Author Topic: The demise of manufacturing in Australia  (Read 55505 times)

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Offline EML

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #165 on: October 28, 2011, 09:01:59 am »
History has shown that it takes about 250 yrs for a society/country/culture to do the full circle from beginning in poverty or oppresion through to wealth or ease and back to anarchy again.
Check out where we all are in that time line. :)

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #166 on: October 28, 2011, 11:11:37 am »
Its all good again  now . Angy  and Nick  just saved us last night from the big collapse , with the stroke of a pen  ::).  The solution was so easy , why didnt I think of that  ??? . I am off to see my bank manager today  and get him to double my credit card limit , then all my problems will be solved too  . How good is that  8)
It's 'all good', the pollies (and the market ::)) say so ::).

"The 50% debt write-off by banks means that Greece's debt burden could drop from 160% of GDP to 120% by 2020. :o"


(Which of course assumes Greek GNP goes up or stays the same :-[.)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-15487269

I betcha the shareholders of the Banks thought it was great deal and a great victory taking a 50% haircut on a multibillion $$$$ debt :P -  'be comfortable, just lie back and think of betterment of the EU while I screw you' ::) .




Offline Marc.com

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #167 on: October 28, 2011, 12:38:34 pm »
I betcha the shareholders of the Banks thought it was great deal and a great victory taking a 50% haircut on a multibillion $$$$ debt :P -  'be comfortable, just lie back and think of betterment of the EU while I screw you' ::) .

Except the Brits who cheerfully came very close to a vote on continued EU membership. Referendum was averted in last ditch save, of course the option is always available like the 'anti smacking bill' in NZ.... where you have a vote more than 90% of the voters reject the bill but the Government decides to ignore them anyway.

A bit like what Angela is doing with 80%  of voters in Germany saying nein to further propping up of the Greek lifestyle but their elected officials are ignoring it for the good of ..... hmmm who does beneift from this endless bail out of the incompetents within the EU.
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Offline VMX247

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #168 on: October 28, 2011, 12:43:11 pm »
meanwhile back in the bush
Raising the steaks
BRAD COOPER
28 Oct, 2011 04:00 AM
THEY'VE made mincemeat of the opposition in the past -and now the boys from Brisbane's Rode Meats have raised the steaks even further.
For the best part of a decade, the team from the Stafford Heights butcher shop in Brisbane's northern suburbs have walked away with silverware from the annual Australian Meat Industry Council (AMIC) awards.
Since the awards' inception nine years ago, they've won a phenomenal seven times, for best customer sevice, retail excellence and shop of the year.
This year, AMIC organisers upped the ante and combined all three awards into one, effectively challenging contenders to excel across a wider range of criteria.
Rode Meats owner, Brad Cammack, said this year's crown of 'shop of the year' was by far their best accolade.
"No doubt this was the biggest award for us to win," Mr Cammack said. "We proudly display all of our past awards in the shop but this one will definitely be going front and centre."
Mr Cammack said his team of 12 butchers took customer service and pride in their cuts seriously.
"Success in business always comes down to the quality of your product and your staff and the boys at Rode Meats serve customers because they want to, not because they have to.
"Customers enjoy the experience of buying from us," he said.
Mr Cammack, who started in the trade as a 15-year-old apprentice, still likes to operate his shop along traditional lines. While customers keep traffic brisk at the front, along the length of the shop's 13-metre, horseshoe shaped display cabinet, butchers will be working out the back, breaking down at least 12 beef carcases, 25 pig carcases and 100 lamb carcases every week.
"We're probably quite different to a lot of other butcher shops around town, but that's what sets us apart," Mr Cammack said.

ps lambs are at a high $187 live weight and ewe's sold yesterday at Jamestown for $246 some are definatly riding on the sheeps back   ;D
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Offline vmx42

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #169 on: October 28, 2011, 12:51:07 pm »
Sorry to continue to hijack Stans thread, but his SMH article from this morning kind of carries on from my previous rant that implied [OK it said] that we are being fed a line of BS by those who wish to control our votes from the pollies, the shock jocks, the spin doctors, the [mainly Murdoch] print media, Today Tonight and ACA etc, etc.

