OzVMX Forum
Clubroom => General Discussion => Topic started by: bazza on January 20, 2013, 06:00:42 pm
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people planning holidays / accomodation / flights etc. Any idea when we will know AJ or Ken?
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Good question ;D
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We're chasing the date as much as you are, but an announcement is several weeks away.
Regards
Ken
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same location ?
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Thanks Ken
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another month gone any one heard anything?
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I spent 3 years on the Committee of a Vintage Bike Club.
And One thing that amazed me was that Blokes would ring up and
Wanted to know when the Next years Calendar was out...
Before the year was even started ….
But it was not till Ask .....Why do you need to know Now!!!!
We have not worked out all the Date yet.
Can you hang On a bit longer!!!
The Answer was ........I need to get in first to let my Boss know witch
Saturdays I need to get Off...some wanted to take the Monday off as well .
And if left too long I could Miss out on getting the days off...That I need if I want to come to that Event ...
Then It all made scents...
So I now under stand Why …
And it works Both ways The Blokes at VMX are trying to run a Grate Mag
And Put on a Big event like Classis Dirt 10 and thare is a Shit load of work to do That...…
And Blokes are trying to get in first to the Boss for the weekend
Or for a week off work ……..
It all make thing Hard Sorry
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I will never forget last year, i took the friday off from work, we set up camp in the rain and sleet on friday arvo as the sun went down some dude on a four wheeler came and told us we were too close to the fence. It was a good thing that the dude had a couple of kids with him so we just buttoned our lips and did what he asked. We had to move everything. two hours later some more people set up in the same possi near the fence and they stayed there all weekend. What a F around. so it goes to show its not worth getting there early to get a good position.
I must say that marking out with track hardwood timber stakes seemed a bit dangerous.
Brett
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another month gone any one heard anything?
I believe Suzuki Australia the main sponsor usually run it before Phillip Is. So thats a gap of about 7 months :-\ :P ;D
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A date hasn't been announced for CD10 as yet for the simple reason it hasn't been set. We are frustrated that this hasn't happened as yet but hopefully it will be known in the next few weeks (and advertised in Issue 53 - out in mid-March).
Brett, please call me anytime 02 9452 1444 or email me if you have complaints about the event, I'm happy to discuss any time. In short though, we had conditions on our Development Consent (yes, we had to lodge a Development Application with Council and submit Statements of Environmental Effects, Traffic Reports, Neighbour consultation, other impacts etc etc etc) with Lithgow Council that required certain setbacks from the neighbouring properties. The person who asked you to move back was doing their job (and unfortunately the same person should have asked the others to move). After the event, we received a letter from Council stating that the neighbour had complained that some people camped too close to their boundary, in violation of our Consent conditions, and at this moment in time that issue with Council remains unresolved. That issue, however, is not the reason for not having a date for CD10 at this point, in case you were wondering, that's just another matter to resolve. As for the 'dangerous' wooden stakes for marking out the track, they were reviewed (and recommended) by not only numerous racers with national and international experience but also by the MNSW official who signed off on the track. They were only a few inches out of the ground, practically at ground level, and certainly did not cause any injuries to the 500 or so riders who were at the event.
Regards
Ken
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The set back from the boundary was also marked by rope complete with bright orange flags and also signs with bright red text ,stating no camping beyond this point.
Its beyond comprehension why people would even set up camp there anyway.
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thanks ken- You do have some issues....bloody red tape and councils
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Do you have a month ? we are about to do our Dt and MX calenders for the year and would like to avoid that month if possible so people can go to your event and not class. I assume Broadford is still on for April ?
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September still looks the best.
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Ken mate i fully understand about council regulations and the fact that there were conditions placed on the event,
Why were we not told as we paid our money at the gate or when we were directed where to setup camp. If anything someone may consider this to save others inconvenience
Brett
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Just about the best track I've ever ridden on ... and having it
bunted/taped all the way around just made it feel
so much better. Saturday morning was gold.
Like a British GP or similar. L.O.V.E.D - I.T!!!
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I could not believe how fast and how well the old champs were riding on the trick old bikes at the lunchtime exhibition.
Brett
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It was a good track, but best ever? wow.....
Needed a few jumps and less off camber corners. There were far too many of them and everyone I spoke to on the weekend agreed.
(I am speaking of the main track here btw).
