Author Topic: Four stroke options  (Read 70115 times)

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Offline James Lee

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #75 on: June 10, 2016, 03:54:12 pm »
I have a few questions,had a look at the SP and RM today and it looks like the rm swing arm will go right on the SP.Im not sure if this is my best option,I would need to make a spacer for it or I was thinking of lenthening the SP swing arm and running some flat plate stood up underneath.Any advice which way to go?The RM one would save allot of weight.Or should I find a DR alloy one as previously mentioned by LWC82PE.
Looks like the RM front end will fit straight on too,not sure if the bars will clear when I drop the forks through the clamps.LWC82PE do you think the 125 forks would be more suited that the rm250 forks?
Id like to work with what I have here as I have other bikes I need to spend money on.Im happy to buy new shocks or would rather get the RM ones rebuilt if they could work?
Im just after a VMX bike that I will enjoy riding and looking at knowing I built it.Im not worried about coming last but dont plan on it either.


Offline evo550

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #77 on: June 10, 2016, 05:05:42 pm »
Its interesting that people spend a fortune to try and get acfourstroke 10 kg lighter, when the rider is the one contributing to the load, imaging how well the four stroke would handle and the suspension would work if the rider lost 30 kg.....just sayin' :)

Offline mick25

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #78 on: June 10, 2016, 05:27:26 pm »
Its interesting that people spend a fortune to try and get acfourstroke 10 kg lighter, when the rider is the one contributing to the load, imaging how well the four stroke would handle and the suspension would work if the rider lost 30 kg.....just sayin' :)
Very good point some forget about there own weight  ;D
I for one have been the same racing weight since high school 79kg
So I'm trying to save weight on the bike project I'm doing now .

Offline LWC82PE

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #79 on: June 10, 2016, 05:29:58 pm »
You will need to be specific when talking about what model RM parts you are considering.
The stock triple clamps are 25mm offset
All 76-78 RM clamps and 78/79 PE clamps are 30mm offset and are a straight bolt on. 76/77 RM250/370 top clamp is 35mm but lower is 36mm. 78/79 PE  77 RM125B and 78 RM250 clamps are the same but 36mm top and bottom.
78 RM125, RM400 and RM250C2 have offset rubber mounted bar mounts and will allow forks to be slid up. If you dont like the rubber mounts, replace the rubber with solid alloy replacements the same shape as the rubbers.

The alloy DR500, steel DR400 and DR500 and SP500 swingarms are all the same dimensionally apart from thickness of various parts on the alloy one is greater eg where the axle goes through. The steel ones are pretty easy to get and cheap. They are box section type. Alloy ones can be hard to find and a little pricey. It really depends on your specific set up as to what will work but there is provision the shorten any of those swingarms by about 12mm by machining the slots more forward and custom making some longer adjusters.  The SP used different swingarm pivot bolt sizes from 78-79 from memory. Some 14 and some 16mm? Basically any other RM/PE swingarm can be made to fit but some are more 'bolt on' than others. Alloy 78 RM 250/400 swingarms can be hard to find in good condition and are prone to cracking and wearing out in the pivot area, which is an area that suzuki designed a bit 'light' The Profab built swingarms i have are a lot beefier in this area.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2016, 05:32:22 pm by LWC82PE »
Wanted - 1978 TS185 frame or frame&motor. Frame # TS1852-24007 up to TS1852-39022

Offline mick25

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #80 on: June 10, 2016, 05:30:12 pm »
I have a few questions,had a look at the SP and RM today and it looks like the rm swing arm will go right on the SP.Im not sure if this is my best option,I would need to make a spacer for it or I was thinking of lenthening the SP swing arm and running some flat plate stood up underneath.Any advice which way to go?The RM one would save allot of weight.Or should I find a DR alloy one as previously mentioned by LWC82PE.
Looks like the RM front end will fit straight on too,not sure if the bars will clear when I drop the forks through the clamps.LWC82PE do you think the 125 forks would be more suited that the rm250 forks?
Id like to work with what I have here as I have other bikes I need to spend money on.Im happy to buy new shocks or would rather get the RM ones rebuilt if they could work?
Im just after a VMX bike that I will enjoy riding and looking at knowing I built it.Im not worried about coming last but dont plan on it either.
They do have weak gear dogs on 3rd I broke one and my spare gear box I got for spares had the same gear broken , oldfart had the same probs on his latest sp project .

