Author Topic: any Yamaha TY riders out there?  (Read 13205 times)

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Oldbiker

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any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« on: November 04, 2008, 01:02:04 pm »
We've seen all the other makes mentioned, but no Yamaha's!

Offline David Lahey

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2008, 07:58:25 pm »
Yes there are hundreds of TY riders out there. There are probably no TY photos in that string because Yamaha TYs are not generally seen as rare or interesting as most people interested in VMX have seen them lots of times already.

I've been campaigning TY Yamahas in competition since they were new bikes and still think they are the bees knees if you want to win but because they are so commonly seen, I don't usually push the publicity on them, and have even taken to riding anything else just for a change.

If you want to see what sort of TYs are in use out there, heres a link to something you might find interesting. It's a very long forum string on the Trials Australia website with photos of mostly queensland-based twinshock trials bikes.

http://www.trials.com.au/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=2556

Regards
David Lahey
Yamaha TY nut
previous pseudonym feetupfun

Offline David Lahey

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2008, 08:11:54 pm »
Here you go. Brooweena Twinshock-only trial 2006.
previous pseudonym feetupfun

Oldbiker

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2008, 10:57:14 pm »
I've seen you on Trials.com.au feetup. you know me as Stu
I thought it may have been that the TY's are getting older they may show up here. I'd like to do the 2 day Classic Trial next year. Any idea where it will be held?




Offline David Lahey

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2008, 08:52:53 pm »
Hi Stu. Thats a bit tricky having two names. You had me going there.
Which 2-day Classic are you talking about? There will be a Brooweena Twinshock and Classic-only 2 day at Brooweena (near Maryborough) again in winter and theres the Denman 2 day in June but I don't know which property it will be at.
We are cooking up the idea of another 2 day trial like Brooweena (ie Twinshock and Classic only) in 2009 but a bit further North (near Gladstone) but are only at the stage of asking potentially interested riders before we commit to running it.
previous pseudonym feetupfun

Oldbiker

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #5 on: November 05, 2008, 09:57:21 pm »
Seeing that I started with the boys from Denman many years ago(G'day Chappy!) I'd like to give the Denman 2 Day Trial a go. I know it will be bloody good weekend!
Gladstone is a bit far at this stage, but you never know!

Offline JC

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2008, 05:49:01 pm »
Hey David (feetup),

I've heard of you too. I grew up at Gladstone in the 60s & 70's but raced MX. Attended a few trials but never competed.

I heard of you a couple of years ago from someone else in vintage trials, but I tho't you were into sherpaTs & MARs.

I have the bones of a TY250A (frame, rusty forks, wheels, matching nos bottom end) that I've often wondered what to do with - complete it as a trials bike or turn it into an Alpina sort of bike.

If they're as good at trials as you say they are, maybe I should go that route

firko

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #7 on: November 06, 2008, 06:53:55 pm »
Maybe someone on this thread can help me. Many years ago I swapped a carton of beer for a decrepit but running TY250A that has some nice mods like YZ wheels and modified reed valve setup. The thing that seperates this bike from others is the chrome swingarm and brake stays and distinctive metallic green and pearl white custom paint job that appears to have been professionally applied. Somebody told me that he thought the bike had been used for professional showground trick riding by somebody whose name he couldn't remember. It's now out of action, tucked away down at the farm after the kids decided that the petrol out of the SL125 would work in the TY. I eventually hope to get around to restoring it, maybe in the green and white scheme if we find that the bike had a part in history. If anybody has any memories of a cool looking green and white TY I'd love to know its history.
In the meantime I'll sort my Maico trials special and learn how to ride these trials things properly.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2008, 08:26:28 pm by firko »

