OzVMX Forum
Marque Remarks => Maico => Topic started by: Mick D on February 27, 2013, 07:43:17 am
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I guess I am a bit excited after looking at the bikes thrown up in 090's pre 60 hunt.
I am only collecting bits at this stage.
So far I have just purchased a frame with Paul's help
I have a 57 250 bottom end and this 250 Iron Barrel top end is on the way
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/T2eC16ZykE9s7t2pUBRGSqNVb8Q60_12_zpsce6e1ebb.jpg?t=1361907674)
And this tank, when it arrives of course
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/T2eC16NHJHgE9n0yEiwMBRFlnlTdiQ60_12_zpscf945b40.jpg)
Although unlikely, if anyone has any other bits for a Maico blizzard project and wishes to sell, please PM me.
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/18022013127_zps2f95fb70.jpg)
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Sounds good Mick! The more of these old girls we can get on the track the better. We will have to get a secret pre 60 hand shake happening. Lets face it, anyone can have a pre 75 bike! :D
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thats true
but who has a pre 60 bike that their older brother built from real race bike parts.
what would be me
350 art seinor ariel 1948 motor
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My '64 KR250 oval Maico is here awaiting customs and quarantine clearance and the Metisse frame and bodywork intended for my 360 oval pre 65 bike arrives on March 31 from the UK. The Maico pre 65 project has had a direction change even before the Metisse kit gets here. Because we suspect the Metisse to be something pretty rare, I may not fit the Maico engine and will instead fit the engine intended for it and I'll now use another lighter, left field pre 65 frame I'd been keeping under wraps for a rainy day.
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Hey that back wheel looks alright Paul. Great unexpected bonus, Cheers.
Thanks Brad. I think it set of a few alarm bells, seeing only one entry in the pre-65 at CRC in 2012. I got to thinking if anyone is set on doing the 4"/7" thing, then may as well throw their hat in to the ring of that of the two early classes ;D That and the real truth being my master plan that I could honestly answer when I got home that I came in second :D And was only beaten by the Man From Snowy River at the 2013 CRC pre65 ;D
GeoffGraeme Morris has often had that 59 Jawa on display at the CRC,s. A good bloke, by all accounts.
It must be making him feel at ease to know his little baby will be treasured and maintained and more importantly raced and campained as it was born to do. Great score.
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Firko, Mick De and Paul check out Micks latest oval barrel Blizzard, Micks stylish lederhosen and sensible sandals really setting the teutonic mood ;D.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/250Blitz_zps96abb03c.jpg)
Thanks to Gus for the photo.
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Mark,
You being the senior spokesman here on the pre 65 class, are you going to lobby that all riders of pre 65 German bikes will be allowed to wear long leaderhosen pants (but with boots instead of socks and snadles).
Just a thought!
Kevin
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Kevin dont forget the compulsory braces for the pants
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mick did the frames arrive yet
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GeoffGraeme Morris has often had that 59 Jawa on display at the CRC,s. A good bloke, by all accounts.
It's Dave Morris Mick......A genuinely good bloke who's a walking encyclopedia of Jawa/CZ knowledge.
I've got an update on my 360 Maico 0val/Metisse project. As we speak the frame and new bodywork are arriving here in Oz from the UK...along with Jims Antig slider. The plan was to build a Maico Metisse for the pre 65 class which I reckon would have been a truly competitive 500 class pre 65er. While the frame was enroute I decided to do some research on it and have discovered something very interesting that has unfortunately put a block on my using it for the Maico project. It turns out that the frame is a genuine DT1 Yamaha Metisse item, one of only 22 made by Rickman back in 1968/69. Because of the bikes rarity and the fact that I've got a decent old stash of Yamaha DT1 engines and running gear, it'd be pretty silly of me to not build it as a DT1 Metisse. It'll be a good partner to my Cheney RT1 as examples of the 60's Brit perspective on improving Japanese engineering.
The Pre 65 Maico project isn't being abandoned however....it's just moving in a different direction. Because I won't be using the Metisse frame I've had to conjure up a frame that was 1: pre 65 legal, 2: reasonably light and good handling and 3: reasonably cheap. I've got a decent stash of aftermarket frames but they've all failed the cut for a variety of reasons. Then I remembered that I'd donated a Cotton Cobra frame to Yamaico Pete to build one of his El Cheapo specials a few months ago. After a chat with Pete it turned out that he didn't have any plans for the Cotton so it's being donated back to be the basis for the pre 65 project. One thing that really shines on the Cotton is its extreme light weight. The frame is made from Reynolds 531 tubing, the same as Cheney, Rickman and most of the period Brit frame builders used. I'll use Mexican Betor forks, Rickman Zundapp hubs/Borrani rims, BSA B44GP tank and alloy mudguards which will probably produce a bike even lighter that the Metisse would have been. After the initial disappointment that the Metisse was better suited to its original guise, I'm now pretty excited about the challenge of building the lightest open class pre 65'er I can. The dream of producing a 2 stroke pre 65 open class bike capable of winning the Nats is still alive 8).
As I wrote earlier, I've accumulated quite a stash of aftermarket framed projects so it might be a while before I get to the DT1 Metisse. Now that the Hindall RT2MX, Cheney RT1 and Fastrac 360 flat tracker are all but a couple of weeks from being finished, the next projects will be the upcoming Shell OW72 750 Yamaha flat tracker and the Maico project. But first.....I have to get my shed tidied up and back in order after the post illness frenzy of getting three bikes built. I won't be doing that again ::).
Below: DT1 Yamaha Metisse:
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/rickman-yamaha-dt1-metisse-mk-iv-1-7720_zps983bdb17.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/rickman-yamaha-dt1-metisse-mk-iv-2-7720_zps4a332a1d.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/DT1Metisse1_zpsec88e483.png)
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It's ironic that in my 25 years involvement in the vintage motocross/dirt track movement I've never seen an oval barreled Maico actually racing. Now we currently have four under construction for either the pre 65 or pre 60 VMX classes and one probable for dirt track down the line, (my little KR Motoball Special) which can only be good for the older classes.
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im sorta looking forward to the finished bike builds as well ;D
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Watto HVA sent me these great photos of his dad Bills 1960 Maico Blizzard 250 motocrosser...photographed when new in 1960. Bill didn't like the forks so he manufactured a set of leading link items similar in design to a Greeves of the period. The last three photos show the bike as it is today, still in Bill Watsons shed on the western side of the island. It looks to be in remarkably original condition although the frame appears to have been modified or changed at some stage in its life...Whatever has happened it looks good enough to just put the tank back on and enter the pre 60 class at this years Nats. ::). The bottom photo shows Bill in action (inside line) on the Maico at Herne Hill, WA circa 1960.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/4-3-2013_002_zps05dafd06.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/4-3-2013_003_zps0c5e8a80.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/maicowatto_zps0b01328b.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/maicobill_zps6ca49ae8.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/SnipImage2_zps89c77012.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/WGWMaicoHerneHill_zpsc31ee902-1_zpsbc9b93a1.jpg)
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Another shot of the little Maico ,found today at Bunburys Scrublands Park 50th Celebration.
(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r259/vmx247/2013-04-07154225_zpsd79314aa.jpg)
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of course that's "Shrubland" Park.. was a great day..had some fun talking to Donny Collins who also raced a Maico at teh same time as Bill before he got the first HVA in 1965.
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in that picture.. Richie Kings on 92 on the D.O.T.. disappearing from view.. Bill on the Maico with the black and yellow check helmet.. Terry O'Leary far left (just) on a Greeves.. Bill Donovon on #70... Peter Groucott in the background on # 28.. Jim Renfree on #14 in the middle..
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found another old maico yesterday. still trying to work out what it is. 250/ blizzard type off thing complete but missing seat ,was told it has a reco,d engine
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Sorry to be pedantic Watto, No 14 is Gordon Renfree.
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The other photo is of course Big Bill, Gordon Renfree chasing. I think the other is 63 but dont know who he is ??
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(http://www.leguidevert.com/_lgv/img_forum/2013/04/154665_2495_bild-maico-13.jpg)
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Great shot Martin, possibly 1957 European 250 champion Fritz Betzelbacher stylin' it 50's style. Betzelbacher was the closest Maico had to a world champion as in 1957 the European title was considered the ultimate achievement on a 250. The 250 class got world title status in 1958.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/maico1957team_zpsb121013f.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/maico1957team_zpsb121013f.jpg.html)
Former Maico works racers from the fifties l-r Willi Oesterle, Fritz Betzelbacher, Otto Walz, Erwin Schmieder und Gerhard Stauch.
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A friend of mine Juha Monto Race's one in Finland ,the front end broke off at one stage. Ola did he crash in that picture you put up?
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The photo was probably taken 35 years before I was born, and I just found it on the net, so I have no idea if he saved it... :)
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I have a gastank like the silver one in the last photo if someone needs it...
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Sorry, been slow to respond.
I've gotten a few pm's about the tank, but Mick De was first, so he gets first pick.
I'll try to check shipping and get a photo next week, as I don't have it at home.
Thanks
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any body interested in a blizzard im going to see one today some time
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Paul, I need a tank if the bloke happens to have a spare one. Mick De beat me to Martins. Take some photos and put it up here, there's a groundswell of interest in early Maicos starting to emerge.
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Maico Metisse pre 65 update: My Petite Metisse Bultaco frame has finally arrived after it's long and harrowing journey from Flowerpot Ben's house in the UK to Casa del Firko in Sydneys golden west. Today I got around to doing a mock up to see what fits what and my first problem has ALREADY raised its ugly head. All along I'd been dreading that the side exhaust port oval barrel would foul the front downtube so it wasn't a shock when I found my prophecy to be true. The exhaust exits straight into the downtube (see bottom photo). There's a few different cures to the problem but unfortunately none of them are easy. The first and most obvious is to modify the frame by putting a loop in the downtube. It's a pretty straightforward fabrication exercise but with genuine Rickman built Petite Metisse frames being the rarest of the rare (it's one of only 102 made) I'm hesitant of doing such a radical change. The next alternative is to move the exhaust port to the centre of the barrel. I've spoken to Frank Stanborough and another good race engineer and they both reckon it's not as big a job as it initially seems. With the exhaust port moved and a later square barrel or radial sleeve used the exhaust clearance problem is solved. Of course, I'll be modifiying a fairly rare 360 oval cylinder but when it's weighed up Maico 360 engines are nowhere as rare as Petite Rickman frames so I don't have any concience issues about doing the barrel mod. Of course, that stupid "engines must remain externally unchanged" or whatever the wording is could be used to protest the mod but Frank tells me that "centreporting" was a common modification on all sorts of engines back in the day so if anyone wants to protest the bike using that rule I'll have done my homework and will have to bring their A game to the protest table ;D.
The third option is to use a single downtube frame that fits the bill....the most obvious being a period Maico frame like Mick De and Rodger Starkey are using. That's a sensible option but by doing that I'm just building another modified Maico, I want to build something different yet legal. I've got a Cotton Cobra frame which is super light but it's twin downtube which would give me the same clearance woes. I've got a period BSA frame but it's too bloody heavy......so, moving the exhaust port to a more convenient location is the way I'm going.
I'm using Rickman Zundapp wheels, Mexican Betor forks from a Cooper 250, the cool ethanol proof glass shown in the photos supplied by Ben and will build an up pipe to suit the flow of the frame. The engine in the photos is a mock up using my 360 barrel on my basket case 250 oval bottom end as the 360 is currently apart getting a 350 crank, Yamaha YZ250 J rod, big end pin and bearing, put together and balanced by Franks Cranks. The head is half welded up and once finished will be shipped off to RK-TEK in the USA for their unique machining http://www.2strokeheads.com/VintageMX.htm (http://www.2strokeheads.com/VintageMX.htm). Frank and I will do the ports using ideas oval barrel guru the late Jim McCabe sent me a few years agohttp://cybermotorcycle.com/archives/maicomadness/early.htm (http://cybermotorcycle.com/archives/maicomadness/early.htm). This is going to be a lengthy build that I hope to have done by this time next year.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/MaicoMetisse003_zpsa202193b.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/MaicoMetisse003_zpsa202193b.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/MaicoMetisse006_zpsd2790358.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/MaicoMetisse006_zpsd2790358.jpg.html)
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Here's a centre ported oval barrel Maico Metisse
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/Maicometisse.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/Maicometisse.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/1960s-Maico-oval-barrell-Rickman1_zpsf4a82a29.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/1960s-Maico-oval-barrell-Rickman1_zpsf4a82a29.jpg.html)
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this bike is for sale pm for details
dragged it home its a 250 buy the id plate apparently it a new engine .ive got the seat base :o
(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP4536_zpsc2a4c1a9.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/IMGP4536_zpsc2a4c1a9.jpg.html)
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP4535_zps9cb69b1e.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/IMGP4535_zps9cb69b1e.jpg.html)
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP4538_zps9dd10a57.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/IMGP4538_zps9dd10a57.jpg.html)
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP4537_zps7678f2ca.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/IMGP4537_zps7678f2ca.jpg.html)
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That's too cool for school Paul, looks to be a mid fifties Blizzard or GS250 but it's hard to guess as there's no photo reference in Frank Ronicke's or Mick Walker's books.
