OzVMX Forum

Marque Remarks => Honda => Topic started by: MX? on August 09, 2008, 08:33:19 pm

Title: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 09, 2008, 08:33:19 pm
All righty then...I've found me beast to be. :o
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/Odds%20and%20Ends/LeftSide.jpg)

Now for some questions if I may:
Sounds like there must be a few people out there running these?
So can anyone help out with a list of things to spend money on...errr I mean that need doing. :D
I'm expecting to try and keep it more or less original in that I don't want to graft on the latest and greatest modern gear.
Any recomendations for new rear shocks? A 350 swingarm was already suggested - does this make a noticeable difference? and the front forks...any mods can be done here.

Hope to get the thing fired up tomorrow and see how it sounds. If she turns out to need major surgery is it worth getting flywheel lightened etc. while it's in bits? I'm hoping to get away with piston/head needing freshening up, maybe just the biggest OS OEM rings with cam/head work...any thoughts.

Thanks in advance


Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Nathan S on August 10, 2008, 11:40:13 pm
Shocks are easy: YSS. Bang for buck, nothing else goes close - and they give you several options regarding how many bucks you spend.

Looks like a pretty clean old girl - don't throw away the remaining road gear! Someone will want it for sure.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Quicksilver on August 11, 2008, 07:17:59 am
 Restore it.  ??? Rego it, ride it. :-\ Or whack in big bore kit, power pipe, carby mods and cain the hell out of it.  :D
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 11, 2008, 10:04:42 pm
Yeah, she's not not a bad thing. Been sitting in a shed for 10 years, but it's fired up and runs quite well. :o

So I may leave the engine alone for a while at least....just a pipe for the moment maybe.
Can you buy a pipe for these over here? though I guess it would be simple enough to have one bent up to suit. I've had an email from YSS so I'll give 'em a call re: shocks and fork springs.
I want to keep it looking like an XL so need to find a seat (Repro one at £350  :o) on the net, and a tank....anyone have/know of one?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: LWC82PE on August 11, 2008, 10:09:24 pm
you can get seat covers from NZ here
http://www.ecologicalinvestments.com/trade/
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 11, 2008, 10:28:52 pm
They look the duck's guts....but the seat pan on mine is knacked so I'm thinking I'll need a complete seat.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: fatboyracing on August 13, 2008, 08:36:27 pm
Hi Mx,
I have a XL 350 and the best money I ever spent was $220.00 on gold valves for the forks now it has rebound and you can control the tank slap (just) .
A 420 kit allso was well worth the money for the extra power that helps keep up with the two strokers off the line.
My seat was well broken and i removed the foam and cut out the rust and migged it back up at least you then no what you have.
Gorby down here in Tassie is the man for XLs he has my motor at the moment and when i get it back it will be better than before, it will now be on the first oversize on the 420 kit as at the Classic nationals the poor old girl got a serious flogging and a long with a good dusting caused some serious damage to the bore.
He also has a fast xl 350 with a 405 kit in it ,gorby and myself have had many close races in the pre 75 class and I think results would be close to even.
Go for it turn your old 250 into a full blown racer you will enjoy it

Cheers
Fatboy
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 13, 2008, 09:37:45 pm
Fatboy Racing?? I've heard that name before...were you up at Santareena Park for the Modern event a couple of weeks ago? Would be good to catch up with some of you one day, I'm on the East Tamar. Be interested in some ideas on setting up etc.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: gorby on August 14, 2008, 07:00:47 pm
close to even :o
I would be ahead by one win if someone had not pulled a desperate at a  bridport grasstrack and cut me off ;D

you had better be nice to me fatboy or your motor will be resleeved and a XL 125 piston fitted :-*

We welcome you to the gentlemans class MX? and will help you out however we can,no seats or tanks available sorry.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: holeshot buddy on August 14, 2008, 08:57:24 pm
heres my big bore 250 8)
back on the track after a year
its a beast :o
inch and three quarter mander pipe
ported  hot cam  :o
hi comp big bore piston about 320cc
38mm mikuni :P
i have had this bike for 8 years
have won many races on her
i have a shed full of bikes all types
but this one always puts a smile on my face
when i race her ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 14, 2008, 09:24:53 pm
Quote
We welcome you to the gentlemans class MX?
Why, thank you sir!
Maybe catch up with you at Golconda?

