VIPER: Take 2

[motomaniac]

To answer the comments;
Who are the relevant people? and another one :- what are they planning and are they aware and involved in this discussion?
(&)
I think there is a new committee this year so let’s all get behind them and help when we can.

I think that you’ll find they are the hard working and time generous people that battled through last year along some new faces that were prepared not to be a "seagull" in an attempt to hold it together for 2012.

They are also the ones that have resigned from VIPER via this thread.

Great observation there Bahnzy ,I noticed that too . My point was that any proposal's for change should be put forward by the committee as a whole (or perhaps a President with the committes consent) bigK understood that and answered

I only really know of one or two "relevant" people and as of this moment, none has had an input. I'm getting some direct emails with some really good ideas, but until a formal comittee is formed, it's probably all for nothing. Who to pass them on to is a very good question. A comittee needs to be formed starting with a president to steer the ship and tasks allocated to spread the load, rather than overloading a few people with everything.

Everyone knows that some people were stepping down at the seasons end and new committee members where asked for , when I offered some assistance a while back I was told that heaps of people had alreadycome forward and things were looking good.So where are these people ?So far I've heard of Ross and Jason and Ross has since packed it in. The Hackings and the Bakers have also since quit their posts which is a very disappointing way to start the season.Andy had offered to stay and help but then dropped out also, understandably.So as far as I know there is only Jason ?I thought that Steve Sweeney and Arno Franz were on but I dont know if they are continuing or in what roll.Where are the others?
In my opinion I cant see the point of banging out some format changes or other stuff if there is not a structured committee that is working on firstly venues and a calender and then any changes that might help in getting the numbers back up to where they were not to long ago.

[Viper666]

What the f@*k is going on here?

Not defending, or crucifying, anyone but wasn't the whole point of this discussion, and correct me if I'm wrong, to benefit our sport (Viper) not destroy it?

Seems that some have lost their way. Let's stop the attacks, especially the personal ones, stop dragging up what happened here or there, last year or beyond & just concentrate on the future. (If we have one)

I'm sure most have the sport at heart but to see such genuine good people as Ken, Dawn, Andy, Gary & (oh alright) even Nimmo, call it quits just disgusts me. Ken & Dawn should be put on pedistals and paid homage to for what they have done for our sport, closely followed by Andy & Gary. Given a chance I'm sure Nimmo would as well.

Whilst there may have not been a direct attack on these fine people they have obvisously taken offence to the context of this and previous threads. I for one would plead with them to come back on board and put aside the comments of a few misguided souls, I have often taken the barb of some, members & others and the thing that keeps me going is that I do it for the club & the sport & not the few who yank my chain.

I hope when things settle these great ambassadors for our sport will rethink & ignore the few detractors that have upset them & do it for the majority of us that appreciate emmensely what they do.

Ken, Dawn, Gary, Andy & Nimmo, please come back on board as your contribution is, by the vast majority, (No one gets a 100%) is extremely valued & will be greatly missed.

My 2 bobs

Viper666

[Viper666]

Now onto flag duty.

I wont comment on past threads just what has happened & maybe ideas.

I used to pay for flaggies for Viper meets & I actually raised it from the club usual of $350 to $500 to try and get groups interested.

I would be happy to do it again but I cannot get any groups to do it for that money.
We are talking of raising it to $1000 to even $2000 for modern classes.

I personally split Viper so that there is a Modern class early then not again till after lunch. This frees them up for the post practice to lunch slot. After lunch it a turkey shoot.

I hear what some say it is up to the club to supply (Yeah I know I said I wouldn't comment but this is relevant) flaggies but believe the guy that this gets left for most meetings at Monza to I cant get enough members for ANY meet let alone Viper. I wish it was so.

OK, I haven't come up with any ideas but if some one can fix this I will pay them for the solution.
There is NO easy fix to this one but we ALL need to work towards a solution & keep the bigger picture in mind.
I wont comment on costs, I wont, just to say it's not about money. Ultimately it's value for money. I for one have never complained about the cost as I choose to do it & treat Viper events as a weekend away, drinking a little bit, talking lots of bull, riding a bit & catching up with a bunch of blokes & ladies who I regard as good stock & thoroughly enjoying the whole kit & kaboodle.

Please, let's get back on track & cement a great 2012 season.

PS OK drinking a lot! You got me.

