Author Topic: Ring locating pin.  (Read 7507 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline evo550

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Ring locating pin.
« on: September 06, 2013, 08:59:11 pm »
O.K. so after a W.W. search I've located a piston kit that I've needed, it arrived today....minus a ring >:( >:(. The piston shares the same size bore as a common as muck Japanese piston, whose ring I could use, but the ring locating pin is positioned differently between the two (mine has the pin offset up from the center of the ring slot on the other piston it uses a locater that is centered in the ring slot).
Question is, is it possible to modify the ring end to suit different types of locating pins?

Offline Lozza

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4206
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2013, 09:05:04 pm »
Why not just get the right ring or move the peg? Modifying a ring wouldn't be something I would attempt.
Jesus only loves two strokes

Offline oldyzman

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2187
  • 250 two stroke!
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2013, 09:22:21 pm »
Lozza, I thought i was going to have to move a pin, but things worked out OK for now. Would you remove the old pin if so how? or just slit it flat with a 0.5 mini thin cutting blade?
Brett
I have a soft spot japanese mxers with aluminium tanks. Two stroke classic Dirt Track...

Offline SON

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 1174
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2013, 09:32:13 pm »
O.K. so after a W.W. search I've located a piston kit that I've needed, it arrived today....minus a ring >:( >:(. The piston shares the same size bore as a common as muck Japanese piston, whose ring I could use, but the ring locating pin is positioned differently between the two (mine has the pin offset up from the center of the ring slot on the other piston it uses a locater that is centered in the ring slot).
Question is, is it possible to modify the ring end to suit different types of locating pins?
Yes points file will do the job

Offline oldyzman

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2187
  • 250 two stroke!
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2013, 09:36:05 pm »
Then take the piston off to the local dentist to get it drilled for the new pin> LOL
I have a soft spot japanese mxers with aluminium tanks. Two stroke classic Dirt Track...

Offline evo550

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2013, 10:18:48 pm »
Why not just get the right ring or move the peg? Modifying a ring wouldn't be something I would attempt.

It's from a lem 65 and has taken me about 3 months just locating this much from Canada, it shares all dimensions with a kx 65 except for gudgeon size  :( So my thoughts were to use LEM piston with kx ring, but they have different ring ends. I hadn't considered the option of moving the pin to suit the ring.
MY theory is that I only have 1 piston...can't stuff it up, I have a unlimited supply of rings..can afford to stuff a few up to get it right.

Offline oldyzman

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2187
  • 250 two stroke!
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2013, 10:30:36 pm »
So the locating pin is in the right position but just the wrong shape?
I have a soft spot japanese mxers with aluminium tanks. Two stroke classic Dirt Track...

Offline evo550

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2013, 11:39:52 pm »
So the locating pin is in the right position but just the wrong shape?
Yeah the piston is right for the bike (LEM 65), but the ring I can use (KX 65) has a different end that closes around the locating pin.
On the LEM the locating pin sits offset high in the ring groove, so as you look at the ring end it has a semi circle cut out of the top.
The KX has the locating pin centered in the ring groove and the ring groove has the semi circle cut out of the back of the ring.
Make sense?

Offline Lozza

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4206
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2013, 11:41:02 am »
Why not swap the rod to use the KX 65 piston?
Jesus only loves two strokes

Offline evo550

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2013, 01:41:32 pm »
Why not swap the rod to use the KX 65 piston?

That's the next step, although I don't know the difference in rod/big end dimensions between the two. Knowing my luck they will be nothing alike. I would probably consider a ktm 65 engine swap before going down the path of crank/rod/pin mods.
I don't particularly want to sell the problem on to someone else, it's quite a sexy piece of Italian engineering...

Offline SON

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 1174
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2013, 03:38:01 pm »
Somewhere OEM Rings will be available

Offline Lozza

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4206
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2013, 03:55:50 pm »
Why not swap the rod to use the KX 65 piston?

That's the next step, although I don't know the difference in rod/big end dimensions between the two. Knowing my luck they will be nothing alike. I would probably consider a ktm 65 engine swap before going down the path of crank/rod/pin mods.
I don't particularly want to sell the problem on to someone else, it's quite a sexy piece of Italian engineering...

There is no 'problem' swapping the rod  There are a few 44.5mm pistons out there.
Jesus only loves two strokes

Offline firko

  • Superstar
  • ******
  • Posts: 6578
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2013, 06:54:43 pm »
Quote
There is no 'problem' swapping the rod  There are a few 44.5mm pistons out there. 
Maybe not for you Lozza, but to most of us it's a major undertaking. Not everyone has the expertise or equipment to do crank rebuilds in their suburban shed. ::)
 
Quote
Somewhere OEM Rings will be available
Simple. Why complicate a simple undertaking....or am I missing something here?
'68 Yamaha DT1 enduro, '69 Yamaha 'DT1 from Hell' '69 DT1'Dunger from Hell, '69 Cheney Yamaha 360, 70 Maico 350 (2 off), '68 Hindall Ducati 250, Hindall RT2MX, Hindall YZ250a , Cycle Factory RT2MX flat tracker, Yamaha 1T250J, Maico 250 trials, '71, Boyd and Stellings TM400, Shell OW72,750 Yamaha

Offline OverTheHill

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 801
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2013, 09:06:12 pm »
Lozza might shoot me for this theory but--all good fun--i think!!. Ok, not sure if i fully understood but think rings don't fit around/under/over the peg. Now going back a lifetime to my RM125S 1985, i got a set of rings [genuine] & sat them in the bore to check gap & thought fk, has about 20+thou gap then looking at the piston [genuine] the ring peg sat flush with the ring land & covered all the groove. New rings had heaps of tension & this is how it was meant to be & was gaped to the peg [for clearance/expansion etc. So, it appeared that ring gap wasn't the important thing but wear on the ring where she slides past the ports is what kills the sharp edge of 2 stroke power. Digressing slightly, new rings in my "86 KX125 days always sharpened it up even though the rings taken out looked ok for gap, but slide them down a bit & hold up to the light & could see past the rings in line with the ports [or exhaust in particular by memory]. Sorry about the long story but thinking just gap the rings square on to the peg with a bit of end clearance & go for it. [if your stuck for the proper parts that is]. Cheers.

Offline evo550

  • Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2435
    • View Profile
Re: Ring locating pin.
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2013, 09:09:34 pm »
Why not swap the rod to use the KX 65 piston?

That's the next step, although I don't know the difference in rod/big end dimensions between the two. Knowing my luck they will be nothing alike. I would probably consider a ktm 65 engine swap before going down the path of crank/rod/pin mods.
I don't particularly want to sell the problem on to someone else, it's quite a sexy piece of Italian engineering...

There is no 'problem' swapping the rod  There are a few 44.5mm pistons out there.
Do you have access to dimensions to both the kx and the lem rods for comparison ?

Somewhere OEM Rings will be available

Not unless you know something that I don't, although your prob right, it's finding them that's the issue.
« Last Edit: September 07, 2013, 09:12:08 pm by evo550 »