OzVMX Forum
Marque Remarks => Spaniards (Bultaco, Ossa, Montesa etc) => Topic started by: mx250 on August 21, 2007, 07:23:16 am
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Remember this....
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/framesmall6.jpg)
..... it now looks like this.
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/DSCF0003.jpg)
Remember this....
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/framesmall2.jpg)
..... it now looks like this.
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/DSCF0004.jpg)
Remember this....
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/framesmall3.jpg)
..... it now looks like this.
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/DSCF0006.jpg)
Just waiting for the engine cradle and head stay so I can line up the lower engine mounts and weld up.
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Excellent work. Nicely done.
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Looking awesome dude...now all the blog needs is a theme song.
"HellsBells" by AC/DC http://media.putfile.com/HellsBells
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Excellent work. Nicely done.
I would love to say it's my welding but alas it was done by another, my good mate George, 'welder exordinaire' and general mechanical 'wizard' and all round mechical guru.
The down tube is excellent. It was replaced with tubing from a DT250 (already 'butchered' by person/s unknown (not me ;D)). Both are 29mm. George v'ed the joints, welded up, ground back and even without paint you cann't distinguish the weld. I am worried about the strength but I'll keep an eye on it in use (one of the reasons the frame will be painted not powder coated). But I'm probably a 'worry wort' (but having your down tubes fail after coming off a jump at speed and having your engine disappear under the back wheel would not be a pretty sight nor an experience I care for ;)) - if Georges says its done right then its done right.
George wanted to replace the rear loop completely but I talked him out of it. I didn't have the tubing and it was more trouble than it worth for a race bike. Maybe after everything is up and running I'll come back and finnese (another good reason for paint over powder coat).
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I rather like montesas'..
[attachment deleted by admin]
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I rather like montesas'..
Sweet.
This is my first Spanish and obviously my first Monty. I rather impressed with most things regarding the Monty. Looking forward to firing her up and going for a lap or two.
Back in the day I didn't look at the Spanish. Although always light they had the reputation of doubtful electrics, dodgey carbies, fragile mechanical and the doubtful pleasure for a MX'er of primary kick start (backed up by not having big name riders or big name wins - no 'cool' there ;)) - and all this pleasure for a third in price premium.
I may have been blindsided to their charms. ::)
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Very NICE Graeme. Why on earth was the down tube chopped!!?? You've really taken on a challenge there and I bet it'll end up a beauty! ;). Lyall O'Brien told me that the only way you'll lose a motor is if the things sucks air. You're already on that so it's gunna give you years of joy. Make sure the fly-wheel's a good fit, plenty of Loc-tite everywhere, lock nuts and you'll give ya other bikes away! They really are giant killers......... ;)
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I voted on the old forum you were just completeley crazy but now im not so sure whos the crazy one, stage 1. Job well done so far Graeme:-\ ;D
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Very NICE Graeme. Why on earth was the down tube chopped!!?? You've really taken on a challenge there and I bet it'll end up a beauty! ;).
[
When it finished I might christian the thing Lazarus. ;) ;D But coming from me that might be considered blasphemy
by some ::). But it gonna be called nothing other than a piece of 'Spanish crud' until I finish it ;) 8)
Here's the story as told on the previous forum I believe;
"I thought I would put this out there as way of explanation of why
I'm so vague about all things Monty and this bike in particular As
I've said before this is my first Monty and in deed my first non-
japanese bike, road, trail or mx (except for the old El Paso (Duke)).
A local ad 'Yamaha RD350 engine and parts, $150'. It's nearby so I
call. Go around.
Me,"yep, I'll take them!"
Owner, "Okay. But you take the lot or nothing" he points to a corner
of the garage piled with the remains of several bikes. "My lease is
up and I'm moving out this week end. Either you take them or they go
to the tip".
It's a good thing I drive a ute.