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All along I'd been dreading that the side exhaust port oval barrel would foul the front downtube so it wasn't a shock when I found my prophecy to be true.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/MaicoMetisse006_zpsd2790358.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/MaicoMetisse006_zpsd2790358.jpg.html)
It seems that there might be an even easier way out of my exhaust clearance problem on my Maico Metisse project....all I have to do is find a genuine Maico alloy oval barrel which come with a centre exhaust port. They were available in 1964 so they're still Kosher for pre 65. I've already got my man in Germany no Italy on the case. ;D If anyone has a lead to one I'll generously compensate if the deal goes through ;).
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/1966360_zpscc3a73a7.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/1966360_zpscc3a73a7.jpg.html)
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1800.00
this bike is for sale pm for details
dragged it home its a 250 buy the id plate apparently it a new engine .ive got the seat base :o
(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP4536_zpsc2a4c1a9.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/IMGP4536_zpsc2a4c1a9.jpg.html)
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Did the guy have any idea of the bikes history Paul? To me it looks like a Blizzard with GS pipe, mudguards, headlight protector and who knows what else? What do you reckon?
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he had two off them that he bought in from germany not that long ago ,this one in perticular lost the seat and seat bracket in the black friday bush fires when the part were stored else were ,im led to believe that they both go other from that i dont know much about it / it has good compression and is actuall in preaty good nick other than the seat missing .it would be good restorer as is or do what ever somebody wanted to it ,
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The cats out of the bag, so its time for a heading change ;D
MAICO Pre-60 Alloy Oval Barrel Blizzard Project :o
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So, you've got one Mick?
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So, you've got one Mick?
Yes Mark, Maico basically used the the top end of their very successful 1950's Kart engines to produce a much lighter 175 blizzard super sport, significantly lighter. They have an all alloy cylinder. No liner, nicasiled straight to a homogenous alloy cylinder, that Maico farmed out to an all Malhe production. Maico produced the cylinder head though.
I bought about eight hundred dollars worth of books and Magazines, mainly from Germany to prove that the X3 framed 360 oval barrel Qualifies as a pre-65 mount. Indeed that one is done and dusted, I have a overwhelming amount of original print to prove that mount was raced and available to the public from as early as February 1964. During that process though I started to search and collect original print to support my case for "MAICO Pre-60 Alloy Oval Barrel Blizzard Project." I have now purchased additional original print, which is in transit from Germany. If I have any problems? I will give/forward these to MA and there readily available sources.
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PS; I will try to get some copies/images of the proof up here tonight. Cheers.
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I'm looking for an alloy centre port barrel..........I'll get one by hook or by crook.
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found this
EARLY MAICOS IN THE U.S.
By Jim McCabe
Maico motorcycles were first distributed in the US on a wide spread basis to the best knowledge of the author by, Whizzer International (yes the Whizzer Motorbike Company) starting in 1955. Kinder Cycle of Ft. Indiana got in a number of new Maico's including a new 56 250cc. scrambler. That was the first Maico scrambler purchased by the author and was titled as a 56 although the original cylinder was produced in late 1955 per its date stamp. (They were fairly popular in 1956 with the author sometimes lining up with as many as 4 other Maicos in a 8 bike heat in 56/57 in Ohio scrambles events.)
The first machines (scramblers) were 4 speed close ratio 250cc Earls fork equipped units with large high chrome pipes and effective mufflers. A cast iron loop scavenged cvlinder was employed with modified porting compared to either the road or enduro version. Maico rated these at 18 19hp. which was probably a bit high but in 56 nothing motored a 250 Maico.( though the 250 Adler Scramblers of 56/57 would for you younger chaps these were 250 cc. 2 stroke twins produced by Adler of Germany and later were copied by Yamaha for their twins). These Maico Scramblers were fitted with a 3.25 x 19 front and a 3.50 x 19 rear tire on WM1 and WM2 rims respectively. Rims were steel on the scramblers with 2 red pinstripes and the spokes were heavier than the road or enduro versions. I should mention that the 56 Enduro's at least utilized the same rear wheel and cushion drive as the scramblers while the later Enduros went to a lighter rear wheel which made tire changes faster with the smaller brake inside the sprocket/cushion drive carrier. The front portion of the frame was made of oval section tubing for greater strength compared to the round tubing of the road and enduro versions. Ignition was by a Bosch dc generator with a battery and the generator would drive conventional lights as it was the same as the road machine except for having 2 condensers which could be selected by changing a screw attached connecting wire. The generator had an automatic spark advance but a single plug. was all that was fitted. The scramblers had a 9 to 1 head initially with a plug that screwed in from the front while the Enduro and the road machine used a lower comp. head with the plug screwing in from the left hand side. This was probably due as much to the high exhaust on the scrambler though the Enduro shared the same high exhaust which ran on the right side next to the 3.3 gallon steel tank. (all chrome with no rubber knee pads.) The bike was the sarne as the one used to win the European 250 championship in 1957( which was the world title at that point in time).
The author was extremely successful with the original, despite having little 2 stroke experience. At 18, how much experience would one have gained from a 125cc Harley owned previously. Oh yes, carburation was by 26mm Bing with a gravel strainer air cleaner, and a choke that worked by closing the openings on the back of the aircleaner. Performance was astounding compared to the 200cc. James units, 125cc CZ road bikes and the 200cc Triumph Cubs. In fact, the first night after bringing it home, with no miles on it was ran against my brothers 750cc Harley K model. There was no comparison up to 70 75 mph. The little 250 would come off the line and run out in front until it peaked out and then the K model could pass it. Road Machines: I'm going to inject a little data here that has been brought to my attention as result of some calls I've received. I've mentioned the 250 cast iron engine with the Blizzard road machine basically using the same engine as an Enduro. The Enduro version had in many cases dual condensers same as the scramblers did in 56. But there were variations. For instance there was a odd ball 250 cast iron which used a special cylinder that contained the transfer ports entirely within the barrel itself with the flow being thru the piston out thru port openings above the wrist pit of the piston thru the port cast in the cylinder and back out above the piston top into the cylinder. To allow this the pistons are an inch taller roughly between the wrist pin and the bottom of the ring area (normal 3 ring configuration). This same porting configuration is found on the fan cooled Maicoletta Scooter engines. These were fan cooled electric start units in 250 and 280cc. versions which propelled a relatively large impressive motorscooter at speeds of 70 to 80 mph. rather effortlessly. Oh yes, the starter was different as it did not spin the engine over but rather rocked it back and forth until it fired and began running. Strange but it worked and not to badly either. Oh yes this scooter had a very sophisticated set of forks the aluminum sliders of which were fitted to the 66 67 Maico x 3 oval barrels and according to the factory literature some of the square barrels as well. About 5 & 3/4" travel with better dampening than earlier forks and leading axle. ( I converted a set of the 62 65 forks to leading axle without a real advange on those single loop frames which are point and shooters rather than sliders my term). Maico offered a cheap 200 with painted rims, black exhaust etc. as well as the 175cc. super sport with chrome, aluminum cylinder, etc. I have encountered 2 different variants of the 200cc. cast iron cylinder as well so it may be that a 175 CI was offered prior to 56 in Europe. The early 57 literatutre shows a 175 scrambler with a smaller cylinder outline than the alloy cylinder has. As mentioned, they used up parts left and an example was some of the odd ported 250 Blizzards sold as new bikes in 65 or 66 which were in reality 17S Supersport chassis with the obsolete 250 cylinders and high bars. The 250 Blizzards came with Earles pattern front forks right on thru from 55 to after 62 at least. We purchased and sold a new 280cc. Earles fork Blizzard in 1962 with a 280cc cylinder but as I mentioned I got along well with the importer. This was actually a 250 with a cylinder that allowed a 71mm. piston rather than a 67mm thus giving 277cc. The chap who won at Catalina Island in the 57 58 era was running one ofthose, I was told by the importer, although few knew they existed. With one of those cylinders and a 27MM Bing the 62 250's would run over 90 mph. even breathing thru a stock aircleaner and muffler but I had problems with piston seizure due to cylinder distortion.
Maico twins; yes they made wonderfully well engineered 350 and 400 air cooled twins with duplex final drive chains running in aluminum housings in a full oil bathe with sophisticated features unlike any 2 stroke road machine I ever worked on or rode for another 25 years. But they are another story. However, the BMW dealer that I bought my 59 R 60 from also sold Maico and frankly questioned the going to the BMW as he preferred the Maico twin to an R 60 in many respects.
The basic bike remained unchanged as far as the frame through the 62 model which used a different rear frame and thus got away from the road type rear frame which derived it's shape from the incorporation of tool boxes in the area behind the swing arm pivot. Transmission ratios remained the same on the scramblers at 2.4 in low compared to 3.3 roughly for the Enduro and road versions. The major change was the telescopic fork option for the 250's in lieu ofthe Earls unit. As I recall the fork, 19" front wheel, fender etc. cost me about $130.00 when I converted mine in early 58. The 175cc version came along in 57 with the telescopic fork standard (4 &5116" oftravel) which was lighter, had less inertia when turning quickly and could easily be fitted with the 21" wheel if desired. In fact all of the 175s I owned were fitted with the 21" wheel from new. The fork was interesting in that it had an external hydraulic shock connecting the center fender brace with a bracket mounted to the top fork member. I left mine offand ran STP and grease on the fiber fork bushings and rode a lot of wheelies as with 4" max. travel you need to clear as many bumps as possible. The 175cc had an alloy cylinder with plated chrome bore, good porting and the same type bore/ stroke ratio's that the Bultaco's came alon~ with later. The first 250 scramblers were rated at 18 19 hp., while the 175 was rated at 16 17 hp. but would wind tighter (Later I was to fit 200cc Bultaco expansion chambers (McCabe copies, one of which was supplied the Maico Factory for test purposes). With the standard mid height exhaust as fitted to the 175's and the later cast iron 250's the bike performed quite well but did not have the strong mid range grunt of the 55, 56 pattern cylinders of the 250's.( All Maico riders with the mid heigth exhaust recieved burns above the ankle the scars of which I carry yet today.) With the expansion chamber and go kart 11112 to one heads, the 175 ran like a early 175 200 Bultaco though. (Maico produced and sold go cart versions of the bike engines which had no clutch or transmission, with a centrifugal clutch and rope starter being used)
So from 55 thru and including the 61 model the bikes are basically identical. During this period, comparable sized road bikes were also offered including a 200cc. cast iron utility model with the short telescopic forks, and a Earls fork Enduro version usually in the 250cc size. The 250 Enduro through 61 used a wide box, with a 17hp. rated engine and was fitted with the 200cc. pattern rear wheel which was less robust and lighter by virtue of it's size and the use of a smaller brake on the inside of the sprocket carrier. These were at one point used by the West German Army. In 62 they came out with an improved front fork with internal dampening and a frame with the different rear subfrarne. The early 62's had the sarne too steep fork angle ofthe 59 61 frames and without a 21' wheel handled terribly quick with little stability. I used to cut out a section of the top frame and change the fork angle by heating and bending the front down tube. for better handling in the late 50's and early 60's. With roughly 6" oftravel up front we thought the 62 MAICO'S with the improved fork angle( the fork angle changed very early in the 62 production run) were a great improvement. The engine remained the same although the porting of the cast iron cylinder was revised for better rpm characteristics. Actually, the change had been to some degree effecte earlier but with a muffler it did not respond like the 62 with the hollow muffler shell type of expansion chamber. Bendix magneto's were fitted to the scramblers in place of the Bosch 6 volt battery and generator. The 175cc alloy engine remained the same. The 175 and 250 shared the same cases etc. except for a different primary ratio to
allow the extra rpm to be used without going above a 70 tooth sprocket (no. 40 chain) on the rear wheel. The original chains were very high quality but sold for $35 back in 57 58. The stroke was different but the flywheels were the same size as were all the other parts. Up until the 62 model Maico had continued to use the same seat as fitted for the two place road bike. Then in 62, they fitted the bikes with a short scrambler type seat, a small metal gas tank and a semi tuned exhaust. Actually the previous muffler body sans any baffles and with a restrictive washer resonance deflector welded to the outlet. With the change in porting, and the exhaust they claimed 22 hp from the 250. This made it competitive with most ofthe comparable 250's although even my modified 250 alloy 63 model had all it could do with Ted Boody's modified 250 Greeves . (The Ted Boody ( uncertain of the spelling) is the father of the late Ted Boody, who was killed racing at Ascot I believe, a few years ago.)
