OzVMX Forum
Clubroom => Bike Talk => Topic started by: JC14 on November 09, 2008, 12:28:15 pm
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Hi I am new here and have a 1982 pe175. Im currently rebuilding it and am wandering where i could get a chamber made for it. Also where would the best place to buy plastics from be?
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Hi i have a 1980 pe400 plastics may be hard to get for one of those as may alot of other parts heres some good stickers http://www.suzuki-pe.co.uk/pe175.html good luck Michael Ryan. :)
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Welcome aboard matey ..... Best you make contact with LWC 3077 , as they have a web site for PE .
At the moment there is a debate on who has the best repo plastics ( look up Yamaha talk back show ;D ) Chambers eeeer um - not sure if GMC does that model, send him a pm and ask
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Thanks for the replys guys. At the moment Im just putting the bike back together. Should be getting the head and barrel back from getting blasted tomorrow and have ordered some gaskets from suziparts. so i just have to clean the rest of the engine and put it back together now.
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Here are some useful links and items...
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Suzuki-PE-Rear-mudguard_W0QQitemZ320310112589QQihZ011QQcategoryZ122304QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-1978-1982-SUZUKI-PE-175-250-400-HEADLIGHT-HOLDER_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ35607QQihZ021QQitemZ310050908898
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/New-1982-1984-Suzuki-PE-175-PE175-Side-Panels_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ35584QQihZ003QQitemZ130262873805QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
http://www.alpha-sports.com/suzuki_parts.htm
http://www.vintage-suzuki.com/
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Not sure what you can about the rear fender. i dont know anyone making the fender for the full floater. have you got an original? it might be able to be restored.
there is a place that makes fibreglass fenders. look under topic of PE 175 vs IT 175.
also maybe look on http://pureenduro.free.fr/ theres been a few guys in france and belgium who have restored the fullfloaters so they may be getting rear guards from somwhere.
chamber made? you would really need to take your bike to a place so they can get it right. i could think a few places but they wouldnt be in your state.
have you got an original pipe? if you have but its damaged at the lower section you can buy repair sections for the bottom.
and i would sugest you join here and ask beacuse there a few other onwers of the full floater PE's and they may know more about getting a rear fender than me.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PEmotorcycles/
oh you should of asked me for gaskets. i have got a whole heap of nos 175 PE base gaskets ive got for cheap price. i was selling them in pairs
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Yer ive got the original pipe but its got a fair few holes and dents in it. not just on the lower section either. what sort of shop would be able to make a chamber? Do rm plastics fit the pe's?
So far i have stripped the bike right down and painted the frame, got the rims cleaned and respokes and the hubs painted black($500), seat redone blue with new foam, cleaned the forks inside and out and replaced fork seals, got some new parts such as sprockets and cables. there a few more things we've done.
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Geoff Morris Concepts can make pipes.
www.iwt.com.au can make pipes - but they are in SA
i think forum member Lozza could also make pipes - yes/no?
theres plenty of 2 stroke tuners/pipe builders who can do the job.
look at the advertisments in VMX and ADB magazines an search for australian places on the internet.
read this topic to see how to fit RM plastics to PE
http://ozvmx.com/community/index.php?topic=2109.0
do you want it original? are you using it for MX or trail/enduro use?
the RM rear fender is a MX fender and will be smaller and shorter than the PE rear fender which is an enduro fender
you shouldnt have problem with front fender
PE side number plates are still available from suzuki. they are different to RM side covers
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Can you still get the plastics from suzuki?
thats good then. Should i polish the head and barrel?
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front fender and sidepannels yes.
just one thing, the side pannels ure superceeded to 14L colour. im not sure what colour this is. that is from www.alpha-sports.com
try an australian suzuki dealer first as things could be differerent here and they may still have some of the 163 colour sidepanels in melbourne warehouse. also try Mick Hone Suzuki. they could have some side covers. and also ask suzi parts in adelaide. if he hasnt got any in stock ask him to do a 'worldwide search' for you which he does.
soem stuff alpha sports are saying are NLA or superceeded but recently i have found out to not alwayts go by this as when you try to order the same part in australia, you often discover that there are still stocks in Japan and the part is not superceeded.
what do you mean by polish the head and barrel? do you mean as in a port job or for external cosmetics?
if its internal polishing your looking at then yes you could smooth out the ports. i would get the bike going first and then see how it goes and decide on the type of power you want and then speak to a reputable 2 stroke tuner to discuss port jobs etc. if its cosmetic polishing your talking about, i personally wouldnt do it. i would rather bead blast and paint black for better head dissapation.