[Graeme M]

Guys, the idea of a thread to discuss possibilities for the club is good in principle, but at this stage it's not offering up a good look. This is contravening the forum guidelines with personal attacks, off topic rants and so on. Please keep it tidy and observe the rules.

[Viper666]

Riders Brief.

K, I'm not sure which ones you're talking about but as someone who has done it a few times. You think everyone gets it but the times I have ASSUMED all are on board & let them go supposed season riders, who should know better, let you down with some obvious bloopers. So unfortunately sometimes you have to treat everyone as green and go through it all just so there is no mistakes.

Viper666

Wont hog again, gunna have another beer now.

[bigk]

Ok it's great for everyone to have an idea of perfect classes etc, but until a comittee is formed to direct the idea's, it's all talk. No-one has answered my question as to how a register is run as against a club? If indeed the people who have resigned via this forum are serious, are there not notifications to be made to some contolling body (MA) or whoever to allow for a new comittee? I see Peter has called a meeting in a new thread, good work, but I think it should be earlier than 3-4 weeks away.
Neil: Riders Brief.
There have been a couple of real shockers and my home club was probably the worst offender and has been quoted in this thread. The flaggie issue has really urked most people and maybe the frustrations associated with this are what have set the "not so cheery" tone @ RB.
 
Some level heads & rationale is what's needed at this point. But humans are an emotional lot, and as we've seen form where this thread has ventured, some of those emotions are detrimental.
K

[ARN]

its sad to see how this is going, i would prefer to put this to a committee but here goes,
my option with flaggies is at the start of the year you nominate a day that you can help on the entry form.
you may have to have 2 preferences to balance out the year then either drawn from a hat to get a roster drawn up.
if you can orginise some one your self on the day ,you can still race.
if the club running the day has flaggies or some one offers to help on the day you can pay $50 to that person and get to race.
the nominated riders on the day who want to pay $50 for the helper would go into a draw (you would have to bring your bike on the day )
if you get an injury during the year or bike problems and cant race ,you may be able to swap your nominated day with some one else.
your results if you get to ride on your nominated day are not counted in to the total for the year.
to help this work there could be a extra fee of say 50$ on the viper entry at the start of the year which is returned when you do your duty or can be paid to your fill in on the day.
i would be happy to be part of the committee and attempt this

thanks to all the helpers over the years and dont ever think your not appretiated and your experience is invaluable

cheers arno

[FDR]

Thanks for posting that PM i sent you Ross, you have class to burn.

By the way i was on a 125 when you passed me at Yanakie, must make you proud passing me on your 250.

Viper committee please consult with the register if you want to go forward, perhaps a questionare could be sent out with committee nomination forms.

Mont why use this forum to canvas ideas, how many of the 100 odd Viper register read this forum ?
You could have sent a questionare to Viper register.

Over and out


 

[maico police]

As I said frank, I don't get into PM blews. Just leave it mate and stop sending them please.

[NR555]

Just dropped into the forum and happened upon this VIPER discussion.  As an ex-VIPER rider, here's my 2c:

Firstly, these are just ideas, so point any assassination attempts elsewhere please.  I'll be upfront, state my intentions and say I don't have time to get involved in running a series.  It's a massive effort and one I just couldn't commit to.  I'm just going to air out my ideas because I think they are reasonable and that's what a forum is for.

Guys, the problem that VIPER, VCM and any series of this ilk is that the rider base generally are towards the end of their riding 'career' (for want of a better term).  Members will drop off as the last waltz with their youth fades away.  It's not like the Gippsland Centres where hordes of juniors flood into the senior ranks every year and yet another division of 250Fs are added.  It's the guys that drop off the end of this type of series that VIPER should be targeting.  The guys in their 30s & 40s with real jobs (& maybe a couple of grommets) who want to ride again but don't want to be faced with a bunch of kids ready to fire themselves off obstacles like lemmings.

VIPER has an opportunity here.  They can change it right up (and possibly risk offending a few of the long term members), take a punt on a whole new format and see where it goes.  Or, they can leave it as is and see how it rolls.  As the years pass, I'd like to think there would be some sort of merge with VCM for the older metal in VIPER.  For example, I believe Pre 78 firmly belongs in VCM now - the tracks just destroy the older bikes with less suspension.  I don't get any satisfaction out of trashing a bike that old.  I absolutely love the tracks VCM puts on.  They are totally appropriate and I miss riding it.  The one or two derogatory comments about 'groomed paddocks' really annoyed me, as that was what MX used to be when my old man raced.  Bombing down those hills into greasy off cambers at Boagys or Mirboo at full noise still requires balls.