The 56 57 and most ofthe 58 250 scramblers had the Earls fork 18/19 hp. cylinder 58's and 59's were still basically the same although the telescopic fork was optional after 57 as I recall. So these bikes are all the same as far as frame etc. Most ofthe 59's, that I was around, had the telescopic fork as did the 60's and 61 's. The cylinders were I believe improved as far as porting in the late 50's although we were not told at the dealer level of what mods. were made that I recall. Looking at the cylinders I still have in stock, the easiest way to check the cylinder for suitability is the measurement down to the top of the exhaust port. the 62"s were an 3/16" higher roughly as I recall. Those of us racing Maico's were, in the mid west, limiting our changes to higher compression, matching the ports, changing the port timing by notching the top of the piston and in my case as early as 1957 bigger carbs. ( a 30mm Amal TT on the original 56 cylinder.) for the most part. At least that's what I did and mine ran with any I encountered here in the mid west. Because Maico was small firm, changes were made mid season etc. such as, the heads on the later cast iron scramblers coming already machined offfor a 12 to I ratio with different thickness copper gaskets to lower it to stop detonation.
The 62 version of the 250 still had the 27mm Bing Carb and the cylinder was the re ported cast iron road machine cylinder from the mid 50's. For 63 a special alloy cylinder became available, with the author obtaining one of the first 6 brought in. These first were a special casting along the lines of the 175 with a chrome lining and employed a 30mm Bing. The later 63's were available with the cast iron lined alloy cylinder, which was better and more durable. It could be rebored up to 2 mm oversize. With these alloy cylinders, the bike put out enough power to be competitive with the Challenger and the hotter Sprints etc. Still the exhaust held it back as it lacked a good expansion chamber. Transmission was still the same as the 56 up except for the fitting of a 5 plate clutch to accompany the alloy cylinder. In my opinion, all of the cast iron Maico's are competitive with each other through 65 if the T' travel forks are fitted. The later port timing from the 62 should be used though. Fork angles were adjusted back then as well as modifications to the swing arms, which are legal today by AHRMA rules. However, it takes an alloy cylindered 250 to run with the later 250's such as the Challenger, hotter Sprints etc. at least it did back then.
The alloy cylindered 250 in the single loop frame was succeeded by the same engine in the double loop X 3 frame which it shared with the oval barrel 360 version starting in 1966. The first X 3 versions were fitted with the alloy sliders from the Maicoletta Motorscooter along with better dampening and much wider spacing of the fork tubes providing S and 3/4" or so of travel. These 360's came with heavier gears and different gear ratios 2 l low gear ,which lowered the load on the sleeve pinion driving the output sprocket. This is still an engine with transmission centerlines laid out for a 125 remember.
The alloy engined single loop units had more power stock than the cast iron variant and continued to produce it on a hot day but were limited by the handling which was no better if as good as the 56"s fitted with telescopic forks except the later fork had another 1 1 1/4 of travel. The rpm range the motor peaked at moved up as well and the power was good for the era. Dick Lyons out of Dryer Cycle and I had some good races at Mt. Meridian with him on a 250 Yamaha twin and myself on the Maico in 63 & 64 before he started riding TT's at Peoria etc. These bikes were and are not good sliders. I had my best success riding deep into the corners, locking up the large front brake and then cornering sort of a brake hard, point and shoot style.
Durability, I raced a 56 cast iron 250 for 7 seasons and the maintenance consisted of yearly rebores until a good dry aircleaner was fitted, one connecting rod assembly, orig. mains were still good, 2 small gears in the trans. 2 primary chains and one set of clutch plates and a clutch hub assty. After all of this the engine was sold and raced in a micro midget. The 63 alloy 250 ran 3 seasons of TT scrambles and short track on the original bottom end, transmisson, primary chain, piston etc. I did have to put a 5 plate clutch conversion in as mine was an early one converted as mentioned to the alloy cylinder. The original parts were still in use several years after I sold the bike when I last knew of it. In short, early Maico riders were like the Maytag repairman as far as machine durability, assuming you mixed the oil and knew a little about jeuing. The only real problems, on the early machines, were commonly from taking a scrambler on the road and sticking the piston in Enduros. Just too many R's with out jeuing compensation, in a cast iron cylinder that expanded slower than the aluminum piston and distorted some in the process. The first time I took my cast iron scrambler and actuaslly tried to win an Enduro, I stuck it up 3 times in the first mile after I hit the road.(I had just won my class and finished 27th or something over all at the 500 mile Jackpine on a 500 Indian Woodsman the previous fall.) After that, it was choke and kill button when running hard with the cast iron cylinder on the road. Oh yes, doing that I finished the 120 mile enduro and picked up a second in "B" class 250 after locking the rear wheel up several times as mentioned. Those Maico pistons were pretty tough.
The 62 thru 65 single loop Maico's with alloy cylinder can run with the Oval barrel X 3 with minor legal improvements to the frame but will not match the handling qualities of the X 3. Bear in mind, that we were able to mix and match Maico parts as needed and did routinely fit the later cylinders, forks, clutches and gear sets to earlier bikes as replacement parts were needed. The X 3 gears gave way to better designed and heat treated gears from the X 4 and X 4a. At Hoffy's (the shop I rode out of at the last of my racing career), the relationship with the importer was such that later interchangeable parts were routinely used and thus it was possible and was routinely implemented, where old bikes were substantially upgraded. But the real result was better reliability, as the key to Maico power was always in the cylinder fitted, carburetor bore, along with the head employed. This was & it is true yet because thru all the years of the 2 shaft trans. Maicols the changes to the bottom end resulted in no stroke or bore changes on the 250 version. The 250 alloy units were in our shop sometimes fitted with modified 175 alloy heads. I once had 290+ pounds compression on the gage kicking over a freshly assembled 175 engine. It must have been a bit over 9 to l compression I guess ( wouldn't you?).
Based on the experience and familiarity with the Maico's and the other bikes I requested and got approval for the current placement ofthe cast iron and alloy 250's. Unfortunately the number of bon a fide early Maico's 62/65 on back seems to be very small. I have sufficient parts to put a couple of original 56 250s back on the track . But they with the Earls fork and the earliest cast iron cylinder are not competitive with the majority of the later bikes in the class. Thus I'm riding a 62/63 cast iron 250 with a 21" front wheel. Truthfully though, I never ran a 21" on the scrambles tracks back then using a 3:50 x 19" to get the larger front brake.
Double loop frame Maico's are a much better handling unit as compared to any of the earlier units with rare exception. I went back to a single loop frame for National Enduros for several years running a 326 version oval barrel engine with the optional McCabe comb. gear box. These bikes so configured provided substantially increased power compared to a 250 while outwinding the 360 oval barrel which it in truth was. The combination box used the first three gears from a scrambler and the countershaft and sprocket driver gear from an Enduro. This gave a 2.9 to 1 reduction in low. This with the shorter stroke viberated much less and allowed a reliable75 mph cruise for making up time in the Enduro era before resets. The original Enduro gears produced a drop from 6000 rpm in low to 3300+ in 2nd at the same speed, while the close gears in my boxes elimated that drawback. For any application where the width and ground clearance of the double loop frame was not a major handicap there was no question as to its handling advantage.
The X 3 oval barrel 360 Maico's were very impressive as to torque and handling was great for the era. I found that then just as now a good 30:50 Triumph, Velocette or Matchless let a lone a Gold Star would whip you badly where the track was not really rough. They were and are 10 EIP. down from the full 500 4 strokes. I did not compete that much with the 250 oval barrels on tracks, in the double loop frame but they were competitive on power thru 66 as I was still riding the 63 model 250 with it's single loop frame on the TT scrambles tracks, riding the 360's and later the 326 variant on the tracks and the woods runs respectively. Compared to the X 3 the X 4 square barrel put out a bunch more power. The oval barrel 360 casting is tied to the exterior dimensions of the 250, and just does not have room for decent transfer ports, thus it dooes not like to wind. Additionally, the oval barrel head retains the combustion chamber shape of the 56 250 cast iron scrambler. The improvement in port area and timing in the square barrel produced dramatic results. These first X 4s we received were fitted with longer travel forks and a longer swing arm which made the bike faster, although I rode an oval barreled X 4 to win the 1967 expert class IN.St. Champ. motocross.
Going back into my old literature, the first square barrels had the same Maicolleta (scooter) based front fork as the oval barrels and indeed per the factory literature came initially with the approx 52' wheel base. Our cost was $100.00 more for the square barrel versus the large barrel as Maico advertised the oval barrel in 68. The oval barrel had less power but was easier on really slippery going. At that time, we were able to get about any combination we wanted from Gray International as I was personal friends with Nick Gray him self and knew his family. Anyhow, the X 4 frame had a better airbox setup and better handling, typically a longer swing arm and usually came with a square barrel engine either 250 or 360 but was also sometimes fitted ( as a dealer option on occassion) with the oval barrel engines. Summarizing, then the real key to any of the double loop frames with AHRMA rules being what they are as far as swing arm modifications and equal fork travel is the length of the swing arm. The fork angle is close enough on the X 3, X 4, and X 4a variant that any can be name to handle the same by juggling swing arm lengths or what ever. the stock X 3 I'm racing is fitted with 7" Maico forks, but retains a stock 66 length swing arm.
By the same token, I was running lengthened swing arms on my 63 Maico's in enduros back in the 60's though usually 2" longer or less. It just happened that the Maico X 3 oval barrel I'm riding is as ridden in 66 except for the T' forks and the swing arm was never lengthened because the bike stock handled much better than the single loop frame. So, yes running completely stock the X 3 frame is not as good as a X 4 or X 4a but with AHRMA legal mods there is little appreciable difference. Biggest disadvantage is the provision for air cleaner installation. The X 3 and early X 4 frames will accept either oval barrel or square barrel engines with out modification. However, the X 4 frame was set up with a high (leg burning ) tuned pipe rather than the low pipe of the X 4a. A low exhaust kit was available for dealer assembly (welding) back then. I still have an unwelded kit in stock as I write this. The X 4 A frame( and again Maico used up stocks of existing parts during transitions so sometimes there were some deviations from the norm) was marked by the narrower front lower tube spacing which improved ground clearance during cornering etc. As a result with the later X 4, the geometry and wheel base is optimized for better handling and to keep the front wheel down as the power kept going up. As I recall the early bikes are only a 50" wheel base, thus the comment about" McCabe's got a Maico belly that keeps the front wheel down on his Maico's ."
Summarizing, I could convert a X 4 a and later frame back to accept the Oval barrel as well as the square barrel engines and the handling, airbox and length of swing arm would be a substantial advantage compared to running a stock X 3 oval barrel frame. The newer unit came with a lighter rear wheel etc., therefore the question in my mind becomes on of how far do we go on building the ultimate oval barrel class Maico. In my case, give me the spec and I can build it out of inventory but what about the guy who wants to race a X3 and does not want to modify the bike extensively to compete with a modified X 4a unit. I suggest then that the chap who modifies a X 4 frame be limited to a swing arm that
provides a wheel base as fitted to the oval barrels originally rather than the 5" stretched unit. This would allow the chap with a square barrel to shorten his swinging arm, widen the front frame and down grade the engine to an oval barrel and race heads up with the X3 owner on an equal basis
.
