Pre 90 VMX

[JohnnyO]

Motomaniac i'll have to have another look at the GCR's. I assumed a pre '85 bike is one that doesn't fit the Evo category because of disc, single shock etc. otherwise it's a confusing f#*k up if both classes overlap.

[GMC]

Bit like a bidding frenzy at an auction isn't it
Wonder who will have the final bid

[mxmaniac]

Before EVO came in a year or 2 ago in vic, the 81 490 husky 414 etc, could only run in pre85..
As that was the class it fitted in. Thats why i think its drummed into us that them bikes are pre85 bikes.
When evo came about, it was a class that was what i believe, designated for a bike that came standard with twin shock drum brake?  Which obviously was a class that these bikes could run in legally. So to myself and probably other vics, its as normal as vegimite and cheese to be able to run in both classes.  I have never heard anyone complain about it on race day, from the TASSIE NATIONALS or Victorian series. I am not used too having to have the rules and regs on ya bar pad, under your peak and in your goggles to know whats what at a new race meeting, as i couldn't give a F$#@ who i ride against, u can have the trophy and bragging rights, i just want to enjoy the fun and banter of VMX.
If some rule book junkie had of jacked up and did something about it at Tassie when it supposed to matter the most, it would of been all understood and dead and buried on the 1st day of racing. The oppertunity was there to make a perfect example of the 81 490 riding up or down a class, but why didn't anyone? Then you would of all been able to sleep at night.  
 Where were you all when the nationals were on at Tassie? Why didn't you guys put the issue too bed on that weekend?  I gather you were all there as you wouldn't want to miss something that is so importants to u? "THE NATS".. or is it only important now because its QLD

[JohnnyO]

Ok i just had a quick look at the rulebook and it says pre '85 is all machines built up to and including '84 models. It doesn't say from when?
Evo doesn't have a year period so does that mean any bike built before 1985 is elligible to race pre 85??

Mxmaniac i think this evo/pre 85 thing has only become an issue lately because we're used to not riding up a class and you guys are used to being able to do it.
Apparently this is also the first year you are not able to at the Nats either. It's all new to me, i haven't ridden the Nats since '94 and there was no evo then.

[motomaniac]

Bit like a bidding frenzy at an auction isn't it
Wonder who will have the final bid

Jump in Geoff .Wheres ya 2 bobs worth? Got anything against Ballard on his Maico going at it with Belly on my old CR500?
Or what if Gally,Williams ,Gunter,Bettle Bailey.Peter Benson , Peter Carney ,Andrwe Bailey,Darryl Willoughby,Vaughn Styles turned up for the Nats with there old rides.Would you want to see that or would you tell Gally and the others Yam Guys that nono you guys are racing with all the Maico's and Huskies .Virile ,Pete Carney and co are in with Gunt and Williams?

[holeshot buddy]

the trouble with pre 85 is you cant say
must have disc brake  as a lot of 84 models still
had drums and you cant say linkage as a
watercooled husky twin shock would have no class
we initiated pre85 for the gcrs up here in qld
it was originally designed for 81 to 84 machines
mainly mono shock
i raced at coffs there was no evo or pre85
couldnt make tassie
will probably go to vicco next year

[JohnnyO]

Rusty the problem with the gcr's is that it doesn't say '81 to '84 models or anything specific.
It says machines built up to and including '84 models.
The rules should have said machines built up to '84 that don't fit into the Evo category.

[090]

Rusty the problem with the gcr's is that it doesn't say '81 to '84 models or anything specific.
It says machines built up to and including '84 models.
The rules should have said machines built up to '84 that don't fit into the Evo category.

I dont read the rules  either. The reality is common sense versus what i can get away with via a loop hole. Common sense says that bikes are put in their eras to race against each other. Because of the wording you have pointed out ,someone with his own agenda can turn it around to suit themselves. Yes im a Queenslander but i would feel the same way no matter where i lived.
As far as back in the day stuff Motomaniac, i raced back then myself . I can only speak about Qld racing, but if you didn't have the latest, you weren't in the race. Whether they were better or just psychologically better who knows but twin shocks were all over as soon as single shocks were available. If there was a twin shock the guy was generally a sweeper rider. In 1981 there was a bit of an overlap as some were 'behind the times', but not the way you make out as if it was a 50 50 till near mid eighties (that is the picture you are painting). With the rules the way they are i can ride my '69 cz360 in pre '85. But that is ridiculous.
I am not a rule book nazi at all. I just am a bit fed up with people that twist the rules that are simple therefore floored to suit themselves.That is all that it is, plain and simple. And it all happens on this forum.
So i am not quoting the rule book, it looks like you guys have studied it to find away around what you want to do on a race day (like i said LOOKS like).
 

