OzVMX Forum
Clubroom => General Discussion => Topic started by: Graeme M on February 07, 2015, 10:26:31 pm
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As some of you know, I've been running the OzVMX forum for over 10 years. That's a long time and it has succeeded and grown far more than I ever imagined it would. Which is great. However, one aspect of the forum that has always consumed a lot of time, effort and careful judgement is moderation. When I began OzVMX, I had the view that as long as discussions didn't end up in the gutter, pretty much anything was open to debate and I felt that very robust discussion was fine.
Well, over the years this hasn't always worked. I've been threatened with litigation, had threats made against me, had to adjudicate all sorts of weird disputes and had many many phone calls, messages and emails about matters on the forum.
A couple of years ago when a few members became regularly abusive of others, I eventually had to apply stricter moderation, provide some guidelines to forum use, and ban a couple of people. This was in response to a torrent of complaint and dissatisfaction from many members. We even lost a few of the stalwarts of the forum over this.
In recent times, the debates about vintage racing rules, administration by MA etc and endless discussions about class structures and so on have become a rather prominent feature of the forum. My time and effort to manage the forum has been growing substantially and I am seeing a similar sentiment being expressed about the general tone of the place.
These days, I am no longer an active VMX competitor. I still enjoy the old bikes, like to hear and read about vintage, and I still have a couple of 1980 models in the back shed. But, my real passion for now is modern dirt track racing. I just don't have the time or desire to put a lot into OzVMX.
And to be honest, I'm a bit over it.
Now, the ongoing saga of rules and MA and so on has sapped my desire to continue. So, I've spent the past couple of days considering next steps. My inclination was to close it down. After all, Facebook does a great job of doing the same sort of thing. I know a lot of people still enjoy the forum, but many have told me that its negativity, the infighting, and the arguments about eligibility annoy them.
I can see where they are coming from.
So.... Have we reached the end of the line for OzVMX? No, I don't think so, I think it still has a place and I still have enough enthusiasm to try reinvent it to an extent. I have decided to keep the thing open for the near future at least. I'm gonna take it back to its roots. When I started the forum, it was meant to fill the gap left by the loss of Ray Ryan and VMX Magazine. His philosophy was simple - Same Old Dirt, Same Old Fun. Today, Ken Smith and crew run VMX Magazine true to that philosophy. And I think that's what we need to take the forum back to.
Now, I agree that many of the concerns and contentious issues that have been raised are valid and deserving of discussion and resolution and so on. But from here on in, you'll have to find somewhere else to do that. I'm not doing this to run away from the problems or to fold to pressure from MA or anything like that. It's just to firstly make my job of keeping things on track easier and more pleasant, and secondly to make the forum a place of positive energy.
From here on in, the forum is meant to be above all, fun. And in the course of that, informative, inclusive, positive, supportive and generally uplifting. Get where I am coming from?
So please, no more comments or posts about MA, eligibility (other than to ask for guidance), rules, or personal sledging of any person or club or organisation.
I will moderate with a heavy hand, and believe me if it becomes too hard to do that, I will close it down. Not a threat - just a fact of life. I don't need the stress of it all.
So over to you all, enjoy OzVMX but please, keep it civil and keep it fun. Oh, and I will be deleting the Administration of Competition board - that sort of discussion is what I want to avoid from now on.
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Thanks mate this is the best topic Ive read , I know a few of the other older members will agree . Iain looking for the like button .
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I respect your position.
Ultimately, it's probably a good thing for the sport, because the issues will be addressed through the MA processes rather than being discussed as nauseum here...
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Far too many angry people in this world, some have made their way onto this forum.Great to see someone in power taking a stand.Dirt bikes should be FUN. thats why vinduro is growing.
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smart move :)
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Well said Graeme lets hope it makes for Forum that we can all join in without all of the crap..that's gone on Thanks Mate..
The Stig
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I'm very grateful for and amazed at the time you have put into this site for all these years.