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If I got a pipe made for the pe but more like an rm pipe and got it ported and polished like an rm would it go more like an rm?
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maybe. i would use a RM ignition as well.
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would that do much? I just got a new cdi for it...
thanks for the advice
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with a internal rotor it will rev more. the RM CDI would have a different advance curve and have more MX power characteristics and suit a RM type pipe and RM spec cyclinder.
every part is originally made to suit other parts of the motor. if you go and change things that your not sure of you can make things worse and not better. a good design pipe will make a difference but is no good if it isnt made to suit the cylinder porting. same with a bigger carby, which will useally require cylinder work. to make the most of the increased amount of fuel/air going in/out.
have you got a 2 stroke tuning shop near you? if you really want to do a lot of modifications then i would recommend you discuss it with them and see what they can offer you. i am not a 2 stroke tuner so cant really offer much more specifc info but a full time 2 stroke tuner could. There are computer programs out there that can simulate your engine and give a reading of what your engine would be like and what power it would make depending on what mods were done.
I would suggest The 2 stroke institute in Sydney or IWT in Adelaide. 2 other good guys are Frank Pons and Gary Treadwell, but im not sure if they still do that sort of work
by the sounds of it you want to make this PE into a Motorcross bike?
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would that do much? I just got a new cdi for it...
thanks for the advice
Yes, RM's use an inner rotor ignition which is lighter and allows the engine to rev more quickly and higher. The PE uses an external rotor which is heavier but does provide more "flywheel effect" which prevents the engine from losing revs so quickly when you bog down.
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i probably wont do that then...
thanks for telling me about that stuff
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I can build a pipe for anything but if it's not already on my list of pipes I will most likely need a bike to jig from.
I haven't jigged for this PE model yet, but if you can get your bike to Broadford, Vic. I can do something, if your interstate then it gets a bit more awkward.
Also I doubt I would have time to jig any more pipes this year, on top of what I have allready promised. Early 09 should be okay though.
Cheers,
Geoff
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mmmm.... well i live in queensland so thats out of the question... is there any good 2-stroke pipe makers in queensland? got the head and barrel today. looks great.
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wouldn't an RM125 pipe fit?
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No
close, but the flange and head pipe are a different Diameter
as well as mount point under tank slightly different
I,ve just been trying to go the other way PE 175 to RM125
Cheers
Noel
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now im pretty sure a RM 250 X or Z (not sure) pipe will fit. yes one of those. in a few weeks time i will have an article about a modified full floater PE with a RM 250 pipe. when i get i will let you know. its at my friends house in USA.
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So a rm250x/z chamber may fit ayy. getting one of those would be cheaper that getting one made?
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So a rm250x/z chamber may fit ayy. getting one of those would be cheaper that getting one made?
You want a 1981 RM250X chamber only, the Z was for the first watercooled RM250 and is a different shape.
If you REALLY want more power you can fit a PE250X/RM250T engine into the frame and modify the PE175 pipe (I have seen this done) to fit. Apparently all you have to do is add 10-15mm to the pipe between where the header and the fat part of the expansion chamber are joined. But if you really only want RM power then trade or sell your PE to someone who wants a Vinduro and that would be a lot less hassle.
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yes this also can be done :o ive got an article on this. its pretty straight forward too. The RM or PE 250 motor can go in a 175 PE floater frame. ive thought of doing this but im not sure about how the PE 175 frame would take the extra weight and power of the 250 and if it would be too squirelly??? maybe a better option to fit a 250 PE motor to a air cooled fullfoater RM 250/465 frame (seen this before too)
when i get this article on the 250 pipe fitted to 175 i will tell you about it.
im sort of with cyclegod here, im not sure why many people try to build serious power MX bikes out of a PE? fair enough if you just wanna strip it down and fit MX fenders, but when your getting to the point of trying to make it exactly like a RM, wouldnt you be better off with a RM in the first place????
is it because PE's are generally cheaper and more common and RM's are too hard to find?
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Pe 175 are awesome to ride when well set up , but they will never be an Rm ;) They rev over the moon with a bit of port work and corner well with a bit of fine tuning to suspension ( rear shocks fade quickly - use trans fluid up front )
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A mate of mine fitted a PE400T motor into an RM250T frame. It was an awesome enduro bike in the day with that suspension and grunt combo. Ran a total loss lighting system. He still has it ...but its in NZ.
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got any photos of that PEZberg? i used to have a PE250 with a PE 400 motor in it. bolts right in with no mods as frames are the same. just need to use 400 pipe and air box to carby rubber boot.