I load up the bits, the engine and a lot of old DT250A rubbish,
frames (to become a source of down tube steel ;)) engine etc
- and the remains of the Monty. The frame is
butchered where someone has cut the left hand down tube and welded
in (badly) a square section of angle iron to form a box in the down
tube. There's an old side port, round case Monty engine included so
I guess that someone has tried to fit an old Monty side port engine
into the centre port frame.
I finish packing when another punter turns up - he's particular
interested in the Monty engine, he is disapointed - Me "$150 and it's
yours!" Him, "Done deal". So I end up with the Monty frame and bits
and a ute load of Yammy rubbish for nothing!!!
The thing with this Monty frame is that it is TOTALLY pulled down -
not into sub-assembles but pulled down into every constituent part.
For example the brake backing plate, the shoes are off, the cams
out, even those little plates on the end of the brake shoe are off
and floating around in a box of bits, screws, bolts, nuts and all
manner of unfamilar dovalackies. All bearing are out or off every
component. Why? Stuffed if I know. And evry thing is old well used
and dirt, greasey and rusty.
This is not a 100 piece jigsaw it is a thousand piece jigsaw.
I'm still not 100% sure what I've got. Iv'e got obvious enduro bits
and obvious MX bits. I've got two ignitions. A lightweight MX and
the heavy Flywheel off the enduro (I deduce).
Slowly I'm putting it together and making sense of it all. (without
a manual). With a bit of help from you guys I might be able to get
this relatively rare (compared to my Yammies) beast back up and
running as some sort of period representation of a classy Montesa
(if not perfect resto).
I'm also interested to have a ride - one way to experienced the
fabled handling of the Monty."
So I basically had the frame, as seen above, no rear suspenion, rusty front forks, the wheels and a damaged tank. The cost of this was essentially zip. However, my guessimate to get this up and running is $2000-3000 (likely resale value, $2000 on a good day after a long wait).
Insane; yep, I feel it at times. But I am expecting a sainthood and honourary Spanish citizenship upon completion ;D.
Lyall O'Brien told me that the only way you'll lose a motor is if the things sucks air.
Do you believe him? 8) ;D 'Done and dusted' ::)
You're already on that so it's gunna give you years of joy. Make sure the fly-wheel's a good fit, plenty of Loc-tite everywhere, lock nuts and you'll give ya other bikes away! They really are giant killers......... ;)
Thanks for the tips. You might find a few PM's and emails headed your way as things go along.
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Here's some shiney bits just back from the zinc platers (Blu-Chrome Bankstown).
Not N.O.S. but nice and clean and done for $50.
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/DSCF0007.jpg)
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Oh yeah,
I believe him.......... :'(
What stage are you up to with the motor Graeme?
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Oh yeah,
I believe him.......... :'(
What stage are you up to with the motor Graeme?
I've brought VB cases, barrel and head, and some gearbox bits from BigK here, and have agreed to take a complete VA engine "Brand New" from someone up Newcastle way. I'll make arrangements to view and buy as soon as I can,
1/ get the time and
2/ prise the money from my wife (the tax cheque ;D aka budget surplus ;)).
I've been concentrating on the frame and swingarm. I hope to have a rear engine mount and head stay from Jared shortly which will allow me mount the engine. I hope to have the engine and the parts in a week or so, engine mounted within say two weeks.
I'm undecided yet but I'll have a choice; put the VB barrel on the VA cases and weld VA corresponding mounts, or swap the VA internals to the VB cases and weld the mount to accept VB cases. This is complete undecided and unaddressed. I haven't even got to the stage to confirm the possibilities. I understand the VA/VB internals and barrel swap but am not certain.
....and pesty Yammaha riders want me to check my stock of goodies so I can sell them stuff ::) :P
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I do have a standard 360 VB pipe that needs a little attention. I was going to stick it on E-bay however if you want it we can work something out......
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Is that frame a VB or later? Looks like it from the shock mounts. How much of it was there when you bought it?
I'm following this resto with great interest.
TFT
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Is that frame a VB or later? Looks like it from the shock mounts. How much of it was there when you bought it?
I'm following this resto with great interest.
