OzVMX Forum
Clubroom => VMX Sidecars => Topic started by: VMX247 on June 15, 2010, 09:04:10 am
-
Rodger H doing it with Vaugh F
(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r259/vmx247/DSC00365.jpg)
Some many photos can have captions ;D
(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r259/vmx247/DSC00369.jpg)
-
I didn't know Roger rode the Chair?
i would have had a go if i had know and found a willing chair owner.
-
I didn't know Roger rode the Chair?
i would have had a go if i had know and found a willing chair owner.
He didn't till Sunday ;) ;D
Yes I'm sure the owners would of obliged you Mr Hoony 8) some asked,but didn't show.Maybe this was due to Macca announcing on the load speakers the body organ damage report for Popeye ::) :D
always next year 8)
cheers
-
I'd be careful, Hoony. Scariest thing I've ever experienced on a bike. It was terrifying! (And I thought I'd cleverly taken the easy way out by driving ... so I wouldn't wind up in the chair)
It was an absolute battle to keep straight. Every time I thought we had a chance to open the throttle, she'd wickedly spear right and try to leave the track.
I stalled it at the edge of drop-off peak of giant downhill ... and wanted to walk back. (But it takes two to return the beast to startline) Hardly got it over idle the whole way round.
You sidecar DRIVERS are legends ... passengers too. Fearless cast-iron gods.
Thanks heaps though, EML. You sure were right - something I'll never forget!
-
no worries Roger, i Raced a KTM540 powered EML in late 80's with some success for a year and served my apprenticeship swinging for for 18 mths in early 80's.
i would need to be sprayed with WD40 as i am rusty though ! ;)
-
Hoony I have a son that wants to take an old, tame, lame, lightweight and very mildly tuned at only a miserable 100+hp Pre75 Honda 754 (well it is 836cc at present ..or maybe 898 or even 920 if I put that one back together.. to the next CD, he says he just wants a happy bright soul to be passenger ,and perhaps take over the riding for a few laps. Cheers Tim754 ( The HBBB too ;))
-
For the people that diddn't hang around till the last chair session on Sunday, u missed an audio delight. One of the chairs was described as sounding like "a sprintcar" don't know what it was or what was done to it but I reckon you would have heard the sweet noise from Brisbane. The noise alone made me want to have a crack at riding it!
-
Hoony I have a son that wants to take an old, tame, lame, lightweight and very mildly tuned at only a miserable 100+hp Pre75 Honda 754 (well it is 836cc at present ..or maybe 898 or even 920 if I put that one back together.. to the next CD, he says he just wants a happy bright soul to be passenger ,and perhaps take over the riding for a few laps. Cheers Tim754 ( The HBBB too ;))
i would Love too Tim.
-
For the people that diddn't hang around till the last chair session on Sunday, u missed an audio delight. One of the chairs was described as sounding like "a sprintcar" don't know what it was or what was done to it but I reckon you would have heard the sweet noise from Brisbane. The noise alone made me want to have a crack at riding it!
I think that mite have been sidecar legend Geoff Udy in the last session having a spin on my XS Yamaha powered Wasp replica 8)
-
Geoff was the throttle man, but that thing sounds like no XS I've ever heard. In all seriousness it would be a real treat to record that engine noise in much the same manner as the H16 F1 car from 1949. if you get a chance drop over to YouTube and have a listen to the clip of pink floyds drummers car at a track in England and you will get the idea. The exhaust note from that chair is by far one of the best I have ever heard.
-
post the link to Nick Mason's car Bahnsy.
-
Geoff was the throttle man, but that thing sounds like no XS I've ever heard. In all seriousness it would be a real treat to record that engine noise in much the same manner as the H16 F1 car from 1949. if you get a chance drop over to YouTube and have a listen to the clip of pink floyds drummers car at a track in England and you will get the idea. The exhaust note from that chair is by far one of the best I have ever heard.
Gday Bahnsy, I do totally agree about the sound of that XS engine. I asked EML about it and he said the firing order had been changed and the 2 cylinders fire like a big single. It sounded awesome.
Stan.
-
This is without doubt the best engine noise ever, but the chair engine from CD7 comes pretty close.
Remember this is an engine that was designed & built in 1949 and was essentially 2 horizontally opposed 8 cylinder engines (think vw & Subaru) bolted one on top of each other displacing around 1300cc and reving to 9000 rpm. The noise you hear is the fuel freezing as it comes out of the supercharger causing the splutter. The project was doomed due to the sheer weight of the engine & it's reliability.