Quote
heres my big bore 250
Oh noice  8)
So how reliable are these old beastie's when breathed on?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: holeshot buddy on August 15, 2008, 06:16:33 pm
mines been raced for 8 years 8)
and only just blew up
you have too remember with them
not to overrev thats the biggest killer ;D
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 17, 2008, 06:13:19 pm
Well I removed a bit of the excess weight today.  ;D
Now to get it all together.
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/BareFrame.jpg)


This is that swingarm I'm after (Or at least the 250 version) Guessing that the 350 item will be approx. 25mm longer.
114mm between the pivots (with sleeves still in) and approx. 466mm from centre of pivot shaft to rear of axle slot.
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/TopView2.jpg) (http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/UndersideView.jpg)

And seat underside
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Seat.jpg)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: gorby on August 17, 2008, 09:47:10 pm
here are a couple of handy websites,plenty of info here :)

http://www.xlintperformance.com/

http://www.oldrice.com/xl_page.htm
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Nathan S on August 22, 2008, 11:02:18 pm
The seat base looks pretty good.
Here's what can happen if you're desperate:
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f128/annaandnathan/Photo0148-2.jpg)
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f128/annaandnathan/Photo0149-1.jpg)

No its not sexy, but its more comfortable than sitting on frame rails...
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 23, 2008, 04:42:13 am
Geez, you WERE desperate!!  ;D
That's a work of art.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Nathan S on August 23, 2008, 03:41:06 pm
You must be a fan of Picasso!  :D
Not being able to oxy weld makes it harder - someone competent with an oxy could do a much better job.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 23, 2008, 07:11:16 pm
Yee Hah! Just got a seat from ePay and some  other goodies, so it's all on the way. Frame at Sandblasters, motor & rear hub having a Soda, back rim cleaned up (sort of)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Tim754 on August 24, 2008, 12:10:22 am
 I have found some swing arms .. Cheers Tim
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 24, 2008, 05:26:25 pm
"Some swingarms"......that sounds promising. :)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on September 05, 2008, 07:04:51 pm
Any luck with that swingarm Tim? Had a few leads so far...but they're all fizzling out.  :(
On the subject, does the XL350 swingarm mean different length shocks. I need to start sourcing suspension which means either staying with the original arm and getting shocks to suit or hanging out for the 350 job which may use different units??
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: jhovel on September 05, 2008, 10:52:28 pm
This is an interestinmg resto report so far! Keep it going, please. I love the seat pan - great work!

Now, I have asked before but got no replies: Does anyone have a 21" front wheel for an XL250S? I'd like to get that one going again and looking nice, but am not able to find a 23" front tyre - and hated that HUGE wheel in any case. Even a 21" rim of the same era would be good. I'm sure I can get a set of spokes from somewhere (e.g. in Thailand)...

Oh, while I'm at it: I also need a headlight nacelle and instruments - if anyone has bits lying around.... ;)

Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Quicksilver on September 06, 2008, 07:34:01 am
Quote from: jhovel on September 05, 2008, 10:52:28 pm
This is an interestinmg resto report so far! Keep it going, please. I love the seat pan - great work!

Now, I have asked before but got no replies: Does anyone have a 21" front wheel for an XL250S? I'd like to get that one going again and looking nice, but am not able to find a 23" front tyre - and hated that HUGE wheel in any case. Even a 21" rim of the same era would be good. I'm sure I can get a set of spokes from somewhere (e.g. in Thailand)...

Oh, while I'm at it: I also need a headlight nacelle and instruments - if anyone has bits lying around.... ;)



I have all that stuff Joe.