TFT
By frame number it is a VB250.
"So I basically had the frame, as seen above, no rear suspenion, rusty front forks, the wheels and a damaged tank." as in the post above replying to 414. Not quite 'I started with the front axle' rebuild, but close - and to think I'm not even a particular Monty fan ;D
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Sorry my bad. Helluva job. I guess Jared is your friend (or should that be banker?).
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I guess Jared is your friend (or should that be banker?).
He's having a close and personal relationship with my credit card ;D.
Nah, not really. I've got a few things winging their way to me at the mo. They're taking a little long - into second week - I hope they haven't been helded up in customs/GST :o ::).
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This'll make ya spew Graeme. Shocks sent last Tue (Mon Arizona time), shocks on bikes in shed tonight (and the customs guys were so excited that they had a look as well!).......... ;)
These ones are for the V 75
[attachment deleted by admin]
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I've probably got the only set of all singing/dancing Works Performance Pro Racers in The Land.
These are for Mr414. Yay!! :P
[attachment deleted by admin]
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This'll make ya spew Graeme. Shocks sent last Tue (Mon Arizona time), shocks on bikes in shed tonight (and the customs guys were so excited that they had a look as well!).......... ;)
These ones are for the V 75
I will be interested in a 'product report' - they might be suitable for the racing MX250 when I get my act together.
My goodies arrived today without a $50 contribution to Johnie's 'War Chest/slush fund/pork barrelling fund' :D ;D.
Jared forgot to include the engine craddle and head stay. He's sending them seperately. Thats what holding up the next stage - fabricate, locate and weld the lower engine mounts. Hope they arrive before the week end.
You must have paid express post surely.
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Nah. I've helped out the American economy so much that Mr Bush said get my bits to me extra fast!! :P
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Graeme, have you seen this?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/AHRMA-Montesa-Cappra-360-414-Bottom-end_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ35618QQihZ019QQitemZ290155142610QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
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Graeme, have you seen this?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/AHRMA-Montesa-Cappra-360-414-Bottom-end_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ35618QQihZ019QQitemZ290155142610QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
Thanks Tim.
Yeah I've seen that, in fact it has been offered several times before. It's attractive but by time I landed it in Oz it would be about $500+. At that money it would need to be spot on and race ready, which I doubt. The seller say the crank feels fine but looking at its general condition with surface rust on various surfaces I would have my doubts. I would estimate a real 'pig in a poke'.
But I have another here in Oz I will look at, probably this week end.
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'k. Managed to find a breaker Sherpa 125 for a mate in Scotland a few weeks ago. Always nice to be able to help.
There's a cleanish H7 on ebay aus presently. If I weren't about to bugger off on a round the world trip and will probably need every cent of credit I can raise (work will re-imburse, but later) I'd buy it. Might result in a minor breakdown in marital relations though!
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There's a cleanish H7 on ebay aus presently. I'd buy it.
You're a man of impeccably good taste ;D
With a bit of luck someone we know might give both of us a ride :-X ;) ;) ;) ;) ;D
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Heres one for you Monty maniacs! I made the same mistake myself. Plenty of people spell montesa with double 's' . Thought it might be of interest.
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/MONTESSA-250-KING-SCORPIAN_W0QQitemZ110164776657QQihZ001QQcategoryZ102690QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/MONTESSA-250-KING-SCORPIAN_W0QQitemZ110164776657QQihZ001QQcategoryZ102690QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting)
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Heres one for you Monty maniacs! I made the same mistake myself. Plenty of people spell montesa with double 's' . Thought it might be of interest.
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/MONTESSA-250-KING-SCORPIAN_W0QQitemZ110164776657QQihZ001QQcategoryZ102690QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/MONTESSA-250-KING-SCORPIAN_W0QQitemZ110164776657QQihZ001QQcategoryZ102690QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting)
I'm not a monty expert (not get ;D) but that looks like a home modified.
