May Viper round at Ravenswood cancelled.

[bigk]

Just let it go, it's history now, who really cares? Hopefully next years hosting club gets a better turnout.
K

[VMX247]

Just let it go, it's history now, who really cares? Hopefully next years hosting club gets a better turnout.
K

here here..good to see it deleted off Facebook also..Does nothing but bring the sport down.

resume racing 

[Hardo]

meanwhile.....

How about we settle it in the middle, and invite both the Vic's and the Queenslndrrrrrrrrsss to come and race their vintage bikes in the Gloucester TT next weekend!

Where else can you get to race under lights !!??

Entries are open and online entry is easy at http://www.heavenvmx.com.au ..   

See you interstaters' all there !!   

[supersenior 50]

Went to the Gloucester event last year and it was great. Racing under lights always adds another dimension

[Digga]

I think 'oorah' to BMCC for putting their hand up to host the event, the club & volunteers did a great job & stated up front, early on, that the race would go ahead regardless of numbers & they were true to their word. So I say outstanding effort & good on them, well done.

I do not know the associated politics/factions/disputes etc & dont really want to, but BMCC would have known that they had an approximate cut off with entries that would be their profit/loss point. Even though the numbers were well down (from all states) they still went ahead & ran the event knowing they might get burnt to some degree, so again I take my hat off to them for just going ahead regardless for the good of the sport 

As for the attendence issue, hope the following is correct or close to it:

2011 Crystal Brook, SA - combined CMX + PCMX = oversubscribed with numbers & initiated the Pre & Post 78 split
2012 Tasmania, cancelled, assume due to lack of interest, lack of numbers?
2013 ACT, cancelled, maybe have been numbers related as per Tasssie but host club withdrew late in the process?
2014 Echo Valley, Qld ~ 130 riders + ~ 75% host state Qld'ers
2015 Ravenswood, Vic ~ 70 rider + ~ 65% host state Vic's

Whatever the issues, there is obviously room for improvement here & nobody would say that the above is a healthy track record for PCMX so far & maybe time to remove the split & put the event back into the one combined meeting again? Food for thought & further discussion maybe.

But again I say, well done BMCC for hosting the event & providing a great opportunity for those who went to enjoy the track & the VMX atmosphere 

[KTM47]

Well said and I think no ones doubts the effort of Bendigo MCC.

A couple of mistakes, the PCMXC in 2013 was to be at Lakes it was cancelled due to lac of entries. 

The Classic MX Champs in 2013 was to be run in ACT it was cancelled well in advance for various reasons and then moved to QMP in Queensland.

Anyway I think the PCMXC at Echo Valley shows it can work.  I think the difference is QVMX hired the track from Toowoomba MXC and ran the meeting.  They sourced sponsorship etc to help with the costs.  QVMX assumed the financial responsibility.

[Digga]

OK, thx Kevin, thought I owuld something wrong but close enough

[Ted]

Is this worth considering? Add to it. Detract from it etc.

Join Classic and Post Classic together again.

Friday: Sign on
           Pre 75, Pre 75 Age Classes, Evo Age Classes....Practice....followed by,
 
           Pre 75, Pre75 Age Classes, Evo Age Classes.......RACING

           Pre 75, Pre 75 Age Classes...6/10 mins  Evo Age Classes.....10/12 mins

           TWO MOTOS each class. In the event of a 1/2 and a 2/1 finish tied points scenario, the
 second Moto takes the prize, same for Saturday and Sunday.

RATIONALE: From what I've seen the older guys ride these classes and therefore may be able to get off a day earlier without it impacting too much on their lifestyle.

Saturday: Sign on.

               Pre 78, Evo, Pre 85, Pre 90 .....Practice ....followed by

               Pre 78, Evo, Pre 85, Pre 90......RACING

               Pre 78...10/12 mins   Evo, Pre 85, Pre 90.....15 mins

               One moto each class

Rationale : Being only practice and 12 motos in total it would leave sufficient time, if needed, to finalize Friday's  class races in the morning.

Sunday:   Pre 78, Evo, Pre 85, Pre 90....... RACING

               One moto each class

               Race duration the same as Saturday....followed by Presentation

Rationale: With only two motos riders will still get more track time than is currently available with the Eras being split.

With only 12 motos Saturday and Sunday it will leave sufficient time to take up the slack from Friday if needed and to cover any unforseeables.

Maybe I've got the maths wrong for Friday so if one of my more learned colleagues can work it out feel free and I'll amend the program.

Having both Eras combined will, I am sure, be a resounding success for any and every club that hosts it.

[Nathan S]

Just let it go, it's history now, who really cares? Hopefully next years hosting club gets a better turnout.
K

Those who don't learn from the past are doomed to repeat it.

---------

There were a grand total of seven New South Welshmen at Ravenswood. Two of them are from Hay, and apparently ride with Viper - they should probably count as Victorians.

The remaining five are all Heaven members, four of whom are/were Northern Districts (Pre-90) members.

I'm not going to speak for anyone who didn't attend, but the sport as a whole really ought to be asking why so few people attended.

--------

I was a strong supporter of the Nationals split, but it's failing. What Ted suggests is the best option I can see: Pre-75 (and older) on Friday; Pre-78 and Evo on Saturday; Pre-85 and Pre-90 on Sunday.