Check your email re NOS XR75 rims.  ;)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Colin Jay on September 06, 2008, 08:30:08 am
Joe,

If these bit are want you want and suitable their yours for the cost of postage.
(http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s120/coljay/XL250Sbits.jpg)

CJ
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Quicksilver on September 06, 2008, 10:08:51 am
Add CJ's set and mine you will have a complete unit.  ;D


(http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii279/Quicksilver_032/DSC00856.jpg)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Tim754 on September 06, 2008, 12:01:04 pm
I have one suitable swing arm only, don't know if its 250 or 350. But we used to race both and in all honesty we never noticed any different lengths in the stock swing arms, The frames had slight variations in rake etc.Both used same length shockers standard too. Pm me an address and I will COD post it to you. Tim
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: jhovel on September 06, 2008, 01:12:48 pm
I'm gratelul for the offers, CJ and Quicksilver - but since I only have photos on Google to look at for what the XL250S is supposed to look like, I can't be sure that these are the bits I need. Hovwever, they do not like the photos I've seen. Please advise.
I think both the gauges and the headlight mount are quite different:
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: cyclegod on September 06, 2008, 01:41:14 pm
1978 to 1980 had single instrument cluster (as shown below), 1981 had separate rev counter as pictured in previous posts however both will fit any year.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Quicksilver on September 06, 2008, 03:00:03 pm
CG is spot on Joe. Either will fit. Twin set up looks way better in my opinion.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: LWC82PE on September 06, 2008, 06:50:32 pm
350 swing arm is longer. its a popular mod to bolt one onto a 250. ive also been looking for a 350 swing arm for some time now.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: jhovel on September 06, 2008, 08:52:58 pm
Sorry for hijacking this thread - I should;ve started another one....
If you look at the photo I posted, you can see that there is no tacho drive - or facility for any to be fitted on my bike... so it needs to be the 'uglier' single instrument cluster to make it 'right'. The headlight ears on mine are also only suitable for an unshielded headlight - the horm is in the way of the shield mounting (and this model didn't have the shield.
Please keep looking though! Thanks!
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: wyatt_turk on September 17, 2008, 02:22:34 am
Hey,

Just like you guy's I was given a Xl250 1977 frame and motor with just the front wheel on Freecycle. I bought a rear wheel on SleezBay and that's about it would like to restore it but can not find much genuine parts in Australia (Swing arms etc). So what suggestions do you guy's have?...
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on January 14, 2009, 09:06:37 pm
Bit of an update on progress:
Hope to have things ready for this season  ::)
Given things a clean up, Race Tech emulators, YSS shocks still have to sort carbie and pipe.

(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/P1010016.jpg)

(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/P1010023.jpg)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Rossvickicampbell on January 14, 2009, 10:14:11 pm
lookin good.  Love the look as it nears completion!

cheers

Rossco
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: VMX247 on January 14, 2009, 10:41:27 pm
Here is something to inspire you... :o
XL versus CCM
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: jimson on January 14, 2009, 11:04:27 pm
MX looks real good are you using the original fuel tank or after market ? good choice with the shocks  8) jimson
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: firko on January 14, 2009, 11:14:01 pm
Peter Lawson CCM?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on January 15, 2009, 08:57:30 pm
XL v CCM....What a great shot! At this point I'll be happy with XL v Anything.  ;D
Yep, will use original tank...have this dumb idea of keeping it looking pretty much like an XL. ::) May even put it back on the road one day, which is why I haven't hacked all the old fittings off the frame etc.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on February 15, 2009, 07:04:54 pm
Another step in the right direction?
Tank finally finished.

(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Resprayedtank.jpg)

Only have to finish handlebars, pipe, front guard, number plates.......and approx. 1 zillion small things. ::)
Why did I ever start this????
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: VMX247 on February 19, 2009, 08:10:08 pm
Only have to finish handlebars, pipe, front guard, number plates.......and approx. 1 zillion small things. Roll Eyes
Why did I ever start this?Huh

Keep going  ;D
Tanks awesome,Ive always loved the real Honda two tone  :o
heres another to keep ya plodding along   8)   ;)   ;D 
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on February 19, 2009, 09:50:51 pm
Ahh more inspiration. ;D
So what's with that heavy gauge red ignition wiring? Looks interesting.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: VMX247 on February 19, 2009, 10:01:34 pm
Quote from: MX? on February 19, 2009, 09:50:51 pm
Ahh more inspiration. ;D
So what's with that heavy gauge red ignition wiring? Looks interesting.

tricked ya,they are the carbie over flow pipes.
bit of bling  ;D
S&A WA
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on February 22, 2009, 09:20:46 pm
Oops, I thought there were a lot of wires there. Wasn't expecting red tubes and I must have overlooked the red clutch plug. Are they painted or have you actually found red ones??

