Cappra kickstart/clutch

[montynut]

My VF250 and 250H7 need the kick it quick and fast and it fires about 4th kick from cold 1st or 2nd kick warm.

The VB360 I use the method described by Cappra and Ross. Prime the crankcase with several slow (very slow) kicks then bring to compression ease over compression return kick start for a full stroke and kick it as if the entire future of the human race depended on it. When the motoplat was slowly dying I was resorting to pushing which involves a large hill and several grids full of pushers otherwise the rear wheel locks solid.

When I had my VB360 back in '77 I don't remember this problem. Either I was much stronger and fitter then (a dead set certainty) or my memory has failed (almost equally certain)

[414VG]

Blow me ,the bloody flywheel key has sheared. I had to use a bodged one from memory and its not been right.........You got any just now Jared??
Cheers Sandy.

[montman]

Ah yes the infamous woodruff key spent many a happy hour doing them mostly on other peoples monts as i used to have ones made out of stronger steel but i have none left(just looked otherwise you could have had one sandy)so i now need some as well . 

[cappra]

Sandy,
I have new keys.  Shoot me an e-mail.  I would suggest lapping the flywheel to the shaft
with valve grinding compound. (course and fine)  makes a world of difference as it increases
the contact area.  I also heat the flywheel a bit and then mount and torque.  I also have new
left handed lockwashers as well.

                                                                   Jared

[Captain Bilko]

Motoplate are average when new , when there 30 years old there shit.

I've had no trouble with them. What makes them shit? 

I dont think having stronger woodruff keys are the answer. The keys job is not to hold the fly-wheel in place. It is simply to align the fly-wheel for the timing. It's the taper of the crank/flywheel/ nut torque that holds it in place.
Harder woodruff keys will only damage the keyway (on the crank) more when it slips which is a major head ache.

Be carefull that you dont go crazy when lapping the fly-wheel/crank. You can go too far and have the fly-wheel pull in to the point where it's hitting the screws that hold the staor plate......

[montman]

Motoplate are average when new , when there 30 years old there shit.

I've had no trouble with them. What makes them shit? 

I dont think having stronger woodruff keys are the answer. The keys job is not to hold the fly-wheel in place. It is simply to align the fly-wheel for the timing. It's the taper of the crank/flywheel/ nut torque that holds it in place.
Harder woodruff keys will only damage the keyway (on the crank) more when it slips which is a major head ache.

Be carefull that you dont go crazy when lapping the fly-wheel/crank. You can go too far and have the fly-wheel pull in to the point where it's hitting the screws that hold the staor plate......

Your quite right Ross but i can only go from experience as every montesa i had new from the factory sheared its key(and i was not the only one to experience this) after a few meetings maybe i was just unlucky but with the stronger key i never had and still haven't had any further problems with them in fact i bought a 414 about 8 years ago off a guy who could not stop it from shearing keys i cleaned up flywheel/crank tapers and put one of the stronger keys in and have not had any problems since.The most important part IS the flywheel/taper fit as you say.

Motoplats as a whole have always been very good never had any problems with mine even after years of no use,i do need a motoplat but that is because i am missing one off a spare engine.

[Captain Bilko]

One of my 414's was forever shearing keyways. I'd done all the things like re-lapping it and such but nothing would keep the fly-wheel from moving. With only a tenth of my tether left  I discovered.....

.....that there was no more thread left on the crank to get any more purchase on the fly-wheel. It just couldn't tighten up any more. I ended up using a special washer that sat neatly inside the fly-wheel but had an internal size that would let it go over the crank shaft. Since putting this washer in (or I could have had a little more thread added to the crank but this would truelly be a pain) I've never had the fly-wheel move.

The keyway will never stop one from moving.....

[SPANISH ARMADA]

your right ross for those that dont know the key size is 3x13mm available in geejay packs from any good bolt store and can be heat treated hardened if u think it helps with an oxy and a bit of time.

[Slakewell]

Motoplate are average when new , when there 30 years old there shit.

I've had no trouble with them. What makes them shit? 

If you had no trouble yet your lucky

[414VG]

New key, loctited flywheel to shaft, timing spot on and i simply cant get this bitch to start.  Dont know what else to try.......forkin beat with it.
Sandy

[Captain Bilko]

If you had no trouble yet your lucky

That's the sort of explanation I thought I'd get......



Might be time to try an electrical system from one of your 414's that are goers Sandy (you have about ten of them dont you? ).

[414VG]

    Finally got her going today..!!!!  Cant quite figure it excactly but may have been too much fuel lying in the cranckcase, and also earthed the stator to frame as per montmans advice, anyway its crisp as buggery and feels spot on.  Thanks to all who contributed.  Off to get pissed now.

Sandy.