You've lasted a lot longer than I would have
Thanks
Brent
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Let just keep Suzuki and Bike/Tech Talk section :)
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If you do decide to delete it all, please give us several months notice so we can collect and save all the info we want. I know i find myself still reading stuff from 08/09 and looking up stuff i know was posted on here years ago.
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I have always found the politics a bit on the nose and tend to stay away from it all. I joined the forum to share rebuild idea's, tech talk and the like. But Graeme, are you the only moderator? It must be a drag... why not slowly hand the reigns over to some other long term members that have Ozvmx in everyones best interests. No need to shut shop. There are members from around the globe that rely on this forum for tech info, guidance, help, pics, updates and what not. Most forums have a heap of moderators to keep it within guidelines. Just lessen the burden on yourself and put a team together to share responsibility and work load.
All the best,
Alex
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If I were to close the forum, I would of course leave it visible for some time.
Moderation... I have tried that in the past and it does help, but I still had to step in to assist with things, or clarify for the mods etc. I've also tried a couple of times to find someone else to take it over but no-one was very keen!
I think it'll be OK if we drop all the politics stuff. The steps last time to take care of the disrespect and rudeness worked quite well, so I imagine the same will happen with this.
By the way, I think that things aren't looking too bright for the Ning mob, so the http://www.ozvmx.com/ site may end up disappearing one of these days... I'm not saying it will, just that I am hearing some rumblings about it all.
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i had no idea of the shit that was happening behind the scenes
To those that have Rang, threatened law suits, verbal abuse of Graeme should buy a full length mirror and have a good look at themselves. for forks sake this is a hobby and he was doing this as a volunteer, we all have other commitments in life as who needs this type of shit for a hobby.
Really, why...........hang your heads in shame ! silly people its a discussion group, would you take the same action in a pub? >:(
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Thanks for your thoughts Hoony. Bear in mind this is over the course of 10 years - the overall feedback is overwhelmingly positive. Most people are complimentary of my efforts and supportive if I get it wrong. But there have been some interesting moments for sure. And this latest round of discussions about MA and rules has added to my workload and caused me a few sleepless nights as I try to figure out how to handle sensitivities.
I'm not whinging, just saying I want an easier job. Plus I'd like to answer the concerns of those who feel the forum is too full of crap these days. I think a lot of the crap is valid and worth discussing but I am just thinking I'd rather that happened elsewhere...
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Excellent ! So politics, posturing and backstabbing will get fired straight into the dumbgeon !
Great move, mate, you are a patient man but some people just can't take a hint. 8)
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Well said Graham. Tere are lots who would come back to the forum if it was what it was ment to be and started as.Thank you for your persaverance.
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Thanks for all your past and present efforts Graeme, everyone gets were your coming from.
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I think the 'general discussion' section should only be for general 'bike stuff' that does not fit into an existing section and not for talk on politics, the PM, global warming, the economy, football, V8 supercars, F1 etc. I am sure there are full forums out there just for discussing those things.
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There was a time when this forum was the strongest, most active VMX forum on the whole internet. I was on here almost from the start and absolutely enjoyed contributing. By nature I love a good old shit stir and must admit that at times I contributed a bit of mischief to the place which prompted some fun and frivolity but on the other side of the coin prompted awful exchanges which in retrospect I'm not proud of. There were/are posters on here that annoyed me and I reacted to their rubbish in my own way which also caused me becoming a sort of Snidely Whiplash character and had my own group of haters and contributing in quite a few leaving the forum. At first I wore it as a badge of honour but one morning when reading back on some o fmy old posts I realised that I'd been as big a wanker as the posters I was acting against and became deeply embarrassed by some of my behaviour. From that very moment I vowed to stay away from potential trouble and leave the shitfights to others.