Angry citizens are much easier to control than those that are calm and considered. And doesn't the gov, shock jocks et al, love to solve our problems for us.

Wouldn't it be good if Aussies looked at the real issues and made up their own minds instead of being led by these knobs.

Love to hear your comments...


They're spending money, Jim, but not as we know it
October 28, 2011

Without budgeting for it, Australians have been busily finding new ways to spend money and then complaining that the cost of living is getting away from them. How about blowing more than half a billion dollars a year on bottled water? A personal trainer, anyone? A barista on every corner and a corner for every barista. You don't have the iPad yet? I mean the latest iPad, of course.

Then there's international travel – previously a lifetime's aspiration, now an annual necessity, as unexceptional as the seaside camping ground of an earlier time. Heavens, not just travel but a whole "gap" year is normal. And we want to tell everyone about it all the time so we're buying more than one million mobile phones a month, most of them smart phones with which many of us will get into trouble managing data and call plans and end up paying a couple of grand a year to a telco.

Tell me about your runners, or joggers, or Xtrainers, or all three. Where Volley OCs were the all-encompassing top-of-the-line sandshoe, we now have chains of specialist stores devoted to annually refreshed lines of genetically engineered thong variants with hundred-dollar-plus price tags. Or two-hundred-dollar-plus. Even running "bare foot" has become expensive. And don't forget to buy and wear Skins when exercising and down a sports supplement drink upon returning.

When we're done paying someone to encourage us to sweat, nearly a third of us sit watching Foxtel or Austar at home at an average cost of $100 or more a month - $1200 after-tax dollars a year to watch the rugby. Just as well we have the time to enjoy it since we started paying someone else to mow the lawn.

Cripes, we don't even do inexpensive bars of soap much anymore to wash the sweat off – it's plungers of liquid soap with extra kryptonite-reduction enzymes. It's no better than the old Sunlight or Cashmere Bouquet, might even be worse, and it certainly costs more both to buy and environmentally thanks to the packaging and requiring more water.

At least we're slowly getting smarter about smoking, but the genuinely stupid are still spending $10 billion a year on cancer sticks. Yes, genuinely stupid – there's a strong correlation between smoking and lower IQ, lower educational attainment, lower income and a generally more miserable life, never mind that it's a shorter one. No, kiddies, smoking doesn't look cool, it's an indication that you're more likely to be an all-round loser.

Ditto gamblers. The astounding $180 billion or so we're on track to flutter this financial year – mainly on pokies - maintains Australians' title as the World's Biggest Mugs. By way of comparison, the Federal Government's individual and company income tax take in 2010-11 was only $8 billion more. That an allegedly significant number of people could be suckered into campaigning to ensure the title is in no way threatened probably merits an insanity award in its own right.
And then tabloid and not-so-tabloid media and politicians, both government and opposition, reinforce our prejudices by telling us again that the cost of living is through the roof, that we're doing it tough and no doubt need help from the government. In the meantime, we desperately need lower interest rates so we can afford to go shopping again to save a retail sector that's been placed on the endangered species list. Oh, that's right – the consumer is supposed to be on strike.

Reality perceptions
No, it all doesn't really add up. Our perception of reality is highly selective. We remember the sticker shock of our last electricity bill, but forget the average household's power bill is about the same as the average Foxtel contract. We're appalled by the cost of water and sewerage, but don't think how much cheaper (and more useful) it is than gym memberships. And we all forget our last pay rise or pension increase.

Which is one of the reasons we're fortunate to have the Australian Bureau of Statistics to occasionally give us an objective view of reality.
Some parts of retail and retail in some parts have been doing it hard, as empty shops attest. Department stores with reductions in profit do not. Families on the fringes or people who even briefly fall from the income wagon – illness, unemployment, family tragedy, divorce – quickly discover that poverty remains real enough in the lucky country. But for the vast majority of us, the cost of living and consumer strike headlines are myths.