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an of course the PE ignition also runs lights. I would keep the PE ignition as its less hassle, instead port the barrel and run after market pipe. Stock exhaust was heavy and had some funny baffles in it. I built engine for PE175Z floater with TS185 piston, RM pipe, it went pretty well.
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yer i don't think ill make any major changes. just smaller things like port and polish, maybe a pipe but at the moment im just putting it all back together. thanks for all the advice so far.
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Hi the Pe's are awsome im 16 and have a 1980 pe400 but i know a man whos had most of them and ridin mine he says even the 175 and 250 were great bikes if I were you i wouldn't be in any screaming hurry to change anything from original the only thing thats not really original on mine are handlebars and rear tyre heres a photo Thanks Michael Ryan. :)
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shocks dont appear original ;D or maybe you just have them unside down? i cant see clearly enough in your pic. rear fender???. have you got the perforated tank decals on it from motoduro? if so what do you think of them? how long have they lasted? any signs of bubbling?
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just out of curiousity, would a 400 motor fit in my frame? if so would it need to be strengthened? thanks
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thats a tough one. a 250 will, but i think a 400 would be a bit too tight..cases would fit as they are same as they 250 basically, but you would struggle with the top end and the rest of it. with a 250 in a 175 floater the carby is allready a tight fit and the bigger barrel of the 400 would space the carburettor back further. nothing is impossible so i think someone with mechanical and welding skills could maybe do it,i think it could be a little too much power for that chassis too? but ive also heard of a RM 500 in a 125 frame aswell, so dont know? the other recommened mod is to then also fit a bigger rear rim and tyre when fitting the 250 motor.
theres always a few PE 250 and 400's on ebay, maybe they would be a better option if you really want more power? many expert enduro PE riders such as Geoff Udy (he still has a 400 and may be riding a few vinduros soon, so im told) have said the 80/81/82 twin shock PEs were better than the full floater rear on the 175 when the std twin shocks shocks were replaced with a good set of french DeCarbons or some Ohlins. the twin shock geometry on the later PE's was at the pinicle of twin shock design, and isnt all that bad.
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Hi Leith shocks arent original forgot to mention that ;D rear fender is though just suffered trim years ago but its getting repainted again and i got sidecover stickers from Nick at Motoduro those tank ones are from him and are excellent the are extremely tough havent laid the bike over YET :) but im sure they would'nt get hurt i spilt petrol on them never looked like bubbling if you're thinking about getting some they are very good i did need to give them a little trim with the stanley and straight edge but then just sprayed water on tank and positioned and are the same today as they were a year ago when i put them on just like the seatcover buy the way jc pretty sure Pe400 wont fit in your frame and doubt you would come across a 400 motor any way but the 175 and 250 were great i reckon you should stick with what you have by the way there are better photos on www.bikepics.com Thanks and good luck with your PE Michael Ryan :)
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would the ful floater be better with a good shock in it? yer i didnt think the 400 motor would fit.
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might have to try those perforated ones on a spare tank i have. i havent asked Nick yet but i suspect he gets MXM to make them. did you also get your seat cover from motoduro?
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yeah should be. another good idea is to use the USA market full floater shock as it has a remote reservoir and adjustable damping ( i think). The australian models didnt have remote reservors because of the battery box location left no where for the reservoir to be mounted so we missed out on the better shock.
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Yes got the seat cover from him cant tell its not origanal its that good :) jc of course it would be better with a modern shocker dont forget the 175 is a lot lighter and if you stiffened the rear suspension i reckon it would be a rocket a 250 in that frame then with maybe larger rear wheel and stiffer suspension would be something pretty good too... :)
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there wouldnt be any new shocks made for my bike though...will there? what shocks would fit
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Yes there would you can just take your shocker into any bike shop they will measure it eye to eye and get one the correct length i got my shocks that way its easy :)
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this place maybe could do it. they make mono shocks
http://www.hagonoz.com.au/HagShocks2.htm
also this place
http://www.progressivesuspension.com/
also you could get an ohlins,Reiger,YSS or technoflex shock
i heard of somone fitting an RM shock but cant remember what year.
do you want that article about how to fit a 250 to a 175 floater frame? if so let me know.
you can also update the internal valving and fit an aftermarket spring. getting a stiffer spring will be easy
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i would like that article about the 250 into 175 frame thanks LWC. this bike should be realy good once its all done
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ok i will email it to you on weekend. i will send you a PM
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I found a bloke in NZ that sells PE seat covers plus tank covers and tool bags, has anyone here seen his stuff first hand , is it any good. http://www.ecologicalinvestments.com/
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I found a bloke in NZ that sells PE seat covers plus tank covers and tool bags, has anyone here seen his stuff first hand , is it any good. http://www.ecologicalinvestments.com/
Yes, his stuff is very good.