All went well for a few years until a discussion started about Evolution Rules. It grew, and grew and became nastier and nastier and a new generation of forum wanker emerged from that one seemingly simple post. I saw a side of people whom I'd respected and liked and it pissed me off. I made my point early in the piece and decided to pull away from the forum and catch up with other things that I'd been neglecting in my life.
Then, after almost a year of self imposed absense I signed on to have a look at what was happening and I found that those same old antagonists were still attacking MA, the Evo rules and making personal attacks on a guy who has done more for our sport as an official, racer and mentor than all of his keyboard antagonists combined. I was saddened to see that these people had reduced this forum and our sport to a nasty antagonistic venom filled soap box for their cause. The good stuff was still there but this rubbish, and it is rubbish, dominated. Once again I walked away, returning only briefly last week to contribute to another rule shitfight about pre 65 rules. I later slapped myself in the chops for that bit of personal idiocy!
Graeme has been a veritible pillar of rock during all of the shit that's gone on here. I've known for a long time that he's been well over it and I wouldn't blame him if he did shut up shop. He's had a fu*king gutful. It's time that a few of you did what I did and take a good long look at yourselves and ask if you've really done anything good for the forum or the sport or have you just created more disharmony and angst while destroying the reputations of people who don't deserve it. I've become a bit disillusioned and disappointed in the sport that I had a big hand in actually starting. I've got to that teeter-totter decision in my life where I could and probably should sell up and move back to my other love of drag racing. Where this forum once was a great meeting place for lovers of old bikes, it's now driving us away..........Get rid of the rulebook preachers and those wanting the sport to fit into their vision and this will be a better place.
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thankyou Graeme for this forum.I like this site for all the info you can get. how many of us Google a subject and it give reference to ozvmx. so again thankyou
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i had no idea of the shit that was happening behind the scenes
To those that have Rang, threatened law suits, verbal abuse of Graeme should buy a full length mirror and have a good look at themselves. for forks sake this is a hobby and he was doing this as a volunteer, we all have other commitments in life as who needs this type of shit for a hobby.
Really, why...........hang your heads in shame ! silly people its a discussion group, would you take the same action in a pub? >:(
Hoony I agree 100% well said .
I joined this forum as my previous persona when it was created . It is and will always be the best Vintage bike forum on the web and a huge thank you Graeme for providing it for all of us .
Hoonys analogy of a pub is the way I have always seen the forum , I left as my former persona as I felt the place had changed a lot and many of the locals had moved on ( still a great landlord but wasn't so keen on the new locals )
Couldn't stay away long though as I still enjoy the knowledge shared even though the banter is long gone .
To all the gutless pricks who felt the need to go running to teacher and threatening action or even ringing the man fork you, you are very sad people .
The Morons mentioned above have IMHO no place in the vintage scene, the Eras we celebrate through motorcycles were a time when men were men and if you won something it was an achievement to be celebrated. Blokes sorted things out man to man not running and snivelling to someone about it,since all this rule crap has been banded about on here of late the atmosphere of the place has gone downhill further. The underlying issues are not as a result of this forum but as a result of a dysfunctional organisation and its representatives .
People on this forum only voice their opinions, the forum carries no weight with the organisation or its representatives, we are told this regularly but those in official roles , those who ride the coat tails of those in official roles and those who find they are losing a debate on here.
There are those on here who try to bully and silence anyone who dare have a difference of opinion or speak out against the dysfunctional organisation .
Thanks again Graeme for this awesome forum and the freedom you have given us all , to the spineless minority karma will get you .
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Graeme, this is an excellent move and I believe a turning point for this forum. This forum is a valuable medium for us old dirt bikers, and if this move clears out the negativity and brings back the fun, it will remain so, and grow.
I love the sport of MOTOCROSS (Love that word!), and the whole camaraderie of the VMX events I go to. VMX has brought dirt bike fun back into my life. In my early days on this forum I felt some of that feeling filtered through this site, so enjoyed that part of it, and visited daily for my fix. I am one of those readers who in the last couple of years got very disillusioned by the growing nastiness and negativity of those hiding behind their keyboard who seemed to enjoy putting people down, and now I am lucky to visit once or twice a month because of it.