The second bit first: As the Reserve Bank has been trying to remind us often enough, the consumer isn't on strike, he or she is just spending a little differently while returning to longer-term saving patterns. Deputy Governor Ric Battellino did it most recently on Tuesday: "After a 10–15 year period during which households increased their gearing and reduced their rate of saving, they have returned to a more conservative, and traditional, pattern of financial behaviour. Household credit growth has slowed to a rate in keeping with, or slightly below, the growth in household incomes;  the saving rate has increased to a level that is more normal based on history and household spending growth has slowed from a rate that substantially exceeded household income growth, to one that, over the past year, has been broadly in line with income growth. Within total consumer spending, there appears to have been a shift away from spending on goods in stores to spending on services, particularly services such as overseas travel, eating out and entertainment. As a result, retail sales have been particularly weak."

Incomes are growing nicely and thus so is consumption, just sensibly within the bounds of the income growth unlike in the years of unsustainable credit growth before the GFC. For a variety of reasons, the stuff in some shops isn't competing as well as it used to with our many other temptations. Maybe the retail lobby would be better served campaigning against pokies instead of internet shoppers.

Living costs As for the cost of living, the detail in Wednesday's consumer price index figures explained some of our perception problems. Those utility bills have shocked us with the sharpness of their increases. Electricity, water and sewerage and property rates and charges costs, all lumped together in the "housing" category, were the big movers in the September quarter CPI. Electricity costs jumped 7.8 per cent, water and sewerage 8.6, property rates and charges 5.2 per cent.
There are some seasonal factors in the CPI business though: utility rises tend to occur more in the quarter that starts the financial year; there was no education cost rise to speak of because that hits at the start of the school year; pharmaceutical costs fell because of the pharmaceutical benefits scheme subsidy picks up more people as the calendar year rolls on, only to jump again in the March quarter.
Whatever the season, everyone knows and complains about rising utility charges. Well, nearly everyone. Origin Energy CEO Grant King instead offers the idea that the percentage of household income we spend on energy has actually been fairly constant at two to three per cent for the past quarter century.

That is the other thing we forget – that household incomes have been rising faster than the inflation rate. Therefore, on average, it shouldn't be the electricity bill that breaks the budget, but all the other stuff we spend money on.

And while we're complaining about the rising cost of living, we tend to overlook all the things that haven't been rising, or not rising much. Over the past three years, the all groups CPI has risen by 7.7 per cent, an average of about 2.8 per cent. The categories with the biggest increases have been alcohol and tobacco up 19 per cent thanks to higher taxes, followed by education up 18 per cent and that housing group ahead 15 per cent.

But at the same time, clothing and footwear didn't increase, transport and recreation and culture costs fell and communications increased by just one per cent.

It's swings and roundabouts, or perhaps shoes and school fees, in the cost of living game. Smoke and pay private school fees for a pile of kids who like airconditioning and leaving the TVs and computers on and you'll go backwards. Ditch the coffin nails, send the kids to state schools or, better yet, don't have kids and stay at home letting your parents pay for the power bills and you'll have no trouble living the good life. There are plenty of cost of living choices we make for ourselves.

But maybe even yuppies sometimes do it tough. I was saddened recently to see an up-market deli with a sign outside saying "TREAT YOURSELF" over that week's special - bottles of Fiji Water*. Luxury ain't what it used to be.



*and just as an aside, I still love Dr Karls breakdown of bottled water as being 1/3 petrol, 2/3 water. The concept being that each 1 litre bottle of water takes 1/3 of a litre of petrol to bring to the consumer. Out side of times of disease and disaster surely we should lobby the government to ban all bottled water for the good of the planet. Kitchen taps for all I say!!
« Last Edit: October 28, 2011, 12:54:12 pm by vmx42 »
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mx250

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #170 on: October 28, 2011, 01:08:14 pm »
I betcha the shareholders of the Banks thought it was great deal and a great victory taking a 50% haircut on a multibillion $$$$ debt :P -  'be comfortable, just lie back and think of betterment of the EU while I screw you' ::) .