So what do you do with it? Wouldn't be competitive in VMX and a lot of work for a resto Scorpian, doesn't state that it runs or even turns over so it probably doesn't - so start the auction at maybe $100 or $200. $800 is off the dial and for amusement value only. They are really 'trying it on'.
I'll watch for amusement ;)
(Ebay offers 'Montessa' as an alternative to 'Montesa' so its fairly common ;) :o ::) ;D.)
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Thanx for the heads-up 090 (Joe??). Bit of a dog though. King Scorpions never did it for me. Spanish attempt at a trail bike. The japs did it better.
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Here they are!
That King Scorpian would make a good parts bike but that's about it I think. Someone's gone to a lot of trouble to do the shock lay-down a few years ago. If that wasn't done you could probably make a good VR mock-up. The H6 would need a lot of dollars I think. Be alright if you had nothing else on the go to bring it back. If you've got the money and the patience. Would make a first-rate motocrosser though!
[attachment deleted by admin]
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About that H6, would it be legal? It's an 85/86 model and has a disc brake, wouldn't that throw up questions regarding it's eligibility?
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Pre 90 I think would be fine.
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......or do think I should get a Honda.......
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.........'cause someone tells me that they're just dandy..........
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Springs for the shocks are wayyy too heavy for me. Good fit and all. Waiting for some lighter ones from The States. Wish they had a distributor here....... :-\
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Im currently putting back together 1977 Montesa 250 H and need complete seat base,foam and cover, air box to carb boot, full set of cables and probably other things not mentioned, is southwest montesa the go for all parts as not being very succesful in tracking down oz suppliers, not going back to enduro set up and will only be used on the track, are all seat bases the same for this year model say between cappra and enduro models, ie would 77/78 VB seat bases same as 250H, looks like southwest dont have any covers in stock, is vintage dirt bike better option for parts, im confused and this is first foray into montesas
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414, are you gonna have a go at Barrabool on 30th Sept ?
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Im currently putting back together 1977 Montesa 250 H and need complete seat base,foam and cover, air box to carb boot, full set of cables and probably other things not mentioned, is southwest montesa the go for all parts
I'm pretty sure YES but check here;
http://www.southwestmontesa.com
are all seat bases the same for this year model say between cappra and enduro models, ie would 77/78 VB seat bases same as 250H,
I don't know the answer but I'm in Campbelltown in Sydney and I have both the metal VB base and a SW monty fibreglass base. Ill be out near Cessnock on the 28-29/09/07, maybe we can do a trial fit if you can't get the answer else where.
looks like southwest dont have any covers in stock, is vintage dirt bike better option for parts, im confused and this is first foray into montesas
I've just recently got a VB seat cover, foam and base from Jared. You might check to confirm. If you get all items from the one supplier I think you'll save on postage.
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thanks for offer Graeme,I will probably be stuck at work that week before long weekend but i do have the original seat complete, just base rusted out, mounting bracket broken off and seat ripped, are you going to heaven round at ACT in september as could bring along there for a comparison, is jared normally quick with postage after order
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thanks for offer Graeme,I will probably be stuck at work that week before long weekend but i do have the original seat complete, just base rusted out, mounting bracket broken off and seat ripped,
sounds familar ::). Why do you think I've got two?? ::) ;) :)
are you going to heaven round at ACT in september as could bring along there for a comparison,
No, I know I will be working to get credits ;D. I have a rough plan to go to the Bultaco Rally with a completed VB (there, I've said it out loud :P ::)) I have plans to con my son into going to Canberra to check out the 'scene' with the view to get him involved in VMX racing ;).
is jared normally quick with postage after order
I've found Jared a pleasure to do business with in every regard. My order took a bit more than a week to get to me. 414 was teasing me with the fact that it only took a few days for him :o :D
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Yes Hoony. I'll be there. 8)
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Roscoe. Most of the components between the Mxer's and the Enduro's and different years are interchangable. My 414 has gear selectors from my V75, they both have each others back wheels (only because I'm too lazy to swap them back) and my 360 runs a 414 piston.
