The Infamous Vern Grayson Cheney Triumph Case

[Marc.com]

It's disgraceful that two of the main protaganists have since been caught cheating themselves....

Its like cops being caught for drinking driving. Frankly I think quite a few people take themselves and the whole VMX thing way way too bloody seriously at the detriment of the sport. Vern's bike is every inch in the spirit of pre 65 and a very cool thing.

You need a whole new formula, I would take an example  from the Poms and Kiwi's, create all British formula, allow as many bikes to run as possible, run a couple of classes, pre 70 would make more sense as keeps the short travel stuff together.

The Kiwis are having all British events now that get a lot of interest and have stars of yesteryear turning up in the same way that the replica Manx race bikes had Bazza and Wayne even Scwantz in the saddle.

[Slakewell]

Gee he used the same frame jig for 5 or more years fancy that.
That's almost like saying a DT 175 is not pre 80 because you can buy a 2010 model that's the same.

[Marc.com]

Listen if as much energy was used to improve the sport rather than enforcing the rules then we would be looking at something other than the demise of pre 65 due to lack of interest.

I mean its all very well churning over Vern's bikes issue from the comfort of your retirement village, but I think I am more interested in how to move forward. Hell I was born about the same time as these Brit bikes were raced, but doesn't stop me from being an enthusiast, I think better to spend our key board energy.... to develop the next generation of Brit bike racers,  Kiwi's and Brits are totally on the way with their formulas.

[firko]

Listen if as much energy was used to improve the sport rather than enforcing the rules then we would be looking at something other than the demise of pre 65 due to lack of interest.

I agree....The impending rule changes should make situations like the Grayson case a thing of the past.
I posted the article in answer the many who have asked about the case, little knowing that the usual subjects would still be harbouring bitterness all these years later. In reality it boiled down to a case of lets get Vern and use his bike to do it. Let's all look forward to the rebirth of the class instead of getting all twisted over something that went down 16 years ago.

[Marc.com]

Hear Hear Firko .... I mean the question to everyone is what they would do to really set things alight again.

I would like to see big twins taking on BSA singles with everyone running on alcohol with flames spitting everywhere.

[cheapracer]

Vern's bike is every inch in the spirit of pre 65 and a very cool thing.

 that the replica Manx race bikes

Yes it is (other than the rear swingarm which a lot of people didn't agree with you), but Vern's isn't a replica that the rulebook requires and has no provision for "spirit" - change the rulebook.

Now I wonder if you can imagine what the field will look like if everyone is allowed to build bikes "in the spirit" using their own interpretations?

Gee he used the same frame jig for 5 or more years fancy that.
That's almost like saying a DT 175 is not pre 80 because you can buy a 2010 model that's the same.

No it's like saying show me the bikes that were made 5 years before 1970 on those jigs. Prove that he used the same jigs 5 years before, it really is that simple.

little knowing that the usual subjects would still be harbouring bitterness all these years later. In reality it boiled down to a case of lets get Vern and use his bike to do it.

Well since I'm the only one stating against you must mean me.

Bitterness? WTF? Bitterness over what? I have had many happy years and good times sharing VMX with Vern (and Averill) working towards a common goal. Vern was often the Steward at QVMX club days and always a welcome face. You weren't part of the Brisbane scene nor did you attend every club meeting and every race as Vern and I did so don't make comment on it, thank you.

"lets get Vern"??  MIB? CIA? ASIO??



Anyway lets end this thread guys with those period pictures .....

[firko]

don't make comment on it, thank you.

On what? Vern and Averil happen to be a very dear, long time friends of mine and I had a lot to do with the case when it was going on so don't tell me what I can and can't comment on .

[bazza]

Cheapracer you go on about your the man at that club tell me again why you left it? Your such an expert your metisse if it gets going will be spot on hope your jigs are pre 65 "its that simple"

[supersenior 50]

"many happy years sharing good times with Vern". Vern's responce to that was absolutely unprintable even on this open minded forum.
I agree with Cheapracer that this should close and we all move on.
We currently have an excellant commission, a resurgence of interest in the old bikes, and perhaps those not currently involved should butt out and let the positive thinkers get on with it.

[Tossa]

I have thoroughly enjoyed the thread as it started with the information regarding this bike and the problems it has caused.  A really good read, thoroughly ruined by personal opinions.  Thanks for sharing this iconic case with us Mark and those who have brought more insight into the bike etc.  To those who want to make it a slanging match, I'm sorry that's what ruins good interesting threads,  a real pity

[cheapracer]

Cheapracer you go on about your the man at that club tell me again why you left it?
Your such an expert your metisse if it gets going will be spot on hope your jigs are pre 65 "its that simple"

Errr I was talking about BMCC but as for QVMX is moving to another country a reasonable answer?

Yep, will be spot on, indeed it's that simple - would you like me to prove that Metisses existed in 1964 also? Plenty of reference ..

What's this got to do with the thread topic by the way? - I can assassinate my own character without your help buddy but it doesn't change the truth about Vern's bike being illegal which is what this topic is about - do you have a technical comment to make about that?

[Freakshow]

 I have no idea or comment on this, but after reading it over the last few days it still comes back to the same thing.  A picture of it pre 65 or otherwise, and loose the late novation style arm. 

I think with those 2 things covered its a race bike in every way.  without them you race pre 68 until you can.   Surely its not about smashing a class and winning ? if its about can the bike ride at the nats or not, im guessing  if its about the riding and not the issues - i would have just ridden a class up and fork it, then you would have had a ride and you worry about the details to vcome back down a class when you have them.

Only person who knows if this bike was made pre 65 is the guy that built it and a photo of it ridden pre 65, thats the only proof you need.  without its all he said she said.

[VMX247]

Freaky how many 65's entered for the Classics ??

[Freakshow]

Freaky how many 65's entered for the Classics ??

2 x 250
2x 263 +
1x pre 60

may be more in the mail now as i wont be doing the entries for 2 weeks as they go to MA letter box and the lady in the office is away for a fortnight.

I have been told on crossed hearts to expect from SA/ Vic ( not including anything that comes out from WA - if at all )
6 pre 68 sidecar
3 pre 75 sidecars
6 pre 85 sidecars
( yet to see the entries but so far i have got 2 sidecar entries so thats a start.

[Freakshow]

what a happy cat, hes loving his foil cap !