Bike eligiblity, arguments and perspective

[Big Bird]

I’ve got a bit to say here and it might seem random and scattered.  I am motivated to write this after reading yet another argument about bike eligibility and who should be allowed to come to what event.  I am NOT after sympathy, but offer this as context.  I sometimes think a few here need reminding that we are all in this to enjoy ourselves.

I am 46 years old, and I love bikes.  I’ve been riding since I was 8.  I’ve raced motocross, done a few years of road racing, worked in the industry for 12 years, and despite the fact that I couldn’t ride out of sight on a dark night I have never lost my passion for these things.

A few years ago I was diagnosed with a degenerative neurological condition.  I was told that at best, I might be able to manage it with little impact on my lifestyle.  At worst I would be in full-time care within 5-10 years.  I seem to be heading towards the latter more than the former.

Upon diagnosis I decided that it was time to start enjoying what I still could do.  I bought a modern Husky, loved it.  I also discovered the joy of doing up old bikes.  As a 13 year old I had lusted after RM125T’s, YZ125G’s, CR125 RA’s.  A year later all I wanted in this life was an RM “X” model – 125 or 250.  I now own both an RM250X and an RM125T and am just chuffed to be restoring them to their former glory.  I’ve even found some Fox AirShox to put on the 125.

I finally “get” historic racing.   In my earlier days I thought it provided us “modern” racers an opportunity to go the food van before the official lunch rush.  Now I see the joy of people getting together and sharing their passion, and helping each other to keep on track.  It is about community and being part of something bigger than ourselves.  It is about purpose.

I went to HBBB as a spectator this year, first time I have ever been and I was really looking forward to it.  I walked through the MX pits and the first thing I heard was some angry lemon-sucking old whinger vocalizing at the top of his voice the character shortcomings of one of his peers.  Apparently there was something heated going on in the background about an eligibility issue, which sounded utterly trivial to me, and this bloke and his faction were making a huge song and dance about it.  It reminded me very quickly of everything less than complimentary I had heard about the historic scene.   Old men arguing about …. well, anything.  Similarly, I learnt fast that the quickest way to turn grown VMXers into utter parodies of themselves is to use the words 1977 RM125 and aluminium swingarm in the same sentence.

How is it that some people take up a hobby, but then feel the need to spend so much energy arguing about it?  Does it really make for a better sport?  A better experience? 
   
I love my RM’s.  I would also love to get my hands on a good 1988 YZ125, my first ever race bike (2VN-037249, if any of you have it in your shed…).  And my pride and joy is a 1967 Sprite, a bike that was built the year I was born and which I feel utterly privileged to own.  Some of my passion comes from nostalgia, some is just respect for history and just a love of bikes irrespective of their origins or age.  I’d gladly ride any of these bikes, anywhere that I could ride them, and I’d gladly ride at a pre 90 event, or a pre 85, or a pre 70, or anything that was available to me. 

We are meant to be united.  We all love our bikes, we all love the opportunity to ride them and talk about them and show them off to each other.  I could not give a fat rat’s if the bike before me is a pre-90 or a pre-70 or if it is Japanese or British or if it is period correct or if it is a road bike or a scrambler or if it was brought here on a trailer or ridden or if the rider has ridden all his life or has just swung in to the scene with his hipster mates.  If the passion is there, they are one of us.

The biggest threat that this sport faces has nothing to do with cut-off years and component eligibility and age of riders.  It is the image we project to newcomers to the sport, and the community we build as we grow.  We can be welcoming and inclusive – and the sport will thrive.  OR we can be jealous and argumentative, and watch the squabbling slowly drive our people back into their own sheds.
 
Now I’m not trying to milk my situation as some sort of one-upmanship, but I can assure you that when you are confronted with not being able to ride at all, suddenly the sorts of issues that some people want to invest their energies into start seeming damn trivial.  I know there are some others on these boards whose recent health scares put mine into perspective too – and I’d expect their point of view might be similar.

So – can we get back to enjoying ourselves?   We have a great sport here, lets not spoil it over trivialities. 

I hope the above doesn’t seem too self indulgent, but I just needed to get it off my chest.  I'll go and have a beer now....
 
Cheers all,

Geoff

[Stewart Allen]

Well put Geoff great perspective.

[Rookie#1]

Thanks for your personal insight Geoff, whether one agrees or disagrees with the point of view it's certainly one with the utmost validity. Do you still work in the industry?? Good luck with your struggles mate, kudus to you for looking at your glass as "half full" 

Cheers, Brendan
PS enjoy that beer 

[albrid-3]

Big Bird, thanks for all that introduction to our sport that we all love, I have been saying it for years, I have been involve with this sport right from the very start, I totally on your side. My son has a 1989 yamaha YZ125 , there would be much difference between the two models if your interested.

[firko]

That's the best post in months Geoff......absolutely spot on. I really hope your health woes go into some sort of remission and you can remain involved in our sport for years to come.

[NSR]

Thanks Geoff, great piece.