If Jared doesn't have something, try Jeff. They're both top fella's and I doubt they do it for the money! It's funny that the thing's you'd think would be hard to get are easy (pistons, rods,etc) but you can roam the world looking for some case screws!
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Remember this.....
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/framesmall1.jpg)
now looks like this....
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/swingarm.jpg)
The inside gasset, 2mm, was cut off and replaced with the new 3mm gasset. The outside mount was reinforced with a washer welded to it. Undercoated waiting a bit more work and topcoat.
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Great Work mate, keep it coming i am enjoying the Before and after photo's!
Excellant workmanship !
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Wow! You're just showing off now Graeme! Very nice Mate!! :P
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Wow! You're just showing off now Graeme! Very nice Mate!! :P
Thanks for the kind words Hooney and Ross, but the photos are a little flattering. Cosmetically there is a way to go for both frame and swinger.
I got the bits from Jared and went to offer up the swinger with all the bits and bobs for a trial fit. Found out sh*t loads and a heap more work to do. The bronze bushs are shot - I kinda knew this but thought I would get away with it but with the length of swingarm in taken into account way too much movement. So new bronze bushs.
But there is also about 4mm of 'gap' between the swinger and frame - go figure. Where did that come from?
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/swingarm2.jpg)
Closer inspection also showed elongation at the mounting plate in the frame???? How did that flog out? Its about 10mm thick! And the pivot axle seems original and undamaged. Go figure.
So the repair is gonna be to drill out and oversize the mounting plate and press in a mechined bush with a 2mm washer/shim mechined in (forming a 'top hat' and pressed in from inside the frame) to make up the difference to the swingarm.
My good friend George is doing the mechining as I write.
"Life wasn't meant to be easy" especially when it comes to resto's. I think 'Lazarus' has had a hard life.
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Thought just throw these into the blog
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Other-Makes-Super-rare-ORIGINAL-360VB-1978-Montesa-360-VB-Cappra-Vintage-Motocross-MX_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6719QQihZ016QQitemZ260157996236QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Other-Makes-Beautifully-RESTORED-250VE-1977-Montesa-250-VE-Cappra-Vintage-Motocross-MX_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6719QQihZ016QQitemZ260158004739QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Other-Makes-Super-rare-ORIGINAL-125VA-1975-Montesa-125-VA-Cappra-Vintage-Motocross-MX_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6719QQihZ016QQitemZ260157990956QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Other-Makes-Enduro-NICE-original-250-1975-Montesa-250-King-Scorpion-Vintage-Motocross-MX_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6719QQihZ016QQitemZ260157980716QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
Those Bully boys could only dream of such quality ;D ;D
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Gee. And he doesn't want much for them!! ::). A '77 VE 250 is indeed a VERY rare thing! My man in the know say's tread carefully.......
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Graeme. You MUST get the proper gasket that goes between the cylinder and the intake manifold. I've tried different types of sealers and nothing seems to work as well as the proper gasket.
Learn from my mistakes....... :'(
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Welcome back 414, this montesa thread/s went really quiet for a while ;)
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this montesa thread/s went really quiet for a while ;)
thats because I've had a number of issues including buying an investment property ::). Now I'm a dirty capitalist with two properties to maintain - no time for them stinking motorcycles ::)
Nah, just kidding :D(about no time for them stinking motorcycles).
Somethings have/are happening but the big issue of making the engine mounts has stalled. Trying to find my hole saw arbor (worth $60). Tempted to go buy another but you know what will happen if I do.... ::)
Yeah, welcome back 414 Ross :-* ;D. Did you get to the Bully w.e.?
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Did you get that seat/frame thing sorted Graeme?
I know what I have to do and I got it figured how I'm gonna do it but haven't actually done it yet. I intend to do the mounts and frame straightening in the one welding session.
But not today. Brakes on the Navara need doing :( and I'm gonna attack an Oliander (spg?) with a chain saw :)
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Just in case you haven't seen it....