This was intended as a brief explanation of the early Maico's sold in the mid west in the 50's and 60's and with the importer based in Detroit, we probably got more of the bikes than many areas of the country. I apologize for not having edited this write up better and reorganized but with some feed back I can expand it as necessary to cover questions which have not been answered. It really came about as a result of the urging of Jim Weber, who is very familiar with the mid seventies up Maico's but had never been around the earlier ones. So for those of you who get a copy of this and have questions I'll be glad to share what knowledge I have with you. I sincerely hope that AHRMA continues to provide the opportunity and incentive for the operation and preservation of these old bikes both Maico and others in a near standard form so that these 45 year old riders can see what scrambling was in the 50's. Actually, I would be interested in running a completely stock 56 Maico, and a stock 51 500cc. Triumph trophy occasionally in a parade type situation just so people could see what some of the old bikes with Earls forks, sprung hub, Greeves forks, Dot Earls type and the like really were. The really early mid 50's on back are getting a bit scarce for full blown competition and the T' travel late forks tend to make them all handle/look some what alike. I think the thought behind Vintage Racing should be to maintain the character and soul of the bikes as originally raced to the extent feasible. I really almost question the change in forks on the early bikes. The Greeves of the " 60"s were known for their handling with the leading link etc. If to many mods. from the original as for instance a 5" or 6" stretch of the swing arm are OK then the result are a bunch of "old" but highly optimized bikes which meet the rules but sure as heck don't handle or run like they did originally.
I know in my case, that much ofthe fun riding the old Maico's is having people see what they really were like back then. Anyone that seen me fighting the 63 250 in the mud at Mt. Meridian could tell it did not handle like a new one or one where I had stretched the wheel base and changed the fork angle. Granted, there is no way to police optimization of the old bikes if it was desired, but if I beat John Easton's 500 Triumph for instance, with basically the bike I rode in 66 67 I'm going to get a lot more satisfaction than if I employ all that I know how to do now. I am getting feed back about the 360 oval barrel being campaigned on the west coast with a cut down sqare barrel head and questionable expansion chamber. I guess if everyone else is stretching the rules then maybe the rider is just fighting mods. with mods., but I can assure you that if he runs like a square barrel then he damn well isn't a near stock oval barrel and he belongs with the square barrels. In my case, I could build up a Greeves Challenger or alloy cylindered Villiers Greeves to Silverstone engine specs, machine from aluminum billets heavier cases for the trans. etc., fit 7" forks, WP shocks and optimize the bike and it would run with nearly anything in the class almost regardless of the owners budget.
My point being that the cost of racing in that fashion escalates considerably compared to the low cost Maico I pulled from the corn crib so to speak. There will always be those with more funds to expend or in the case of some of us the ability and facilities to build/fabricate that which is required to optimize the equipment compared to what the average rider may be able to purchase. I received a call from a Maico enthusiast on the West Coast last year who talked of $4,000.00 per bike expenditures on the racing Maico's he prepared. That's a far cry from what I'm investing, even in the Triumphs I'm putting together. I have been most impressed with the genuine friendliness of the competitors etc. and applaud the efforts of those who have put this operation together. I make the above comments only to express the importance in my mind of keeping the competition affordable and fun for everyone. And currently I think it obviously is just that. Logically, if a bike, due to optimization (my term), application of current state of the art porting or what ever gets to where it's obviously a substantially superior machine compared to others in the class it should be bumped up to the next one. That is the only effective prevention for over optimization as I see it in the older classes.
This is not voiced as criticism but just an expression of a concern on my part having seen the friendly scrambles events ofthe mid 50's develop into sponsored win at what ever cost efforts by the 70's. And gosh it really was a lot of fun in the early days ! In 63 67etc. we rode hard, apologized after the race if we accidentally bumped some one, and in general enjoyed a close friendship with even our toughest competitors and for those who could not ride like gentleman and win on the basis of ability, well occasionally feet were known to slip from the brake pedal etc. and they went off the track or were T boned. Usually, the overly rough got the point after one or 2 such incidents while those who persisted usually lost interest in motorcycle racing entirely after a season or so.
Jim McCabe
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Any of that you would like to highlight for the benefit of this thread Paul?
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Dear old Jim McCabe.....I was in fairly regular email contact with him until his death in 2009. Nobody knew oval and square Maicos more than McCabe.
I recieved the below email from American Maico guru Jim McCabe a number of years ago and only just found it while cleaning up my hard drive files. It's an interesting read, even if you don't totally agree with his theories.
MAICO 326 THEORY
I built a 326cc oval barrel in 1967 using 250 -70mm stroke crank
under a 360 oval barrel cylinder for Enduro work. The 360 oval barrel
with a 76 mm stroke vibrated a lot at higher rpm and the 70 mm stroke
326cc I came up with was much smoother. I was using a tucked in
silencer from a Bultaco Madador on the 360 oval barrel at that point
and it and the 30 mm carb carried right over to the 326cc version
with no change. Compared to my buddies 360 oval barrel I lost a bit
of torque but had another 12-1500 rpm on top and actually the bike
became faster in the woods and definitely had a much faster usuable
cruise speed for Enduros. I recently got my original 326 chassis(62-
65 single loop frame) back after 40 years complete with the engine
etc. to restore.
I purchased a factory made 326cc radial top end a few years ago, with
the 70mm stroke, but with a 250 pattern rear boost port inconjunction
with 77 mm bore. I've done a bit of research on various combinations
of 400,440 and 501 engines. Incidently the original 360 oval barrel
cylinder required decking the top of the cylinder and also the top of
the crank case by 1/2 the stroke decrease (3mm off each) to get the
proper degrees of timing. The key to any of these mods is measurement
of the port locations in the cylinder castings to see if the finished
port timings are close to optimum. Perhaps the most interesting swap
is conversion of a 501 back to approximately 460cc via a 250 stroke
crank. Yamaha rods with longer center distance can be employed to
reduce the machining required in some cases, and late model cranks
can be destroked to provide the advanges of 3 row primarys.
Incidently I dropped off a 80+ pound block of aluminum for my brother
to start machining on a 760cc. McCabe top end. 108mm bore planned.
Within limits, I believe bore and stroke relationships are less
important as far as power characteristics/max power than the port
timing and the exhaust expansion chamber of the engine being built.
The biggest advantage of the short stroke versions is they usually
have larger transfer passages (in proportion to displacement) than
the original smaller cylinders and are capable of breathing better on
top end in addition to the increased displacement. Power output is
controlled really by how many cfm can be flowed per minute and the
shorter strokes will allow higher rpm thus more strokes/minute within
which to flow fuel and air.(and many of the destroked engines have
wilder port timing than the original cylinders had) In the past 50
years the biggest change in Maico engines is in increased vertical
transfer port areas. The difference in actual exhaust port areas
between a 68 250 square barrel and a 2000 water cooled power valve
250 is actually not that much but the transfer ports have doubled in
area during that period. My long term rule is to optimise the
transfer port areas for better breathing and more top end power.
(440's in particularlar need increased area as the increase in bore
dia. is obtained by a reduction in transfer port area) All that said,
a longer stroke combined with a shorter (percentage rod
length/stroke) rod will provide better low speed punch than a short
stroke version of the same displacement in my limited experience.
Nothing beats porting cylinders area wise and degree wise for the
rpm/power characterists desired using data available to us today.
Expansion chambers are another matter however and I'm planning on an
inertia type dyno to facilitate tuning of my engines more accurately.
Some of the 370 Suzuki Savages had very violent power characteristics as
well. I believe there was eventually found a solution to some of the
violence thru the use of an altered ignition advance cure. The best
example of over square under square engines power output I'm
experienced with, is the 125 thru 350 Bultacos where the 125 despite
it's long stroke was a very sucessful high out put engine while the
350 short stroke Astro's are also very very competitive. And the 350
singles went very well on Road racing as well. I firmly believe it's
port timing/expansion chamber design that's the predominant
contolling factor, although most 250 motocross 2 stokes became
slighter under square (strokes became longer) in recent years. I have
to admit that my 499 has grown to be some what of a light switch
engine as far as how it hits compared to power delivery of a stock
400/440/490. as I've strived for more top end output.---
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While it's a tad too modified for our pre 60 class (and pre 65) I still love Karl Landrus's 1957 250 oval Maico
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/klp1957maico_zps1bd38592.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/klp1957maico_zps1bd38592.jpg.html)
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Any of that you would like to highlight for the benefit of this thread Paul?
nah i just found it on the net did i do something wrong !
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While it's a tad too modified for our pre 60 class (and pre 65) I still love Karl Landrus's 1957 250 oval Maico
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/klp1957maico_zps1bd38592.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/klp1957maico_zps1bd38592.jpg.html)
The spirit of legitimate vintage competition and show-casing an era must be way different in the US than here. Thank fug for Aussie rules.
That Creation of Karl's is an absolutely beautiful work of art and a testament to his skills base and engineering ability to go outside the square, but I doubt a search of Oz would find any moron Stooopid enough to even consider entering that bike in PRE-70,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, let alone pre 65 or pre 60.
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Any of that you would like to highlight for the benefit of this thread Paul?
nah i just found it on the net did i do something wrong !
No, not at all mate.
I will try to find the time to explain latter, at the moment I am ready to level this box of crap and the new multi-function center with me granddaddies plumb axe >:(
Time to resort to the camera me thinks >:(
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OK, this is one of the coffee table additions.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00045_zpsa04bafc9.jpg?t=1367316303)
These are some pages from it
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00048_zpsc21845f5.jpg?t=1367316402)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00047_zpsb8b6f48d.jpg?t=1367316778)
Also this mag I bought
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00049_zps101c73bc.jpg?t=1367316896)
With this date on the front cover
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00050_zps710516a8.jpg?t=1367317137)
Featuring this article
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00051_zpsbd45c599.jpg?t=1367317244)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00053_zps4552851b.jpg?t=1367317433)
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(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/IMGP4535_zps065c8480.jpg?t=1367352448)
That's too cool for school Paul, looks to be a mid fifties Blizzard or GS250 but it's hard to guess as there's no photo reference in Frank Ronicke's or Mick Walker's books.
Yes, I reckon your dead right about that little beauty being a genuine GS M250B(Blizzard), civilian model.
Maico produced more of this model motorcycle than any other model that it ever produced in its entire range. They added a map box to the tank, rear panier racks etc, etc, painted them dark army green all over, including in the end the hubs spokes, rims, tank badges,etc, even dark green matching vinyl on the seats and continued to sell them to German military long after they became unavailable to the general public.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/maico-10_zps53053754.jpg)
Maico finally phased out the Blizzard"s supply as a military model and replaced it with this
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00059_zps94f7ed46.jpg?t=1367354930)
In early days it was a contract to supply the GS Blizzard as a military mount That saved Maico from impending bankruptcy, bought on by the financially failed attempt of becoming a main-stream automobile player.
Saying all that, it is not cheap to get any bike shipped here from Germany and half decent Blizzards there still pull good amounts of EUROs in their homeland. Just like old rare old Holdens do here, I Guess.
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Watto HVA sent me these great photos of his dad Bills 1960 Maico Blizzard 250 motocrosser...photographed when new in 1960. Bill didn't like the forks so he manufactured a set of leading link items similar in design to a Greeves of the period. The last three photos show the bike as it is today, still in Bill Watsons shed on the western side of the island. It looks to be in remarkably original condition although the frame appears to have been modified or changed at some stage in its life...Whatever has happened it looks good enough to just put the tank back on and enter the pre 60 class at this years Nats. ::). The bottom photo shows Bill in action (inside line) on the Maico at Herne Hill, WA circa 1960.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/4-3-2013_002_zps05dafd06.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/4-3-2013_003_zps0c5e8a80.jpg)
That is one nicest and best prepared M250B(Blizzard) GS ROUND IRON BARREL machines the web has ever shown me :o
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It should be Mick...the pic is from 1960..the bike is brand new..
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http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200920260404
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The spirit of legitimate vintage competition and show-casing an era must be way different in the US than here. Thank fug for Aussie rules.
That Creation of Karl's is an absolutely beautiful work of art and a testament to his skills base and engineering ability to go outside the square, but I doubt a search of Oz would find any moron Stooopid enough to even consider entering that bike in PRE-70,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, let alone pre 65 or pre 60.
Here's another USA based oval that wouldn't pass our scrutineering muster.....check out the rear suspension, forks and wheels. It's got the correct tank however ::).
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/maicoovalracer_zpsde77a0bf.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/maicoovalracer_zpsde77a0bf.jpg.html)
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Yeah Firko, all-though I admire hot rods and intend a couple for the dirt track scene, I am pretty much coming to the opinion that we need to play a roll as VMX custodians of history. I intend to keep my bikes as aesthetically original as reasonably possible and legal to the Aussie vmx rules even if I do think they need updating every now and then as new facts come to light. Mind you I will always have optimisations like two finger Maico brakes and clutches as I have had since a 1973 whipper-snapper.