A mate of mine was at Goodwood the year it was run there and it was louder than the F1 cars that were there - Awesome!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZMPDCNyQxE&feature=youtube_gdata (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZMPDCNyQxE&feature=youtube_gdata)
-
Geoff was the throttle man, but that thing sounds like no XS I've ever heard. In all seriousness it would be a real treat to record that engine noise in much the same manner as the H16 F1 car from 1949. if you get a chance drop over to YouTube and have a listen to the clip of pink floyds drummers car at a track in England and you will get the idea. The exhaust note from that chair is by far one of the best I have ever heard.
Gday Bahnsy, I do totally agree about the sound of that XS engine. I asked EML about it and he said the firing order had been changed and the 2 cylinders fire like a big single. It sounded awesome.
Stan.
Thanks for the nice comments lads,
Heres a bit of info on the engine:
The firing order has been changed, however it doesn't fire as a single.
Instead of firing every 360'degrees, (parallel twin 4 stroke), it fires 270'-450'-270'-450'degrees and so on.
The right hand crankpin is 90'degrees ahead of the left one.
This is the same firing offset as a 90degree V-twin (ducati, good noise), but instead of the cylinders being 90degrees apart, the crank is.
The main objective of this was to reduce vibration, which it has done significantly.
It has turned it into a really smooth reving engine with loads of torque, and the traction is amazing due to the un-even firing pulse going through the back wheel.
Matt.
-
This is without doubt the best engine noise ever, but the chair engine from CD7 comes pretty close.
Remember this is an engine that was designed & built in 1949 and was essentially 2 horizontally opposed 8 cylinder engines (think vw & Subaru) bolted one on top of each other displacing around 1300cc and reving to 9000 rpm. The noise you hear is the fuel freezing as it comes out of the supercharger causing the splutter. The project was doomed due to the sheer weight of the engine & it's reliability.
A mate of mine was at Goodwood the year it was run there and it was louder than the F1 cars that were there - Awesome!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZMPDCNyQxE&feature=youtube_gdata (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZMPDCNyQxE&feature=youtube_gdata)
You are confusing the V16 BRM in the clip with the H16 engine which won at Watkins Glen in 1966 fitted to Jimmy Clark's Lotus 43 : that was the layout you have described above, two flat eights in piggyback. Nick Mason's car is a V16, as used from 1951 to 1954. Still a 'kin AWESOME noise... :o
-
Geoff was the throttle man, but that thing sounds like no XS I've ever heard. In all seriousness it would be a real treat to record that engine noise in much the same manner as the H16 F1 car from 1949. if you get a chance drop over to YouTube and have a listen to the clip of pink floyds drummers car at a track in England and you will get the idea. The exhaust note from that chair is by far one of the best I have ever heard.
Gday Bahnsy, I do totally agree about the sound of that XS engine. I asked EML about it and he said the firing order had been changed and the 2 cylinders fire like a big single. It sounded awesome.
Stan.
Thanks for the nice comments lads,
Heres a bit of info on the engine:
The firing order has been changed, however it doesn't fire as a single.
Instead of firing every 360'degrees, (parallel twin 4 stroke), it fires 270'-450'-270'-450'degrees and so on.
The right hand crankpin is 90'degrees ahead of the left one.
This is the same firing offset as a 90degree V-twin (ducati, good noise), but instead of the cylinders being 90degrees apart, the crank is.
The main objective of this was to reduce vibration, which it has done significantly.
It has turned it into a really smooth reving engine with loads of torque, and the traction is amazing due to the un-even firing pulse going through the back wheel.
Matt.
Thanks Matt for clearing that up, what EML told me was probably more like what you have explained but buy the time I related it I got it all wrong. Anyway it still sounds bloody awesome.
Stan
-
I do not like to rev engines hard. I prefer to grab another gear and let the torque do the work, much the same as the way you use the longstroke GRM power. Reducing vibration should not be confused with reducing 'grunt'.
