OzVMX Forum
Marque Remarks => Yamaha => Topic started by: cblyx6 on October 02, 2008, 08:48:44 am
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Hello,
As promised I said I would be posting p in a few days, I have a Profab / Aberg HL500 replica. I found this bike a few days ago and purchased for $500 USD. ( not for sale )
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0709.jpg)
Here is where I am at with this bike, I been wanting to build a Aberg replica for some time ( thats what led me here ) and I just happened to luck on to this Profab Bike. Now I am in a rock and a hard place, I want to build this bike to ride, but I dont know what the true value would be if restored period correct and I dont want to do anything that would diminsh the value.
I am at the moment considering powder coating the frame and side cases and the magura lever perches. Bead blast the aluminum, and pipe, then just giving the bike an overall cleaning. I have the correct tank on the way, bought some NOS period correct fenders, and new seat cover. Kinda need to know about the rear shock, ( Ohlins and the correct length) have found a couple of vendors that can set them up for my weight,
Anyways I need some expert advice as to the value, and then some of the technical data such as eshock length, oh yea ,one more thing, I noticed the swing arm bearing is loose on one side, maybe if anyone knew the Yamaha part # for the swing arm bearing, it would sure save me a whole lotta reasearch.
Any and all advice welcome,
THanks
cblyx6
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restore it, there quite valuble
theres been 2 or 3 profabs/hallmans on ebay usa in the last year or so one nicely restored one went for 15000 us dollars and another basket case went for around 6000 there was another for sale in nz that the guy wanted a 15000 for but that one was in terrible condition i have a few pics and i sold mine for around 12000 aus dollars which i have pics off if you want them plus i have the original hallman 3 page instruction sheets that came with the kits i will try and email you a copy .paul
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ill have a look through the computer and see what ive got
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(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/IMGP1035.jpg)
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/IMGP1036.jpg)
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/IMGP1037.jpg)
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this one was in nz but he wanted enough to retire on in hawawi
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/IMG_0157.jpg)
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another in the uk
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/scan001002-2.jpg)
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my old one
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/TT010204-076.jpg)
and he wont sell it back
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Hey Paul
The fellow that purchased your HL was at our Vinduro on the week-end. It still go's and looks sensational.
Can you scan and send me that info in your post. ([email protected] or [email protected])
Picture attached of our HL.
Thanks
Shoey
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thanks shoey im going to offer him a 490 maico straight swap see if i can get it back lol .do you want the hallman pages if so give me a fax number if you have one [email protected] btw it will take me awhile there in the garage somewere
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Claude, the swingarm doesn't use Yamaha bearings. I replaced mine using bearings I bought at an everyday bearing supplier. They were standard sizes and didn't cost a lot. There are two per side and I think cost me $15 AUD each. Failing that, Geoff Morris Concepts here in Oz sells stuff for HLs, but his is based on the UK NVT HLs, so am unsure of detail differences between them and the ProFabs.
Here's Geoff's catalogue:
http://www.ozvmx.com/market/gmc08.htm
That's an excellent buy you've got there, and it looks in great condition too. The only real 'problems' I found with my ProFab are the airbox thing - as you can see yours doesn't have one, and the need for a decent chain tensioner. Oh, and if it is using TT500 footpegs, replace them with something with some meat on them.
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this is on the mark hollaway site us swap meet
HL Yamaha
I thought that i could put this off but the economy has caught up to me, being retired and having my money in the wrong places don't go well together.
1977 HL Aberg kit frame and swing arm the real deal i have all paper work. the frame has been powder coated it has a 540 motor with new top end Shell cam and piston and new valves and springs work being done by R&D Springs motor has not been fired needs a PVL ignition.
Bike has new fenders and seat cover has gas tank but it needs a little work before painting also has Simons forks and ProTaper handle bars and newly mounted side covers.
The bike is ready for the finishing touches. $9500.00 obo which is low for this bike.
If interested in buying i can email pictures the end of this week.
Thanks.
David Tellez
Thousand Oaks, CA
Phone: 661-904-5093
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Hey ,
thanks for all the great info, I got another problem at the moment, started taking the bike down for frame prep, and got hung on the swing arm, does anyone know how to remover the swingarm bolt, I was thinking it to be a one piece, but after looking and studing, it almost looks as if it is like a head stud bolt.
And would anyone be willing to guess what type the front forks are?