[ba-02-xr]

If the GCRs said post 80 to pre 85 and evo was post 78 pre 81. How many biks would this exclude? I can only think of 1. 79 Mugen ME 125. What would thoughts be on that. Dont take this as an attack. Dont start throwing s**t. Just a sugestion to a problem that is here. Or come up with resonable sugestion NOT to suit yourself but to suit the sport.

[GMC]

I think JohnnyO hit the nail on the head this time, Vic. evolved in one direction & Qld. another.
Depends on what your used to as to what you consider right.
Neither view is really all that wrong & it gets to be like arguing if a glass is half full or half empty.

I'm no fan of guys that look for loopholes to justify something for themselves, but this is a section that isn't written all that clearly.

Not wanting to maintain another bike isn't a valid reason to want to mix Evo & Pre 85
Nor is "he gets more rides than me" a valid reason to keep them separate.
I bought up 2 teenagers that would always complain the other got more ice cream or more playstation time, I really couldn't give a fork.

Pre 85 is a legit class & I'm all for Pre 90 at club level but it's the older bikes that are the real classics so if the older bikes are getting more rides then that is a good thing as it encourages guys to get something older.

What say we go back to debating how evil Pre 90 is

[NR555]

Before EVO came in a year or 2 ago in vic, the 81 490 husky 414 etc, could only run in pre85..
As that was the class it fitted in. Thats why i think its drummed into us that them bikes are pre85 bikes.
When evo came about, it was a class that was what i believe, designated for a bike that came standard with twin shock drum brake?  Which obviously was a class that these bikes could run in legally. So to myself and probably other vics, its as normal as vegimite and cheese to be able to run in both classes.  I have never heard anyone complain about it on race day, from the TASSIE NATIONALS or Victorian series. I am not used too having to have the rules and regs on ya bar pad, under your peak and in your goggles to know whats what at a new race meeting, as i couldn't give a F$#@ who i ride against, u can have the trophy and bragging rights, i just want to enjoy the fun and banter of VMX.
If some rule book junkie had of jacked up and did something about it at Tassie when it supposed to matter the most, it would of been all understood and dead and buried on the 1st day of racing. The oppertunity was there to make a perfect example of the 81 490 riding up or down a class, but why didn't anyone? Then you would of all been able to sleep at night.  
 Where were you all when the nationals were on at Tassie? Why didn't you guys put the issue too bed on that weekend?  I gather you were all there as you wouldn't want to miss something that is so importants to u? "THE NATS".. or is it only important now because its QLD

I'm not keen on vegemite, but I agree with mxmaniac on this.  If your bike fits under the age limit; you should be able to ride in it.  It's your funeral if you try to clear the same jumps as Evo on a Pre75.  

[Tex]

I always assumed (wrongly it seems) that even after the Evo class was introduced to VIPER that you still couldn't ride a Pre 80 bike in the Pre 85 classes. But, you could ride post 80 bikes in the Evo class.

In my mind that meant there were only a handful of bikes that could enter both classes (e.g. YZ250H).

I've always thought that Evo had no year cut off, but was restricted by technology. So if you found a twin shock, air cooled, drum braked bike that was made in 2008, it was still eligible.

Tex

[Sun Prarie Jimmy]

Just to keep you fine "ride up a class" type guys happy, I hear a rumour that a certain serial offender from WA has already protested the Nationals because he has entered a pre '65 bike in Pre '65, Pre '70, Pre '75 and Evo and the organisers have said no. What a complete dipshit this bloke is. I'm led to believe it's the same bloke who caused the famous CZ rear sprocket incident in W.A. a few years back. If ever there was a cockwash that should be charged with bringing the sport into disrepute it's this prick.

I'm mad as hell and i'm not going to take it any more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mxmaniac]

I am not a rule book nazi at all. I just am a bit fed up with people that twist the rules that are simple therefore floored to suit themselves.That is all that it is, plain and simple. And it all happens on this forum.
So i am not quoting the rule book, it looks like you guys have studied it to find away around what you want to do on a race day (like i said LOOKS like).
 
 Its not intended to bend the rules to suit ones self, as in Victoria we have been riding the 81 490 and 414 etc in both classes since day dot as explained earlier. There is no Twisting the rules at the Nats, as the thought of not being able to use the one bike in both classes had never even crossed our mind.. It wasn't illegal to race the 490 in EVO/Pre85 at last years nats, but if it had of been, it would of been an honest mistake, due to not knowing any different. Until this round of the nats, where you cant ride in both by the sound of it,The only problem is the difference in rules from state to state..  
Its like Karmichael Hunt throwing the ball in his first AFL game... ha ha  His doing what he is used to doing! It be fuggin funny though

[Sun Prarie Jimmy]

I can't wait to see the Victorians reaction the first time Karmichael pulls off a perfect cover tackle around the ankles, or does a grapple tackle. Now that will be funny.