Can I make a suggestion? I don't see the point in handles. If the forum is going this way, why don't we show our support and all use our name. I certainly have nothing to hide with what I have to say, and if the other members don't then wouldn't it contribute to us getting to know our community better? It has always frustrated me trying to work out who is who as I read through threads, and one of the reasons I find Facebook more user friendly. Infact, as a sign of gratitude for your efforts Graeme, support for these changes, my wish for the forum to grow & continue, and become the positive and friendly place it has the potential to become, and a stand against the 'past' negativity on this forum, I am changing my handle now to Kenneth Swan(222), so you know who I am and what my race number is.
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I'm new to VMX despite racing but have been racing since 1980, have just sold my new KTM350 to jump into VMX in a bigger way. I have found the forum very informative and helpful, and the knowledge of some of the guys on this forum is awesome. Facebook pages have lots of guys who know just enough to be dangerous and probably never raced/worked on bikes in the 70s or 80s, or raced at all, so have very little real knowledge to pass on. As a newbie I am not influenced one way or the other in the politics of the sport, and just am wrapt that bikes I love are out on tracks around the country.
The forum is great and detractors, shit stirrers and soapbox types can stick to FB.
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In response to Kenneth (222) what a good idea , Iainyz will now be Iain Cameron .
and to KIWImxer Ive found the same with the FB pages some info is so far away from the right answer its dangerous . If your after info the gents on here will have the answer . look at the wealth of knowledge here there are gents that raced the bikes when they were new ,on FB Ive read answers that have made me wonder how the bloke even thought motocross even started . Iain
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in response to Kenneth and iainyz towards openness and as a way to show support for graham my handle is now my name Kane McGuire.
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Unfortunately with an issue like this, some people won't get that they are a part of the problem with this site. It takes a real man to admit to mistakes and I tip my hat to Firko in standing up and admitting he may have been caught up in the venom of the past. Maybe if we all looked at ourselves in the same way more of us would have to admit maybe we were part of the problem also.
It will require all of us as contributors to take the time to ensure that whatever we post is not just relevant to the discussion but will bring positivity to the forum. I'm not advocating free love, just being accepting that other people may see things differently to you and that that's o/k.
I for one have been enjoying the posts that have been put up recently about the early VMX race meetings here in Australia. More of that sort of post and in my opinion your well on the way to returning to the forum of old.
I have been a member of this forum since 2007 and hope to have the privilege of being allowed to be a member into the foreseeable future. I just hope that things lighten up and the good spirit of old times returns and this forum powers on into the future.
Many thanks Graeme for the effort you put into providing this forum for us to enjoy.
Cheers Mark Possingham
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In response to Kenneth (222) Iainyz will now be Iain Cameron .
In response to Kenneth(222) Doc will always be Doc ;D Chris Wright if you prefer but most of my friends simply call me Doc ;)
Many thanks Graeme, still the best vintage dirtbike forum on the net 8)
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Thanks for the effort Graeme. I mostly soak up the info here and the politics of Aussie rules is only for me to observe. This IS the best vintage moto site on the net.
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The webmaster at play
CD 5 Barleigh ranch
(http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e204/tmbill/CCI08022015_zps1eba45e4.jpg) (http://s40.photobucket.com/user/tmbill/media/CCI08022015_zps1eba45e4.jpg.html)
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I'm also pretty well over the forum pseudonym thing
It's fine if you know the person, but can be detrimental when there is someone who contributes to forums, riding at an event somewhere far from home and you only know them by their forum name and miss out on meeting them in person because you don't recognise the name on their name plate (trials bikes use name plates rather than racing numbers). It's happened to me a couple of times.
I'm now going to use my name on motorbike forums
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Sounds like a very positive move Graeme.