However, back to the ignition,(please tell me that red thing hanging at the sprocket is an ignition wire  :-[) What have you done with the other wires from the stator?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: VMX247 on February 22, 2009, 10:51:25 pm
I opened the picture up in large view and saw what you were on about.
That lead is the plug for the battery. I run a 7.2 volt NiCad battery - total loss. (6 volt ignition coil)
The battery sits in behind the side cover. Lead out means the batteries out.
The clutch cover plug - well the original got dislodged on the track some where. The replacement was a red hydraulic hose end cap that happened to fit just good. Would have been black if one was in the toolbox.
Still run points - but found an xl185 with CDI so am looking to fit the pickup into the points cover. If that's not going to fit I was thinking about trying a Boyer. I have a spare for the Norton sidecar.
Goes ok with points - but you have to try these things.
Steven
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on February 23, 2009, 10:55:02 am
Good stuff! If you don't mind the "20 questions" scenario, where does your exhaust run to? Can see it ducking down to the rear of the engine, but where to from there? Reason I ask is I'm trying to use an old 350 pipe on mine.
Plan at the moment is to bring it in under the carb across to the left side then up and out inside the rear shock, but it's going to be very tight. (maybe too tight probably  :()
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: holeshot buddy on February 23, 2009, 09:09:04 pm
hi here is a picture of my xl320
pipe is inch and three quarter
stainless manderal bent it exits
around left and does fit up behind shock
also has an inversion cone at port
and also goes very fast ;D ;D ;D ;)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: VMX247 on February 23, 2009, 09:33:50 pm
MX there is more pics on the  below link  8)
pipe ends just in front of the sidenumber plate & muffler to go on.
cheers S&A WA

http://ozvmx.com/community/index.php?topic=6503.0

Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: paulr on February 24, 2009, 09:17:48 am
Hi all, 1972 XL250 ready for WA vmx season, kicking off 15th March.
Cam plus Mikuni plus header.
Rgds
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: VMX247 on February 24, 2009, 09:50:48 am
Quote from: paulr on February 24, 2009, 09:17:48 am
Hi all, 1972 XL250 ready for WA vmx season, kicking off 15th March.
Cam plus Mikuni plus header.
Rgds


hooley dooley.... :o  Nice pre75er   8)
How are we going to keep up with the Jones now   ;)   :D 
see you there.
S&A WA
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on February 24, 2009, 12:34:28 pm
He won't be too hard to keep up with........No chain. ;D
Paulr, that looks seriously good! You have a shot of the other side?
Quetions, questions.  :)
Is the pipe a custom made job? What's the gear lever off? Looks to be a lot of travel in the back end.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: cyclegod on February 24, 2009, 01:11:53 pm
My mate Marc will be chasing him on his XL250 too....

(http://w4.bikepics.com/pics/2009%5C01%5C21%5Cbikepics-1545563-full.jpg)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: paulr on February 24, 2009, 03:43:46 pm
Header by Pete Lawson and homemade mega; sounds great but may not please the Conondale officials in August?
Gear lever after market for XL's (fine spline and either an F4, FG4 or FB4 - cannot remember).
Must admit have not tried the S&W's; ran Mulhollands last year suffering serious coil bound issues on jumps [arse to fat!]
Rgds
 
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: paulr on February 24, 2009, 03:45:31 pm
Before and after.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: paulr on February 24, 2009, 03:55:18 pm
Race 1 Wandering '08 - thanks to VMX247 (good on ya Alison)!
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on February 24, 2009, 05:20:44 pm
Back onto that XL of Paulr's,
I notice you've put the later model (or 350) right hand engine sidecase on it. I need to replace mine at some point due to the bottom edges being eaten away (whatever happened there?) I could have gotten that type of case but thought it may not have fitted. With the different angle on the tacho drive..does this still work with the gear inside, or have you taken that out?
Love your frame sidecovers BTW.  8)

Nice to see all the bikes, it's good for the imagination. :)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: paulr on February 24, 2009, 05:56:56 pm
MX?, a good observation!
I had an annoying problem of breaking kick-starter shafts (the original shaft splines were well mutilated followed by kickstarter itself causing additional problems).
Obtaining a replacement kick-starter shaft for the KO250 was near impossible whereas the shorter (by 10mm) later model ('74) shaft is readily available over the counter.  By shear luck the later casing fits the motor 100%, even down to the speedo drive (which I've removed).
The only mod I had to do was grind some of the rear brake pedal / bracket away so as to clear the kick-starter on the downward stoke.
Cheers

Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: gorby on February 24, 2009, 10:31:54 pm
hello paulr,
               speedo drive?if you mean tacho drive then I hope you fitted something to get the oil from the case to the galleries when you removed it. :-\

I found there was a difference somewhere in the two models,one had a restrictor jet inside the tacho drive shaft and one did not?