Graeme, I do have the aluminum pieces that make the air box, and I wasnt for sure if they were original equiment, I will try t oget a pic of them and post up, also I was going to build some like ones on the bike RJ rode. I thought they looked way cool.
Regards,
Claude
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my old one
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/TT010204-076.jpg)
and he wont sell it back
That's a nice photo. Who took that? ;) ;)
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curtosy barrossa photo co
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/TT010204-072.jpg)
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/TT010204-071.jpg)
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Tony, that's just sad!!!
VMX42
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Hey Tony he did a curtsy for ya! Me I would have bowed..................... :D
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fallen over drunk more like it
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(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a393/gmcloa/Hallman-1C.jpg)
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a393/gmcloa/Hallman-2C.jpg)
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does anyone know how to remover the swingarm bolt, I was thinking it to be a one piece, but after looking and studing, it almost looks as if it is like a head stud bolt.
The pivot bolt should be one long bolt with has a nut on each end, that's how NVT & I make the pivot bolts, not sure what Pro-Fab did.
It's probable just siezed in, the kids probably never heard of oil :o
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Wow, I am at a loss for words, I thought I might be able to get good info here, just didnt expect the amount of participation that is going on, thanks everyone for all the good info, gonna make this build so much easier. I will try to post up pics as we progress. THanks again!!!!!!
GMC, I just looked at the motorcross Action July 1977 ad that you sent via email and it clearly shows the swing arm pivot bolt as being one piece. Man I am gonna have a tough time getting it out. I guess the next step is an impact wrench and some heat, god I hate that.
Paul, dude I am in awwwww with your old bike, cant believe u let it get away, awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! good luck on re-capturing it !!!!!!!! When I look at your bike, I see you used a late model chain guide, how did that work for you? And what was the length of your rear shock, your bike looks to have the correct stance for the HL500!!!!!
A gratuities shot of my CR500AF, had a lot of fun building this bike, just finished it about a month ago, if anyone is interested in building one, just follow this link, tons of information!!!!!! ( hope its ok to post links, if not, my apology)
http://cr500riders.com/cgi/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1219103792
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0674.jpg)
Best regards
C. Bly
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i can probably find out the exact information/history of Pauls old bike (before Neil Collard had it) . A guy i know told me the exact history of that bike, where it was found, When it came into the country etc and what happened to it after Peter Stayt used it in Finke. I will see him in a months time and will ask if he can put it on paper as he told me a while back but i cant remember it now.
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I am thinking that the rear shocks should be a round 17 to 17 1/2" on theAberg bikes, can anyone confirm that? Reason is I am tying t oscore a set of Ohlins on Ebay and I sure would hate to buy the wrong length?
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mine were 16/,1/4 or 16, 1/2 i think :-\
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the very early HL's ive seen with air shox dont look like they have very long shocks. they look fairly short compared to Pauls old bike and the one on the front cover of issue 2 of vmx. there is one pictured in issue 2 of VMX i think with KYB forks and fox air shox.
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Would anyone have the article on the ProFab TT600 that RJ rode? I had that article saved in my favarites and now the link is bad, that article had a lot of technical data on his bike. Thats the look that I am after? Thanks for any help.
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The suspension travel situation on an HL comes down to which particular era you are building the bike tto or what class you wish to race in. The original Husky framed "HL" appears to have around 8'' of travel maybe a bit more. The next generation featured either the Curtis/NV frame or Profab frames and had 10'' of travel using the available forks and Fox Shox of the 1977/1978 era. That bike is eligible to race in the pre '78 classes. The third generation is the later take on the bike usually using GMC replica Curtis/NV frames often using 12'' travel 43mm forks and overly long Ohlin or similar shocks. In my opinion HLs look better when built to the original pre '78 specs. They look too tall when using long travel later components in my view.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1062154/AbergThumper_edit.jpg)
The original Husky framed HL with Bengt Aberg and Hallman and Enqvist
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1062154/aberghl.jpg)
Aberg 1977 Profab HL
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1062154/pomhl.jpg)
Ben Pennys GMC HL and genuine Curtis/NV bike both featuring later suspension components.
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Shock lengths will vary depending on models.
I recomend 15 1/4" - 385mm for my frames. I know guys have used up to 17" but it raises the seat height nearly 2" compared to the 15 1/4" shocks
But this is for the 78 NVT based frame that uses a banana style swingarm.
The 79 NVT frames used a straight swingarm with the axle plate kicked upwards which seems identical to some of the Pro-Fab frames like CB has. They are so similar that I suspect Pro-Fab may have been making the alloy swingarms for the NVT frames.
