OzVMX Forum
Marque Remarks => Maico => Topic started by: Rossvickicampbell on November 05, 2014, 03:08:14 pm
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Gents - what are the major differences between the MC and GS 490's - 81 model. Is the GS as good as the MC was supposed to be. Could it also be used in MX?
cheers
Rossco
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OK. A lot of the 490s being raced in Australia probably were a GSs originally. There is a different engine number
Enduro is GT and MX RT
The motor changes are as follows. The final drive gear is slightly higher. Remember there are three gear box shafts. Fifth gear and the matching final drive are different ratio for MX and Enduro. The enduro also has a Bosch ignition with external rotor and lighting coil. The MX motor has a motoplat ignition and top coil with smaller internal rotor. The MX motor is faster but for old farts the GS might be better.
The frames were the same but extra brackets (loop behind seat and centre stand brackets) are welded on for GSs. Most riders cut them off, but the steering lock is usually still there.
Kevin
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Gents - what are the major differences between the MC and GS 490's - 81 model. Is the GS as good as the MC was supposed to be. Could it also be used in MX?
cheers
Rossco
Way too much power for you petal.... But saying that you might exceed it's weight limit ;)
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what did your mother tell you Craigy?????
Thanks Kevin.
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It is funny how everyone seems to think the 490 Maicos are a beast to ride.
They aren't they have got a very broad power spread and don't come on like a lot of 500 class bikes. This is why they are so successful.
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Did the GS have different porting to the MX?
Rode a 79 GS 400 many moons ago (CD2) and was very impressed by how smooth and tractable the power was.
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I have a 78 mx rolling chassis that I'm going to make a GS. Just need an engine. J
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As well as KTM47 indicates;
The GS has extra Rear frame loop around Rear Gaurd,
Centre Stand,
and Fork tubes Marked different, reported to be thicker material on MX
There is minimal difference on the track,
Like Laurie Alderton said,
"Racing a Maico is almost like cheating"
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Did the GS have different porting to the MX?
Rode a 79 GS 400 many moons ago (CD2) and was very impressed by how smooth and tractable the power was.
To my knowledge porting is the same, although the Bosch ignition with heavier flywheel does have some effect.
Some of the 1982 GS 490 did come with reed valve barrels also. They were still twin shock too.
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It is funny how everyone seems to think the 490 Maicos are a beast to ride.
They aren't they have got a very broad power spread and don't come on like a lot of 500 class bikes. This is why they are so successful.
Yeah you are right. They are not a beast at all. Especially after seeing what a certain 81 YZ 465 did to two of them on the uphill at Lakes last weekend ;D
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I wondered when the Maico haters would pipe up?
Ted, Don't you think that maybe the age and ability of the rider might have something to do with it. If you come out of a corner faster than the rider in front of you, you carry the extra speed into that section.
I always remember a Production Road Race at Surfers Paradise Raceway. Anyway the rider of a 750 protested the rider of a RZ500 Yamaha, because he was passing him on the main straight. The bike was pulled down and found to be standard.
Anyway someone said maybe the RZ500 rider was just coming onto the straight faster. The name of that rider was Michael Doohan.
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I wondered when the Maico haters would pipe up?
Ted, Don't you think that maybe he age and ability of the rider might have something to do with it. If you come out of a corner faster than the ride in front of you, you carry the extra speed into that section.
All always remember a Production Road Race at Surfers Paradise Raceway. Anyway the rider of a 750 protested the rider of a RZ500 Yamaha, because he was passing him on the main straight. The bike was pulled down and found to be standard.
Anyway someone said maybe the RZ500 rider was just coming onto the straight faster. The name of that rider was Michael Doohan.
Not a Maico hater at all. I just dont buy the myth. But then again i dont believe in Jesus or the tooth fairy either.
I know what i saw. The Maygo rider , a Australian title holder himself, commented on it.
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I love all bikes and still reckon Rosco wont get permisson from his Mummy to buy one ;)
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It is funny how everyone seems to think the 490 Maicos are a beast to ride.
They aren't they have got a very broad power spread and don't come on like a lot of 500 class bikes. This is why they are so successful.
Couldn't agree more. I have several Maicos and my 84 SC500 is a big arm chair to ride. Plush suspension and the power is nothing like your normal CR500's. Basically just feed it more gears and it goes.