MX?  good to see the progress,I won't get to race you due to retirement but my bike should have a new owner soon and it will be back out there roosting ;D
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on February 24, 2009, 10:45:12 pm
Quote
MX?  good to see the progress,I won't get to race you due to retirement
Retiring? I didn't think you racers ever retired..... ;D
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: paulr on February 25, 2009, 08:49:08 am
Gorby, yeah, you are correct as speedo drive should have read tacho drive.  All I removed was the drive gear with shaft and internal oil passage still in place.  I could not find any differnece between the oil passages of the two casings and with a full season under the belt, it continues to run well.
All round, a great little bike!
Rgds
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: VMX247 on February 25, 2009, 10:23:22 am
Quote from: paulr on February 24, 2009, 03:55:18 pm
Race 1 Wandering '08 - thanks to VMX247 (good on ya Alison)!

Thanks, but not this Alison (VMX247),I'm a flaggie.  8)
Three Alison's in the VMXWA club.
Could cause some trouble couldn't I  ;)  ;D

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=180331348408

another excellent  XL   :o
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on March 15, 2009, 09:26:44 pm
Well it lives!

Almost anyway....fuel tap has decided to leak every where since being dismantled....oh, and the "new" left side engine case has been bent at the bottom of the generator cover (so I just found out) meaning that oil is dripping (running) out 'cos there is enough of a wonk in the case that the cover won't seal!!! Don't know whether I can file things flat or will need to replace the case again. :-\
Hopefully make the racing next weekend. ::)

(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Leftside3.jpg)

(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Rightside.jpg)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: mx250 on March 15, 2009, 09:43:34 pm
10 outa 10, nice work, looks the business.  Congrats.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: VMX247 on March 15, 2009, 09:53:58 pm
You'll be the star of the show--- oops grid/event.
You should be the proudest bloke in the country.
 
    :-*  :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :oCONGRATULATIONS  :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
where did you get the pipe???  8)
alison and steven
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: vandy010 on March 15, 2009, 10:17:21 pm
theres something about those 4banger honda's...
nice work...... 8)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on March 15, 2009, 10:48:56 pm
Thank ya, thank ya, thank ya.  :-[
Only wish it would look that good with me on it.  ;D
The pipe is an old XL350 header (Peter Allen?) I got from Shane aka "FatboyRacing" that was modded a bit then had a universal Supertrapp silencer whacked on the end.
Just have to solve the twin leaks now to find out how it sounds. ::)
Anyone know where I can get a fuel tap re-build kit...like tomorrow? Maybe Ballards?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: misfit on November 27, 2009, 03:34:28 pm
hey have you had the bike on a set of scales yet? interested to know what it weighs
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Tim754 on November 27, 2009, 04:48:45 pm
Very impressed!!!! ;) Cheers Tim754
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on August 26, 2010, 08:17:38 pm
Christmas has come early this year, mail man just turned up
Amazing what you can get for a truck load of money. :(
Project 305 begins ;D
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/Odds%20and%20Ends/Gofastbits.jpg)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Stan S on August 26, 2010, 10:42:44 pm
Quote from: MX? on August 26, 2010, 08:17:38 pm
Christmas has come early this year, mail man just turned up
Amazing what you can get for a truck load of money. :(
Project 305 begins

Hi MX, firstly well done on the beautiful job you have perfomed on the XL. I had a XL250KO in 1973 as my transport and absolutley loved it. I had fitted a 305 kit, pipe/muffler and 34mm Mikuni carb to it and couldn't beleive how it transformed into a real fun trail bike (wheelie machine). I had a new 250 Maico, CR250M and Hodaka Combat Wombat as my race bikes at the time and strange as it may seem I enjoyed riding the XL more than the race bikes. I have started collecting all the parts needed to put an XL KO motor into a Mk 7 Bultaco frame to come and have some fun in some form of classic racing whether it be VMX or Vinduro or both. Any way great job.