Pro-Fab also had a banana style arm with 2 shock mounts, one at the rear & one around mid arm.
Sorry I can't help you much with your model as I am not sure of the geometry of the 79 NVT or Pro-Fab swingarms, other Pro-Fab owners may be of more help
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You guys are great, I guess it is just a matter of what people prefer, I am 6'-2" so I may go ahead and try some long shocks, Another question I have, I just purchased a 76 125c aluminum tank, no gas cap, what other model caps will fit this tank?
Also the Australia based VMX magizine Issue # 4 had the article about RJ's bike, I just checked there website to see if it could be purchased and it was sold out, It had a lot of technical info on the bike, if anyone happens to have a copy and the means of scanning that article, it would certainly be helpful
Thanks again!
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i think GMC sells the stainless steel fuel caps for that tank.... :)
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the feul caps are common to most yamaha MX~ers pre 76 and also the TY and early XT/TT yammie range as well and i have had no trouble at all in getting them over the counter at my local yammie shop.
although the billet alloy jobbie's do look good.
a US$500 Profab HL?
very, very jealous over here mate! ;)
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i think GMC sells the stainless steel fuel caps for that tank.... :)
Nah, Hanks Engineering makes the billet alloy jobs. As Vandy says the caps are quite common, they were also on some MX & YZ 80's
Think I paid around $25.00 for one a few years back
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I just handed over a crisp $50 to Staffords for one :(
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Can anyone identify this type throttle and possibly what cable would fit it? THanksssssssss!!!!!!!!!!
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0711.jpg)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0710.jpg)
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Tomaselli ,I think
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Can anyone identify this type throttle and possibly what cable would fit it? THanksssssssss!!!!!!!!!!
What cable fits also depends whats on the other end. It probably a case of taking it off and comparing it to others rather ythan just going to a shop and asking for a '84 Yamasuki txz 250 throttle cable.
It might be easy or it might be a case of having one custom made. Welcome to the wonderfull world of hand built specials ;) ;D.
That positioning under rather than over the bars sux :P
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It looks like a gunner gasser throttle.
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ive go that exact throttle on my yz175 ill get pics tonight i found it in the shead and just modified the stock cable to fit
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i'll go with it being a gunner gasser too!
grab a brand new aftermarket universal cable. you'll need to cut it to length and solder a nipple on one end but they should come with a few optional nipples in the pack when you buy them.
and maybe a sticker!
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mmmmmm.......optional nipples......
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All right, next question, and I hope you guys dont mind the dumb questions but you have been very helpful so far. Its really hard to find credible information on vintage bikes. Ok , footpegs, this frame uses the stock TT500 pegs ( which by the way suck ), my question is: Does anyone know of a supplier of an aluminum wide peg that would fit this application? I have a 74 elsinore that I was able to get pegs from Red Baron, that fit a CRF50, found this trick on a Honda vintage website, was hoping that maybe someone here would have a good idea!!!!!
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i would be restoreing it to original as possible .and arnt the foot pegs yz 400
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/IMGP1019.jpg)
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Thats the pegs, and I was under the impression that they were TT pegs, got that info from someone, maybe not credible, I have the original pegs, is the one on the right side of the bike suppose to be longer than the left? Or maybe vise versa, cant remember which one is longer.
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The UK built frames used YZ pegs, I think 125. They have 2 tapped lugs on the frame that a plate bolts to which holds the folding pegs.
1W4-27412-10 left
1W4-27422-10 right
The Pro-Fab frames used a spline type system that looks very similar to the TT pegs.
No replacement options that I know of, I have supplied the parts for TT frames so you can cut the old peg mounts from the frame, weld the lugs on & then fit the YZ style peg mounts which then gives you more peg options.
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There used to be a whole lot of articles here on OzVMX about the HL500s, including scans of the VMX articles. Happy to repost them on the site when I get home - next Tuesday or so - if no-one else can help in the meantime...
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ive got a pic off the tt 500 pegs and they seem to be a different angle but im have ing trouble blowing it up
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Like I was saying guys, I have the original pegs ,and they are in really good shape,go being 31 years old. I was going to put them up if there was a good wide peg option ( for riding purposes) after all I am gonna have to ride this machine for a while before I can make a trailer queen out of it!!!!!!!!
