Poll

Your thoughts regarding flag duties.

Hosting club to provide flag people.
8 (18.6%)
Independant paid flagging group. (dream at this stage.)
1 (2.3%)
Just hope a friend comes to help you.
1 (2.3%)
Pre-arrange the req`d amount of flaggies and pay them.
13 (30.2%)
Pay a fee to cover flaggies.
20 (46.5%)

Total Members Voted: 38

Author Topic: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.  (Read 10272 times)

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Offline Billet YZ

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Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« on: January 06, 2012, 10:07:04 pm »
Most of you would be well aware that finding enough willing people to wave a flag for us for a full day is getting harder and harder.

My thoughts with this poll is to have everyones input and suggestions and maybe just maybe we might stumble across some sort of fix for this problem, my personal opinion is that i would dearly pay a fee on top of the entry fee to have a day without the flag dutie.

What are your thoughts on $$$ that should be paid to all day flag individuals, that would also have lunch and drinks provided to them by your club. ?

Beware i am not a know all authority on this subject just a racer, i`m sure there are some very good ideas and suggestions on this forum.   Regards Peter. 
YAMAHA  you know you want one !!!  Viper #50

albrid-3

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2012, 10:12:12 pm »
local Fire Brigade, and donate some money for them and a free lunch. Thats who I got when I organized VMX meetings. Scouts are also willing

Offline Billet YZ

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2012, 10:16:13 pm »
local Fire Brigade, and donate some money for them and a free lunch. Thats who I got when I organized VMX meetings. Scouts are also willing

Good idea in theory Dave but i believe there are issues with O.H.&S. and these groups no longer being approved to do flagging etc.  Peter.
YAMAHA  you know you want one !!!  Viper #50

geoff22

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2012, 10:28:08 pm »
when I was road racing for years in victoria(upto retiring in 2003) the marshalls were from an actual organisation. They called themselves Race Marshalls Victoria. I finer bunch of men and women you would not meet. Not sure what the financial arrangement was with them however

albrid-3

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2012, 10:40:20 pm »
Also years ago, members that where not mx riders helped on the day as marshells, I also beleive that clubs that are hosting the meetings its there responsibility to arrange the marshells, I feel it needs to go back to days when clubs like colac mcc, sporting mcc, maffra sale mcc, Ballarat Rover Mcc, not VCM or Classic SCramble Club racing all over the country side looking for paddocks and half the members are warn out doing so.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2012, 10:50:16 pm by Dave #6 »

Offline VMX247

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2012, 10:53:39 pm »
When you send your yearly membership in, you nominate which 2 or 3 weeks you can officiate/flag at club level.
Which is usually turned into 4/5 half club days.(shared with mate/wife/boyfriend),So at least you get a few laps in on anyone club event...
Really time for the riders to cough up, as its for thier benefit in the first place.
cheers A
Best is in the West !!

Offline John Orchard

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2012, 11:46:05 pm »
I hate standing out on the track watching (flagging), I only want to ride (although I end up working at all the Mitchell days :-( ), pay em! (even tho I don't have much money)
Johnny O - Tahition_Red factory rider.

Offline brent j

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2012, 12:22:21 am »
We went through all the dramas of trying to get riders to provide a flaggy but now we use a local labour hire outfit.

We order the number of people we need and provide them with a written instruction sheet and run through it with them.

We provide drinks, lunch, sunscreen and shade on the track. We also move them around the track during the day and usually have one extra person to relieve or help on the canteen etc.

They have insurance and OH&S covered by their emplyer. We charge every rider $30 and there are no complaints.

Brent
The older I get, the faster I was

Offline Kenneth S (222)

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2012, 06:07:59 am »
Paying other people sounds like the easy way to solve this but those of us who employ casuals know how much stuffing around it would be for the 'Manager' of those casuals to have 10 casuals actually turn up, on time, on a both Saturday & Sunday to each out of the way location. Without doubt, one or two of them won't turn up or will have 'a pressing prior arrangement at 2pm' or 'My mum is picking me up and she can only do it at 2.30' or 'Jack couldn't make it so he sent me, his 10 year old kid brother'. The cost whatever it is, is a lot of extra money to some and using the example of $30 per rider with 100 riders at a race meeting that extra $3000 would be much better utilized in the clubs' coffers in my view.

