Identify early KTM

[Gippslander]

Can someone identify exactly what model this is?

[Slakewell]

Without the real frame numbers I would guess it's 1974.5 GP frame bike

[oldyzman]

I dont know what it is but its as cute as Liz Hurley...
Brett

[Gippslander]

Whats the GP mean?

[Slakewell]

If its the one for sale in Denver from this thread
http://ozvmx.com/community/index.php?topic=16173.0

I thinks Its a 1974.5 , If you can buy do so if you cant send me the details and I might.

[SAABCOMBI]

GP means general practitioner

[ozktm]

Looks to be a 74 numbered frame as it hasn't got the extra strengthener around the bottom head stem bearing.
Motor looks to be 74 as the left side engine support bracket is via a stud that is in behind the clutch basket, and right side engine case is a proper early one.
Note : the front wheel is incorrect - they have used the later '79 - '81 conical style front wheel. Should be a parallel style hub in black, along with the rear (may be correct) but wrong colour.

Info Per Penton Site Below: (note variations to this occured due to parts finishing and new parts entering)

1974
Same as 1973 except for the following:
* November 1973 - 250cc is now red and is still called "Hare Scrambler"
* 250cc MX models had green number plates
* 250cc Enduro models had yellow number plates
* December 1973 - 18" long seat now 3 1/2" thick (previously was 2 1/4" thick)
* All models have 35mm Ceriani forks
* Gas tank decal is a long wide black and white stripe with the word "Penton" in white
* New fiberglass 2.9 gallon low profile design enduro tank (nicknamed "watermelon") replaces the previous "toaster"
   enduro tank
* All models have color coordinated fiberglass exhaust heat shields/number plates
* New rear brake arms with holes
* All KTM engines are now finished in silver and come with a round profile clutch case cover
* 250cc and 400cc now have megaphone style pipe with large removable chrome tip
* 175cc came with original and megaphone style pipes
* KTM engines now have 2 piece kick starters
* New rear fender mounts are contoured stampings tin mounts located on corners of rear frame loop
* KTM powered models (175cc, 250cc and 400cc) had high shouldered Akront rims and conical rear hubs
* Head light is large bowl shape
* 100cc and 125cc are still Sachs powered
* 100cc and 125cc now have early style 175cc muffler
* 100cc and 125cc still have barrel hubs and chrome rims
* Last year for 100cc Sachs powered Berkshire model
1974 1/2 (April '74)
Same as 1974 except for the following:
* 400cc Mint introduced with all new KTM engine
* Mint has white gas tank and air box along with yellow number plates
* 400cc (actually 352cc) KTM engine is silver with Motoplat ignition, 6 speed gear box, cast aluminum alloy cylinder and
   head with 38mm Bing carburetor
* New frame and swing arm with 6 shock mounting positions for the 175cc, 250cc and 400cc KTM models - all
   100cc and 125cc Sachs models still maintained early suspension designs
* 125cc Sachs "D" series engine introduced
* Ceriani gas shocks
* GP seat, 21" long by 3 1/2" thick
* Right side air box mount eliminated
* Tank held down by two spring cables with aluminum retainer ring around tank filler neck
* New center U bracket rear fender mount
* Forged aluminum brake stays
* Late 1974 - 200mm (non-ribbed) forks, quick release rear brake arm and front brake arm with holes

[SAABCOMBI]

l think the 74`s had red tanks.

[Gippslander]

Thanks all, it looks like it's a 74 or more likley a 74.5 (because the lack of two rear mounting tabs for the rear mudguard seems to be a clear indicator) with 78 or 79 wheels (hubs and rims), 'cause the 73 to 77 models had full width hubs (thanks ozktm for the info), the engine looks 74 or 74.5 but I cannot work out the right hand side engine cover goin' all the way back over the front sprocket -- all of the other 'photo's on the net show a shorty cover over the ignition only and no cover over the front sprocket.
Anyway -- will see if I can get the numbers and that will tell the story 

[Gippslander]

Frame No is 54410-78013  Engine No is 3-5402277

So that looks like:
October 74 frame
73 Engine -- but 73 engines were black
Anyway, from what I can see there is no difference between the 73  and 74 KTM engines.
The hubs seem to be from a slightly later model but the Penton owners group site says that conical hubs were used in 74, so maybe correct -- but I think all rims in 74 would have been mudcatchers.

[ozktm]

Conical rear hubs only, not on the front till late late 70's like 79.
Maybe early 250 motor cases used in his rebuild, but all the same.
Interestingly we checked billy campbell's '74 175 (owned since new) at a recent vinduro to find that the motor was stamped 4-etc but in fact had date clocks cast from '72!!

[Gippslander]

Thanks OZ -- will now have to wait and see till it arrives -- will take a few months -- long and winding path to travel

[Slakewell]

If you dont like it sell it to me

[Gippslander]

The "problem" I have is that I was a crap pilot in the day and I'm slower now so if anyone else rides it I will break my heart to see how fast it can go  :'(

[Slakewell]

Brad Lewis put a current A grader on his at the Coffs Harbour nats a few years back and he won everything by half a lap. One race with a flat tyre and the all in race when one of the rear shocks fell off on the last lap.