What flatslides are legal for Pre 85?

[Nathan S]

Nathan, Thorpes bike, number 3, has the standard left side vertical inlet for the fuel.

The other photo shows a redrilled inlet entering the same gallery. It is not a design difference, probably just a convenience allowing the very low right side of the tank to drain.

In all other visible respects, right down to the color scheme the carbies look production.

The production PJs had the angled inlet. Can you prove that the angled inlet carbs existed in 1984? If not, can you prove that the vertical inlet and angled inlet are identical inside?
"The onus of proof is in the competitor".

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Ross, that would be very interesting. The written rules do NOT exclude works parts. VMX, like MX in the 1970s and 80s, do not specify production parts.

[Momus]

Nathan

I've written (emailed) to Keihin in Japan asking for information on the release dates and availability of their flat slide carbies.

I'm not holding my breath waiting though.


Judging from the period photos, and JohnnyO's helpful offering, it seems that the issue is pretty settled.

[Nathan S]

To take a step back, PJs are rubbish.
Given the choice between running a PJ carb and a night with Justine Clarke, or a Mikuni VM and a night with Bronwyn Bishop, I'd go for the VM and abstinence every single time.

[Momus]

What about Julie Bishop and a Jikov?

[Nathan S]

Is "die in a fire" an option?

[FireKwaka]

I went to a lot of trouble to get my PJ running right, won't have an choice but to run it. Hope Nathan doesn't protest I'll just say it was off an RC500 

[Rossvickicampbell]

Nathan - hold your breath - I agree!!  I did not think there was anything in the MOMS preventing use of works bits and pieces that could be bought - even full bikes if you were that lucky - however am aware (if I remember correctly) of a protest upheld and it went all the way to MA adjudication who came back with "since the parts were works and not available to the public" they could not be used - or similar - remember the failing memory 

[Spanish Armada]

Yes another topic settled till the gates drop 

[FourstrokeForever]

Seriously......this is where punters get put off of racing at the "Nats". Who cares what Carby you run on your bike? Unless you have somehow managed to make a fuel injected 1984 CR500, is ANY
flatslide carby going to make that much of a difference to a round slide?
We all seem to forget that the least functional part of any motorcycle is the person controlling (or attempting to) the bike.

[mboddy]

We all seem to forget that the least functional part of any motorcycle is the person controlling (or attempting to) the bike.

The rider should also be pre 1985 too then.

[Hardo]

Seriously......this is where punters get put off of racing at the "Nats". Who cares what Carby you run on your bike? Unless you have somehow managed to make a fuel injected 1984 CR500, is ANY
flatslide carby going to make that much of a difference to a round slide?
We all seem to forget that the least functional part of any motorcycle is the person controlling (or attempting to) the bike.

+1 mate.

A lot of the punters that comment in here about "eligibility" don't even race....

[John Orchard]

And what happens if we throw out the rule book? ........ sexmax?

[KTM47]

Nathan

I've written (emailed) to Keihin in Japan asking for information on the release dates and availability of their flat slide carbies.

I'm not holding my breath waiting though.


Judging from the period photos, and JohnnyO's helpful offering, it seems that the issue is pretty settled.

Please note several things.

1.  If you could get a keihin flat slide carby off a 1984 works bike you could ask MA if you can use it.

2.  Just because something went through scrutineering at one meeting (or championship) does not mean it can't be protested (within 30 minutes of the close of scrutineering).

3.  Also  GCR 16.15.13.1.  Acceptable for Pre 85 class are machines and COMPONENTS built up to and including the 1984 model.  It is COMPONENTS built up to and including the 1984 model.  It could be argued that Model refers to the production bike.

My gut feeling is if keihin had the PJ carbies available for sale to the general public "MA may approve their use for Pre 85.  So get the proof and submit it to MA.

Also this is from the 2014 MOMS so it may have changed.

16.11.1.2  The onus of proof of eligibility shall rest wholly upon the rider or entrant of the machine.

If in doubt ASK MA.

[Momus]

@ KTM427. 

Why does MA have to be asked when they have published regulations?

The rules principle seems clear.

If the part was available in 1984 then it can be used.

There is no caveat  prohibiting works parts or specifying a particular type of availability.

If a succesful appeal against the use of a part or component is going to set a precedent then the relevant rule should be re- written to reflect that.

There are many precedents from pre 1985 when works components or complete works bikes were run and if one of the categories aims is to faithfully reproduce history, rather than rewrite it the use of this stuff should be encouraged.

Anyway, judging from conversations and the evidence on scramble tracks, the issue of flat slide eligibility seems decided.

[John Orchard]

I don't want to seem a 'trouble maker' but, if I ride the National Titles and I spend a lot of time to get my stock carb sorted and if I just happen to get a 'place' and there is a a PJ or PWK on a bike in front of me, I'll be protesting.  Hey it's a National Title, no friends when a 'sheep station' is on the line  ;-)