But, hey,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Ola Martin got me reconsidering my approach, when he put his 175 up and his comments in another threadhttp://ozvmx.com/community/index.php?topic=27958.0 (http://ozvmx.com/community/index.php?topic=27958.0)
Both these bikes are the 175M GS models, with the 21" frontwheel and more powerful engine, for flat out racing ;) A lot rarer than the more common M model.
Mine also has a extra damper for the fork, from the fenderbrace to the upper yoke, between the forklegs.
+ it runs.... ;D
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/IMG_0990_zps7a517ade.jpg?t=1367380477)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/IMG_0991_zps01d26f65.jpg?t=1367380387)
This is one of the images I have of what Maico's early production IRON BARREL motocrossers looks like.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/Scan0012_zpse50446e1.jpg?t=1367319635)
Note; the lighter smaller front hub, of which I have one these laced to a 21" muddy.
The more I have looked at this,
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/4-3-2013_002_zps05dafd06.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/4-3-2013_003_zps0c5e8a80.jpg)
the harder I get,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
It has got me thinking that I will probably get these new fenders painted as well.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00070_zps6a764577.jpg?t=1367375174)
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If I had of known how to and thought shipping might be reasonable? I probably would have just tryed to buy Ola's bike. Would have beeen a buzz just to service add fuel and mud I reckon.
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Yeah Firko, all-though I admire hot rods and intend a couple for the dirt track scene, I am pretty much coming to the opinion that we need to play a roll as VMX custodians of history. I intend to keep my bikes as aesthetically original as reasonably possible and legal to the Aussie vmx rules even if I do think they need updating every now and then as new facts come to light. Mind you I will always have optimisations like two finger Maico brakes and clutches as I have had since a 1973 whipper-snapper.
I'm a bit opposite to you in my old Maico endevours Mick. I'll build the Maico Metisse hot rod for motocross....mainly because it's something I've wanted to build for years. For Dirt track however because its so rare I'll do my little KR250 strictly by the book, hence me needing a genuine tank and a pipe to copy. What's the score with the rims on my KR by the way? They're alloy (Akront???) and appear to be the originals, The little hubs appear to be off the 175 or early 250 Blizzard.
I ran into Blair Harley the other day and we started talking about oval and square Maicos. He remembered seeing some motoball bikes destined for America at the factory in the late 60's, the odds are high that one was probably mine. Old Blair's getting on but he's still got a lot of Maico memories. He reckons the 350 was the best square barrel by far. He probably says that because they wouldn't have existed without his great influence at the factory but I agree with him. He was stoked to hear that I was converting my 360 to 350 as he hates 360 "shakers".
I'm going to prepare my 350 squarie for him to ride at CD10.
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If I had of known how to and thought shipping might be reasonable? I probably would have just tryed to buy Ola's bike. Would have beeen a buzz just to service add fuel and mud I reckon
Mick.....Jim and I used Chas Mortimer http://www.chasmortimer.co.uk/ (http://www.chasmortimer.co.uk/) to bring our stuff in from the UK. Jonesy used him to bring in a CCM and an ESO scrambler from Sweden, his trucks cover all of Europe and although it seemed to take forever to get here compared to our stuff from the USA, we were all pretty pleased with his door to door service. They take care of all of the little bullshit things that usually make it hard to get stuff from Europe.
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If I had of known how to and thought shipping might be reasonable? I probably would have just tryed to buy Ola's bike. Would have beeen a buzz just to service add fuel and mud I reckon
Mick.....Jim and I used Chas Mortimer http://www.chasmortimer.co.uk/ (http://www.chasmortimer.co.uk/) to bring our stuff in from the UK. Jonesy used him to bring in a CCM and an ESO scrambler from Sweden, his trucks cover all of Europe and although it seemed to take forever to get here compared to our stuff from the USA, we were all pretty pleased with his door to door service. They take care of all of the little bullshit things that usually make it hard to get stuff from Europe.
Thanks Firko, good knowledge for down the track maybe, but that's it, no more for a while, until I half the heard. And getting the 360 Oval from the US in boxes was a stress I don't want again for a while ::)
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I'm a bit opposite to you in my old Maico endevours Mick. I'll build the Maico Metisse hot rod for motocross....mainly because it's something I've wanted to build for years. For Dirt track however because its so rare I'll do my little KR250 strictly by the book, hence me needing a genuine tank and a pipe to copy. What's the score with the rims on my KR by the way? They're alloy (Akront???) and appear to be the originals, The little hubs appear to be off the 175 or early 250 Blizzard.
I ran into Blair Harley the other day and we started talking about oval and square Maicos. He remembered seeing some motoball bikes destined for America at the factory in the late 60's, the odds are high that one was probably mine. Old Blair's getting on but he's still got a lot of Maico memories. He reckons the 350 was the best square barrel by far. He probably says that because they wouldn't have existed without his great influence at the factory but I agree with him. He was stoked to hear that I was converting my 360 to 350 as he hates 360 "shakers".
I'm going to prepare my 350 squarie for him to ride at CD10.
See I think Metisses belong, and who wouldn't like or want one? not many I bet!
Heres the thing I reckon with the KR. (in the mean-time), Clean up that rare Ducati tank, stick it on ebay Global for some more fun tickets. That 360 side port exhaust will drop straight into a freshly rattle-canned KR frame for a legal pre65 slider. Stick any suitable seat and tank on it for the time being. Make a low-drop pipe up. Clean those original factory optioned alloy rimmed wheels up (not sure if the little rear 125 moped hub will stand up to the 360 donk though). Couple of cables and a fuel line and Bob's your uncle. It would be a quick build, a chance to sniff the 360 and build the original KR engine as you get around to it.
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You actually read my mind but I've got a backlog of Yamahas to finish first ::) Another oval racer
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/MEL-57Maico_zpsd0273013.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/MEL-57Maico_zpsd0273013.jpg.html)
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Ps; when you finish the KR engine I am pretty sure we can verify that you will have a legal pre60 IRON BARREL slider.
Pss; Those little moped hubs can easily be verified as being as around for ever, for all intensive pre60 etc purposes(I have tons of proof, they are everywhere, in nearly every book I have got).
Psss; I don't know who made those rims yet(I have one, need to get the tyre off and see if any thing is written inside) , but they seem to have been around Europe as an option prior to 1960. One of the rules that I refer to a need of "update" when we find more indisputable proof.
Pssss; That email from Jim McCabe, in sound mind is awesome, thank you for sharing that.
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While it's a tad too modified for our pre 60 class (and pre 65) I still love Karl Landrus's 1957 250 oval Maico
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/klp1957maico_zps1bd38592.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/klp1957maico_zps1bd38592.jpg.html)
My Favourite Maico, I would be happy to ride this bike in pre70.
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1800.00
this bike is for sale pm for details
dragged it home its a 250 buy the id plate apparently it a new engine .ive got the seat base :o
(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP4536_zpsc2a4c1a9.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/IMGP4536_zpsc2a4c1a9.jpg.html)
sold
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My Favourite Maico, I would be happy to ride this bike in pre70
You and me both Dave but I don't think the scrutineers would let us. It's a pre 60 class bike that's legal only for pre 75..........a shame really.
getting the 360 Oval from the US in boxes was a stress I don't want again for a while
All of my bikes come in boxes Mick, the more I bring in the less I stress. It's all about finding a shipper you can trust. My Shell Yamaha OW72 flat tracker is on its way in 14 separate boxes.
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I should start a thread on the 64 Alloy oval barrel 360, But in the mean time here is the 1963 Alloy Oval Barrel 250 Moto
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00075_zpsf7dc911f.jpg?t=1367463299)
I have to go through the rest of my books and stuff, but I am thinking that KR of yours could be a rare little pre60? Does it have anything on the ID plate?
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Actually that 1963 bike pictured there has those Alloy rims in question fitted as well and I have other pictures of them fitted prior to 1965. So as far as I am concerned they were most definitely around pre65. So in any mans language, they are legal for use in pre65. Time to go and pop that tyre of the 1957 wheel/rim I think.
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Does it have anything on the ID plate?
In typical Maico fashion the plate has 247cc and no date whatsoever. I'm not sure it'd fit into pre 60 but I'm sure it'd slot into pre 65. Blair told me they were made the only on order from motoball teams or individual competitors, they weren't a showroom model per se. I seem to think that it was Frank Cooper who imported a few into the USA for short track competition in the mid to late sixties. I think he ordered the engines in a higher state of tune that the softish motoball setup. The bike is extremely light, methinks the frame could well be chro-mo. I will probably have it ready next year. It'll be a cool partner to my rigid Tom Cates framed 305 Honda flat tracker. I don't want to start it or the oval Metisse projects until the Hindall and Cheney Yamaha 360's are fully built and sorted. They're not that far off now though. I've put the KR in storage until it's time comes up on the production line.
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(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/MOTOBALL1_zps1433b21d.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/MOTOBALL1_zps1433b21d.jpg.html)(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/motorcycle-74MGMotoBall-03_zps73c21105.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/motorcycle-74MGMotoBall-03_zps73c21105.jpg.html)
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oK ok OK,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Those rims,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,it seems in 1930 there was professional cyclist dude in Germany called Karl Altenberger, who started making his own aluminum competition bicycle parts.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00079_zpseafce733.jpg?t=1367467481)
Apparently he registered a factory for the manufacture of such products in 1940, and when on to produce competition alloy rims for racing motorcycles as well. That is a very early frame that Paul got me, complete with the rear wheel(and it is the earlier small axle rear wheel/hub/brake plate and sprocket carrier job) . It is fitted with one of those rims. Not enough as proof. Although I am confident that three will be proof around somewhere.
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That's what my rims should be too Mick, they look identical....they're nothing like mud catcher Akronts or Borranis and if they are in fact Altenberger rims we've got something rare and exotic! I'll have to go and have a lookee at mine over he weekend (in storage). Do you have a pair of bolt on cross brace handlebars for your bike?
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Mark, if the wheels / rims are as per the brochure..you're going to have fun finding tyres.. 16 inch..??!!
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Mark, if the wheels / rims are as per the brochure..you're going to have fun finding tyres.. 16 inch..??!!
You're not wrong there Brian but luckily mine has 18" all round, probably as a result of its use for flat track rather than motoball.
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http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/161013923268?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
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I'm high bidder ;D
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Firko
Found this test on the 1962 Maico Scrambler
Might have to start again on my DKW rt250 1957 mx project ;D
http://66.84.0.143/~ahrmanwc/1962_Maico_Scrambler_Tests.PDF
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Great stuff Murray, the "tests" are a bit gentle by todays standards as is the stilted use of language. I love the photo of the two kids "lifting" the Maico off the ground like it was a TAS minibike. While the kid lifting the front seems to be putting in some effort, ihe kid holding the back is lifting it by the alloy mudguard and looks to be putting SFA effort into it....methinks 1962 vintage photoshop helped lift the bike ;D.
You're going to have to get that old 'Deek' up and running mate.
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Firko
Found this test on the 1962 Maico Scrambler
http://66.84.0.143/~ahrmanwc/1962_Maico_Scrambler_Tests.PDF
I have adds etc for the 1962 introduced X2 Framed round iron barrel, but no test. That's one I have been searching for VMX60, beautiful clear scans, Thank you.
Might have to start again on my DKW rt250 1957 mx project ;D
What a great idea mate, the more the merrier. Just because 090 got himself a shinny new Jawa, doesn't mean we are just sit back and let him walk of with another trophy does it! No way. I'm up for this. I am even thinking seriously about giving up drinking the night before the race. Well, by midnight anyhow.
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(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/MAICOARTICLE1_zps6ca19a9d.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/MAICOARTICLE1_zps6ca19a9d.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/maicolettaengine_zps1e78f57f.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/maicolettaengine_zps1e78f57f.jpg.html)
http://www.maicowerk.com/Articles/index.php?link=3 (http://www.maicowerk.com/Articles/index.php?link=3)
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mick did the frames arrive yet
Yes Paul, thank you and thanks to Matcho-Mick, Bultaco-Macca and the other bloke in Melbourne as well, all involved in getting it to me ;) You are all welcome to check out the inside of my latest Esky, Cheers.
Could you do me a favor please Paul? Grab a magnet and see if the brake pedal is steel or Alloy on that red blizzard.
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mick did the frames arrive yet
Yes Paul, thank you and thanks to all those involved in getting it to me ;) Cheers.
Could you do me a favor please Paul? Grab a magnet and see if the brake pedal is steel or Alloy on that red blizzard.
steel
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Thanks Paul.
That's what my rims should be too Mick, they look identical....they're nothing like mud catcher Akronts or Borranis and if they are in fact Altenberger rims we've got something rare and exotic! I'll have to go and have a lookee at mine over he weekend (in storage). Do you have a pair of bolt on cross brace handlebars for your bike?