As for the YZ465, Ted they are a good thing but it has been well documented that the big4 Japanese bike manufactures all went out in 1981 and bought Maico 490's and pulled the engines down to find out why they were so good. I reckon a real match up would be Gally on a YZ465 V's Ballard on a 490 Maico. I saw Gally on his YZ490 at CD7 and he going well until he got spat over the bars and Ballard came through for the win ;D
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I wondered when the Maico haters would pipe up?
Ted, Don't you think that maybe he age and ability of the rider might have something to do with it. If you come out of a corner faster than the ride in front of you, you carry the extra speed into that section.
All always remember a Production Road Race at Surfers Paradise Raceway. Anyway the rider of a 750 protested the rider of a RZ500 Yamaha, because he was passing him on the main straight. The bike was pulled down and found to be standard.
Anyway someone said maybe the RZ500 rider was just coming onto the straight faster. The name of that rider was Michael Doohan.
Not a Maico hater at all. I just dont buy the myth. But then again i dont believe in Jesus or the tooth fairy either.
I know what i saw. The Maygo rider , a Australian title holder himself, commented on it.
myth
/m??/
noun
noun: myth; plural noun: myths
1. a traditional story, especially one concerning the early history of a people or explaining a natural or social phenomenon, and typically involving supernatural beings or events.
"ancient Celtic myths"
synonyms: folk tale, story, folk story, legend, tale, fable, saga, allegory, parable, tradition, lore, folklore; More
technicalmythos, mythus
"ancient Greek myths"
2. a widely held but false belief or idea.
"the belief that evening primrose oil helps to cure eczema is a myth, according to dermatologists"
What part of the above explainations for the word myth applies to the MIGHTY MAICO 490.
IF you haven't ridden one you aren't qualified to comment.
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Having read my post I realise something does apply.
The MIGHTY MAICO 490s are supernatural.
I think I will get a shirt made using a Superman logo and change it to SuperMaico.
We haven't herd from the over Maico haters yet, but it won't be long. Where are you KXBill and Davey.
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Having read my post I realise something does apply.
The MIGHTY MAICO 490s are supernatural.
I think I will get a shirt made using a Superman logo and change it to SuperMaico.
We haven't herd from the over Maico haters yet, but it won't be long. Where are you KXBill and Davey.
kev do you write your posts with your tongue firmly planted in your cheek (ie joking and having a laugh) or do you legitimately write to shit-stir and cause friction??
Just asking.
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I'll bite Kev......lol......are you coming to Biddadaba tomorrow for a push start and a steak?....I just picked up 4 of the biggest rib eye's you've ever seen. Are you going to sponsor a Maico only class at Conondale next year?... 8)
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Simo63 It is the Aussie way to respond with sarcasm.
John Like a lot of riders I can't afford to ride at the moment. As for sponsoring a Maico Only class at Conondale. I think Les Ricther would be the best one for that. He is the local Maico Only dealer.
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Les has sold up all except the Kedo stuff.....more money and less headaches with Yamaha owners.....lol.....mate, it's 2 days practice, $30 for 1 day or $50 for 2 and the bonus off a free steak dinner and pudding Saturday night.....got lots of rain last night on the track, have a 15,000 litre water truck there [thanks to Shane Chestnut from EDI machinery].
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Hey Kevvy i'll cover your two day ride fee Only to prove to you that your Maygo wont last two days
So go and ride, eat and be merry. Well at least till your ride stops
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I'll bite Kev......lol......are you coming to Biddadaba tomorrow for a push start and a steak?....I just picked up 4 of the biggest rib eye's you've ever seen. Are you going to sponsor a Maico only class at Conondale next year?... 8)
Habib is about to play Jesus. He is going to break 4 steaks and half a loaf of bread and feed the hordes.
Now Kev, that is another myth 8)
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Ya dreaming Ted, Maicos go all day long, I don't remember any Yamaha 465s going past Maicos on the weekend :o
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Your eyesight was better when you were on the cans Rossco ;D
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It is funny how everyone seems to think the 490 Maicos are a beast to ride.
They aren't they have got a very broad power spread and don't come on like a lot of 500 class bikes. This is why they are so successful.
Couldn't agree more. I have several Maicos and my 84 SC500 is a big arm chair to ride. Plush suspension and the power is nothing like your normal CR500's. Basically just feed it more gears and it goes.