Except the Brits who cheerfully came very close to a vote on continued EU membership. Referendum was averted in last ditch save, of course the option is always available like the 'anti smacking bill' in NZ.... where you have a vote more than 90% of the voters reject the bill but the Government decides to ignore them anyway.

A bit like what Angela is doing with 80%  of voters in Germany saying nein to further propping up of the Greek lifestyle but their elected officials are ignoring it for the good of ..... hmmm who does beneift from this endless bail out of the incompetents within the EU.
I won't pretend I fully understand the economics of it all but I'm pretty sure its a case of 'damned if you do and damned if you don't'.

The problem is we have already spent our future. But the real prob is they didn't spend wisely (on infrastructure and wealth creation). It's not just Greece and its not just Europe. The whole western world has done it to varying degrees. About the only exception has been the Australian Federal Liberal Govt (all other Oz govt's state and local are 'in hock to their eyebrows', and now suffering economic pain).

But Europe and the world have to go through a lot of economic pain. It is just how much and how to do it without going into an economic tailspin. That's where A&N (Germany and France) are now. Trying to give positive 'signals'. How and why The Market has apparently accepted I don't know. They have told the banks to take a multibillion euro haircut and 'you'll have to recapitalise to the tune of 100billion euro in the next 12 months (or we'll have to do it for you ::)) and blithely admitting they'll need more than a trillion euro to deal with the problem while arguing about  a 100billion euro ???.

mx250

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #171 on: October 28, 2011, 01:59:57 pm »






  About the only exception has been the Australian Federal Liberal Govt (all other Oz govt's state and local are 'in hock to their eyebrows', and now suffering economic pain).


Yes Australia is much better off , but only thanks to the crown jewels being sold off cheap ( mining ) Without that things would totally different .
It's worth nothing in the ground.......... ;)

It's what you do with the wealth that is important. Our last minerals wealth boom (a.k.a. The Gold Rush) put the great into Great Britain (then they 'blew it' winning two world wars ::) and making the world safe for the Yanks and the ungrateful effing French ;) :P). Let's this time help them get started and then tax them more and more as they make Super Profit - a la Kevin Rudd ;) ;D.


Offline Nathan S

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #172 on: October 28, 2011, 02:03:35 pm »
They're spending money, Jim, but not as we know it
October 28, 2011

....

Clearly a whinger who wants to stifle discussion!
Gittins?

Edit: Google reveals that its Michael Pascoe. Clearly a political maestro...
« Last Edit: October 28, 2011, 02:06:18 pm by Nathan S »
The good thing about telling the truth is that you don't have to remember what you said.

Offline vmx42

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #173 on: October 28, 2011, 02:10:41 pm »
They're spending money, Jim, but not as we know it
October 28, 2011

....

Clearly a whinger who wants to stifle discussion!
Gittins?

Edit: Google reveals that its Michael Pascoe. Clearly a political maestro...

See Nathan does have as sense of humour [to those who doubted it].  :D
When a woman says "What?", it's not because she didn't hear you, she's giving you the chance to chance to change what you said.

Beam me up Scotty, no intelligent life down here…

"everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not to their own facts"

Offline Marc.com

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #174 on: October 28, 2011, 03:51:34 pm »
and blithely admitting they'll need more than a trillion euro to deal with the problem while arguing about  a 100billion euro ???.

Its to cover the fact that the banks then used Greeces borrowings like an assett to leverage more capital so they could loan it out to other people who really needed it but couldn't pay it back (Aussie States ?) knowing full well that they would get their commissions for making the loans and would be covered by just passing the loss to their original investors if it all went ass up.