No Firko, I don't have a pair of bars yet.
Did you get a chance to see your little Dirt Tracker at the week end?
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Did you get a chance to see your little Dirt Tracker at the week end
No I didn't get anywhere near it Mick.........
I've just come in from the shed and I'm in some pain after Maico got some revenge on me. I'm doing a bit of tidying up and like a dickweed I tried to move a big steel locker in which I keep my Metisse and Cheney parts to sweep behind it. Unfortunately the movement dislodged a Maico AW tank that was on the top of the locker and it fell (about 2 metres) and donged me right over my left eye leaving a bump the size of a golf ball and me with a bad case of head spins and a shocking headache....the biggest hit since I stopped playing Rugby. Serves me right for wanting a tidy shed :'(.
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Thats a bummer. Time to head to the lounge for a while, grab Reggie, a bottle to wash some pills down and dream about how much Chics dig scares mate.
Sorry mate, just got to ask, is the AW tank OK ???
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Thats a bummer. Time to head to the lounge for a while, grab Reggie, a bottle to wash some pills down and dream about how much Chics dig scares mate.
Sorry mate, just got to ask, is the AW tank OK Huh
Yeah I've pretty much abandoned play today. Reggie was lucky actually, I took the bullet for him, If the tank hadn't have been blocked by my noggin it would have creamed the little fella. Instead of pills and a brew I whipped up a chicken & veggie stir fry for dinner.....nothing like a bit of kitchen therapy............oh, the tank survived with nary a scratch, it is a Maico part after all. ;D
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(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/cw_maico2_zps90435e1f.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/cw_maico2_zps90435e1f.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/cw_maico3_zps83139796.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/cw_maico3_zps83139796.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/cw_maico4_zps87f75d05.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/cw_maico4_zps87f75d05.jpg.html)
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Firko
Never mind the pup or your noggin - did you dent the tank :D :D :D :D
Dave Mac ;)
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/1957_250.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/1957_250.jpg.html)
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/1966Maico.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/1966Maico.jpg.html)
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mick i know were this is but i doubt weather he would ever sell it
Keith Stackers?
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no. not even warm ;D
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mick i know were this is but i doubt weather he would ever sell it
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/MICKY/1966Maico_zps852f8ede.jpg)
I want it. Just go and get it. Fuk the new shipping container, just go and get that bike for me OK. Its ok if you need to use force, get a gun from somewhere if you have, just go and get it. Please.
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(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/360gs01_zps658c49f8.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/360gs01_zps658c49f8.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/360gs02_zps2de69b42.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/360gs02_zps2de69b42.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/360gs03_zpscfca0a10.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/360gs03_zpscfca0a10.jpg.html)
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Its all-right now, I've calmed down now. Theres a good chance that I might have an obsessive compulsive disorder. I hope you haven't done anything rash on my behalf Paul.
Few, wow,
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/MICKY/1966Maico_zps852f8ede.jpg)
that got the blood flowing. I have already got one though. Its just that mine is laying on the kitchen floor still in kit form.
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mick ive sent the email ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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At the risk of getting Mick pumped again....I think I might know of the whereabouts of a '67 frame. This afternoon's bump on the head has done me some good, I'd forgotten all about it until 10 minutes ago ;D.
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mick ive sent the email ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Cheers. I have been having a clean up. There is room for another now. I wish I had of bought the Blizzard of you ::) It would be hell cheaper than the one I am building from parts I reckon.
Hey Mark, I reckon that bike that red bike Paul just put up is a GS too, I would love to see the numbers and the ID plate on it. There are quite a few things which are not genuine MC. In fact why would any one replace them with GS ones ??? Dont figure, so I strongly suspect it is a GS, nothing wrong with that though. Get the groceries on it, then ride it to the track, rip the headlamp of it and race it.
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At the risk of getting Mick pumped again....I think I might know of the whereabouts of a '67 frame. This afternoon's bump on the head has done me some good, I'd forgotten all about it until 10 minutes ago ;D.
You shouldn't have told us that, now we know that all we have to do is give you another bump on the noggin anytime we want to know something, big mistake mate.
Now lets get down to business, I don't care if you make a few hundred on that frame, how much and when please ;D Serious :)
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I have to give its owner a ring tomorrow, he got it in a job lot of square barrel Maico stuff up your way in the early 90's. John Owens put him onto the stash. I'm not even sure if he's still got it..........we'll know tomorrow.
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I have to give its owner a ring tomorrow, he got it in a job lot of square barrel Maico stuff up your way in the early 90's. John Owens put him onto the stash. I'm not even sure if he's still got it..........we'll know tomorrow.
Well now you've done it, definitely no sleep now without a sedative ::)
Hey you wouldn't believe it, talking about John Owens, a few weeks ago I bought back the engine out of my first brand new Maico 250. Its another story hey, but what are the odds. I will know the frame if I ever see it.
Ahh those were the days, so many mammaries, yeap, yeap, yeap.
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http://www.ebay.de/itm/Maico-M250-B-Bremspedal-Bremslichtschalter-/300899639692?pt=Motorrad_Kraftradteile&hash=item460f04218c
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I might do some searching myself for a Maico pre 65.
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I might do some searching myself for a Maico pre 65.
iknow were theres another ;)
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I might do some searching myself for a Maico pre 65.
What happened to the Adler Dave, please don't tell me it's gone ???
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When talking Pre-60 Legal Maico mounts, it is the Blizzard based models that make the cut.
Thank you to those that have gone out of their way to contribute pictures and other info, every shred of data is helping, Cheers.
In the 50's all sorts of blizzard born configurations appeared at local German Motocross tracks.
Originally campaigned in events by some privateers.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/f33cffba-ecb8-4eb3-9cbe-32436405482e_zps1042c80c.jpg)
The first dedicated x1 Maico frame was born when the Maicsh Brothers got serious about supporting Motocross.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/2648f1b6-8b03-4452-9083-e91f68d8adcc_zps9e6ca2ce.jpg)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/MICKY/maico1957team_zps9f3d43f7.jpg)
I would be great, If anyone has anymore images of this bike or any links to any accompanying text. Doesn't matter if it is in German.
It seams obvious and reasonable to suspect that the X1 Frames were produced predominately from the same tube bending dies, jigs and designs of Blizzard.
Indeed these were still referred to as Blizzards, although these X1 frames were dedicated factory born MXers.
PS; hows the noggin Firko?
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The adler is all rugged up in the shed mark
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(http://i914.photobucket.com/albums/ac346/albrid-3/SnR.jpg) (http://s914.photobucket.com/user/albrid-3/media/SnR.jpg.html)
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PS; hows the noggin Firko?
The swellings gone down a bit but it must be still noticeable, This afternoon I was doing the supermarket shopping and the little checkout chick asked me if I'd forgotten to duck ;D
I feel like Dagwood Bumstead after Blondie hit him over the head with a rolling pin :'(.
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(http://i914.photobucket.com/albums/ac346/albrid-3/SnR.jpg) (http://s914.photobucket.com/user/albrid-3/media/SnR.jpg.html)
Thats a cool photo Dave 8) do you need the Maico to have a re enactment of the photo :) do you know where it was taken ?
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That's what I'm talkingabout, What an awesome shot. It loooks like the Maico may be in front ;D
PS; hows the noggin Firko?
The swellings gone down a bit but it must be still noticeable, This afternoon I was doing the supermarket shopping and the little checkout chick asked me if I'd forgotten to duck ;D
I feel like Dagwood Bumstead after Blondie hit him over the head with a rolling pin :'(.
;D ;D
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thats a may be, mick.
(http://i914.photobucket.com/albums/ac346/albrid-3/wpf721558c_0f_zpsfb1e94c6.jpg) (http://s914.photobucket.com/user/albrid-3/media/wpf721558c_0f_zpsfb1e94c6.jpg.html)
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(http://i914.photobucket.com/albums/ac346/albrid-3/wp68942b15_zps4581f556.jpg) (http://s914.photobucket.com/user/albrid-3/media/wp68942b15_zps4581f556.jpg.html)
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(http://i914.photobucket.com/albums/ac346/albrid-3/255351_4003290772239_2106079271_n_zps7a272ebe.jpg) (http://s914.photobucket.com/user/albrid-3/media/255351_4003290772239_2106079271_n_zps7a272ebe.jpg.html)
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(http://i914.photobucket.com/albums/ac346/albrid-3/295270_4003287852166_653469086_n_zps25190751.jpg) (http://s914.photobucket.com/user/albrid-3/media/295270_4003287852166_653469086_n_zps25190751.jpg.html)
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(http://i914.photobucket.com/albums/ac346/albrid-3/wp016947c1_zps77c355aa.jpg) (http://s914.photobucket.com/user/albrid-3/media/wp016947c1_zps77c355aa.jpg.html)
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Arh geez, for the love of crumb cake ::)
Only the Blizzards and the X1 framed Blizzard look alikes are legal for and belong, belong, belong, in Maico pre-60!
FFS, I give up,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ???
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Dave, it maybe as simple as
"accidentally, you have just put all of the above posts in the wrong thread"
then again the question begs "or was it intentional?"
http://ozvmx.com/community/index.php?topic=29026.0 (http://ozvmx.com/community/index.php?topic=29026.0)
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I have more and I can cut and paste also mick to the other post.
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pre 60 ;D
?
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Norton-Model-50-1954-350cc-Single-/251272020513?pt=AU_Motorcycles&hash=item3a80fac221
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I have more and I can cut and paste also mick to the other post.
Other thread Dave, not post, the other thread Dave. That would be good Dave.
I primarily started this thread so I could learn from the "tree of knowledge" as to what constitutes a legal Australian Pre-60 X1 framed Maico blizzard project, OK,,,. All though, so far, Mine will be just a plain old 1957 Maico Blizzard framed with a choice of two engines.
The first engine being a Round Iron Barrel 250 blizzard engine.
The second engine being a 175 Alloy Oval Barrel engine From a 1957 175 Super Sport, Road going Blizzard
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/Scan0014_zps81a86f77.jpg)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/Scan0016_zps5652866d.jpg)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/Scan0017_zpsc21dd3c3.jpg)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/Scan0018_zpse6161080.jpg)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/Scan0019_zpsb80f2e10.jpg)
Apologies if the scans could be better,,,,just the frustrations of more shit I have to learn.
As well as somehow scanning this foreign language to English
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pre 60 ;D
?
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Norton-Model-50-1954-350cc-Single-/251272020513?pt=AU_Motorcycles&hash=item3a80fac221
Yeah, I should have just bought a going concern, but I love tinkering, learning, Maicos and building.
That Blue 57 AJ you put up that time would have been the go I reckon. Lets see If I still have the Pic???????
Yeap, yeap, yeap
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/7a60a6cf-5b2e-4fd2-b996-504902aabf66-xlg_zps69c7ea4b.jpg)
Now that is pretty :o 8)
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do you know where it was taken ?
My bet's Holland Bill...it looks sandy and I think that's Dutch rider Rudy Boom or Jan van der Hoek on the Adler, possibly Fritz Betzelbacher on the Maico.
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I realise this Blizzard needs the side stand removed, a folding gear lever fitted and verifying that the rear fender is metal.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/MICKY/Pictures/582502_3486535573682_664568926_n_zpsf32bce7f.jpg~original)
This bike maybe a 1960 or a 1961 model, but never the less it is one beauty of a Pre-60 mount as well ;D
Another expensive ebay purchase for this project,,,,,,,Uuuumm
Yeap just as I suspected
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/MICKY/Pictures/DSC00024_zps3159ff39.jpg~original)
The whole world has Its share of impossible to educate D#*B C^%TS
It is just that some countries call them by different names ::)
DUMM K*^TS maybe.
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Another expensive ebay purchase for this project,,,,,,,Uuuumm
Yeap just as I suspected
AAAAAAHHHHH! what a bugger Mick....I bet you were livid >:(. Was it insured? You're right, some of the senders are indeed dumb, not even thinking about packing the stuff properly to avoid over zealous postal staff handling. I've been lucky with my stuff coming from overseas but have had my share of squashed packages including a flat track seat base that was broken in half. I guess we have to suck it up but it's certainly frustrating.
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ouch
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I know the pre 60 and pre 65 Maico thread boundaries are getting blurred but this Maico fin treatment does it for me. There was a mob that did similar finning on Maico go-cart engines (Zeigler, Zeidler or something like that)which I think is what my square barrel 250 was copied from. Maybe this is one of their creations. It's given me ideas for my Metisse. If I'm going to build a hot rod Maico, why not go the whole hog as long as it fits into the pre 65 concept. Any idea of this finning was available prior to 1965?