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Thats good to here,,,im thinking i might not bother doing up my tanks on the PE or IT now, i can see his tank covers going on :)
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thanks LWC for that article. I now see why the 400 motor wouldnt fit. do these tank covers cover the whole tank or just the side?
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yes whole tank. the photo on his website shows a PE one.
you have the option to have the printed logos on the side, tool bag on top, clear map pocket, black edging, etc. he has a number of options that will vary the total cost.
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how much do these tank covers cost?
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dont know. email the seller. price varies depending on what features you want, eg coloured logo, map pocket etc. i havent bought one, only inquired.
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how do i get in contact with the seller?
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His name is Alec Saunders <[email protected]>
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http://www.ecologicalinvestments.com/trade/
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To: LWC3077
I have an '82 PE 175 that has been fully restored. I also have a '80 PE 250T. I want to put the 250 motor in the 175 full floater. Any chance I can get a copy of your article on the conversion? I am new this forum and I live in Northern California, USA.
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I can be reached at: [email protected]
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Hi are you a member of the yahoo PE club heres it address to join
[email protected]
Thanks Michael.
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yeah look in your in box in about 10mins time
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FYI a custom tank bag made by Alec for my PE175N landed at my door for AUS$105 total.
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The 1982 Full Floater PE175 is one of the sweetest Pre85 Enduro bikes ever built. Having rebuilt one from the ground up with the only performance mods being a sectioning of the expansion chamber to remove the internal baffles, a small Pro-Circuit muffler, a set of Boysen reads along with a port clean up and you have a bike that you can ride all day with out being torn a new asshole every time you roll on the throttle.
Modifying them with bigger engines or making the engine more RM like seems wrong to me.
Why not get an RM and de-tune it rather than trying to make a PE175 something it will never be?
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I'm ashamed to admit it but I had a long standing notion that PE175s were pieces of shit. I can now happily report that I was very wrong and that they are indeed a great little bike. I rode one for the first time ever on the weekend and couldn't believe how nice it is for an old bike. It lugged my lumpy 130kg around surprisingly well. The bike is in pretty ordinary condition too with more rattles than a rich babys pram so It'll be even better when my mate freshens it up for the coming vinduro season.
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Hi guys its anyones choice to do what they want to do to their bikes but personally i prefer original bikes if you want more power you might want to sell what you have and get something bigger that way 2 people win and both have originals and you dont have to go to the trouble of making something its not just like all those mock up xy gt's waste of perfectly good falcons and fairmonts thanks Michael. :)
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what model did you ride Firko?
here is a shock that will fit the full floater PE 175. australian markets didnt get this one with reservoir
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1981-SUZUKI-RM125-RM-125-REAR-SHOCK_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a543Q7c66Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a0Q7c293Q3a2Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem390017858084QQitemZ390017858084QQptZMotorcyclesQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
the problem is frosty, that with all bikes, new or old, they are only made to suit the average person. what is the average person?? there is always going to be compromises in the design or appearance somewhere. its impossible to make a bike to suit a 60 KG novice rider as well as a 120 KG expert rider for example. since bikes were first invented there has always been people modifying and improving their bikes to suit there own abilities, tastes, performace requirements etc and fixing up things the factory may not have quite got right. the factories cant please everyone and make everthing perfect so people will customise the looks of their bike with different coloured parts or a different headlight etc simply because they prefer a different look. for example enduro bikes in america competing on the west coast ( harsh dry desert terrain, lots of rocks, faster sections etc) had to be set up and modified toally different to the bikes competing in the east coast regions which were more tight terrain amongst trees, wetter soil, less rocks, slower speeds etc and suzuki for example were not going to make a PE for east coast enduros and a PE for west coast enduros.
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I've been putting some of the parts back on the bike and i cant figure out how the coil is mounted on. Does anyone know? One of the mounts might have been broken off... thanks
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mounts under tank on 2 mounts with 4mm? screws. look close enough and you will be able to see where the second one has broken off or someone has ground it off ::)
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The PE only needs a few more parts now... I need a new chain (doesn't have one) and don't know the size or length, I've been searching the net and have found 3 different length chains (106,110,120 links) for sale for the pe. On this subject what is a good chain for a pe? I think I'll be getting an O-ring one but what brand is decent?
Also It needs a new muffler. Where should i get this from? I was thinking of getting a muffler from the local bike dealer and taking it to an exhaust shop to get a piece of pipe the same as the pes original one welded on to the nw muffler, would this be the best way around this?