Thanks
Ken Lilley (formerly Retro Rocket)
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I have been amazed at the amount of tolerance you have shown over the years Graeme.
Often wondered how hard it was/is.
If you do pull the plug then I for one will miss reading and participating in this forum.
Cheers
Mike
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enjoying how positive this thread is. I'm sure when Graeme kicked this off he was catering to enthusiasts with a common love/interest/
obsession in all types of old dirt bikes,not egos,intolerance and selfish attitudes. thanks Graeme for the huge effort and hopefully your advice
will be taken seriously so Ozvmx can be enjoyed into the future. safe riding Grant
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Thanks again for all the positive words. I will emphasise that not all those who contact me behind the scenes do so to complain or threaten - often it's just to put a point of view or express concerns etc. The hard part has always been deciding what decision to make or when to bow to pressure or whatever. So please don't go throwing out criticism on this thread - I appreciate the sentiment but it's not THAT bad. As I said, on the whole the feedback is good but over time the negative does add up.
I hope this change will help to reinvigorate the forum.
And using your real name isn't such a bad idea, that's true. As long as you feel comfortable doing so - and bear in mind the darker side of advertising your name and what sort of bikes you have...
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I refuse to use my real name. I want to remain anonymous.
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The webmaster at play
CD 5 Barleigh ranch
(http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e204/tmbill/CCI08022015_zps1eba45e4.jpg) (http://s40.photobucket.com/user/tmbill/media/CCI08022015_zps1eba45e4.jpg.html)
Nice one Bill... I remember how muddy and messed up the track was. The strange thing was I had a ball riding around (make that bumbling around) in all that muck.
It's funny how you feel when riding - I recall thinking how muddy it was and my sense of that was that it was hub deep in places, and even worse in others. Imagine my dismay watching some video later and realising that I barely made a splash as I rode through the mud, and rarely was it deeper than the height of my tyre!!
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I refuse to use my real name. I want to remain anonymous.
And so you shall, Firko, so you shall! ;D ;D
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Always wondered who Firko was . Iain
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Hi Graeme,
First off thanks for this great forum, I selfishly hope it can continue. Because I am not the Admin I just ignore stuff that I don't like or annoys me, I can understand how the Admin role would not give you the option. Hopefully everyone will respect your requests. I support you whatever you do now and in the future ( except for taking more incriminating photos of me :). Following Kenneth's good suggestion Oldstuff is now Stewart Allen
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i had no idea of the shit that was happening behind the scenes
To those that have Rang, threatened law suits, verbal abuse of Graeme should buy a full length mirror and have a good look at themselves. for forks sake this is a hobby and he was doing this as a volunteer, we all have other commitments in life as who needs this type of shit for a hobby.
Really, why...........hang your heads in shame ! silly people its a discussion group, would you take the same action in a pub? >:(
Agree completely Hoony. As the recipient of some unwanted communications and threatening PM's myself I completely understand what sort of person would go to those lengths. Many would be surprised.
I wasn't going to comment on this thread as I have recently managed to become embroiled a bit with some of the discussions around Evo (that I suspect is part of the issues Graeme refers to), but from my personal perspective it's always been to try and help the sport .. not hinder or harm it. In understand that not everyone will agree but that's okay, not everyone has to.
I must admit, VMX as a sport and the forum as a meeting point has, for me anyway, lost a lot of what I came here for as well.
I've almost pulled the pin a number of times but always kept on because I believe in the sport and the people. I've recently dragged my old Monaro drag car out of it's retirement and will likely spend a lot more time tinkering with that I think. That and I'm part way through rebuilding a Nissan 260z with my 12 year old to teach him the fundamentals of cars and mechanics. I still support VMX, I still have a collection of bikes that I will ride at key events and have recently bought and funded the rebuild of a 77 YZ400 and a YZ250 for a young rider I believe in. Hopefully it's people like him that will keep the sport going when we're in our wheel chairs or pushing up daisies.