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/maicofins_zps987bf60b.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/maicofins_zps987bf60b.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/maicometisse002_zpsa2470339.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/maicometisse002_zpsa2470339.jpg.html)
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Another expensive ebay purchase for this project,,,,,,,Uuuumm
Yeap just as I suspected
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/MICKY/Pictures/DSC00024_zps3159ff39.jpg~original)
The whole world has Its share of impossible to educate D#*B C^%TS
It is just that some countries call them by different names ::)
DUMM K*^TS maybe.
Ouch, that sucks.
Is that the cast iron barrel?
I guess it must be for the fins to break that easy.
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cutting fins is cooling factor not a performance part, so it should matter in pre 65.
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cutting fins is cooling factor not a performance part, so it should matter in pre 65.
I does matter Dave. Cutting the fins drastically modifies the look of the motor which would incite hate from the rule Nazi's. Being all about peace, love and goodwill I'd hate to rile the ire of these folks by presenting a bike with an engine that doesn't look pre 65. If it can be proved to have been done by somebody prior to the cutoff date (pardon the pun) for pre 65 I'm doing it.
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Ouch, alright Paul.
Yes Geoff, Cast Iron. It should be of reasonable grade one would assume though, given its application and the fact that Maico made 5 digit # amounts of these.
I bought it, for the once perfect fins. Yes disappointed at first Mark, but that passed quickly. At least the seller is not a thieving scumbag with an intentional lying description, he is just a dumb f***, with little to no idea. In regards to a PayPal claim the trouble is, because of its weight, it is more $s to post back, return with tracking and receipted arrival for a smaller refund(purchase price only). I asked him politely for a refund, he ignored me so I left a Negative, something I rarely do. I am OK with it. I always expect some level of risk with ebay, its only a hobby. I will just have to weld them back on I guess.
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Yes Geoff, Cast Iron. It should be of reasonable grade one would assume though, given its application and the fact that Maico made 5 digit # amounts of these.
Cast iron is weldable but it’s a bit like guessing the Lotto as to what they have put in the mix.
Some cast iron will weld easily while others can be a real bitch.
And I have come across the same parts for the same models that will weld differently so it can also depend on the casting batch on the day.
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The cost of postage on that lum of cast iron out of euro would be more that the barrel cost
What about removing the broken top fin only with the head on be hard to pick
Pity it was not a Alloy barrel ;D
My DKW projects have been a pain in the arse postage wise out of Germany
(http://i48.tinypic.com/6omkx1.jpg)
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The cost of postage on that lum of cast iron out of euro would be more that the barrel cost
What about removing the broken top fin only with the head on be hard to pick
Pity it was not a Alloy barrel ;D
My DKW projects have been a pain in the arse postage wise out of Germany
(http://i48.tinypic.com/6omkx1.jpg)
What an awesome pic :o Thank you VMX60!
More proof that an all alloy 175 based engine is legal to race in Pre-60.
Your dead right, the barrel was 65euro and the shipping to here was 91euro :-[
Good idea, I would have been satisfied to remove the top fin completely, but,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
a view from the left
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/DSC00023_zpsf32306c5.jpg?t=1368069322)
Out of all the countries I have dealt with Germany has been the most frustrating. A lot to do with boggy translators, but also a lot of dodgy sellers that I will not trade with again.
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Bloody hell hope the cast iron Maico finning is not like the Deek barrels Telves Finning
The process was pioneered by Alfred Telves of Frankfurt-am-Main in an endeavour to obtain more efficient heat dissipation, allowing higher engine speeds and greater power output.
This system was not exclusive to DKW but they were the ones who made most use of it on their production bikes. The process is based upon a centrifugal casting method, producing bi-metal cylinders consisting of thin staggered copper fins on a cast iron cylinder barrel. This was achieved as the centrifugal process threw the molten copper being the heavier metal into the extremities forming the fins, while the lighter molten grey iron formed in the centre area, creating the cylinder wall.
The advantage of this system was to produce a cylinder barrel which dissipated the heat more efficiently from the thin copper fins. The fins could be made shorter and closer together, which were staggered to increase the air flow efficiency. This would not be possible to achieve with cast iron alone and led many manufacturers to concentrate on aluminium from the sixties onwards for their production
Deek did make a Alloy barrel for the 250 one day i hope to find same
Murray
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I stick welded the cast iron fins on my Triumph 500 barrel a few years ago but for the life of me can't recall what rods I used (possibly Austarc Supercast :-\ ). I don't know whether Maico cast iron is comparable to the Brit stuff but I had no problems and it dressed up nicely. Once painted you couldn't tell which fins had been repaired.
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Hi Mick,
Like Mark, I've had success welding cast iron fins on a Triumph cylinder, but I used the tig with S/S wire. Preheat and postheat required, but easy to control,
Pete.
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common as muck these old Maicos....
http://www.flickr.com/photos/75850763@N03/8717852944/in/set-72157633425939943/
Out racing last weekend
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or this oval in action from Siege, Jeff Mullen on his Maico taken at Crooked River Ranch
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/maicoovalT13-Mullins98_zpsdf045949.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/maicoovalT13-Mullins98_zpsdf045949.jpg.html)
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Can someone tell me how heavy are these maico, do they feel light.
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the one at my joint isn't that heavy/bout the same as a 74 maico
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(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/MaicoAd6502150_zpsced50c51.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/MaicoAd6502150_zpsced50c51.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/MaicoAd660375_zps99b0ea53.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/MaicoAd660375_zps99b0ea53.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/MaicoAd6703150_zps0780c49c.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/MaicoAd6703150_zps0780c49c.jpg.html)
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http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Maico-BLIZZARD-repair-instruction-/161026303210?pt=AU_Motorcycle_Parts_Accessories&hash=item257dea64ea
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Mick, tried to contact you through PM for a email to send the pics...
Anyway, here they are. :)
Get back to me at olam then an @ and then husaberg.no
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd485/ola_martin/IMG_0882_zpsd0dc7847.jpg)
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd485/ola_martin/IMG_0883_zpsc9cbe891.jpg)
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd485/ola_martin/IMG_0881_zps9bfc5456.jpg)
I took off the paint in the "knee-dent" to check the surface as I had planned to have that area plated.
Can't see any rust inside through the fillerhole.
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The tank is very similar to my -66 Tempo, but when I got both next to each other they where quite different. Too bad, as Tempotanks go for well over 1000$ ::)
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd485/ola_martin/Tempo_zps53769ba0.jpg)
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Wow, I glad I am not restoring building a '66 Tempo,
nice bike but Ola,
PM sent, try to be gently ;D
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Tell me about it, I found this in a field as a bare frame and swing when I was 13 years old, have been collecting parts for 20 years and are almost done, no reproduction parts except grips cables and seatcover. Parts are very hard to find and pricey... :-\
Seems like every guy with a bike interest, born around 1950, wanted one of these back then, so due to nostalgia the fetch up to 70 000 Norwegian Kroner, about 12000US$
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I bet ya there were times when you had wished you had never gone out in the field that day :D ;D
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Hey Ola, just out of curiosity, what sort of rims are on that Tempo?
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got another blizzard engine avail .any interest
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PM sent Paul
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/02072011159_resized_zps004dd7ad.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/02072011159_resized_zps004dd7ad.jpg.html)
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Still available?
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yeah im waiting to see what cc it is
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PM sent
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Couldn't find her on previous pages, but a sweet treat !!
(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r259/vmx247/Maico201963_lge-1_zps78163c43.jpg) (http://s146.photobucket.com/user/vmx247/media/Maico201963_lge-1_zps78163c43.jpg.html)
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/02072011159_resized_zps004dd7ad.jpg) (http://s382.photobucket.com/user/ozmaico/media/02072011159_resized_zps004dd7ad.jpg.html)
sold
sold
soldsold[move]sold[move]
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geezas,11 pages on blizzards,nobody mentions front page "old bike australasia",with an resto article to boot,surely "not VMX" applies??,such dedication ;D, :P
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I got no money or body parts left to buy a magazine Mick.
I just swapped an arm, a leg and a left nut for some early Norton Roadholder forks.
The way its going, I may as well go the whole hog and get the Darlin gold plated and fit some diamond encrusted handlebars ::)
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MickD sounds like your in to bling....lol
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;D
Yeah, I reckon Bling would be heaps cheaper Bazza.
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This one Mick
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqFHJFYFGWM7OQoBRrvvscI60_58_zps9f50f648.jpg~original)
I'll get one as soon as me left nut grows back.
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:) More credence to the all alloy pre-60 Maico 175 engine, derived from using the top end of the very successful 50's 175 kart engine.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/Maico_Kart_Engine_01_zpsc84e58b0.jpg~original)
and
Alloy Altenberger rims a plenty as standard if you were able to afford the Deluxe Super Sport model.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/T2eC16ZsE9swm1iBBR23IR4y60_3_zpse9692972.jpg~original)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqNqMFHTNy-R3BR23ISE5bQ60_3_zpsb4dded0e.jpg~original)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqFo0FG05sZJsBR23IRlOL60_3_zpsf5261028.jpg~original)
Click HERE (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Other-Makes-blizzard-175-super-sport-1958-maico-175-cc-blizzard-street-motorcycle-/290943397653?pt=US_motorcycles&hash=item43bd93ef15&vxp=mtr) for Ebay link.
I wish I had of had the confidence at the time to have snaffled and transported Ola Martins GS175 :-[
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Yep...alloy barrel...175.. but not 250 for pre 60...still the 175 may well be as quick as the 250 at any rate.. :-[
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Does it have anything on the ID plate?
In typical Maico fashion the plate has 247cc and no date whatsoever.
Actually Mark, that is not the case in the MotherLand. In fact ALL of the Maico bikes and frames that I have seen on German Ebay for the last six years do have the date stamped on them. It has been a reasonable classroom(German Ebay).
Who knows why they weren't date stamped when Exported? Could be a multitude of reasons :-\
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This little beauty just arrived. YeeHa 8)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/10dace03bf219b1a981d1dffeb05f1ad8_zpsc8e1fdbb.jpg~original)
Not only is it in great condition, it also has delivered some great news in the name of research and proof of eligibility.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/2013-08-16112234_zps5a9f6b6b.jpg~original)
The numbers stamped on the frame match the numbers stamped on the ID pate.
This frame to me proves what I had been hoping for, that the second generation of Blizzard frames were indeed being produced en mass out of the factory from sometime during 1959. It has a fabricated steering head instead of the earlier cast steel one. A heavier oval shaped tubing is used for the upper backbone and also the main front down tube. I have spotted several other significant upgrades in regards to geometry and strength failings of the earlier frames.
Incidentally, this is another earlier blizzard currently on German ebay at the moment
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqZlQFH4RGhKiBSEnSrfTD60_58_zps4a87b318.jpg~original)
http://www.ebay.de/itm/MAICO-M200-1953-/121162115560?pt=Motorr%C3%A4der&hash=item1c35d329e8 (http://www.ebay.de/itm/MAICO-M200-1953-/121162115560?pt=Motorr%C3%A4der&hash=item1c35d329e8)
It too has its ID tag dated
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/T2eC16NzUE9s389zFjBSEnUGnYCw60_58_zps4d416bcb.jpg~original)
Just like all Maicos sold inside Germany to their Home-Land domestic market up till the first major fracture of the Maisch Brothers reign.
Over the years it has produced for me what I consider to be a much more realistic Chronological account of Maico production prefix IDs. A list that is in contrast to the web published lists of a few Global Maico Stalwarts and Gurus.
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You're an intrepid explorer for the early Maico cause Micky ;D. You and Rodger should be right for pre 60 now, leaving pre 65 ovals to little old me ;D.
Below: AL161's iron barrel oval Maico approaching completion.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/blizzard002_zpscaf21023.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/blizzard002_zpscaf21023.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/blizzard004_zps04168ded.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/blizzard004_zps04168ded.jpg.html)
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This frame to me proves what I had been hoping for, that the second generation of Blizzard frames were indeed being produced en mass out of the factory from sometime during 1959. It has a fabricated steering head instead of the earlier cast steel one. A heavier oval shaped tubing is used for the upper backbone and also the main front down tube. I have spotted several other significant upgrades in regards to geometry and strength failings of the earlier frames.
Could you elaborate on these failings? I have a '56 frame.