-
Stan, down your way Daryl Hutcheon of Professional Motorcycle Tuning in Airport West has been playing with 650 Yamahas for years, including big bore kits and 270 degree cranks, might be worth a call if you're keen.... ;)
-
Never had a problem with vibration ....um from the engine that is... and on the other general item CD7 thread they have a few comments on "free hand air brushing" glad no body interested in VMX sidecars is silly enough to indulge in that rubbish. Cheers Tim754
(http://i951.photobucket.com/albums/ad360/tdee754/754/754200403.jpg)
-
Wasp,
Moving the crank around 3 splines is a common and simple way of doing it, works out to be 83.08degrees and apparently works quite well.
To get 90degree, u need 2x #2flywheel (centre left) and a special double ended centre shaft (and a small amount of machining) to get the magic number.
Chuck the #3 flywheel in the bin, as well as the other 3 flywheels from the donor crank
-
Wasp we have used another tank on the track....mostly ;) Cheers (also the photo was really a test to see if I could properly upload hosted piccies , Success!) :D
-
Talking of vibration, the 880 we tried to run this year is a big drama and vibration is most likely the cause of our ignition failures. We are up to our 3rd Boyer box and 4th coil pack. On top of that we had the whole thing rewired twice and each time it has failed it has been diagnosed as something else.
I recall from back when these were raced alot that they had issues with bolts falling out and things breaking all of the time so we might consign that engine to the scrap heap.
It can't be considered poor preparation as some half-smart bastard is suggesting as we spent plenty of time and money on it.
-
Made the cam at home from start to finish, it is made from billet 4340 steel, with adjustable sproket.
Ignition is off the shelf unit made by PROBE Indudtries in the states.
(http://i833.photobucket.com/albums/zz259/270YAM/cam.jpg)
This is the cam 'rough ground' before it was stress relieved.
-
Great idea I have a mate in Sydney with a rephased 840 in a Rob North copy frame, racing Period 5 (Forgotten Era). He has a lot of success, especailly in the wet and on tite tracks, even at Eastern Creek he gets up the 1100 Suzuki's and the Morowaki Kawasaki's, but the 840 doesnt quite have it down the strait.
That thing of yours would eat the P4 class alive.
Unfortunately the program for this cam moved to QLD as it was made by hand on a conventional lathe and a home made cam grinder!
-
Unfortunately because I have moved to QLD I no longer have access to the gear I use to build the cams.
You can get them hard welded and re-ground, but you probly like that idea as much as i do.
In answer to your earlier question, yes the cam shaft is hollow.
How do you rephase a Euro longstroke crank? do they use the same 13 spline setup as a standard crank?
-
Matt, what have I told you about talking to strange old men on the net in the middle of the night??
I heard you had a win at Proserpine but that the Norton took the trophy home. was the track as dodgy as Nick says-he reckoned it was very tight and twisty through the trees like an enduro special test.
Bloody great bunch of people though eh.
-
The below sidecar came with no esky in the chair, as some models did at CD 7 8)
(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r259/vmx247/CD7006.jpg)
-
So then what was the purpose of this bike? ;D
-
So then what was the purpose of this bike? ;D
It was the all time, best ever seen fastest yellow yammie wheelie jumping machine ... :P
I mean they all have a purpose ;) ;D ;D
-
Matt, what have I told you about talking to strange old men on the net in the middle of the night??
I heard you had a win at Proserpine but that the Norton took the trophy home. was the track as dodgy as Nick says-he reckoned it was very tight and twisty through the trees like an enduro special test.
Bloody great bunch of people though eh.
Yep top weekend, Great people, not so great track. Still an awesome weekend none the less.
Great to have the crew from down south come up, thanks guys.
-
It must have been bad as for the last two years it was great yet everyone one seems to agree that it wasn't open enough this year.
The camp is a pearler though, isn't it?
-
The below sidecar came with no esky in the chair, as some models did at CD 7 8)
The owner of this monster has already expressed his intrest in having the esky mods, should be standard equipment!
(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r259/vmx247/CD7006.jpg)
-
Matt, I was just checking out your cam and I worked out that I couldn't even take a photo that well let alone turn a bit of steel into that!!
-
The below sidecar came with no esky in the chair, as some models did at CD 7 8)
The owner of this monster has already expressed his intrest in having the esky mods, should be standard equipment!
A full esky here . ;D
(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r259/vmx247/CD7064.jpg)
-
Thanks for that shot - man that was a hoot, and I think Brad von beDutchman had a great time too.
I didn't have the heart to tell him that the Dutchies have won more sidecar titles than the rest of the world put together!!