Now I’m not trying to milk my situation as some sort of one-upmanship, but I can assure you that when you are confronted with not being able to ride at all, suddenly the sorts of issues that some people want to invest their energies into start seeming damn trivial. 

Geez,  I've just got arthritis's in my hands and I feel the same. 
Cheers
Noel     

[Iain Cameron]

Well what can one say after that !!! Best post in a long time .  Iain  Ps Geoff  HBBB was my first time this year too , Had a great time even got a Cpl of laps on my possessed pre 70 Yamaha's .

[Nathan S]

The old bike scene is about people - the bikes are the obvious bit, but not really the important bit.

My Harrow experience this year is a good example:
Had Mate #0 ring me to tell me that entries were open - I wasn't sure I could make it (lots going on in my life), so I fobbed him off.
Then Mate #1 just goes ahead and enters me.
Busted my arse to get my CR ready, wasn't going to make it.
Mate #1 and mate #2 took time out of the working day to help get it ready.
Sent a text to Mate #3, asking if he might have a cheap bike I could buy to get me around Harrow.
He says "No, but Mate #4 has a spare bike. I'll ask if he's happy for you to ride it".
Mate #4 is happy for me to ride the bike, and happy to cart it across Victoria for me.

Then we get to Harrow. Catch up with a bunch of good people - including plenty of mates - who are all enjoying themselves a whole lot. Got recognised in the Drakie/Baker show, along with everyone else. Drank too many beers with Mates #5, #6, #7, #8 & #9 (along with Mates #1 & #2).
Mates #5 & #6 were happy to transport bits to and from their home state for me. Then again, Mate #6 was riding my YZ in the event...

Got helped out of a boghole by two complete strangers (New Mate #1 and #2).

Then I broke Mate #4's bike. Not catastrophic, but not what either of us wanted. He is unfazed, and says stuff like "it was overdue for a rebuild anyhow". And refuses offers of parts or money - just "you could return the favour someday", which I'd be more than happy to do.

Mate #7 had offered to transport a project bike back to Canberra for me, but because I hadn't gotten back to Mate #8 in time, he'd sold it to Mate #9.

I can go on, but you get the idea - it's about PEOPLE NOT BIKES. People with a common interest in old bikes for sure, but people.

My stories from various Classic Dirts, various HBBBs, most club days and even various CMX titles are similar. The bikes are the focus, but it's the people that make it special.

To then get home to the news that the organisers are planning on introducing a rule that was going to exclude about a dozen people who don't quite meet the letter of the law, seemed like the most pointless and destructive thing I've heard in a long time.

What can I do from there? Pretend to be happy and positive about it, and say "yeah, great idea fellas", even though every part of me thinks it is A Very Bad Idea?

We are a tiny fringe sport/past-time, and will never be mainstream - but we are dooming ourselves to mediocrity while we are so focused on saying "no" and finding ways to exclude people.
Obviously there have to be limits, but working out how to say Yes and be inclusive is what I've been harping on about (in my own charming way).

[Big Bird]

Thanks all for the kind words. 

Nathan, I think we are on the same page.  We are part of a community, and that is worth fighting for.  I just get concerned when the fighting starts happening within the community, not for the good of the community.

Thanks Iain.  I probably saw you at HBBB.  Next year I'll get around and talk to people a bit more...

Cheers NSR, and yeah, it seems there are a few of us around who are pondering whinge culture.

Firko, thanks, and I wont be leaving this community too quickly.

Dave, you were the guy who got me into this whole game when I bought that Sprite DT1 off you.  Cheers mate.

Rookie, the beer went down quite nicely    I work for a mob called the Society of Automotive Engineers now (SAE), so sort of linked to the industry still

Thanks oldstuff.

Cheers all

Geoff

[TM BILL]

Top post Geoff  you and Nathan are both correct it is about people but it is human nature that causes any problems or dissention in what we do.

Sure we all want to ride and enjoy our old bikes thats why we got into it in the first place . For the record i have a real problem with authority and disapline  in everyday life , it can be a good thing and a bad thing .

With motorcycling i am different , its what i want to do so i try to play within the guidelines / rules laid down by whos ever event i am riding at and get pissed off when others wont comply or have to push their own agenda while at the event .

Im not saying that i agree with all the rules and regs in the MOMs but if i feel passionatly enough i will try to get them changed through the correct channels .

As for putting off newcomers to what we do with the attitude i and some others have about doing it by the book then personally i dont care because i dont want / need another person in the sport whos going to whinge and want to buck the system .

Educating newcomers to the sport is the way forward / events like the recent bike show Ted and the boys put on in Sydney is a great way to introduce new people to what we do .

In your post you called what  we do a sport , all sports have rules and all sports have a percentage of competitors who want to play outside the rules . Even the Social events like the CD events and  Broadford bonnanza have guidelines/ cut off dates .If these are not upheld then why call it a classic or vintage event , just call it a motorcylce rally and invite anyone to ride / show any motorcycle they have , but i think there are plenty of those events already .

William Doe MIAME

[09.0]

Top post Geoff  you and Nathan are both correct it is about people but it is human nature that causes any problems or dissention in what we do.