Offline David Lahey

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2008, 08:53:35 pm »
Hi JC
So does that mean you are a real Gladstone local? I've only been here 13 years so can never be classed as real local being born elsewhere.
Seeing you were doing MX here way back then you probably rode at the MX track beside the Boyne River at Benaraby at fireman Col ???s place. He still has the Mk2 Matador which aparrently was a hot setup for MX in 1965.
Yes I'm into Sherpa Ts and OSSAs and anything else from the 1970s. For many years I was a Yamaha-only person but gradually developed a burning desire to know what the other bikes of my youth were really like to ride so I set about getting one of each bike that I fancied as a kid. Most are rebuilt from basket cases because that was all I could get hold of at the time. I've kept them all basically standard so other people can give their opinions on a standard bike too, riding them back to back. It might be crazy but I love it. The only serious mods I've done are to lower the pegs on my TY250B and that is because there is a standard TY250A to ride if people want to feel what a standard TY250 feels like - and I've pretty much gone to town on a TY175B - its like a rolling test bed for modifications.
About JCs TY250A, even standard they make a very good Alpina type bike in fact that is one thing I use the TY250A for. The other use for the TY250A is to ride it at trials exhibitions so lots of old dudes like me can tell me how they had one of them as a youngster. The later TY250s had a smaller gap between 3rd and 4th gear but that doesn't stop it being a blast to ride up mountains on.

Firko your TY250A sounds interesting. I was just about to redecorate the TY250B in pearl and metallic green and following the paint patterns on the TY250A because it has looked too standard for too long.
 
In about 1974 the local trials hotshots where I lived in Brissy had a pre-production TY250 that had been brought to OZ and ridden by Mick Andrews when he was here. I think it had a plated swingarm. Can't remember if the wheels were YZ or not but it had a distinctive exhaust that went straight up from the exhaust port like an OSSA MAR. It had a paint pattern the same as a TY250A but the yellow bits were metallic maroon. If you think that one might be your bike I can put you in contact with the person who owned it back then.
I think the prototype TY250 that Mick rides in the old Yamaha promotional films made near where he lived and that he rode in the 1973 SSDT might have had YZ wheels. Now theres an excuse to look at that film again!
You know if you ride around on that Maico then get on a TY250 it would feel like a feather by comparison, even though the weights are probably very similar. I know that Maicos are endlessly cool, but its enough for me just enjoy looking at them nowadays.

David
previous pseudonym feetupfun

Offline JC

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2008, 01:41:22 pm »
D, Yes I was a tru-blu local. Lived there fron 59 when I was 2 till I went away to Uni in 75 & on/off thro 70's & early 80's.

I sure did race at Boyne Raceway - in fact I designed the track you mention on Col Howse' place (w his son) & on which our club ran the 75 Qld 250 championships - a great day. Col's son & I were school mates & went to Uni together. I was down at his place every 2nd weekend riding/racing that track. If I say so myself, it was a great track.

I rode his Mk2 matador a few times too. They weren't that great tho the previous owner raced it reasonably successfully in local 'scrambles' in 70-71 before he went onto become B grade trials champ in Qld on an Alpina he rode to work. Last I heard Col had quite a collection of bikes.

RE the TY250. I was going to ask you about the placement of the pegs. Just 1 look & they look way too hi - tho the MARs were quite hi too as I recall. No doubt Mick's preference.

I'm thinking of using a DT gearbox & barrel&head in mine, probably w a longer swingarm too. I have the TY gearbox, but don't have TY top end.

I remember the show circuit Demos on the TYs but can't remember the guy's name. Don't think it was Peter Pace (Oz champ at the time) but it was somebody supposedly fairly prominent at the time- ah yes, Dave Pinkerton wasn't it?