Regards Stan. 
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: jack82 on November 07, 2010, 11:12:09 am
Quote
Quote from: MX? on August 26, 2010, 08:17:38 pm
Christmas has come early this year, mail man just turned up
Amazing what you can get for a truck load of money. :(
Project 305 begins ;D



Nice...........am about to order some stuff from the states to get mine started.

Rode my (stock,tired) xl at Stony Creek recently......great fun but would really benefit from a few more HP.

Are your parts from Xlint ??.......stainless valves?....standard size?

Alloy top valve spring kit?

Interested to see how she goes once your done........keep us posted.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: firko on November 07, 2010, 12:32:08 pm
That's indeed a very sweet XL250. I love that you haven't tried to turn it into a surrogate C&J by fitting Elsinore bodywork and tank. Most old time vintage racers will remember Steve Greentree's beautiful XL250 (which yours looks almost identical to)that blitzed the 4 stroke class back in the 90's. I think he won the Nationals three times with a stock bore 250. He later built an equally nice XL350 but he didn't like it as much as the 250 so he fitted a 305 kit to the little bike and continued winning the 500 class. Cubic inches isn't necessarily the way with these engines.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: LWC82PE on November 07, 2010, 12:53:57 pm
(http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pbFB8BaGyOHe_IFG1vsDhvwpDuCNJjrP8NZ1SlzkCJMKDuFci-GkHoplARhtRT5aiQ7dPVWYoP40JVsktb_YNdQ/green.JPG?psid=1)
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Slakewell on November 07, 2010, 01:07:23 pm
My old XL project was 98 kilo's , Yamaha YZ back wheel is 8KG lighter and as long as you don't go over 320 cc it's fine.
CR 125 tank is almost a bolt on and 80's husky seat is almost a bolt on as well.
Oh and 77 XL fork internals give you a full 7 inches of travel instead of 5.5 and make it corner nicer. 
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: LWC82PE on November 07, 2010, 01:10:28 pm
Do the 77 250 fork internals fit the 72 250 forks? is that what you did or are you talking 350 stuff?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: firko on November 07, 2010, 02:32:41 pm
Thanks Leith, that's the XL350 Greeny built to replace the XL250. Edgar Phipps owns both bikes today.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Slakewell on November 07, 2010, 03:05:34 pm
Quote from: LWC82PE on November 07, 2010, 01:10:28 pm
Do the 77 250 fork internals fit the 72 250 forks? is that what you did or are you talking 350 stuff?

Yes you can if you want just undo the bottom nut and slide the chrome legs and internals inside the 72 bottom's 
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on November 07, 2010, 03:47:14 pm
Greentree bike looks great!
In the middle of home reno's at present, so still clearing up the new shed so I can tackle the engine work without falling over junk. ::)
Missed our last 2 meetings for the same reason......
More time and more bike next year. ;D
That '77 fork sounds like an idea?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: LWC82PE on November 07, 2010, 04:32:00 pm
Now that i think about it, i dont think i would do that fork mod. I dont think its in the spirit of pre 75 as the 77 forks were not out then.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: bazza on November 07, 2010, 06:49:25 pm
greentrees xl that i think
 Ed has now was a rocket. xr200 electronic ignition? I run Honda points only and have had no problem since 1991 whan i built the 305, first set of  replica points gave trouble.From memory XL350 swing arm is 1" longer and helps.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Slakewell on November 08, 2010, 08:02:30 pm
Quote from: LWC82PE on November 07, 2010, 04:32:00 pm
Now that i think about it, i dont think i would do that fork mod. I dont think its in the spirit of pre 75 as the 77 forks were not out then.

You can if your anal enough pull both sets apart and just copy the 77 ones , Honda didnt make new ones just modified the old ones to give more travel.
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: LWC82PE on November 08, 2010, 08:43:07 pm
so how did they increase the travel? Longer damping rods?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on January 06, 2011, 09:18:22 pm
OK, no turning back now!
Going to fit the new 305 piston and roller cam gear.

