Pre 90 VMX

[All Things 414]

What do you have against someone wanting to ride multiple races, on one bike without breaking the laws of physics (or time travel)?

[kaw440]

As it is currently with Pre85, there is nothing in the GCR’s that will stop a Pre78, or EVO bike from running in the Pre85 events. This (in my opinion) is not in the spirit of the class structure. We should be promoting each class on its own merits with matching technology other wise we will have entrants building high end EVO bikes and running them in EVO, Pre85 & Pre90.

IN REFERENCE TO THE ABOVE COMENTS

Guys as i see it riding a twin shock bike in pre 85 is at no advantage as for the not within the spirt part thats a bit harsh as we have seen pre 85 bike with USD forks fitted to them if thats the case then evo bikes riding up a class is not so bad hey maybe guys just dont like twin shock bikes beating their single shock disc brake bikes but i might be wrong in saying this

[LWC82PE]

i think if you have a 80-84 model evo legal bike ( husky, can am, KTM, suzuki or even a KLX250) i think you shouldnt be forced into EVO and should be able to have the option of of entering EVO or pre 85. I am not saying i personally would want to enter both classes and i dont really care if my EVO legal bike is not ultra competitive against single shock pre 85 bikes. i would just much rather ride a bike in a period defined class not a technology defined class. My bike is a 82 so i want to race against other 1982 bikes not 78-79 model bikes because back then in 78 or 79 i couldnt race a 82 model bike against a 78 or 79 model bike as they were not available yet, so competing in pre 85 makes more sense for me.

i just think there should be an exception to allow any 80-84 bikes which are twinshock,aircooled,drum front to go in pre 85 but i do kinda agree in not allowing 78 model bikes to compete in pre 85. Or i just put a disc front end on my 82 ( if i find one that is legal) and that makes it easy. Aircooled, twin shock but disc front and that means its definitely ok for pre 85 then.

[All Things 414]

For me it's just a practicle thing. Most races are over a two hour drive for me (or an overnight stay). So if I'm going to lose a whole Sunday I'd like to get a fair bit of riding done. That means 3-4 classes to get a decent fix. Remember most of them are three lap races. If I have to run two bikes then that's a lot more washing, maintaining and general stuffing about as well as towing a trailer blah, blah ba blah.
It's easier to keep one bike up to race ready than it is for two. It's enjoyable. Once it becomes more work (than it already is) then lawn bowls on the telly or a sleep-in on Sunday starts to look really nice. People really like value for money. They keep coming back for more!

And isn't it a lot nicer having those big starts with all those bikes rather than a half dozen or so....

* I'm not trying to stamp my feet here and say "I only ever want to ride the one bike forever and ever." When I retire the 414 I will get a Pre 85 single shocker with the lovely brakes etc, etc. But I'm going to want to be able to race it in Pre-90 you can betcha!

[kaw440]

EVO bikes are not technology more advanced that pre85 or 90 bikes and as for period how do you define the difference between say huskys ktm495 maico evo bikes and pre85 the years are so close the technology is the same year just some brands chose to go single shock and some stayed twin shock i say let evo bikes run in both it all comes down to the riders choise he is at no more advantage on a evo bike in pre85 more bikes on the gate is better than less

[BAHNZY]

If running an Evolution class bike in Pre85 is deemed to be kosher, then scrap Evolution all together and build more capacity / rider age classes into Pre85. This will then satisfy the needs of entrants wanting to ride/race a reasonable amount of events in one race day.

[All Things 414]

I'm sure that will probably be the natural progression of things. No arguments here. As long as you can ride up a class (Pre-85 in Pre-90)

[BAHNZY]

Onya Rosco

Using the GCR's as an example;
If you were entering a National Title Event, what would be the result if you entered your 1974 model bike in Pre78 class?

At similar levels, Bikes don't beat Bikes, Riders beat other Riders. As I overhead someone the other night, "That bloke would win on a broom stick" is rather apt.
Let’s get over the competitive nature of whether a twin shock bike is better or worse than a single shock bike.