Thanks in advance
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you can get muffler from here
http://www.motoduro.co.uk/include/suzuki18.php
dont go by what the pictures show. he had some incorrect photos with sticker on worng side i think. im pretty sure now he gets them supplied with no sticker and customers put it on where they like.
these are pretty quiet mufflers too
chain, well most brands are good except for the chinese type ones. i prefer DID but EK, RK, Regina etc are also very good
just get a 120 link and cut the excess off your self
full floater 175 is 106 or 110 links depending on year. original fitment was DID
all that info is one the PE websites/forums by the way
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whats the other number like 520,420 etc for, and is the pe's one 520?
thanks
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yes 520 chain.
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I'm ashamed to admit it but I had a long standing notion that PE175s were pieces of shit. I can now happily report that I was very wrong and that they are indeed a great little bike.
Certainly, they were built to a price - definately not in the league of the Europeans for finish and quality, BUT for me at 17 it was (just) affordable and wildly cool! I had ridden RM125C's and the PE175N was every bit as much fun AND was going to make me 'legal' to boot.
They went OK, they are easy to ride and didn't cost the earth. A nice combination of the fast/good/cheap triangle! 30 years on, PE's are still fun! I blasted around the forests in Belfort in France on a mint original PE175C recently, with Fabrice (le Canari) who has a PE collection and had an absolute ball ;D I suppose should mention gorgeous locals and the fabulous food!
(http://byfiles.storage.live.com/y1pCtkRXq2tduQqsZM4NfKc1b5JZ4SEWy8w20oJO3kzqSnGiTQJIPgh7skxE-gEApOxQc2aKG3EQ7W7PP5Xgp8hBQ)
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I must say when the opportunity came up to buy my PE175 i thought "its a bike at least" as i thought it would be too small and underpowered. I really wanted a 250 or 400.
When i got it started a couple of days later and took it for a quick spin i was surprised by the power of the 175. It was a short ride though as the brakes didn't work and the suspension was terrible. I only planned to get the brakes fixed but later that day I had it mostly pulled down.
Cut to 3 months later and my budget restoration was complete. It is 5 times the bike i thought it could be. Plenty enough power to get me in trouble and everything else works just right.
It really is a great bike, I would highly recommend one.
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Floberts: I'm in the same boat ... looking at one and thinking "at least it's a ride". I'm normally on Europeans but I'm beginning to think, for trails/enduros, the PE175 could be the go.
What did you need to do with the suspension and brakes?
The one I'm looking at has no headlight, front plate, speedo or tail light, so I'll probably have to go aftermarket with those? Any clues, anyone?
Also, is there a forum for PEs? The Yamaha IT forum is, like OZVMX, a corker.
Hope you can help.
...turning Japanese, I think I'm turning Japanese, I really think so ...
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Thats funny, here is a PE site for you to look at.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PEmotorcycles/
Cheers Mick.
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Thanks Mick. I'm in the holding pattern to the site now. I'm just doing all my due diligence before I hand over cash for an 82 (don't know the model) 175 so I'm ensuring they're a good allround bike (I won't win an award at anything) for some fun and without being a complete bitch to look after. Headlights, speedo etc would be nice but I can do that later. Hell, it's 40C outside so I have a few weeks to spend in a cool(er) shed fixing up a bike. Still turning Japanese and, yes, I do know what that means ... :)
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What did you need to do with the suspension and brakes?
The brakes were just not adjusted properly. I had the forks rebuilt with new seals and bushes. The shock needs to be rebuilt (are they rebuilable?????) or replaced.
I never planned to get it registered so i stripped all the electrics although when i find a globe holder i will fit the headlight for a bit of night riding.
Im 6'2" and about 90kg and it still really gets along well.
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if you want a aftermarket headlight then one of these vintage UFO ones will look pretty good. im not sure about still be able to fit a speedo, so if you really need one then just go for a cheap digital bicycle one.
http://www.mdracingproducts.co.uk/products/universal-headlight/
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if you want a aftermarket headlight then one of these vintage UFO ones will look pretty good. im not sure about still be able to fit a speedo, so if you really need one then just go for a cheap digital bicycle one.
http://www.mdracingproducts.co.uk/products/universal-headlight/
Is anyone in Australia selling the Vintage UFO products?
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NO. you buy them from MD racing in UK. they are offering discount to Australian buyers and special shipping rates. Too bad for the AU UFO importer, they miss out since they dont want to bring the vintage UFO line in.
also see current issue of VMX in product section, for information about UFO vintage line and where to get them.
also available from www.motoduro.co.uk