(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Engineout.jpg)
Normally I'd be paying someone to do the bigger engine work..but how hard can 1 cylinder be?? Should have been learning this years ago.  :-[
Have a few dumb questions though:
How can you tell when a cam chain is stuffed? thought someone told me sideways movement once?
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Camchain.jpg)
As far as I can tell these guides look fine as well?
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Camchainguides.jpg)
As far as lubing the cam / cylinder etc. on assembly do I just use a little engine oil? or is there a better product?
What's the best gasket sealant to use?
Thinking of making up some kind of valve spring compressor, unless anyone can recommend an off the shelf one?
Any tips on degreeing the cam.....or anything else for that matter ::)

Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: matcho mick on January 06, 2011, 10:32:28 pm
cam chains stuffed when you run out of adjustment  ;D,(replace for peace of mind  ;)),just assemble with the engine oil your'e going to use,either sprayon coppercoat (repco) head,n basegasket,all other alloy to alloy surfaces use 3 bond silver, sparingly,works for me, :P
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on March 04, 2011, 07:10:49 pm
Thanks Mick (belated  :))
OK 'nother problem,
Being the dummy I am....can someone have a look at this
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Cam001.jpg)

Now can someone confirm:
Am I correct so far?
If so, when the intake begins to close (or whatever) at 45deg after BDC. should this also be after it has closed 0.04"?? :-\
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: matcho mick on March 05, 2011, 10:51:28 pm
http://www.flowbenchtech.com/porting/CRH/dd%20bike/MOTORCYCLECAMDEGREEING.pdf
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: MX? on March 31, 2011, 06:19:28 pm
Finally back on track but for other brain related problem....
Seems I can't read a degree wheel, even after reading that article  :-[

These pics are with the valve opening to 1.016mm (0.04") and the reading on the degree wheel which started with the engine TDC on the  TDC wheel mark and traveled counter clockwise to be almost back at that point again

(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Dial.jpg)
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Cam.jpg)

Now this shot is after having continued to roll the engine over until the dial gauge hits the exact same point just before the valve is fully closed.

 (http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d14/photos2u/XL250/Cam2.jpg)

Sooooo.....what I want to know is what / how to take off those two readings on the wheel??? In the top one does it read 16deg, 344deg or neither
If I've got it right I'm meant to subtract the second reading from the first then /2 and +90 to come up with a lobe center of 103deg
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: shelpi on April 13, 2011, 12:26:50 pm
THE BEST REAR SHOCKS, BEST VALUE, GAZI,  ;) IT WAS ONLY 6 MONTHS AGO AND HAD NEVER HEARD OF GAZI, BEING A SCEPTICAL OLD BUZARD ASKED LOTS OF QUESTIONS THEN WAS CONFRONTED WITH TAKE THE PLUNGE AND BOUGHT A PAIR OF GAZI VMX HYPER FOR ME RM125B WOW,CAN IT GET ANY BETTER THAN THIS? CHECK EM OUT SEE WHAT YOU THINK.
HAS ANYONE ELSE HAD THE PLEASURE OF GAZI? PLEASE LET ME KNOW ;D
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Freakshow on April 13, 2011, 12:45:10 pm
thats a bit random ?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: shelpi on April 13, 2011, 12:50:05 pm
SORRY IT WAS FROM THE FIRST QUESTION,  :-\ WHAT SHOULD I SPEND MY MONEY ON?
Title: Re: Project - Pre 75 XL250
Post by: Slakewell on April 13, 2011, 03:21:37 pm
Quote from: shelpi on April 13, 2011, 12:26:50 pm
THE BEST REAR SHOCKS, BEST VALUE, GAZI,  ;) IT WAS ONLY 6 MONTHS AGO AND HAD NEVER HEARD OF GAZI, BEING A SCEPTICAL OLD BUZARD ASKED LOTS OF QUESTIONS THEN WAS CONFRONTED WITH TAKE THE PLUNGE AND BOUGHT A PAIR OF GAZI VMX HYPER FOR ME RM125B WOW,CAN IT GET ANY BETTER THAN THIS? CHECK EM OUT SEE WHAT YOU THINK.
HAS ANYONE ELSE HAD THE PLEASURE OF GAZI? PLEASE LET ME KNOW ;D

All my bikes have Gazzi I love them