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Uuuuhmm. draggin the chain of posts catch up.
This frame to me proves what I had been hoping for, that the second generation of Blizzard frames were indeed being produced en mass out of the factory from sometime during 1959. It has a fabricated steering head instead of the earlier cast steel one. A heavier oval shaped tubing is used for the upper backbone and also the main front down tube. I have spotted several other significant upgrades in regards to geometry and strength failings of the earlier frames.
Could you elaborate on these failings? I have a '56 frame.
I checked through your posts, I see your name is Kurt, mine is Mick, hello.
I knew bugger all about blizzards, still do, that is why I started this thread, for help.
Didn't know so many would contribute, thank you.
I am flat out over the next two weeks at least. I will then try to display a comparison between the two generations of frames. Your prompt has given me some ideas, Thanks.
In the mean time it may help if you could throw up some pics of your please.
Have you had it stripped to bare metal yet? have you noticed ant cracks or bends?
My early gen one frames have been bent and straightened more times than I have.
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Hey Mick......What's the best way of getting a tank out of Germany and what would I expect to pay for shipping or post? I'm thinking of bidding on this.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/330997605800?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/330997605800?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649)
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I think that tank might be quite large for a mx bike if it's the one I think. Ask for measurements before you bid...?
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Good point Martin. What model is the tank I need off? I want it for my Motoball Maico.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/15497895-27240-large.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/15497895-27240-large.jpg.html)
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Don't know very much about this, but the ebay tank you linked to looks like the one that was on my GS.
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd485/ola_martin/IMG_0991_zpsabc976b2.jpg)
Wich is pretty big.
The one Mick bought from me came of a MC model, and is quite a bit smaller. (wich as you can se is the same as the Hercules)
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd485/ola_martin/IMG_0882_zpsd0dc7847.jpg)
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hhmmm,that last tank style looks good 8), :P
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Until I find a proper Maico MC tank I might use the Wassell trials tank I've got on my Maico trials bike. I think it'll look OK. I'm toying with getting the little Maico running for the Bonanza at Easter.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/CD9116.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/CD9116.jpg.html)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/wassell_zpsbbf5ac12.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/wassell_zpsbbf5ac12.jpg.html)
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Nice work Firko.
I think there are four different sizes of this shape Maico tank
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/T2eC16dkE9s4BL5tBSFJePDlNw60_58_zps1a633a81.jpg~original)
That particular seller is very decent to deal with Firko and he has two of those same tanks for sale, both black.
He speaks english and his charges are fair with tracking.
The smallest of that shape come on the M175 and M200
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqZlQFH4RGhKiBSEnSrfTD60_58_zps4a87b318.jpg~original)
The largest from the 400 Taufin twin cylinder roadies and there seams to be two other sises used on the intermediate roadies and GS models. I think the GS 360 models and 350cc twin Taufin use the third largest sise.
I would like to know the fluid capacity of each.
I would be prepared to pay mega bucks for this 277cc Blizzard tank, for my early GS or SS projects.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqJHJEkFH-qh4RkOBSG0bo3VQ60_58_zps5763ef05.jpg~original)
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I am very grateful to Ola for this tank
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/IMG_0882_zps3d51362b.jpg~original)
It will be the first item through the new soda blasting plant and then the first through the new rust diss-appearing plant.
I am pretty sure Maico never made such a tank. Like most European Manufacturers, Maico had no aversion to outsourcing component manufacture or supply though.
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I have a '56 frame.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqMOKpwFIDgPmGqwBSH5Iv1J60_58_zps1de04cc1.jpg~original)
There you go Kurt
This 1956 magazine features your frame being raced
It is on German ebay right now and dirt cheap international postage as well.
Pain in the ass translating them, but these magazines are a great account of the truth from a time when I wasn't even born.
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I love the groovy party shirt worn by the Maico rider (Fritz Betzelbacher??). Not an energy drink logo in sight ;D
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(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqMOKpwFIDgPmGqwBSH5Iv1J60_58_zps1de04cc1.jpg~original)
Yeah he was in the gruuv alright. Trendsetter.
looks like hes been out partying all night :D ;D :o :o
Sorry girls, suns up, the gates are about to drop at the track, got to go :-* :-* see yah's
Any how we will all know who it is in two weeks time::)
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I love the groovy party shirt worn by the Maico rider (Fritz Betzelbacher??). Not an energy drink logo in sight ;D
Yep I do not get the current idea of actually paying extra money for riding or casual gear for the privilege of wearing an advertisement on your body. Monster this, Repsol that, Red Bull something else what th…………. It is a bit like wearing your under pants 150mm above your daks what is that about
Oops thread hijack ::)
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And a baseball cap with the eye protecting sun peak facing backwards ::)
And wearing UFC and Tap Out crap, with out ever been in a ring or on a mat.
I have enjoyed every Harley I have ridden,
but the bad boy eyes on the back of the mid life crisis harley jacket ::) ::) ::) FFS
Yeap, you don't have to have it in your hand to be tugging away on it ::)
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Based on Fritz's groovy shirt, I reckon he would have cruised the Paaffingen, West Germany night club precinct during his nights off driving his Maico sports car. The chicks would have sacrificed their virtue for a ride with Fritz in his exotic teutonic two tone roadster 8).
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/Maico2050020Sp_zps7ff43c7f.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/Maico2050020Sp_zps7ff43c7f.jpg.html)
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(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/Maico2050020Sp_zps7ff43c7f.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/Maico2050020Sp_zps7ff43c7f.jpg.html)
That is awesome 8)
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It looks like a 4 cylinda gogomobile :o
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(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/maico_500_brochure_zps8d205842.jpg) (http://s1112.photobucket.com/user/firko2/media/maico_500_brochure_zps8d205842.jpg.html)
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[url(http://i1282.photobucket.com/albums/a535/facthunt/IMGP0001_zps8ebf75f2.jpg)][/url]
http://i1282.photobucket.com/albums/a535/facthunt/IMGP0002_zps6f15acc4.jpg[/img]](http://i1282.photobucket.com/albums/a535/facthunt/IMGP0002_zps6f15acc4.jpg) (http://[img width=800 height=626)
Some pics of my '56 Blizzard frame. It appears to be straight, some corrosion visible, probably quite a bit hidden.
When I find a front end I'll get serious with this project.
Cheers Kurt
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That's the first pics you have posted?
you sorted it, good work Kurt.
For any given period the 175, 200, 250 and 277 Blizzard frames are the same. The only difference being brackets, gussets etc for varying applications of either road, Gs, scrambles, military etc.
Yours is a road Bike frame, probably why it is still straight, looks OK from a distance. Which of course makes it a good starting point.
If it were mine, I would gusset and brace it in several areas if it is to survive the trauma of scrambles or motocross.
Areas where they commonly fail under duress. I will get some pics up in a couple of weeks of where I know they fail.
Keep an eye out at your local scrap dealer for a trashed shipping container, and see if he will cut you a couple of the GOOD square feet out of it for gusseting and bracing stock.
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I will certainly be strengthening the frame, just a question of where and how.
Any suggestions will be most welcome.
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No worries,
I will show you what I have learnt and Identified so far, mainly from slowly to translate German Magazines.
I will do some pics up on where they are known to crack and bend.
But I need to vacate this site and ebay for a couple of weeks first
Hopefully I will be a bit more organized by then and have a barrel of Monkeys of my back as well.
PS; all those cheap new India Royal Enfield front forks on ebay look the go. They are close to the right length.
I wonder who on here could tell us which are the right pre-60 legal ones?
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This Blizzard has an allloy barrel as well ;D
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqJngFJBiqq0OOBSVDPZoMu60_58_zpsc46f933f.jpg~original)
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http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-4Page-1962-MAICO-250-Scrambler-TEST-AHRMA-Vintage-Motocross-/261323731890 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-4Page-1962-MAICO-250-Scrambler-TEST-AHRMA-Vintage-Motocross-/261323731890)
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2013 sucks, but things are improving now, touch wood.
I have a lot of German magazines and a few Blizzard brochures now.
One interesting thing is that at one time or other during the fifties, the Blizzard range had just about every rim size combination imaginable.
Lots of evidence that the Alloy Altenburger rims were indeed OEM fitment on the light weight deluxe models,
such as the small capacity Super Sport range.
This is on the way
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/KGrHqJjYFJtP8vh-QBSfkHK2Eg60_57_zps816d61d4.jpg~original)
It is an original OEM fifties wheel.
An Alloy 19" Altenburger rim factory laced to the smaller diameter Wide hub.
It completes a matching set 19/18" factory alloys.
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Ok, time for me to be positive, even if I have to force a smile ;D. well that wasn't too hard, great to have the icon to click on ;D See, done ;D See
Any how, I have misspent a lot on this project. I usually don't know if the idea is acceptable, until it can be measured. So it feels great when a win is had,,,,,, as I collect components for the build :)
The Blizzards run a steel lower triple tree clamp. Through books from Germany, I have found that the predecessor to the Blizzard
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/2013-12-13141945_zpsdaea20b7.jpg~original)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/91bb03f0-b326-4e91-b06e-0ab4e3a6d800_zps588b4c40.jpg~original)
Actually ran an all alloy triple set.
These just turned up. They ran upside-down forks back then, so the triples easily accommodate the 35mm Norton Road-holder forks. Eureka, you little beauty bottler, Bingo!
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/T2eC16VHJIFHSKq62fBSeuUQJ4w60_57_zps51f3778e.jpg~original)
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This little beauty just arrived. YeeHa 8)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/10dace03bf219b1a981d1dffeb05f1ad8_zpsc8e1fdbb.jpg~original)
The numbers stamped on the frame match the numbers stamped on the ID pate.
This frame to me proves what I had been hoping for, that the second generation of Blizzard frames were indeed being produced en mass out of the factory from sometime during 1959. It has a fabricated steering head instead of the earlier cast steel one. A heavier oval shaped tubing is used for the upper backbone and also the main front down tube. I have spotted several other significant upgrades in regards to geometry and strength failings of the earlier frames.
Well done !
This frame is for the M250B => Behörde. That means government, like army, police, customs authorities etc..
Most of them were produced for the army, because Maico has won a contract with them, against rivals like BMW and DKW.
Production starts in late 1958!
The parents of the Bike are the MC modells of 1957 and so the frame is nearly the same in matters of geometry and strength :)
Just cut the additional parts away and ready ist the MX Bike :) :) !
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This little beauty just arrived. YeeHa 8)
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/10dace03bf219b1a981d1dffeb05f1ad8_zpsc8e1fdbb.jpg~original)
The numbers stamped on the frame match the numbers stamped on the ID pate.
This frame to me proves what I had been hoping for, that the second generation of Blizzard frames were indeed being produced en mass out of the factory from sometime during 1959. It has a fabricated steering head instead of the earlier cast steel one. A heavier oval shaped tubing is used for the upper backbone and also the main front down tube. I have spotted several other significant upgrades in regards to geometry and strength failings of the earlier frames.
Well done !
This frame is for the M250B => Behörde. That means government, like army, police, customs authorities etc..
Most of them were produced for the army, because Maico has won a contract with them, against rivals like BMW and DKW.
Production starts in late 1958!
The parents of the Bike are the MC modells of 1957 and so the frame is nearly the same in matters of geometry and strength :)
Just cut the additional parts away and ready ist the MX Bike :) :) !
Danke Marcus
1959 ID Plate
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/2013-08-16112234_zps5a9f6b6b.jpg~original)
To date, it has been an expensive but enjoyable education.
Your knowledge will be invaluable to our builds. There are a few of us wanting to build and race these early Maicos.
Danke.
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Another expensive ebay purchase for this project,,,,,,,Uuuumm
Yeap just as I suspected
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/MICKY/Pictures/DSC00024_zps3159ff39.jpg~original)
The whole world has Its share of impossible to educate D#*B C^%TS
It is just that some countries call them by different names ::)
DUMM K*^TS maybe.
Cut the first 4 or 5 fins away and put a selfmade alloy barrel on it like this:
(http://up.picr.de/17133777tj.jpg)
That will improve the cooling too ;)
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Here a 175ccm with this conversion:
(http://up.picr.de/17138232jm.jpg)
(http://up.picr.de/17138236vc.jpg)
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Do you know about the "crankshaft conversion" (400'er rod in 250'er crank) in this forum?!
(http://up.picr.de/17139244mu.jpg)
Or the crank sealing "problem" ?! Please let me know, because this are the 2 requirements for tuning and reliability ;)
(http://up.picr.de/17139243tq.jpg)