Offline David Lahey

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2008, 08:27:53 pm »
JC
Yes Dave Pinkerton was a legend of that time and another rider from back then is still riding - Steve Johnson. Do you remember the two of them in the movie Naturally Free on their trials bikes doing endless wheelies? Steve still rides trials and his son Brendan is the current Aussie Twinshock champ riding one of Dad's Sherpa Ts. Steve rode pre-65 Classic this year at the Titles and came second.
I've met Cols son but know his daughter Julie much better as she is the wife of a riding buddy (Ian Gudgeon). You are probably the right age to know Wayne Onions, Reg Pugh and Os Blacker too.
The MX track for Gladstone has moved around since then, next being out near ORICA on the way to Mt Larcom next to the mud flats and with a beaut flat-track made from imported deco granite. About 6 years ago we finally had to give up that land for the new Rio Tinto alumina refinery and the current MX track was built at Benaraby in a motorsport complex including the drag strip, on the Western side of the Bruce highway, a bit South of opposite Cols old place.
About the TY, the TY250A motor is probably very close to DT2/3 or DT250A port timing, the main performance difference of the TY comes from having a weight band added to the OD of the flywheel. Later TY250s also have milder port timing that makes them a bit better for trials competition.
Mick wanted the pegs high on the OSSA and the TYs and a few others at the time followed the trend like the Cota 348 and the KT250. The height of the pegs was simply to improve ground clearance. Bultacos never went that way. Mick liked to turn tight with the arch of his outside foot resting on the end of the footpeg so that is one reason why the OSSA and TY pegs are so short. The other is that it reduces the overall width of the bike for better clearance. Bultaco Sherpa T pegs are shorter than Alpina and Pursang pegs (but did not follow the high footpeg trend). If you have bars that are the same (high) rise as what came on TYs new, then the riding position is not too bad, but lowering the pegs does improve balance at rest. Remember that when these bike were made, there was no stopping allowed so continuous forward movement was critical - and balance was not as critical, hence the ground clearance issue. Current rules allow for stopping. Modern bikes are much lower than twinshocks and their footpegs are also as low as possible, to improve stationary balance. Many twinshock riders use modern techniques (stopping and hopping the front) so also benefit from lowering the footpegs. Likewise it is an advantage to have a more upright stance for unweighting the front for hopping it sideways so the lower pegs help here too.
We must be pretty close in age.
Here is a picture of my TY250A from a riding demo at the Rockhampton Heritage Village. Since this demo day with our portable obstacles, we have constructed a permanent trials riding display area with rocks and logs dug into the side of a slope. It is a terrific setup and a great way to publicise trials, especially on the days they run the Heritage Machinery days.
previous pseudonym feetupfun

Offline David Lahey

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2008, 10:49:48 pm »
Firko
I just had a look at the old Yamaha publicity film that shows prototype and pre-prod TY250s and can confirm that the front and rear hubs are both YZ type on the bike he rode in the 1973 SSDT.
There is also footage taken near Micks house of him on an earlier prototype that has hubs that look like AT3/CT3 hubs. On this older bike the flywheel cover lacks the fancy groove pattern seen on the TY250A production item.
David
previous pseudonym feetupfun

Oldbiker

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2008, 01:29:14 pm »
Firko, it sounds like you have a rare bike. Resto it and bring it out for a couple of rides.

Offline JC

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2008, 09:12:25 am »
Dave, the guys you mentioned were a couple of years older than me. I knew Reg Pugh's younger brothers. Oz Blacker bought the Yam dealership of Dick Burns as I recall but I was long gone from G'stone by then.

Yes, I noticed that the Sherpa Ts never went the hi-pegs route. They were the only trials bike I had anything to do with. I remember riding the 1st model 325 SherpaT (M91/92?) & instantly feeling like I could do anything (trials-like) on it, but never persued competetion trials.

The TY engines are quite a lot diff to the DT. Diff crankcases, diff placement of kickstarter (higher), much larger dia crank (appears same as DT360 except for pin offset for shorter stroke), diff clutch & ign covers, diff primary reduction & much milder port timimg than DT barrels (tho stud spacing is the same), as well as the extra band on the ign flywheel that you mentioned.

Offline JC

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Re: any Yamaha TY riders out there?
« Reply #14 on: November 14, 2008, 09:24:17 am »
Dave,

Which model later TY's had the diff gear spacing & diff porting?