Author Topic: Gasless mig ?  (Read 17456 times)

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Offline sleepy

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #30 on: November 25, 2016, 10:09:25 am »
It takes a few years to get good at TIG and even after close to 40 years of doing it I'm still learning. Struggle now as one get older is to see what I'm doing and try not to forget the things learnt in my youth. You are correct about the operator, very important part.
This is what you need Sleepy, if you haven't already got one.
https://www.revolutionindustrial.com.au/assets/full/N469.jpg

Got those, work well but no substitute for young eyes.

Offline shelpi

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #31 on: November 25, 2016, 05:21:16 pm »
just finishing playing with the tig, it turned out the job was a alloy punt, so 8 metres of welding all up, we took the time to twiddle with the knobs, arc balance,  amps, current
we both fiddled while the other weld, set out sections with a texta and gave settings then went back had a look and a chat,
so all inall was good and feel better about my welding, so have a bucket of rm, pe magnesium covers so will hava crack,
Any of you Guru's please feel free to offer tips, I'm only a 4 year old boily (yer I know I left my run late) long story, just sorta happened
p.s did do watch weldingtipsandtricks.com for rod series az101 and cleaning prepping etc
cheers
« Last Edit: November 25, 2016, 06:00:02 pm by shelpi »

Offline sleepy

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #32 on: November 25, 2016, 07:49:31 pm »
just finishing playing with the tig, it turned out the job was a alloy punt, so 8 metres of welding all up, we took the time to twiddle with the knobs, arc balance,  amps, current
we both fiddled while the other weld, set out sections with a texta and gave settings then went back had a look and a chat,
so all inall was good and feel better about my welding, so have a bucket of rm, pe magnesium covers so will hava crack,
Any of you Guru's please feel free to offer tips, I'm only a 4 year old boily (yer I know I left my run late) long story, just sorta happened
p.s did do watch weldingtipsandtricks.com for rod series az101 and cleaning prepping etc
cheers

Most important is the filler rod, needs to be almost pure Mag, costs about 10 times that of alloy and much harder to get. I count the buts and workout the cost of filler rods and add to bill, last batch was about $2 a stick. The 5%mag alloy rods don't work. Welding current needed is usually quite a bit less the alloy
Cleaner the better. Having a longer post flow of gas helps as well. Be very careful with any grinding dust/swarf on your bench it will burn very vigorously(don't ask how I know).
If the job does start to burn quickly turn the welding current to 0 and blast the flames with argon by holding down the welding button.

Offline shelpi

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #33 on: November 26, 2016, 10:38:35 am »
just finishing playing with the tig, it turned out the job was a alloy punt, so 8 metres of welding all up, we took the time to twiddle with the knobs, arc balance,  amps, current
we both fiddled while the other weld, set out sections with a texta and gave settings then went back had a look and a chat,
so all inall was good and feel better about my welding, so have a bucket of rm, pe magnesium covers so will hava crack,
Any of you Guru's please feel free to offer tips, I'm only a 4 year old boily (yer I know I left my run late) long story, just sorta happened
p.s did do watch weldingtipsandtricks.com for rod series az101 and cleaning prepping etc
cheers

Most important is the filler rod, needs to be almost pure Mag, costs about 10 times that of alloy and much harder to get. I count the buts and workout the cost of filler rods and add to bill, last batch was about $2 a stick. The 5%mag alloy rods don't work. Welding current needed is usually quite a bit less the alloy
Cleaner the better. Having a longer post flow of gas helps as well. Be very careful with any grinding dust/swarf on your bench it will burn very vigorously(don't ask how I know).
If the job does start to burn quickly turn the welding current to 0 and blast the flames with argon by holding down the welding button.
good advice, thanx Sleepy

Offline Oldfart

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #34 on: November 26, 2016, 06:16:11 pm »
Oil residue is a pain also, Clean the work area thoroughly.
  I tend to use 90% magnesium 10 % Ali with a great deal of success and have elbow length tig gloves on. 
Too much current and the bloody thing will catch  fire and believe me its a scary moment .   As Sleepy has stated put it out with argon gas shield.
 
 

Offline shelpi

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #35 on: November 27, 2016, 11:20:31 am »
thanks old fart, with a bit of luck I'll get some time to finally get to do some of my jobs! funny thing when you are not racing you're no longer on the priority list (by self and others) so everything and everyone comes before me (even the wife is getting me to do things) LOL
Hey while on the subject doing home based choirs, fire season is on us so purchased another pump, old mates been using the Chonda's for a couple of years (ive used a chinese coil) and reconned no worries, so I went in and purchased a Electric start, 6.5hp (complete hondaGX160 copy)pump from Jono and Johno delivered for $318.71 including battery, was so happy with it rang them up and bought another, just saying

