Chassis Evolution

[Phil]

Freaky, At least Ji's contributing to our knowledge. I don't recall Ross ever doing anything other than taking the piss.

[NR555]

British EMC/EMX frames are all Reynolds 531.  An absolute work of art.  All brazed.  I'll put up some pics of the welds when I get the chance.

The new CCMs are bonded aluminium frames, featuring KTM plastics & Yamaha motors.  I'll be stumping up the cash if they ever land here. 

http://www.ccm-racing.com

[LWC82PE]

im skeptical of the bonded alluminium frames. They tryed it on bicycles, it didnt work/didnt last long

ive gt some good pics of some Hagon alloy framed bikes that i dont think anyone here would have seen as they are from old french magazines. i will look for them tonight and scan over easter.

[VMX247]

There is a lot of old talk on ozvmx of Hagons in days gone by,wish I knew where the boss stored the Morgan SA sidecar photos.    Tim may have some pics 
Got to say there are very impressive bikes.   good to see something different. 
http://www.cybermotorcycle.com/gallery/hagon/index.htm
http://ozvmx.com/community/index.php?topic=648.0
Alison
Hagon shocks are 18 years old.
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Hagon-swingarm_W0QQitemZ140311329470QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAU_Motorcycle_Parts_Accessories?hash=item140311329470&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Hagon-fuel-tank-slider-longtrack-speedway_W0QQitemZ140311334627QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAU_Motorcycle_Parts_Accessories?hash=item140311334627&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318

[Ji Gantor]

Hi Nathan S and Old Phil,
When, where and by whom were these Hagons manufactured.
monocoque usually means one piece, how is that possible with the swingarm?
They certainly look really cool but they sort of look like a Frantinbike, bits from different manufacturers.

A very cool add to my topic.

Ji

[LWC82PE]

entrant 999 at the bonaza has a Hagon outfit
http://www.ma.org.au/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Forms&Template=/CM/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentFileID=44682

The Hagons were made in England. i think they are the same company who make Hagon shocks

[Ji Gantor]

Hi NR555,
That sounds great I look forward to seeing the images of these past craftsman.

Ji

[evo550]

What's the advantages of a perimeter frame over the older style "backbone" ?

[LWC82PE]

i just found the Hagon article

[Ji Gantor]

This is great.
This is the spirit I was looking for when I started this topic.
I have never heard of a Hagons before nor did I know about Reynolds 531.
Lets all share what we know about frames.
There will be some dead ends and some paths that lead the manufacturers to the modern chassis.

Ji

[Ji Gantor]

Okay I see the monocoque definition in this case means that the bike does not have a tube frame but instead all the number plates tank and so on are the chassis.

Very Cool.
I think the Hagons is a very attractive bike.
How many were made?
Where does one get parts?
Were they made of Aluminium?

What did they weigh?

Ji

[Ji Gantor]

Frame weight loss using similar materials can only be achieved by reducing the amount of metal used. In the case of CrMo tube frames this means that the wall thickness has to be reduced. If the original frame was over designed then reducing the wall thickness is no problem. Take my CZ400 1973 bare frame, it weighs 9.7kilos. CZ state that it should be CrMo but I am still checking to see if it is actually some kind of mild steel. Geoff of GMC makes a  CZ / CMS replica frame from CrMo 4130 and it weighs 7.8kilos. Thanks Geoff for graciously supplying this data. That is a reduction of 1.9kilos which is great for the power to weight ratio. The only other way to reduce weight is but removing sections of the frame that by testing to see how the loads are applied are no longer needed. This moving the frame sections around in an attempt to design the frame to just carry the loads is evolution as is using lighter metals.

Ji

[JohnnyO]

Hagon frames have been around forever in speedway and long track racing.

[Ji Gantor]

Hi JohnnyO,
How about motocross?
How well did they do in MX?


Ji

[JohnnyO]

Didn't see too many in motocross especially in OZ. May have been successfull in England where they were made.