As for the YZ465, Ted they are a good thing but it has been well documented that the big4 Japanese bike manufactures all went out in 1981 and bought Maico 490's and pulled the engines down to find out why they were so good. I reckon a real match up would be Gally on a YZ465 V's Ballard on a 490 Maico. I saw Gally on his YZ490 at CD7 and he going well until he got spat over the bars and Ballard came through for the win ;D
Adam, there is no racing at Classic Dirt.
Go back to 1981 when both riders, similarly aged, both at their peak and have your race. Geoff wouldn't have kept in the same post code as Gall.
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1981 Maicos came into their own in the vintage scene, back when it counted 1981 they were OTB ;)
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Les has sold up all except the Kedo stuff.....more money and less headaches with Yamaha owners.....lol.....mate, it's 2 days practice, $30 for 1 day or $50 for 2 and the bonus off a free steak dinner and pudding Saturday night.....got lots of rain last night on the track, have a 15,000 litre water truck there [thanks to Shane Chestnut from EDI machinery].
$50.00 to ride plus $50.00 in fuel to get there plus $20/30 for the bike fuel ++++
Les is still advertising Maico parts on his website.
Aren't you glad I asked Shane about the water truck.
Bill were have you been you're too late.
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Mustafa, those 4 rib eyes are bigger than your belly mate......if you could eat one of them I'll let you ride a Maygo. ;D
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You wont need that much fuel for your bike Kev.
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Still think Roscos Mum won't sign off on a maico breako.
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You wont need that much fuel for your bike Kev.
You wanna re-live the vintage scene Kev. Go milk a few cars tonight. Instant race fuel.. Easy ;D
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Teddy... your a bad arse man
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Ted I didn't see you racing in the over 60 EVO 500 class at Toowoomba at the Australian Post Classic MX Champs. Which class were you racing in?
I race/ride my Maico when I can because I really enjoy it. My only regret is that I didn't have one when they were new. However I did have a 1980 440 Maico in 1980.
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watched a neat twin shock pommie utube clip the other nite, bloke on a 510 husky FOUR STROKE clearly ran down a YZ490 then the RM 500 then the Maico 490....to take 1st place ;D......then he fell off. >:(....nice work
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I still don't like Craig :'(
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Ted I didn't see you racing in the over 60 EVO 500 class at Toowoomba at the Australian Post Classic MX Champs. Which class were you racing in?
I race/ride my Maico when I can because I really enjoy it. My only regret is that I didn't have one when they were new. However I did have a 1980 440 Maico in 1980.
Yes you are correct. I didn't race at the PC Nats. My wrist injury prevents me from racing. However I did put up sponsorship money for it and the Classic Nats to help fill the coffers so as you and others could ride. I also paid entrance fees for a rider to compete. I am also putting up more money for the Conondale Classic next year. What this has to do with your outlandish claim that 81 Maicos were so successful is beyond me. Or is it that because you race/ ride your Maico that you only can lay claim to its prowess.
Fact: 1980 MR MX 1st place YZ 465
Fact: 1981 MR MX. 1st place YZ 465
Argue with history.
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You win Ted the YZ465 was the best PRODUCTION 500 class motocross bike in 1981.
All the dirt bike magazines were wrong in 1981.
If you don't already know this is sarcasm.
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An interesting market statistic for 1981 is that there was more Maico MC490 sold in the US than all the other open class MXers put together. In anything but pro class the 490 Maico made up a large percentage of the bikes. The Pro class naturally contained all the riders who got paid and rode what they got paid the most to ride and had unlimited budgets to make them work. Many Pro riders that lost their sponsored ride would buy a Maico once back as a privateer.
Ted the YZ465 is a fine bike but nowhere near the best in the year. Gally would have won regardless. Following a well set up Maico on the track you can clearly see that it handles a dream while following a YZ465, both of which I’ve done heaps of ::), it becomes clear very quickly the riders is working much much harder to do the lap times.
The YZ465 has a fast engine but that does not win open class MX races by itself the whole package is the most important thing. Look at the world titles of the late '70s early '80s Yamaha had one or two works bikes in the top 10 (yes top 3 probably but they spent millions) while Maico had four or five production bikes in the top 10.