On another note, after I get some good photos of this thing going back together I will start a new thread covering the build. At the moment I got the bike in a kazillion pieces. My wife just doesnt understand, I think her exact words were Quote: buy something running and then take it apart, idiot. , Women, gotta lovem, cause its against the law to do anything else to em Later.
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THESE MIGHT HELP TOO
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/IMGP0828.jpg)
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(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/IMGP1255-1.jpg)
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(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/IMGP1027-1.jpg)
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(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/IMGP1022.jpg)
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nv hl 500
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g120/ibop/xtcataloghl500-300x212-1.jpg)
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A little progress, got the motor all cleaned up and shot paint on it, frame is next!
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0719.jpg)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0716.jpg)
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Looking very nice indeed! The throttle is the same as was on my ProFab HL, although I can't remember what it was now! Nor what cable, although I suspect it was a universal made to fit. Not much help there.
The pegs I am certain were stock TT500 and fit onto splined mounts on the frame. The right is shorter than the left and they both suck big time. I was forever slipping off the right one. I bought peg extenders from Ballards and welded em on and that was the single biggest improvement. As these pegs are not exactly rare I don't think it would hurt to modify them, but maybe chase up another set to modify and keep the originals.
My HL was running Falcon shocks, not sure of the length. I measured 8.5" travel at the axle. The forks were RM400 which I believe were a poor choice as they never worked very well for me. Then again I never tried to set them up. To be quiet honest the suspension was the weak spot on mine as it was harsh at the rear and soft at the front. If I'd kept it I'd have upgraded big time.
Here's those HL articles. Note that this is some old stuff from the site that I've reposted, so some of the links/navigation don't work.
http://www.ozvmx.com/features/hl500/
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Hey Paul,
Looking at the pics of your bike, what is the type and brand of the silencer or muffler tip you have on it, looks to be a reverse cone type, and how did the bike perform with it!!!!!
Thanks,
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didnt ride it much it just sat with the rest off them ,it did run on 100 octane and the times i did ride it made good power ,i dont know the name off the pipe or the muffler but it ran better with the muffler section on rather than some you see with just a pipe only
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Next question for the HL experts, my new found friends, Tripple trees, does anyone know what was actually used? I just cleaned these up and the top doesnt seem to match the bottom, also the fender bolt holes are stripped out and dont match the bolt pattern on the NOS fender.
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0763.jpg)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0760.jpg)
Thanks for all the info guys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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HERE ANOTHER ONE IN THE USA
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&viewitem=&item=320312142156
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As far as I know the ProFab bikes were sold as frame kits and didn't come with triples, forks or shocks. You got a frame, swingarm, rims and a few other bits I think. So usually the triples are whatever fits and suits the forks selected, for example mine was set up with RM400 forks and triples. Yours actually look awfully RM-ish too.
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if you read the 3 page instruction page that i posted it give the companys recomendation for the add on parts
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i would have thought they would have used their own pro fab triple clamps. ive seen them for sale on the internet before
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if you read the 3 page instruction page that i posted it give the companys recomendation for the add on parts
I read yor post and this is where my question come from, I think I have KYB,s but not sure, got them at a shop getting them rebuilt, should know in a few days, I definitly need to change the lower tripple clamp, so if I have KYb forks, ( what Yamaha uses) will the trees and stem from an early YZ work? ( correct stem length)
And the HL on ebay, I talked to that guy today, the bike has a new 540 motor, and its the same bike that you posted earier in this thread, and he has came down on price quite a bit form his other post, says he is really into pre 74 bikes, has a early model cz 360 that he is trying to finish, had a really good conversation about his HL today, if I had the extra cash laying around ,I probabaly make a trip to SoCal. Looks like he spent so quality time with it.
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Can anyone identify this rear hub? I think that its a 76 125c, looking at Yamaha Microfiche it looks the same as a 76 / 77 125c, am in need of a new sprocket, the one on the bike has some letters KA and then 49 which is the amount of teeth. Not sure what the KA stands for, any help appreciated. THanks!
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0769.jpg)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0770.jpg)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0772.jpg)
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looks like 125e to me
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In need of a shifter, been watching ebay for one to fit a TT, any ideas of other models that will fit?
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I am not sure, but it's possible late model YZF stuff may fit. They'd have to be angled to avoid the cases and may just do the job. Anyone else know? I know there's a few YZ400/426F bits actually interchange with the old 500s, like the decompressor lever for example, so just maybe...
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more progress, kinda slowed down, work is getting in the way.
