EVO legal flatslide

[JohnnyO]

The rules state in clear english "ANY period flatslide". My bike is 1982, the carbs were available in 1982, maybe earlier. The evo "period" ranges right up to 1984 with certain manufacturers. The way I read it, it is a legal period carburetor. I asked a simple question to clarify and opened a can of worms. Lots of differing opinions, but no clear answer forthcoming. It's not about building a bike outside the rules at all, it's a legitimate inquiry. Next someone will say a 1984 Husqvarna CR500 is a pre '85 bike even though it meets all EVO requirements. Maybe the evo rules should be amended to no linkage, no water cooling, drum brakes, built before 1985.
To answer your questions Brent:
Could I fit a flatslide TM to my 1982 EVO bike in 1982, yes. Could I fit 1984 MUGEN or Simons UXD 60's to my 1982 EVO bike in 1982, no.
BUT could I fit 1984 Mugen or Simons UXD60's or WP40U's to my 1984 EVO bike in 1984, YES. So there's an even bigger can of worms.

No one here has a clear answer Michael.. you probably need to ask the question to Dave Tanner or Col Metcher, someone who really is an MA official and not just a forum official

[evo550]

It's a bit of a worry if the rule book refers to the evo class in "era's", as Nathan point's out that covers all classes in some shape or form. The way I interpret and apply the evo rule to the flat slide carb would be if it came from a bike that meets all the evo component requirements irrespective of manufacture date it's good to go (maybe a 1984 husky cr 500), but of it came from a non evo legal bike even if it came from the same year as a evo legal bike ( 1984 Honda cr 500) then it's not good to go.Simple really.

[motomaniac]

Neither were twin clicker fully adjustable rebound & compression shocks, which is the norm these days

Thats another issue and IMO they shouldn't be allowed ,I don't run them at this stage and making it "the norm" only adds to the expense of setting up a bike which might sway any potential new guys thinking about getting into the sport or old guys like my brother who gave it away at a time when the bikes started to get that serious and costly.

Fat bars are a monstrosity on VMX bikes and are surely not "period correct" but are no problems

I agree and I thought that point was sorted after the hypocracy of the 2008 pre78 protest.No more fat bars.

There seems to be little "common sense" with the rules and heaps of reasons for anyone to protest.

IMO its perfect common sense.EVO bikes built post 79/80 already have enough of an advantage on the rest

I ride Huskies which were EVO legal until 1984, the no later equipment rule cannot be applied when I would be fitting a carb readliy available in 1982 to a 1982 EVO legal bike. If I were fitting it to a 1981 or earlier bike, there MAY be an issue.

You just suggested that there are two class's of EVO bikes,pre 85 /post 81 and the rest,pre81.So why dont we just forget the failed EVO experiment as it seems to complicated
and just bring back pre 80 but as pre 81 with some carry over models and post 81/pre85 classs then you can run a pre 85 carb that wasn't available for the other EVO bikes with no problems.Only you EVO bike will be in pre 85, just like Rangelov and Guerra in the GP's?

[motomaniac]

Could I fit a flatslide TM to my 1982 EVO bike in 1982, yes. Could I fit 1984 MUGEN or Simons UXD 60's to my 1982 EVO bike in 1982, no.
BUT could I fit 1984 Mugen or Simons UXD60's or WP40U's to my 1984 EVO bike in 1984, YES. So there's an even bigger can of worms.

Mugen kits were available 82/83 /84. Simons UXD maybe weren't available in 82 but they were in 83 so some guy with a 83 Husky could fit them if components that came after the EVO only era are allowed. Its not a can of worms because its not EVO .

[motomaniac]

It's a bit of a worry if the rule book refers to the evo class in "era's", as Nathan point's out that covers all classes in some shape or form. The way I interpret and apply the evo rule to the flat slide carb would be if it came from a bike that meets all the evo component requirements irrespective of manufacture date it's good to go (maybe a 1984 husky cr 500), but of it came from a non evo legal bike even if it came from the same year as a evo legal bike ( 1984 Honda cr 500) then it's not good to go.Simple really.

Thats about it .Remember the EVO class came after the pre 80 class .Its purpose was to allow some "carry over tech" models to race with pre 80 bikes. So many 80/81/82/83/84 models that owners didnt feel were competitive against the new tech bikes of the early 80's would have a more even class to compete in.In my "Im nobody opinion" as soon as you include components from the new tech early 80's models your bike is no longer a " carry over" model from pre 80 technology. Pretty uncomplicated to me.

[holeshot buddy]

simple fix flat slides only allowed on huskys
all the rest round slides as they were all pre 1981
let K run it or any one else with a husky .technically they are the only models
 that can run them  who cares

[motomaniac]

simple fix flat slides only allowed on huskys
all the rest round slides as they were all pre 1981
let K run it or any one else with a husky .technically they are the only models
 that can run them  who cares

as if the later model Husky's dont have enough of an advantage over a pre80 Jap EVO. All 1982 model Husky's had mikuni round slides ,Bigelows and Grossi's works 82 Husky's had round slides.No flatslide crbs except Blue Magnums are listed in White Brothers catalogue for 83.
Whatever! no one cares except if someone enters a pre 78 race with rubber mounted 78 model handle bar clamps.As if no bikes pre 78 had those.