Anyway, I digress.

The new focus?  My thinking has "2 STROKE" all over it.  Less Pre 80, More Pre 90, Pre 00 & maybe a Modern class.  Break it into 125s and 250+. Give the old 4 Strokes a class, but they shouldn't be the focus.  No modern four strokes either.  Combined with a careful grading system, it could work well.  Get in touch with some of the 90s top A-graders & Pros to see if they're interested.  How cool would it be to see a Lee Hogan, Troy Dorron, Jye Harvey or even a stupidly fast ex-junior champ like Ben Coleman out there having a crack?  These bikes were their bread & butter.

I know of two guys building up late 80s CR250s right now with the intention of competing in VIPER.  These were the bikes we wanted to ride when we were kids.  Now we're in our 30s, we've got the cash to build & run toys like that along with our other hobbies.  As it stands, VIPER sort of caters for Pre 90, but more as an afterthought.  If I had a series to run my favourite bike (a 1993 CR250) with other bikes like it and guys like me (in my mid-30s), I'd be rapt and I'd run out and get myself one of those bad boys again.  Yeah, I could run it in Modern, but as I said, I don't fancy getting taken out by the Gen Z nutters.

I was watching some mid 90s motocross videos the other day.  The buzzing two strokes bouncing all over the place was spectacular and I bet there would be a heap of people in Vic alone willing to race a series marketing to that appeal.

As far as all the bitching goes, well...  FFS guys.  There are bugger all people who are actually quick on a bike that contribute to this forum (including myself!), so starting stupid fights about crap like passing each other is pointless.  Keep it on message and constructive and it'll start to get somewhere.  All ideas are good, because they are just that; ideas.

Anyway, carry on....

Cheers,
Neil Ritchie
ex-VIPER #46,
2007 Pre78 Champ 

[Yamahaha]

I have raced viper for 3 years now, and have watched it slowly dwindle. It would be a crying shame to see it fall in a heap the way it looks like it's going to.
As one of the riders in the fabled pre85 125 class (and the slowest!) as well as the moderns I sincerely hope that people of the capacity of the Bakers and Andy, Bear etc can stay on to make it happen.. The enjoyment I get from racing my old shitbox against Jason, Alan Rihaetc is far more than the moderns even though the speeds are slower..

If I can be of assistance to anyone please let me know.. Mark.

[Montynut]

Firstly I have to state I am not a member of Viper, don't even live in Vic. So I'm sticking my fingers into something that has no real impact on me other than it is very saddening to see a very great VMX group such as Viper imploding so publicly. The acrimony and animosity displayed on here has been more than disturbing.

I met the Bakers , Bear and a heap of other Viper members at last year’s HBBB. All super people and love their VMX with a passion and made me feel very welcome . They even had me saying GROUSE by the end of the weekend . Any club or register or whatever would be very lucky to have such people on the team.

All clubs or registers or whatever go through periods of prosperity and difficulty. They should be worked through internally. The meeting organised by Billet YZ on another thread is by far the best solution as it is the only way to work through the issues and resolve them as a group.

What is happening in this thread is that Viper is bleeding publically with no good coming from it :'(.

Many great sporting coaches will tell you you don't change a winning game but always change a loosing game

OK that’s my 2 cents worth I’m ready to be assassinated now

[Hoony]

i think your on the money Greg.

well done to BilletYZ for organising the meeting. the intention of trying to use the forum to gain opinion is a good one but sadly it went downhill. everyone has a differing opinion on things and a consensus will never be reached that will appease all members but hopefully the issues will be sorted to please the majority. i hope to come back and get a few rides in this year as an old mate is about to give it a go after a long break (1983 retirement) and another mate is building another bike so that should fire me up again for a play.

[albrid-3]

I problem with the hold issue is that their are to many events on each year and it needs to come back together as a one unit. ( Victorian State Vmx Championship.) IT would stop all the bickering and riders and people would start to get more interested in the whole series again.

[Viper666]

Montynut,

For an "Outsider" you seem to have a good grasp!

Viper666