I don't have a Maico don't intend buying a 490 either but I know which one I would rather ride. Riding the 465 Yammie is about the same level on my bucket list as base jumping off the back of your truck or trying to out booze you ;D, both of which would see me face down and unconscious :o.
So just admit it Ted the 465 was not the best bike Yamaha ever built by a long shot ;). It is also a shame the Maico does take a lot of maintenance ::)
Taking the piss OK ummmm well a bit anyway ;D
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Here's a couple more facts..
The 490 Maico is a much better bike than the CR450 Honda i rode that year
The two Qld A graders that changed to 490 Maicos in 81 were much faster that year than the year before or year after..
There was no Maico dealer network or race team in Oz otherwise the start lines would've been full of Maicos in 81 like they were the rest of the world.
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I heard a lot of good comments in the past about the 81 490 Maicos, but how good was the 81 250 Maico?
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I haven't raced or ridden an 81 250, but I do know they have all the good handling qualities that the 490 has. Generally the Japanese 250 motors are better than the European 250s. The peakier power isn't the problem it is on a 500.
Having said that the Maico 250s are competitive in the class. Also the rolling chassis is the same as the 490 and you can even make the 250 into a 320.
Just another interesting statistic. There are probably more 81 490s in Australia now than there was in 1981.
Ted The support you give VMX racing is great.
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I have had 250 mc and still have a GS 250 81.
they handle even better than the 490 ( less reciprocating crankshaft weight or whatever) but they are peaky so a 490 is easier to ride because of the torqey motor esp if you are not at peak physical condition....they aren't slow though.
I think quite a few of us have seen young ross downs totally whipped out on drunks hill at connondale on a 81 MC 250- super cool..
I do recall a vmx mag evo test where the 81 maico came out on top.
I would rate the yz 250H motor as the best motor , but the maico handles better... hmm mc250 with yz motor?? yamaico..
actually this is pretty much what kev is saying too when I reread his post
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His mum won't let Rossco buy the Maico, because it will cost too much to update his fluro wardrobe!!
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Les has sold up all except the Kedo stuff.....more money and less headaches with Yamaha owners.....lol.....mate, it's 2 days practice, $30 for 1 day or $50 for 2 and the bonus off a free steak dinner and pudding Saturday night.....got lots of rain last night on the track, have a 15,000 litre water truck there [thanks to Shane Chestnut from EDI machinery].
$50.00 to ride plus $50.00 in fuel to get there plus $20/30 for the bike fuel ++++
Les is still advertising Maico parts on his website.
Aren't you glad I asked Shane about the water truck.
Bill were have you been you're too late.
Au Contraire Kev ;) Tis the Maico that is too late , nowhere in the day but apparently all good now . I have always said and as I remember from the day .The Maico made an ordinary rider a better rider due to its handling but at the top end of things they were OTB.
I cant remember but did Maico ever win a GP ? I don't count the Hans Maisch bullshit win in Spain where he stole Jim Pomeroys trophy .
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No GP wins for Maico is true. I don't count 73 Spanish GP either Bill. J PS I have 78 roller begging me to start resto. Have to finish house extension first though!
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1970-80 Maico had some good finishes in GP Motocross (Jonsson, Bauer and Weil mostly).
Tough to compare Factory GP bikes to what was sold to the public, but I would look at what privateers were running in 1981 to get a more accurate picture. Most were probably riding Maico 490's or Yamaha YZ465's.
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GP wins has got nothing to do with how good the Maico is.. How many production Jap bikes won GP's?
The Jap factories bought the top riders for big bucks that Maico couldn't afford. Many top privateers rode Maico..Their choice.
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Exactly. J
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GP wins has got nothing to do with how good the Maico is.. How many production Jap bikes won GP's?
The Jap factories bought the top riders for big bucks that Maico couldn't afford. Many top privateers rode Maico..Their choice.
Aberg won a GP on a converted trail bike ;)
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Fair conversion! J
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GP wins has got nothing to do with how good the Maico is.. How many production Jap bikes won GP's?
The Jap factories bought the top riders for big bucks that Maico couldn't afford. Many top privateers rode Maico..Their choice.
Aberg won a GP on a converted trail bike ;)
He actually only won one heat of a GP I believe not the overal GP
To call it a convertion is a long shot.