Offline James Lee

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #81 on: June 10, 2016, 05:30:20 pm »
The RM I have here is a 1979 125.I got the SP running today and its sounds good but will test tomorrow for any gearbox issues.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2016, 05:34:30 pm by James Lee »

Offline mick25

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #82 on: June 10, 2016, 05:35:15 pm »
I used to try and do a poo and a wee before BMX racing.

It all helps James  ;D

Offline James Lee

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #83 on: June 10, 2016, 05:41:45 pm »
I edited that,you caught me out lol.

Offline mick25

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #84 on: June 10, 2016, 05:43:39 pm »
When I first got my dr500 it had a broken gear dog and I didn't notice it when I rode it around the paddock , but when I gave it the first oil change the broken dog fell out the sump  :'(
So I rebuilt the whole bottom end gears etc then five years later while changing the oil a broken dog was stuck inside my magnetic sump  :'(
So then I checked my spare gear box that I got from the wreckers and the same gear dog was broken in there to .
I know the dr500 and dr400 had the same part number for third gear and think the sp are the same .
and third gear is the gear most used on the track .

Offline mick25

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #85 on: June 10, 2016, 05:45:47 pm »
I edited that,you caught me out lol.
I noticed it gone ? Had me stuffed for a second , then I throught I was to fast for ya  :o

Offline LWC82PE

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #86 on: June 10, 2016, 06:16:44 pm »
The 79 RM forks are 38mm and the steering stops are different. I am not so sure they will work with the frame stops without some additional mods. Stems are longer too. All the ones i suggested are bolt on's, but if you want 38mm then i guess you gotta go with 79/80 stuff then. The 38mm forks are longer than the 78 36mm forks too. I would carefully consider fork length thats for sure. Its not just a matter of chucking the extra length up out the top triple clamp which will reduce the gap you have here when full bottom.
Here are RM370 forkss you can see there is no way these can be slid up anymore. They only have a 22mm gap as standard here between slider and base of triple. This is what you need to check out, if intending to slide the forks out the clamps to reduce length.


 Consider the how long the stock forks are from axle hole to top of the chrome and then look at what ones you want to use. The issue is, if you go a lot longer in front and at the rear it does raise the center of gravity and ride height a lot. The bikes that these long forks may come from have all this factored in and the engine cradles sit down lower. As soon as you get into this project you will quickly learn how one thing effects another and you will need to do a lot of measuring, experimentation, trial fitting of parts etc. It can become very time consuming if you really want it to work out well. My advice is don't go to extremes with the mods and take your time with it. I would be looking for a set of forks in the 9 inch travel range roughly around 840-870mm long. The previous mentioned issues of sprocket/pivot location and distance between top shock mounts and swingarm pivot are going to limit what you can do with the front anyway. Sprocket sizes also affect things. Larger ones will give you a bit more breathing space at the buffer area but do they give you the ratio you are needing...... decisions,decisions. I hope you like spending hours in the shed :)
« Last Edit: June 10, 2016, 06:40:08 pm by LWC82PE »
Wanted - 1978 TS185 frame or frame&motor. Frame # TS1852-24007 up to TS1852-39022

Offline yamaico

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #87 on: June 10, 2016, 09:33:13 pm »
Its interesting that people spend a fortune to try and get acfourstroke 10 kg lighter, when the rider is the one contributing to the load, imaging how well the four stroke would handle and the suspension would work if the rider lost 30 kg.....just sayin' :)
It's all about reducing the unsprung weight...

Offline Tony.Brown

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #88 on: June 10, 2016, 09:47:06 pm »
Its interesting that people spend a fortune to try and get acfourstroke 10 kg lighter, when the rider is the one contributing to the load, imaging how well the four stroke would handle and the suspension would work if the rider lost 30 kg.....just sayin' :)
It's all about reducing the unsprung weight...

Dead right Pete!

Offline James Lee

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Re: Four stroke options
« Reply #89 on: June 11, 2016, 07:13:55 am »
At 104KG Im at my lightest,anything under 100kg and I feel like I lose some strength,so my poor bikes have to lag me around the track.
Im having a different idea with the RM chassis now,I have a fast little XT250 engine here,would this be a better choice?
Im happy to leave the SP in relatively standard form and fit the best suited forks and best shocks I can get on it and mod or fit a longer swing arm.
That way I can use the RM and end up with 2 bikes instead of one.
I have the shed to myself this weekend so will test fit some parts and see what I come up with.
GMC do you make extended bolt on swing arms for the SP?