1. Most riders will only have one or two days of competition, reducing their time away from work/home.
2. If the newer bikes really do chew the track up, the older bikes won't be affected.
3. One MA permit, and one track reduces the event costs.
4. One event means one trip for competitors who race on both sides of the Classic vs Post-Classic divide.

There's been four Post Classic Nationals held. Two have fallen over due to insufficent entries and a third "should" have fallen over (many thanks to the Bendigo club for holding the event anyhow).
We have a problem.
A 25% success rate/50% failure rate is not acceptable.

If we care about this sport, then we need to work out what the issues are, and fix them.

[supersenior 50]

Good to have the input, but been there. One of the rationales for the split was to bring the event back to two days. Sign on and scrutineering Friday is currently for convenience, not compulsory.
The split opened up the opportunity to introduce Pre90 and Evo age grouping.
The split has brought back Pre60 from oblivion, and increased Pre65 participation.
The bottom line was there just wasn't the time to run over two days even when it was only up to Evo.
It went to three days with Evo and Pre85 and still not enough time. Conondale Nats was well run and supported, but lost time due to an accident meant the final round was two laps and presentation in darkness with people leaving during it. Think of the fuss on the forum from non riders over the three lap Pt Augusta event.
The three day format was unpopular with a lot of riders, classes were being dropped through time constraints, there was the push to bring in Pre 90so the split was inevitable.
The first Classic Nats after the split saw a record entry, and from a Classic point of view it's not only been a success but necessary.
There are many factors that have contribuited to the Post Classic situation, but lack of numbers at club level is certainly not one of them. QVMX, Heaven and Viper have heaps of bikes, plus the more Classic orientated clubs such as Brisbane with smaller Post Classic numbers.
Tasmania Was obviously a cost issue with the Post Classic failure, but they have run two successful Classic Nats.
The Lakes foundered following forum griping about camping etc, and Canberra from bad publicity about the track etc.
Bendigo could have perhaps been better promoted, but everyone knew about it well in advance, and the track was known to be ideal for a Post Classic event.
To me the problem seems to be that the big Post Classic clubs just didn't support the event.
Ted this is not a smart assed question, with no hidden agenda, but why were you not there? Liam would have loved the track and been very successful. It's not as far from you as Qld or WA, and we know finance is not a problem.
The answer in my opinion is not to step back to the problems of four or five years ago, but to just participate.
If the big clubs had supported Bendigo in even half the numbers I would have expected it would have been a ripper.

[Nathan S]

Col, Queensland is the strongest state overall. This needs to be clearly kept in mind when looking at the numbers (and lessons learned) from Qld events.

[supersenior 50]

Nathan I agree, and it was good to see you at Bendigo.
Yes Qld currently enjoys a strong Classic/Post Classic scene and certainly has the luxury of good  numbers
However I went to the Heaven meeting at Canberra a few weeks ago and there was a good turnout.
The Classic Nats has been a success since the split, so the problem is to get the Post Classic firing.
The numbers at club level are there, so why don't they support the Nats. QVMX is probably the biggest Post Classic Club, yet only had four or five were at Ravenswood where I would have expected twenty or so. Perhaps their members could be surveyed as to their lack of interest as a guide to the low Ravenswood entry and used for the future.

[Rossvickicampbell]

ted - just a comment not disagreeing - but the old eras followed by later eras in whatever time frame was a suggestion that fell over previously before the split was advocated and pushed through - so been there looked at that.

[sleepy]

Is this worth considering? Add to it. Detract from it etc.

Join Classic and Post Classic together again.

Friday: Sign on
           Pre 75, Pre 75 Age Classes, Evo Age Classes....Practice....followed by,
 
           Pre 75, Pre75 Age Classes, Evo Age Classes.......RACING

           Pre 75, Pre 75 Age Classes...6/10 mins  Evo Age Classes.....10/12 mins

           TWO MOTOS each class. In the event of a 1/2 and a 2/1 finish tied points scenario, the
 second Moto takes the prize, same for Saturday and Sunday.

RATIONALE: From what I've seen the older guys ride these classes and therefore may be able to get off a day earlier without it impacting too much on their lifestyle.

Saturday: Sign on.

               Pre 78, Evo, Pre 85, Pre 90 .....Practice ....followed by

               Pre 78, Evo, Pre 85, Pre 90......RACING

               Pre 78...10/12 mins   Evo, Pre 85, Pre 90.....15 mins

               One moto each class

Rationale : Being only practice and 12 motos in total it would leave sufficient time, if needed, to finalize Friday's  class races in the morning.

Sunday:   Pre 78, Evo, Pre 85, Pre 90....... RACING

               One moto each class

               Race duration the same as Saturday....followed by Presentation

Rationale: With only two motos riders will still get more track time than is currently available with the Eras being split.

With only 12 motos Saturday and Sunday it will leave sufficient time to take up the slack from Friday if needed and to cover any unforseeables.

Maybe I've got the maths wrong for Friday so if one of my more learned colleagues can work it out feel free and I'll amend the program.

Having both Eras combined will, I am sure, be a resounding success for any and every club that hosts it.

Were do all the other classes fit in. Pre 70 , 65 , 60 and 4strokes.
Before the split the older classes almost disappered and since there has been a resurgence.
Leave things as they are.

[Viper79]

Track layout could be an issue with the extremities from pre 60 to pre 90