[holeshot buddy]

pre 85 class was originally instigated  for
the new generation linkage suspension
and watercooled bikes there is no reason
a twin shock be it hybrid, husky, ktm,
or whatever cant compete in this class as long as its the class entered for and not a ride up
so do we have the same riders on the same bikes
riding pre78/ evo/85/90
whats the point
if you only have one bike up here in qld at our club days we have
a one bike rider class so the rider gets an extra 3 legs
and we have an all in at the end of the day x 2 heats
so your 1 bike gets 7 races
also what about if your only bike is a pre 85 say a kx500
you cant ride down in evo
so why should they ride up in pre 85
we just introduced pre 90 up here
with fields about 10-15
all of them pre90 no pre 85
most of the people complaining about not being able to ride up a
class have more than one bike anyway i would bet
i have just spent the last year working on 4 bikes for
the nats all in there proper class
how would i feel about someone riding 1 bike in 3 classes
what do you think
if you cant afford another  bike borrow one theres heaps of guys in
vintage racing who would lend a bike
and pre 90 bikes are still cheap

[Husky500evo]

I have two '84 Husky 500s. I think it would be fair & reasonable to turn up with one of them at a club day and ride Evo & pre '85 classes . But for a national title event, I would have to bring both bikes to do this . One of them would have to have an "E" prefix on the numberplates & the other bike would have to have a "Y" prefix. 

[090]

Okay Ross, you want to ride up because you cant be bothered washing / maintaining another bike. Leith, you want to ride up because you dont want to stick to the eligibility side of things (flat slide and shocks). You are just trying to change things to suit yourselves is the only thing i can see here. Same as people that want to 'interpret' rules a certain way. To make a bike fit in that clearly doesn't fit. Bill, you have plenty of bikes, just bring another or buy one of those "kettles"  .
It is era racing.Each class should show case the era, not an all in .

[JohnnyO]

Exactly! Stop trying to adjust the rules to suit yourselves and buy another bike to ride another class like everybody else has.

[BAHNZY]

As Husqvarna were stretching the model life of their bikes back in the 80's, where would CR500 owners be if the machine was manufactured in January 1985 rather than December 1984?
Theoretically you would not be able to ride in Pre85, but still good to go for Evolution.

The GCR’s tell us that the bike is an Evolution bike, even if it was built in 1984.

[LWC82PE]

No, im not trying to change the rules and nothing on my bike would question eligibilty anyway and would be a hell of a lot more eligible than all the EVO bikes running 2009 made shocks. Flatslides are allowed in evo anyway and so are all my shocks i have, but im actually trying to do the right thing here and have my bike legal for the right class to compete against bikes of the same era. Even if i dont have a flatslide carby, i only want to race my bike with shocks that were available in 82 or pre 85 and i do not want to use shocks newer than 1985 and i dont want to ride EVO with shocks that were not available pre 1980. Its just a personal thing that i want it to be correct for the period. Flatslides were available in 82 so i think its fine i can have one on my 82 but even though they are allowed in Evo, i would not feel right going against bikes like 78 or 79 models when mikuni flatslides were not around then.
I dont think its right to force later model twinshock bikes to compete against 78-79 models, when they are more at home in pre 85, especially the last model twinshock Husqvarnas.

[Nathan S]

.... Leith, you want to ride up because you dont want to stick to the eligibility side of things (flat slide and shocks).

I reckon that Leith's attitude is entirely reasonable. The historic road race guys have a rule that says that the bike will be defined by its newest major component - and the same actually applies for us, even though we don't specifically state it.

If he wants to upgrade his Evo bike to pre-85 specs* and race it among the pre-85 bikes, then let him. If we were to say "No, its an Evo bike so you must return it to Evo specs, and race it among the Evo bikes" then he'd probably stay at home, which wouldn't help anyone.

Its no different to someone with a LTR-modified '74 model bike, racing it as a pre-78, rather than pre-75.

HEAVEN allows you to ride up one class per bike. You are strongly encouraged to ride up a capacity class, rather than an era - which I reckon is a good approach because it keeps the racing as a showcase of a particular era.
Of course, if you've got an open class bike, then your second ride is in the newer era.

Personally, I think that the cost of building & running a second bike is minimal compared to the on-going costs of getting to events, entry fees, etc etc - and having a second bike at the races also means that even a major mechanical disaster doesn't end the fun early.

*The funny thing is that the shocks and flat-slide aren't enough to bump it out of the Evo class anyhow. But you see my point.
Edit I type too slowly - Leith's pointed this out himself since I started typing.