Thanks for everything Graeme, your efforts, tolerance, patience, calmness and incredible ability to focus on the key issues has been greatly appreciated. I for one am truly sorry that you have had to suffer any abuse, unwanted phone calls, legal threats or whatever .. that really is just not on.
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To all the gutless pricks who felt the need to go running to teacher and threatening action or even ringing the man fork you, you are very sad people .
Well said Bill, I had one of those and it really put me off the whole thing and take a rest for a while..... yes fork you indeed
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The only people who call me shane are my girlfriend and people from Work. Everyone else calls me pokey and its just kind if wierd hearing my real nane. For yours I thought my name was Hugh Barstard as thats what mum called me and still does.
Time out isnt a bad thing. Sometimes we all get a but too close and passionate about a subject and the emotions kick in for the fight or flight reaction and most choose the fight.
I, like many have been visiting this site that Graeme adjudicates to perfection with the wisdom of Solomon. I also like many have taken some self imposed time out to ponder my navel and concentrate on life and what really matters. If you get upset about a topic then you know its time for a beer and a good nap in the hammock.
BS is why I dont race. Never could get my head around people hell bent in tying something fun up with red tape. Its suppose to be fun and a leisure activity.
For my mind I think we need guidelines in life, a direction and acceptance of peoples views. When that acceptance goes arse up then the arguments slip in. I trust admins to be knowlegble enough to make the right call even though I may nit understand or agree. After all they are at the pointy end and cop the shitty end of the stick if they dont get it right. Dont think I would like that type of attention.
Damn good website this one with diversity and comeraderie and its combination of spirit that keeps me returning.
Cheers Graeme, your doing a damn fine job.
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I blocked a few of the sections out so I didn't have to read the crap but it drifted all around the place so go for it Graeme.
I don't think I was a sh!t stirrer but I'm happy to use my real name.
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I just want to say Thanks for the forum Graeme. I didn't really ever take into account the amount of time you have to put into the moderating of the forum just so you don't get threatened with a law suit or the like. I can now appreciate you being over the negativity and character assassinations that sometimes rares it's ugly head, mostly regarding rule interpretations and eligibility of a certain bike or era. Those that have threatened you should take a long hard look at themselves.......
I enjoy coming onto the forum most days to get my fix of old dirt bike stuff. Some of the banter is great and I get a laugh out of the funnies. Not to mention the wealth of technical knowledge that gets shared in here. Being a relative new comer to VMX and old bikes, some just about as old as me, this place has been great for learning how to get the best out of my bikes. Hey, none of us are ever too old to learn, or think of approaching things in a different way but achieving the same end result.
I'm not comfortable with sharing my full name on the internet. Mark H will do me. Too many scumbags troll places like forums to find a pot of gold.
Long live Ozvmx
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Good to see people fronting up their names but can you guys put your old name up for a bit as well. Suddenly I'm seeing all these new names! While I know very few of you personally I do recognise the site names
Brent Josling,
brent j on just about every internet forum I peruse
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I may be paranoid but I have had bikes stolen before. Undesirables only have to Google you name and they probably will come up with your address. I show restorations on this site, free advertising for the crims. Sorry I am not changing mine.
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I may be paranoid but I have had bikes stolen before. Undesirables only have to Google you name and they probably will come up with your address. I show restorations on this site, free advertising for the crims. Sorry I am not changing mine.
Just did it apart for a quote from ozvmx the other Iain,s are much more interesting than little old me doctors ect . iain
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Well, I don`t need to give my full name as every person knows me, even if I change it, so their is know point. Graeme, I have always said to you that you have done a great job with this forum,
if used properly by example finding parts, helping members find bikes and parts, It is a very helpful forum at times, its a very useful tool, but as for eligibility, I am over it, if its in the rules book thats great, if its not, suck it up and move on, I have turned 59 now, I am pondering what to do next, stay with vmx, or move away from vmx, and I am finding it hard to take that step. I have personally copped a lot of sh---t from people on this forum over the years, and I can be my own worst enemy too, but there are members on this forum that may know me by name only, but they don`t know the real david behind the name, vmx is in my blood and as I said, its hard to walk away, what you have done for this forum Graeme you can stand tall.