I have posted about this before. The one resource you are guaranteed to have at a race meeting is riders, and most riders are reasonable, realizing their obligation to carry some of the work load in this area. The organizing committee needs to get it right though. We as a club are in control of these race meetings so we should design a system that is the least 'uncomfortable' for us the riders and make all riders accountable.

What makes flagging uncomfortable?

Too long out there - Make the time shorter - spread the work load each day to 4 x 1 1/2-2 hr sessions.

The heat or rain on your back or the cold wind - Charge a little extra on the entry fees and have the club buy 10 x 2.5mtr x 2.5 mtr pop up quick shades with 2 sides filled in.

Nowhere to sit when flagging - Provide a $20 Directors chair for each flaggy.
(We are riding/racing vintage motorbikes and the majority of us have vintage bodies. After we have trashed about the track with those vintage bodies or before we are about to do same, it is crazy to have a system where we have to stand out there for 3 hours with no where to sit but a sharp, ant infested, pile of rocks or a pile of old tyres full of who knows what!)

No icy cold drinks on hot days or warm up drinks on cold days. - 10 x Esky's, 10 bags of ice, 10 large thermoses plus drinks.

With a bit more planning and initial preparation, no more than organizing & training 10 casuals to come to just one race meeting, for the entire race season you could transform an experience of 3-4 hours in the blistering heat with no shade or comfortable place to sit and a warm drink when you want ice to a 1 1/2-2 hour sit down in the shade out of the sun and wind sipping an ice cold drink.

If the organizing committee has organized all this and riders still don't do their bit then they should pay extra and be ineligible to earn race points.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2012, 06:10:26 am by KJ222 »
Kenneth S
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Race Bike History
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maico police

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2012, 07:24:34 am »
I think each rider nominates a day out of the series to flag/help run the show/not ride for the day. K's suggestion of full points for the day or some other incentive seems a good idea. Saves a lot of money, ma/mv are happy because you're using people who know what is expeted of them and there's more chance they'll not turn up. If they don't they lose any points they've earned in the series and get paraded through town like a downed bomber crew in enemy territory.....
« Last Edit: January 07, 2012, 07:26:50 am by Mont »

Offline BAHNZY

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2012, 08:10:19 am »
To run a points reward program i think you would need a minimum of 6 rounds to "smooth" the end of year results. This is kinda how the Victorian Off Road series run their program. The difference is you don't get your day off points till the end of the year where they give points equal to your highest points yield from any of the competed rounds.

On a different take, why is issue not being taken up on-mass with MA & MA-V ?
These are the people that we fund to promote the sport of motocross.
Rod (BAHNZY) Bahn

Offline Suzukal

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2012, 05:36:55 pm »
Good idea in theory Dave but i believe there are issues with O.H.&S. and these groups no longer being approved to do flagging etc

If a blind eye is used by some of the sanctioning bodies overseen by MA to allow for committee & club members to Flag Marshall, then it can be used to get the SES, CFA, the Rovers, the Scouts ,etc… to flag.    How hard is it before racing starts to inform the flaggies... rider down,stopped,crashed,... wave flag.

Offline VMX247

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2012, 05:41:48 pm »
Its not for MA to manage at club and interclub level and isnt it the steward of the day- no flaggies no ride ?
I'd have thought they have enough fingers in the pie !!
cheers A
« Last Edit: January 07, 2012, 05:44:28 pm by VMX247 »
Best is in the West !!

albrid-3

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2012, 07:43:08 pm »
I would like to build or see built, use the same system as Formula 1 build up a yellow flashing system which would be mounted on each corner, and use a wireless controlled panel that is controlled by one person at the finishing line or commentary box, by using your track marshell which in terms is called a track sweeper, he is the man that is in control of the track if a rider fulls off the yellow lights come on and  the riders are aware that the sweeper is on the track and they must take care and slow down, if an ambulance is needed then the sweeper will stop the race as well as the finishing flag man will do so too. by using the Red Flag. This system will be portable and used anyway at any track or natural terrain tracks.

Offline Canam370

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Re: Flag Marshalls Australia wide.
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2012, 08:40:04 pm »
Viper42 experienced the style of corner lights as described by Dave while at Glen Helen for an AHRMA race last year. He said it worked well and didn't require much in the way of manpower. Once the system has been constructed it would be pretty portable and if some corners couldn't be reached by cabling a flaggie could be used there instead. Maybe the lights could be activated wirelessly? At a guess the cost would be less than paying 2 meetings worth of flaggies? And then its use is free! Seems to be a common style in the US.
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