Offline Slakewell

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #36 on: November 27, 2016, 12:07:01 pm »
When welding MAG , you must get it really clean. Welding current is way less ( under 20 on bike cases ) I also clean an area attach vise grips to that area and then earth on to vice grips. Keep the earth as close to the welded area as practical. I use 90% mag rods , yup there dear as. I think quarter kilo was like $180.00
Current bikes. KTM MC 250 77 Husky CR 360 77, Husky 82 420 Auto Bitsa XR 200 project. Dont need a pickle just need to ride my motorcickle

Offline shelpi

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #37 on: November 27, 2016, 01:02:49 pm »
When welding MAG , you must get it really clean. Welding current is way less ( under 20 on bike cases ) I also clean an area attach vise grips to that area and then earth on to vice grips. Keep the earth as close to the welded area as practical. I use 90% mag rods , yup there dear as. I think quarter kilo was like $180.00
thanks Slakewell, more good advice! ahh shit havnt bought the rods yet, Ouch!

Offline Daryl Jones

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #38 on: December 04, 2016, 12:19:52 am »
Back to Gasless Mig (more accurately called Flux Cored arc welding).
They have their uses. eg. welding outside, where wind will waste an awful lot of Mig or Tig gas.
Flux Cored is also more tolerant of older, dirty or rustyish metal, (like a stick welder).

Biggest problem, is that the really cheapest ones, are AC welders, (like a stick welder).
They Splutter & Spatter and make welds that look like you have never used a welder, (Arc, Mig, Tig or Oxy.) in your life.
With patience & practice & fiddling with speed & power (volts/amps), you can sort of 'stick metal together' with one.

They can be vastly improved by converting them to DC, using suitably rated diode rectifiers.
You can also add capacitors, to even out any DC pulse, if you are worried about that.

If you don't have knowlege, experience, confidence & time to do this,
Spend the extra money and buy a Gas/Gasless Mig which should have a DC output, and use it gasless.

You need to ensure the polarity is changed to Negative Electrode for flux cored.
For thin panel steel you still need to do stitch & cool welding to prevent burn through & distortion.

Heaps of u-tube videos about all this stuff, though most are not worth your time.

Cheers, Daryl
Life's too short not to try to do Everything.

"First they tell you you're wrong, and they can prove it.
Then they tell you you're right, but it's not important.
Then they tell you it is important, but they knew it all along."
Charles Kettering.

Offline Mick D

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #39 on: December 04, 2016, 12:49:22 am »
Been watching this thread and was considering writing something similar, but you have just done a far better job Daryl  8)

There is one very important thing not mentioned yet though and that is the same goes as for rod choices for stick welding.
Rods aren't rods. When I find a brand of GP for example, I then go out of my way to stick with them.
Some are absolute rubbish, same goes for flux cored wire, try the CigWeld brand ;) 
"light weight, and it works great"  :)

Offline Mick D

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #40 on: December 04, 2016, 01:08:39 am »
I live opposite a near 70 year old spritely panel beater. The legend is a dead set artist on full ground up vintage restos.
He has a giant rotisserie that takes a full car body/chassis. He uses this to achieve the optimum working and welding angle out comes where possible/practicable. (after watching him oxy weld aluminium on Healey Sprites etc, got me started. I can oxy weld cylinder fins back on, no problem)

I use this to great advantage on smaller stuff
http://forum.ozvmx.com/index.php?topic=31379.msg306257#msg306257

I know you probably wont be able to rotate and position Jimsom, so you may have to employ several types of welding before you are done.

Don't get me wrong. I have done a fair bit of fine steel panel work on full metal car restos ::) ::) ::) ::)
Never again ::) ::) ::)
Mig with gas is god.   
"light weight, and it works great"  :)

Offline sleepy

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #41 on: December 04, 2016, 11:05:05 pm »
Talking about Mag welding got of the subject a bit but does anyone know of a source for the Mag Tig rods here in OZ. Local welding supplier told me they need to be ordered from USA and I would need to get 5kg and mortgage the house. I have found an Ebay source from the states for 1lb pack at about $120 delivered.

Offline sa63

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #42 on: December 05, 2016, 12:25:32 am »
I got a few rods from the aircraft welders at archerfield, although
Though a little while back

Offline shelpi

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #43 on: December 05, 2016, 10:52:01 am »
I'm still looking without selling me house, cant believe I'm saying this I'm gunna go and see what the Chinese have,
hey sa63 any chance I could get in on the act and get a couple of rods off ya (will swap for money)?

Offline Slakewell

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Re: Gasless mig ?
« Reply #44 on: December 05, 2016, 06:40:16 pm »
I purchased my mag rods from Jaymac in Tamworth. Had to buy half a kilo but had a mate who took half.
Current bikes. KTM MC 250 77 Husky CR 360 77, Husky 82 420 Auto Bitsa XR 200 project. Dont need a pickle just need to ride my motorcickle