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I've been the recipient of threatened violence, poisoned hate PM's and other ugly stuff by a couple of seriously sick dickwipes, one bloke in particular actually upset me so badly I went into a pretty nasty depression for a few months. I never publicly let on because I'd been a bit cruel to a couple of punters myself so I figured that maybe karma was coming to get me. To his credit he did later apologise. It was about that time that the deep passion I'd had for this sport since 1986 went down the gurgler. I resigned from the forum, stopped attending the races except for Classic Dirt and sold a couple of bikes. Over the next couple of years I gradually got much of that mojo back but I've never regained the deep passion I once had. Even though I understand where the angst in the Evo Rules debacle was coming from and can see points on both sides of the discussion, what disappointed me was the sheer venom and hate that was showing up on here, a place that should have been a happy, fun environement. I found it all so sad, and still do.
I'd like to see the forum remain for the good reasons it existed in the first place. I'll still drop in from time to time but to be honest I'm not remotely interested in any of the classes after pre 78 (well, perhaps a bit of interest in Evo), and that seems to be the direction the forum's heading. That's progress and I wish those classes the growth they deserve. If I see a post concerning my beloved pre 70, dirt track or something of interest and I feel I've got something to say I'll drop in but in reality I've found a happier social media place on Facebook.
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I can understand where you are coming from Graeme.
I too had some run in"s with a couple of absolute tools on here over the years-didn't destroy my love of the sport-just my passion for the forum.
In hindsight I behaved like a dick didn't help myself really so have pulled my cranium in since.
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I also refuse to use my real name. I want to remain anonymous ;) Tim754 aka Tim Derrick
Thanks for 10 years of putting up with my umm weird ramblings mate, I for would be shattered without this little personal outlet/lifeline. That said Graeme your own life and health must be paramount to you and your family ;)
haven’t used my facepoop account thingo in about 4 years and well sadly I just got to loath it
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Let everyone not forget that the passion for old bikes that we all have will show up in the written word, and that is in here, the best VMX forum in the world. The problem with passion is it can run hot or cold as with the topics that can get discussed in here. I for one have enjoyed all the great debates and usually thrown my 2 cents in, or maybe a $1 or 2, but thats what a debate is all about. As one person discribed me, "your like a dog with a bone" and yes I am, but its one thing to debate and another to defame. I have always liked the way Graeme has run this forum and its a credit to him, not an easy task considering how many of you are quick to scream blue murder or straight outright slag another off. My hats off to you Graeme.
I have been a member of this Forum from the start and a member of the old Turk Hacked forum of yesteryear. Both have been an absolute godsend of information and general good banter. But, and theres always one isn't there, the snipes, backstabbing, in your face jibs, the deleted posts and the inane posts have all contributed to the detriment of this great forum.
I don't come in here as often as I used too because of the last two things I said, deleted and inane posts that ruin a good thread. I don't care if someone wants to slag me off or conjure up a load of bullshit. I prefer to stand on top of the bullshit than sink in it. So to all the people who have nothing to add to a good debate/thread other than to say, shut it down, good onya, thats freedom of speech working right there, if you don't like it, don't read it, move on.
To what Graeme is saying (entirely correct) about going through the correct channels with regarding the Rules of VMX, I just hope everyone understands, that without general discussion in an open forum, your understanding/Interpretation of some of the rules could have a completely different meaning to what they actually mean. But then again, head in the sand stuff is always a good look.
Graeme, if I have ever offended you or any member of this forum I sincerely apologise but I will not bow down from a good debate about our sport of VMX. I believe that most members hold VMX close to the heart and generally fight for what they believe to be right or wrong for our sport. That said, I do hope some here re-read their own postings over the years and take a good long think about what they have said.