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I reckon a real match up would be Gally on a YZ465 V's Ballard on a 490 Maico. I saw Gally on his YZ490 at CD7 and he going well until he got spat over the bars and Ballard came through for the win ;D
Adam, there is no racing at Classic Dirt.
Go back to 1981 when both riders, similarly aged, both at their peak and have your race. Geoff wouldn't have kept in the same post code as Gall.
Ted I know there is no racing at CD, I was there. Let's just say there was some competitive rivalry between Gally and Geoff.
I reckon you need to throw your leg over a Maico and find out first hand what they are all about.......if you can handle it :)....I know you have hang ups about Euro bikes.
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Thanks for your comment on the 81 250 KTM47 & sa63!
Sounds like it could be the ultimate EVO machine a crossbreed Yamaico!
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Ted you do know that Galls bike in 81 was running his older works 400 power valve engine and not the standard 465?
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Hi Jerry,
Just a few stats for you : 1970 - East German GP Ake Johansen overall, 1971 Ake Johansen 2-1 overall, British GP Farleigh Castle, Ake Johansen 1-2 overall GP Winner, German GP Bilstein 18/7 Adolf Weil Maico 1-2 overall winner, Luxenberg GP 8/8 Ake Johansen 2-1 overall GP winner. 1973 Willy Bauer, Chech GP Maico 1-1 overall GP winner, US GP Carlsbad Willy Bauer Maico GP winner, thats only the 500cc class, not sure about 250's but I dare say they might have squeezed 1 or 2 GP's out, not bad on basically a production bike with a few factory go fast pieces against 1 off hand built unobtainable works bikes.
Regards Ken Baker
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Ken my face is bright red! Whilst I was indeed alluding to the 250 class I completely forgot about Ake, Willi and Adolphs achievements in the big bores. Wolsink wasnt too bad either.They did pretty good in the Trans AMA series too. Call it brain fade! Cheers Jerry PS I'm looking for a 250 78/79 motor either MC or GS if you see one around the traps.
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Hi Jerry,
Just a few stats for you : 1970 - East German GP Ake Johansen overall, 1971 Ake Johansen 2-1 overall, British GP Farleigh Castle, Ake Johansen 1-2 overall GP Winner, German GP Bilstein 18/7 Adolf Weil Maico 1-2 overall winner, Luxenberg GP 8/8 Ake Johansen 2-1 overall GP winner. 1973 Willy Bauer, Chech GP Maico 1-1 overall GP winner, US GP Carlsbad Willy Bauer Maico GP winner, thats only the 500cc class, not sure about 250's but I dare say they might have squeezed 1 or 2 GP's out, not bad on basically a production bike with a few factory go fast pieces against 1 off hand built unobtainable works bikes.
Regards Ken Baker
And 1981?
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I rode nothing but jap back in the day. When I started vmx other than the first bike that was sold to me to get involved was a 490 Maico. They are the best. You all know that they are good and were good back in '81 and it's well documented that the jap's bought all the top riders and threw millions at the bikes. I'm so impressed with Maico's that they are the majority in the shed now.
I've had an A5 kx250,and a cr250 ra. I now own a Maico 250.
I will also have an 89 500/610 restored for pre90 open
(http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa474/090bvb/EUROTRASH_zps6d3700fa.jpg) (http://s1199.photobucket.com/user/090bvb/media/EUROTRASH_zps6d3700fa.jpg.html)
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Lean Mean Maico Racing Machine !!! ;D ;)
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400 & 490 are smooth easy to use power, 440 a little aggressive & vibrates a bit. I've had a few Maico's, the '81 490 was real nice, just a tad hard to live with having a prehistoric clutch (even though the current KTM clutch is similar). The best one I had was a '75 250 with 400 piston which made 326cc. It was fast & super easy to ride, should have kept that one. Any Euro bike is better than an Oriental in the hands of mortal men, especially when the going gets tough. They may feel under powered coz they are not wheel standing or pig rooting everywhere, but the stop watch generally shows the truth. Smooth, tractable power, with good handling = less rider fatigue which equates to going faster for longer, take a bow Maico MC490.
K
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Very well said BigK, smooth/tractable = fast! 8)
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What are the diffences (if any) in the 80-81 250 Maico?
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Interesting video from arguably Australia's greatest off road racer.
