CCM/B50 How Good are they

[EML]

Keen to know what sort of power could be expected from a very good B50 or big CCM ?
Is 60 reliable hp out of the question? and what do they weigh??
I see from the original spec sheet that 38hp was factory back then but plenty has been done over the years and there seems to be plenty of "stuff"available.
How do they compare to a JAP of the same size?

[SON]

You might get someone to claim 60 ponies but not 60 real horsepower
If you want a B50 based engine to rev and be reliable hunt down Stan Millard from the Flattrack.com page as Horsepower by Stan
I think Stan is from Illinois

[Michael Moore]

MSQ tested all the open MXers on C.R. Axtell's dyno back in the day.  32.9 rear wheel HP was the verdict for the B50MX.



A reliable 40 RWHP is going to take some special parts.  I have some unit singles and I like them, but the more stock parts that are eliminated the better they seem to be.

I think the lightest works B50 was getting close to 210 lbf.  One magazine said the TR5MX (with the bulky exhaust) was 294 with 2.3 gallons of fuel on board, so subtract about 14 pounds for that to get a dry weight around 280.

cheers,
Michael

[EML]

Thanks guys. I would have thought 30 something was too light on even back then.
Also I was thinking of the weight of the engine alone.
I recall Russell Bergmeier racing a 500CCM in a Wasp when the junior class dropped from 650cc down to 500cc to encourage new teams back in the 80s...not sure he would have settled on even 40HP.
And again, what about the JAP 500 single...what sort of neddies there? bearing in mind that one would need to add a primary drive and gearbox (AMC?)

[Michael Moore]

The B50 engine is about the same weight as a TT500 or Rotax single - 90-95 lbf.

cheers,
Michael

[yamaico]

And again, what about the JAP 500 single...what sort of neddies there? bearing in mind that one would need to add a primary drive and gearbox (AMC?)

A 4B JAP had about 50hp on methanol. Fairly high state of tune requiring regular maintenance and inspection.

[FourstrokeForever]

It is possible to get some decent mumbo out of a B50 without breaking it all the time. Carillo rod, 88mm piston, big mikuni and a decent clutch set up. It all costs plenty of coins though. The gearbox is the weakest link but a 3 speed gearset is said to be much stronger. I don't know if I'd use one in an outfit though.....It might just be too much weight for the pommy lump to handle the extra strain....

[Rosco86]

Have Bergy's CCM motor on the bench at home about to go into a project. Except for rod and piston and a slight port job it was fairly stock. Also have his ccm motor where they cut the gearbox off. Basically gearboxes shattering was a problem in the sidecar. 4 studs fitted to the crank cases and bolt on an A10 gearbox , also bound for a different type of project. Also have Ron's JAP motor that was run in the 'Arab' short circuit sidecar. She's a biggun at around 600cc and now proudly sits in a hagon frame. Still kicking myself that I gave away Ron's road racer sidecar. Was one of the first Lindsay Urquart's centre hub steerers. Used to house a 750 honda 4. Ron broke his back on it at the Avalon meet when they brought out Sheene and co to race. Gave it to the owners of the Beaudesert motorcycle shop they split and sold the shop and haven't heard a thing about the bike since. Some interesting stuff on it like the passenger floor serving as the fuel tank using an electric pump to supply the carbies. Hope it's circulating somewhere.

[EML]

Thanks Rosco. There must be a connection in Beaudesert with sidecars as the late world sidecarcross champ Ton van Heugten visited there when he came down under.
I thought 60HP is where it needed to be but sounds like it'll cost a bomb.
Just looking for a lighter option for the old chassis than the Norton it came with.

[Slakewell]

I know nothing of sidecars or there engine needs but why not a Maico 501 engine? You would get close to 60 HP on meth.

[EML]

I know nothing of sidecars or there engine needs but why not a Maico 501 engine? You would get close to 60 HP on meth.

You got one lying around Mr Slakewell?
A couple of guys are going to try SC500s which will be fun.