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0822.jpg)
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looks great, what exhaust are you going to to run, I like the one that was on it when you bought it.
Just finishing bolting all the clean parts back on mine, will be runner for Xmas
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I just boughta works exhuast from a guy in California, it resembles the stock exhuast from RJ's Pro Tec bike, Reverse megaphone, I bead blasted the original exhuast and am going to put it up and save for later!
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yeah i bought Flow Masters one off the ebay for the motor for my Lickman, looks like RJ s pipe and is really nicely built and finished.
On my HL I am using GMC stainless HL pipe, mmm mmm, polished like a surgical instrument. Also using Geoffs airbox which is super sano and too pretty to cover up with much in the way of sidecovers.
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I bit more progress,
waiting on a few things and this bike will rip!!!!!!!
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0827.jpg)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0830.jpg)
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Took the HL500 out for its maiden vouyage, I think the rear shock are a touch long, think I may change them for some 16" still have a few things to do to it, side plates and need an exhaust bracket.
A few pics
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0002.jpg)
Another
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0012.jpg)
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How much rear wheel travel do you have , by the pic it looks like 20 inches :D
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17 1/4" are the shock length eye to eye, I believe they suppose to be 16" I am 6' 2" tall and I have to tip toe t otouch the ground, on a side note I am really impressed on how the bike handles, I have rode TT,s for ever and way big improvement with the ProFab frame.
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CW,
Its a side-track I know, but got any pics of yr 74 CR/XL175 Elsinore? I rather like the small-bore 4 strokes hybrids.
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Here you go JC, to bad your not in the states, this bike has a 225 Powroll stroker kit in the XL 175 motor, and i just traded the bike off last night over the phone, a friend of mine has a XL350/ 412 powroll motor he is going to put in the bike. He's been after me for years trying to get the bike, I finally gave in, got his really clean honda TL125 for it, it has a powroll 148 kit in it.
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0049.jpg)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0044.jpg)
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Thanks CW.
How much did you have to lower the engine cradle by to fit the XL engine in?
Also the 175 engine was supposed to be hard to get any decent power out of. How'd it go w the Poweroll 225 kit?
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I bought the bike this way, they cut the frame just in front of the pegs anjust below the front motor mount and made the engine a stress member, then they made a really fancy skid plate out of stainless steel and welded to the frame below the engine. Looks like they needed about 1" clearance. As far as the 225 powroll kit, Its still a turd, but it has a ton of torque.
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0047.jpg)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0046.jpg)
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Your bike reminds me of my friend Eddie Phipps 4T Elsinore. His has a Powroll stroker XL350/480 engine which is waaay too much engine for the chassis. It'd be a much nicer unit with a 250/305. Despite the power overload, it's a nice conversion, looks factory.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1062154/phippsy.JPG)
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1062154/phippsy2.JPG)
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All done, shortened the rear shocks by 1" gives the bike a better stance and I can touch the ground, finally finished the air box, this thing should rip, been to cold to get outside, will post some action shots when it warms up!!!!!!!
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0052.jpg)
(http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh20/cblyx6/DSCN0054.jpg)
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I think Geoff is bang on with 385mm shock length, my bike sits level with the Foxy Forks in their mid position. My final assembly was going well until the paint fell off the frame.... >:(
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yep the 100% sticker on the front really finishes it off, nice RJ replica.
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yes i saw that thanks trolly
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I've been watching that bike.. Very cool. It must have the lowest seat height of any HL i've seen, bit more practical. Could probably touch the ground on that one. :D
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john i use to have a log from gum tree to stand on lol
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Yeah you need a step ladder to get on the things..
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http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320329299466&viewitem=
The bike that is on ebay is the same one that was on Marks vintage swapmeet last summer, it has also been on ebay a couple of different times, it had a primer grey tank on it, The tank that is on the bike now was also listed on Marks vintage swapmeet, THe guy beet me to it, oh well, it makes for a ncie finish to his HL I been watching its progress and a few stickers, a tank and some controls and the guy has almost doubled the bid on the bike.
I took my HL out yesterday, and this thing is a monster, I have never rode a TT engine with this much power, I put an IRC 140 x 18 rear tire on it and man you talk about bite, zero wheel spin. we rode about 40 miles of verytight and technical trails, thru some tall pines in the national forrest in Missisippi. There were a few guys that just couldnt believe how well the HL handled and run, its amazing that a 30 year old bike can perform with modern machines, or pretty darn close anyways!!!!