Sure we all want to ride and enjoy our old bikes thats why we got into it in the first place . For the record i have a real problem with authority and disapline  in everyday life , it can be a good thing and a bad thing .

With motorcycling i am different , its what i want to do so i try to play within the guidelines / rules laid down by whos ever event i am riding at and get pissed off when others wont comply or have to push their own agenda while at the event .

Im not saying that i agree with all the rules and regs in the MOMs but if i feel passionatly enough i will try to get them changed through the correct channels .

As for putting off newcomers to what we do with the attitude i and some others have about doing it by the book then personally i dont care because i dont want / need another person in the sport whos going to whinge and want to buck the system .

Educating newcomers to the sport is the way forward / events like the recent bike show Ted and the boys put on in Sydney is a great way to introduce new people to what we do .

In your post you called what  we do a sport , all sports have rules and all sports have a percentage of competitors who want to play outside the rules . Even the Social events like the CD events and  Broadford bonnanza have guidelines/ cut off dates .If these are not upheld then why call it a classic or vintage event , just call it a motorcylce rally and invite anyone to ride / show any motorcycle they have , but i think there are plenty of those events already .

William Doe MIAME

Yep! I started to post similar.

say Yes and be inclusive is what I've been harping on about (in my own charming way).

But yes is the answer. Purchase, borrow the correct bike for the event and its all ' Yes Man'.

[mboddy]

Im not saying that i agree with all the rules and regs in the MOMs but if i feel passionatly enough i will try to get them changed through the correct channels .

The recent Veri rules eligibility discussion is not about rules in the MoMS.

I was not at that original Vinduro meeting when the rules were originally discussed,
but I was told that it was decided that the pre-85 cuttoff would not be strict like VMX and the the rules would be reviewed at a later date.
The problem we have at the moment is that there is talk of tightening the rules rather than talk of reviewing what would make the rules the best for the sport.
Tighteneing the rules to exclude bikes currently coming to events and excluding bikes that are in the same spirit of Vinduro are both bad for the sport.
 

[Rossvickicampbell]

yet again Bill has in right IMO - we are vintage not just bikes, we have events which are open and free for all and others that maybe because they are competition and not social have stricter rules.  I have no issues with that - I checked out the local scene before buying a bike and bought a bike to suit that I never imagined I would ever do and because I am also like Geoff just enjoyed the bike.

Enjoy what is on offer, if you don't like it either don't go or try and change through the system (and remember the majority may not agree with you).

Sweat the big stuff in life - and remember there isn't any big stuff in VMX 

[John Orchard]

Thanks Big Bird for starting the thread (although it wouldn't surprise me if it ends up in a sh!t fight, lol).

I too left MX to go roadracing (in '85) and after MA & MV killing it with bad management, have returned to the dirt last year, getting the vmx bug real bad (buying 11 dirtbikes in 12 months!).

I love everything motorcycle, be it 'Pre 70' to 'Pre 2000' mx, CB750 to ZX10, Jawa speedway bike or TLR125 trials bike.  And yes I built an '77 RM125 with an alloy swingarm  lol  ;-)

I can understand some riders, that take so much care to build a bike to exactly fit a class, complaining about other bikes that don't comply.  But if the people running CD (for example) gets its numbers from just 'Pre 85' so be it.

At Viper & VCM events in Vic they are both relaxed when it comes 'eligbility' so I don't think it is a big issue.  I guess the people running the National Champs need to look at the numbers of riders they are getting verses the cripiling compliance regulations?

[TM BILL]

At Viper & VCM events in Vic they are both relaxed when it comes 'eligbility' so I don't think it is a big issue.  I guess the people running the National Champs need to look at the numbers of riders they are getting verses the cripiling compliance regulations?

John while i can see the philophisy behind relaxing the elidgibility at club level i think that attitude also leads to problems at national events .

Ole mate joins up with your or anyones club , really gets into it and is having a ball , he races pre 78 on a 1977 250 RYMX but has a few 78 / 79 model components fitted but nobody cares or points out its technicaly outside the rules . Next he gets caught up in the enthusiasm for the nats and enters pre 78 250 as this is what he races at club level .

Gets to the nats and

Scenario #1 gets pulled up at scrutineering and told change it or ride up a class ( unlikley as in my experience officals like the badge but dont want to be the bad guy )

Scenario #2 gets told on the startline for practice by other riders that his bike is inelidgable and that he could be protested / excluded ( unlikley as most fellow competitors are there for a good time not a confrontation and surley the officials will pick that up , see above )

Scenario #3 ole mate races the event and podiums only to get protested out of placing by another competitor . Ole mate is gutted and confused /dissolusioned , fellow competitor feels bad about it but hey hes played by the rules , offical is uncomforatble as now wearing the badge aint so much fun .

The rules are the rules and should be upheld at all levels or done away with completly.

To say the organisers should look at numbers versus crippling compliance is not the clubs call , they are held to ransom by MA and their GREED and the contents of that MOMs