I will not be changing my avatar, but I have signed enough postings with my full name for all to see over the years.
Cheers
You know me as DJ and Im still Racing
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Thanks for keeping the forum going Graeme, in what must sometimes be very trying circumstances. Your patience, forbearance, and even handedness have played a significant part in the success of this unique forum. I think the changes you've outlined are a great idea.
Thanks
Tex
(John O'Brien)
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I used my name on another forum but seeing it pop up regularly in google has spooked me too much. got enough stuff out there without adding my muddaboik thoughts...
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It galls to read the thinly veiled 'finger pointing' in this thread.
I accept my own part in Graeme's frustration.
I accept (and respect) his right as forum owner to do whatever he wishes with the forum.
There is clear dissatisfaction in aspects of the way this sport is administered. The forum angst is a reflection of that dissatisfaction, not the source of it.
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Graeme this forum is a great place for all to research their bikes, sales , tech info plus events and tracks and so forth, apart from some people and their hidden amenders, myself I would like to thankyou VERY much for this what we call OZVMX .
I have meet and made a lot of friends through here and only can thankyou for the privilege .
Here is to hoping many more to come. For those who do not know me --Brian Fox QLD, come and say hello this weekend at our two day sign on practice weekend. info at QVMX web site or Facebook page.
Again thankyou Graeme we all really do appreciate you and this forum :)
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Quote "There is clear dissatisfaction in aspects of the way this sport is administered. The forum angst is a reflection of that dissatisfaction, not the source of it."
Nor is it the answer to it, If the rules and administration is that bad (i"m in Unzud,where vmx is simple) get good candidates into the MA
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I do believe the vast majority enjoy this forum for all the reasons Graeme set it up for. Over time I have seen it be abused for VMX political agendas, personal vendettas, thinly disguised rascist rants etc etc. Since I've been on the forum Graeme it seems to me as been very patient with some members and it saddens me to realise how pissed off he has become. Graeme do what you have to do mate I certainly wouldn't blame you if you did shut it down. Remember the use of this forum is a privilege NOT a right. I have derived an enormous amount of pleasure over the last few years and made some friends and would be gutted if Graeme shut it down due to some on here's selfish actions. Jerry
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I have found this forum very helpful with bike related tips , saved me time in the shed going the wrong way doing some things ;)
And if it wasn't for this forum Graeme I wouldn't of found a long lost family friend last seen 35 years back in nz , now he's in Darwin 8) so well done on your efforts Graeme on this forum .
And my name is really mick
But Called mike in nz but ;D
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Mean while on another thread... the fuse has been lit again.
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Unbelievable, and it's the same old culprits
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That's just so disappointing. Don't be surprised if Graeme pulls the plug. J
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(https://img0.etsystatic.com/029/0/9421546/il_570xN.599416088_n8hq.jpg)
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Been away and came on to see Graeme's new direction for the forum. Firstly, well done. Secondly I couldn't believe it when I saw the new thread, same old stuff from the same people. Unbelievable
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So taking swipes at me somehow puts you on the moral high ground Col?
Did you really think Graeme's post didn't include you, or bigk, or any of the other "usual suspects"?
Do you really think that it only applied to Ted and I, and that your shit don't stink?
FFS.
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Certainly know where your coming from Graeme.
While the special section for the rules seemed like a good idea at the time it just didn't work out that way.
By the same token I think you should also lose the dumbgeon, it also seemed like a good idea at the time but it just leaves all the old feuds to fester away.
I think if a thread is heading downhill then just dump it but leave something behind so we can see that it has been removed as it can be frustrating to be looking for a thread that is no longer there.
I also recommend you sit back with a cold beer, you've earned it.
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Hmmm... some interesting posts above. I take your point Geoff, and as for the other recent comments, I think I've said my piece.