[bigk]

Can I paint the carb blue & be legal? This has gotten ridiculous and it seems emotions have taken over again. So I'll build an EVO bike with externally adjustable modern shocks, fat flexible bars, modified forks with emulators and whatever else is legal by the rules (maybe a set of 1980 Honda cartridges). While I'm at it I'll add great big fat footpegs, easy pull clutch & brake levers, modern electronic ignition, improved exhaust system built yesterday with today's technology, a modern reed block, wheels with new modern high spec rims and big heavy spokes fitted with mousse tubes & current tyres. No possible protests there, but because I want the bike to stay "period correct" and eliminate the possibility of a protest, I'll stick with a VM roundslide carb. Maybe I'll fit a power jet kit to it.
It's your brothers choice to step out Brent, he can still ride a stock bike. There's plenty of guys out there who could give me a lesson on how to ride on dead standard XR75. I like trick things for no other reason but, and am forunate enough to be able to do it. If it "psychs" someone out, that's the only advantage I'd gain. When I look at other peoples bikes I generally say wow, good job. Don't think I've ever said or thought something like, oh that's not legal it has a flatslide on it. The rules are hard to deal with, I can't even ride my stock standard '77 Husky in pre '78 without forking with it to accomodate the MOMS.
K

[Lozza]

A TM flatslide has been log booked in Period 5 road racing(Pre 83) as a IIRC an RM250 82???

Can I paint the carb blue & be legal? This has gotten ridiculous and it seems emotions have taken over again. So I'll build an EVO bike with externally adjustable modern shocks, fat flexible bars, modified forks with emulators and whatever else is legal by the rules (maybe a set of 1980 Honda cartridges). While I'm at it I'll add great big fat footpegs, easy pull clutch & brake levers, modern electronic ignition, improved exhaust system built yesterday with today's technology, a modern reed block, wheels with new modern high spec rims and big heavy spokes fitted with mousse tubes & current tyres. No possible protests there, but because I want the bike to stay "period correct" and eliminate the possibility of a protest, I'll stick with a VM roundslide carb. Maybe I'll fit a power jet kit to it.

K

Similar situation to the XY GT Falcon's and LJ Torana's in Historic Touring cars, the 351's are putting out about 200HP more than they did back in the day, they run about 20seconds a lap faster at Bathurst with a amature driver, but they still look and sound like XY Falcon did back in the day.

[motomaniac]

Im stating the rules as I see them , if thats emotion in your book no worries carry on.Seems to me someone is sooking coz they cant "creep" the rules even further than they already are.
I've already stated my views on fatbars ,modernshocks and emulators. So why keep crying on about them?

My brother did ride a stock bike for two years in 96/97 ,that was bought for $700.After gaining 1,2 & 1,1 in his class's for the 2 years he opted out because he was riding his nuts off as it was and didnt think that he could compete with the new trick  bikes that started to surface in 96/97 especially in the EVO class that started in 97. My brother was never one to just go out for a ride ,that was his choice and I'm just stating what I think the possible consequences are if things keep going in the direction you are trying to head.

Like I already suggested if the EVO rules are too hard and people want to run stuff that wasn't strictly EVO then maybe the EVO class is a failed experiment and we should go back to pre78,pre80 and pre85 ? I wonder if that would be simple enough for the crew?

[bigk]

Maybe EVO should just stick the basics of no linkage, no water cooling & drum brakes, forget the other stuff. I'm not sooking Brent, I just can't see how you (or anyone for that matter) can say a TM flatside is not a period carburetor on an '82 EVO bike when they were available to buy in '82 just as Lectrons & Blue Magnum's were. Let's just agree to disagree. My question is a legitmate question and I have a fair idea of what the answer would be in a court. We're not dealing with that though. It'd be nice if someone in the position to rule would comment.
K

[topari]

Related but no directly... my 1984 KDX200 will be ready soon.

My modifications:
1) racetech fork emulators and diff springs
2) rear shock, diff spring and gold valve, seperator valve
3) relocated shock reservor
4) modern headlight, cannot find an original
5) Vforce reed but with standard carby
6) Modern Honda cr quick action throttle
7) Honda brake and clutch controls - suit my hands
wide footpegs, standard were damaged and the wide pegs looks trick AND I prefer them
9) possibly an XR500 TLS front brake fitted

It will still look like a 1984 kdx200.

[motomaniac]

Maybe EVO should just stick the basics of no linkage, no water cooling & drum brakes, forget the other stuff. I'm not sooking Brent, I just can't see how you (or anyone for that matter) can say a TM flatside is not a period carburetor on an '82 EVO bike when they were available to buy in '82 just as Lectrons & Blue Magnum's were. Let's just agree to disagree. My question is a legitmate question and I have a fair idea of what the answer would be in a court. We're not dealing with that though. It'd be nice if someone in the position to rule would comment.
K

For exactly the same reason that you cannot fit  CR480 motor to an earlier EVO frame : it didnt originally come on a EVO bike.Same goes for Simons UXD's and cartridge fork kits like Mugen and White Power.You could say the same about the variable exhaust systems.

[bigk]

I've just been advised that a number of EVO bikes were running at S.A nationals last year with TM flatslides and all were deemed legal to compete in the EVO class, so the precident has been set. I guess this storm in a teacup was for nothing really.
K

[motomaniac]

I've just been advised that a number of EVO bikes were running at S.A nationals last year with TM flatslides and all were deemed legal to compete in the EVO class, so the precident has been set. I guess this storm in a teacup was for nothing really.
K

That just proves the inconsistencies in the sport.Did you ask about fat bars and rubber mounted handlebars ? I just read a few 84 shootouts , the only bike with a flatslide was the Suzuki and they are all pre 85 bikes not EVO bikes.If you want to put a Suzuki item on your Euro bike all power to you. My bikes dont have items from other brands on them but thats just me.Just wondering about building up a CR250 EVO and using some pre 85 cartridge forks now.
If we get that one through then there only the 480 motor issue left.Should be a breeze.