Don't assume that UBS or Deutcherbank taking a 50% hit may not effect your retirement fund or your next rate bill in Aussie. Depending on how much your local council and super fund has been playing in the bond market/ 

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Offline motomaniac

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #175 on: October 28, 2011, 11:22:17 pm »
Its all good again  now . Angy  and Nick  just saved us last night from the big collapse , with the stroke of a pen  ::).  The solution was so easy , why didnt I think of that  ??? . I am off to see my bank manager today  and get him to double my credit card limit , then all my problems will be solved too  . How good is that  8)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-15487269

I betcha the shareholders of the Banks thought it was great deal and a great victory taking a 50% haircut on a multibillion $$$$ debt :P -  'be comfortable, just lie back and think of betterment of the EU while I screw you' ::) .

The write off is a fudging of the books , the debt is still there bigger than ever.Without the EU the banks wouldn't have the volume of tax payers to pay for the debt. The banks (IMF) loose nothing ,they just increased their holdings.If they really wanted to get the greeks to stop spending they wouldn't have made them buy submarines and other war machinery from the French and Germans as part of the first bailout deal.

Offline EML

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #176 on: October 29, 2011, 10:30:48 am »
I spoke with a customer of mine last night re this and he is closely aligned to mining/hydrology at the moment travelling about Qld doing govt checks etc...
He mentioned that the 'fly-in fly-out' policy that the new mine owners are wanting is not for us , but rather to fly their own workers in from OS.
The two most vocal right now are an Indian company and a Chinese company  that have in fact completely purchased the mines in question. We will only get some royalties from the coal. They want to set up international airports on site and the hick-up is that in effect we will be giving them a complete piece of OZ to have as their own-their own customs enclave to be precise. No Aussies will be allowed on these sites, esentially they will be foreign soil-in our own backyard. The thin edge of the wedge!!
This is how this Govt. has worked out how to be back in surplus by 2013-they are selling the farm to pay their debts. FFS.

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #177 on: October 29, 2011, 10:50:35 am »
Obviously its none of my Buisness im not an Aussie and i dont live in Australia , but it EMLs information  is correct you guys have to act now to stop this  >:( Its happening here asians are buying up the dairy farms and the succsesion of limp dick governments we have support it. Along with there immigration policies bring a million dollars with you and you are welcome , you dont even have to have a minimal grasp of the English langauge  ::) once they have arrived with there million dollars next step import the family who bring nothing but some prohibited Voodoo medcines and 20000,0000 cigarettes with them  >:( of course they dont speak a word of English  ::)but thats ok so the mug at customs says in his most official voice "you naughty little slope  :-* next time we will issue you with a $200.00 fine " ::) In my experience Asians do generally have a good work ethic , but make no attempt to assimilate when they arrive .

Offline Marc.com

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #178 on: October 29, 2011, 12:28:28 pm »
He mentioned that the 'fly-in fly-out' policy that the new mine owners are wanting is not for us , but rather to fly their own workers in from OS.
The two most vocal right now are an Indian company and a Chinese company  that have in fact completely purchased the mines in question. We will only get some royalties from the coal.

Horrifying, you know you cannot even buy a postage stamp size piece of dirt in China as a foreigner. It will be a bit like on some mines with the Boriginals where they will guarantee the Aussies a few jobs and that makes it all OK.

I thought you had a Labour Government who was taking care of us Aussie workers. Man I always thought there was a case for strong labour unions, the BLF, WWF etc might have been a bunch of ratbags but you need that balance otherwise the Government does what it likes. Man like sooner or late people will rise up, try running a mine once the Transport Union shut your fuel off.
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Offline EML

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Re: The demise of manufacturing in Australia
« Reply #179 on: October 29, 2011, 12:41:57 pm »
'try running a mine once the transport union shut your fuel off'

No such problem mate, they will be flying everything they need in and out-we wont have a say in it.

I have no idea what labour did to the union side of things but they are forsaken in this deal. they are either complicit or under some other threat as they don't seem to have any teeth.

At Qantas meeting yesterday they voted to not support the workers then gave the CEO an extra 2mil FFS.