Google" stefan merriman rides Maico 490"
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Interesting video from arguably Australia's greatest off road racer.
Google" stefan merriman rides Maico 490"
It would have been good to have heard Stefan Merriman's impressions of a YZ465H Yamaha, if he had also ridden one of those on the same day. I have owned and raced, long term, both Maico 490s and a YZ465H and I know which one I would rather ride.
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i was fortunate enough to get a ride on a 490 maico (Many Thanks Ken Baker) some years back at the then tight Parwan practice track that was very hard packed with a loose skatey surface after riding my own CR500 around it before hand.
my take was the big Maico was a pleasure to ride and very tractable (although i wasn't used to the slight hesitation from the non reed engine).
it was lovely to ride and i mirror those that say it was not demanding, i felt i could do many more laps on it than my bike, since most tracks are tighter than days of old i can see why they are favoured.
being a Honda fan this post will self explode in 3 days ;)
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mark, you have both the husky 500 and the 490. whats your riding impression on both? I had the xc500 and I hated the vibration high in the revs. I rode your auto 500 at cd remember with the 38mm carb. I did not like the pause before it took off but going up the big hill that year at the cd at connondale it is the fastest bike I have ridden. without having to change gears it should never ever lose a holeshot.
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Yeah , sometimes on a track that suits it, the 500 Auto almost feels like you are cheating. But overall, when you are comparing a Maico 490 and a Husky 500, I would choose the Maico because of the way it handles, steers and the easy to use, smooth tractor like power.
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i was fortunate enough to get a ride on a 490 maico (Many Thanks Ken Baker) some years back at the then tight Parwan practice track that was very hard packed with a loose skatey surface after riding my own CR500 around it before hand. my take was the big Maico was a pleasure to ride and very tractable (although i wasn't used to the slight hesitation from the non reed engine). it was lovely to ride and i mirror those that say it was not demanding, i felt i could do many more laps on it than my bike, since most tracks are tighter than days of old i can see why they are favoured. being a Honda fan this post will self explode in 3 days
Gooday Hoony, I remember that day very well. Parwin was at it's worst for sure, but I thought you were never going to come back in ;D That 490 is the one that Shaun won Evo & Pre 85 in Tassie back in 07 from memory, he's got that Maico in Brisbane now and goes out to QMX Park at Beaudesert and more than holds its own against new 450's on the pro track. I remember he rode a 465 somewhere couldnt wait to get off it, that hesitation off the bottom that you mention has been tuned out. If you're at the bike bonanza at Easter my latest 490 is waiting for you, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.
Regards Ken & Dawn Baker
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G'day Ken, I am hoping to get to Bonanza this year as missed the last 2. would love another ride but you have to take up my offer to swing a leg over "Big Red" as well.
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What are the diffences (if any) in the 80-81 250 Maico?
Bump
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What are the diffences (if any) in the 80-81 250 Maico?
Lots. The '80 model Mega 1 MC250 had longer forks, shorter swingarm and a piston port cylinder. Where the '81 Mega 2 MC250 had a reed valve cylinder, different forks, frame and longer swingarm and just handled way better. I thought that '80 model 250 felt weird to ride, because you sat into a "V" where the seat and tank met, the triple clamps were really high in the frame and the bike felt like it had too short of a wheelbase. Combine all this with a peaky motor (because of the piston port cylinder) and you had a bike that was hard to ride and wanted to wheelie out of corners when you didn't want it to. The '81 model addressed all of the issues and was heaps better. Chalk and cheese really.
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What are the diffences (if any) in the 80-81 250 Maico?
Lots. The '80 model Mega 1 MC250 had longer forks, shorter swingarm and a piston port cylinder. Where the '81 Mega 2 MC250 had a reed valve cylinder, different forks, frame and longer swingarm and just handled way better. I thought that '80 model 250 felt weird to ride, because you sat into a "V" where the seat and tank met, the triple clamps were really high in the frame and the bike felt like it had too short of a wheelbase. Combine all this with a peaky motor (because of the piston port cylinder) and you had a bike that was hard to ride and wanted to wheelie out of corners when you didn't want it to. The '81 model addressed all of the issues and was heaps better. Chalk and cheese really.
Could not agree more. The 490 is a great bike, but sadly its notoriety overshadowed one of the sweetest bikes ever built.