there.

[Hoony]

Mate you are bringing back memories, another great track and often muddybut that was when it was at its best.Was it a Gippy centre event or VIPER or?It must have been a few years ago if Malbum was there.

the year was 2004 in late Aug early Sept Motomaniac as Mrs Hoony was due with the 1st Apprentice Sheila at the time and i was tossing up if i should go or not, in the end i stayed home in case.

i have a pic of Malcolm W from that Viper day exiting a corner sideways on his CR500RE with a big spray of mud from the back wheel.

How good was Outtrim, Traralagon, Newry, Lakes Entrance, Yarram  and Wonthaggi back in the 80's opens and Gippy Centres !