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/montessa-250-motorcycle-70s-model_W0QQitemZ230194771477QQihZ013QQcategoryZ102690QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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Just in case you haven't seen it....
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/montessa-250-motorcycle-70s-model_W0QQitemZ230194771477QQihZ013QQcategoryZ102690QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
I'll finish what I got first Thanks ::) ;D
But great potential there. I think the V75 is one fine looking bike and good period performance.
(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/mx250a/cp250_75.gif)
But $500 starting price for seized engine, seized rear suspension, missing seat and a full resto, is a bit ambitious I would have thought.
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Im currently putting back together 1977 Montesa 250 H and need complete seat base,foam and cover, air box to carb boot, full set of cables and probably other things not mentioned, is southwest montesa the go for all parts as not being very succesful in tracking down oz suppliers, not going back to enduro set up and will only be used on the track, are all seat bases the same for this year model say between cappra and enduro models, ie would 77/78 VB seat bases same as 250H, looks like southwest dont have any covers in stock, is vintage dirt bike better option for parts, im confused and this is first foray into montesas
Still cant get seat covers and air box boots afetr nearly 3 months, tried rocky mountain and they havent come back either, any ideas, staring to piss me off taking up bench space ::)
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Still cant get seat covers and air box boots afetr nearly 3 months, tried rocky mountain and they havent come back either, any ideas, staring to piss me off taking up bench space ::)
Have you emailed Jared at SWMontesa Rossco. I'm pretty sure he has what you need.
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Still cant get seat covers and air box boots afetr nearly 3 months, tried rocky mountain and they havent come back either, any ideas, staring to piss me off taking up bench space ::)
Have you emailed Jared at SWMontesa Rossco. I'm pretty sure he has what you need.
Regulary like fortnightly but still no seat covers or boots and cant give a time, just coming soon, 3 monthsbit dissapointed hearing that same responce but i will get over it but not what I could foresee before buying bike ::)
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I just like the seat covers on Jareds web site but now youve put the mocka on, its gauranteed to get torn first ride :D thought of pod, guess i just would like to put it back to original straight away but riding it would be better, what the fu-k, ill take your advice 414 and bite the bullet for now, other bits will show up eventually :)
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other bits will show up eventually :)
Yeah, I think this is a good approach especially for Monties - so long as you don't bastardise things such that they can't be taken back to original when bits become available.
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Hi guy's,
I apologize for the delays in getting some of the repro parts out. Many times I am at the mercy of a supplier that don't understand the urgency of vintage enthusiast's,
(me included!) and is reproducing an item as a hobby and dosn't really need the money to survive. This includes the guy's that makes my seat covers, exhaust pipes, and seat foams.
When I have a part repoped, I'm not alway's sure how well that part is going to sell, or how long it's going to sit on the shelf tying up my money! I had the VB seat covers and foam repoped at the same quantity and didn't think about having more seat covers made, duh... I didn't think that some would want just a cover!..Now there on backorder and the supplier is taking his sweet time in getting them to me! The best suggestion I can give, is to grab the stuff when it becomes available, and if you can afford it, buy two!
Cheers, Jared
S/W Montesa
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Thanks for your response Jared, ill get an order off this week for other parts needed but was trying to save on postage, lucky the aussie dollars up though, it can be frustrating little hold ups and realise we are all dictated to by third parties, need to talk your supplier into getting a good cappra from you then hold him to ransom when he needs parts ;D
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Hopefully the proud owner has been doing his push ups and other arm excercises as he will probably need all the strength he can muster when the throttle is opened
(http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s297/Lozza85_2007/025.jpg)
A tight fit and had to fight the length but i's on there.
(http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s297/Lozza85_2007/023.jpg)
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Is the front wheel gunna miss that thing? :o
Front wheel???? Who needs a front wheel? Front wheels are for pussies. This thing makes sooo much power life is just one endless wheelie ;D.
Front wheel and engine internals are just so much unnecessary weight to slow you down. ;)