This should not be seen as criticism, simply feedback - although I am sure the usual trolls will jump all over it.... ::)
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I have never been to CD as I am new to VMX
One question can juniors ride? My son is 10 and races and I am sure he could handle the track.
Would be a nice father son event.
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I think its AO riding TFR. I will go again for the day if it is in Lithgow/ /Wang
Brett
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"Needed a few jumps and ..."
That exactly why I loved it - no jumps!!
(This white man can't jump or ride over bumps)
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Look I had a Top time and so did my son and all the Blokes in our Camp..
I used 20 ltr of petrol in a 4 stroke .that a lot of riding .
All track where Fun and Safe . the Big long tracks made it even safer than any other Years .
One of the Thing I love so much is that is all ezy layed back Good time ..
Just like all the other 9 befor it.
When every it is or when every it is I we Be going ..
By the Way My son is 22 years Old ...
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Sorry to be a Troll but I loved the off cambers and no jumps.
Suited my tired old body and it was just good old fashion fun to ride.
There was heaps of room to overtake with most corners having many options for lines.
Remember also that this event draws out a lot of guys that don’t ride much and if the track was too full on then they would just end up spectators.
We arrived late in miserable weather and finding a camp site was hard in the dark. We were wondering what the deal was with the bunted off camping sections.
Don’t you just love the modern beurocratic world.
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I will never forget last year, i took the friday off from work, we set up camp in the rain and sleet on friday arvo as the sun went down some dude on a four wheeler came and told us we were too close to the fence. It was a good thing that the dude had a couple of kids with him so we just buttoned our lips and did what he asked. We had to move everything. two hours later some more people set up in the same possi near the fence and they stayed there all weekend. What a F around. so it goes to show its not worth getting there early to get a good position.
I must say that marking out with track hardwood timber stakes seemed a bit dangerous.
Brett
Dear Brett
I am going to reply on behalf of the 6 main people that set CD 9 up all non paid helpers
1 You took Friday off most of us where there 2 weekends before and the week leading up to it and a couple of days after to set up and clean up!
2 You had to set up your camp in the rain and snow. You should have been there the week end before we started at first light and the snow didnt melt until about 11oclock and it was F*%King cold all day!
3 The Dude in the ATV is a very good mate and he would not have asked you to move just to be a Pr$%K.
4 There where boundry markers placed all around the campsite and signs so I am not sure how you managed to miss them when the other 300 campers didn't?
5 2 hours later which would have been in the pitch dark you say someone else turned up and pitched there tent in the same place well good on you for watching them do it and saying nothing to them!
6 14 kms of bunting was laid all 2000 pegs where put in and laid over in the direction of traffic and pointing away from the track with the bunting secured at the bottom I know because I went round and checked every peg saturday morning on every track. I look forward to you supplying us with a more suitable safety peg ( We will need at least 2000)
7 I should imagine the reason other people where not asked to move was because of the storm that hit friday night I know the six of us had bigger issues to deal with than that!
So when you get on this forum complaining that it was a bit inconvenient spare a thought for all the manly club members and all the other helpers that gave up there week end to make sure you had a good time.
Warm Regards
Steve Baker
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Well said Steve. :) May I personally thank you from the bottom of my heart for all the work and spare time you and the band of helpers put in to staged a great show. It was the best weekend iv'e had for a long long time. As Doggy said the tracks were Grouse and set up well also. Rode as much as I could and drank all night with a pile of old mates. Really the only complaint I had was the CD9 hangover I had each morning. Had an absolute ball.!!!! :) :) Regards Les
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So when you get on this forum complaining that it was a bit inconvenient spare a thought for all the manly club members and all the other helpers that gave up there week end to make sure you had a good time.
Well written Steve.....Quite often the poor bastards who donate their time, energy and sometimes finances are overlooked by punters who think that these events just materialise out of the ether. I'm certain Brett's a really nice bloke and perhaps the inclement weather clouded his outlook, I know Friday nights windstorm tested a lot of our patience. I hope he now understands that while some rules seem a bit silly, they're usually in place to placate some official body or another, most often Sport and Recreation or local council legislation. For big events like CD to work we all need to play by the rules whether we think they're dumb or not. Once anarchy takes over at these big events, things turn to shit really quickly and the event is spoiled for everyone.
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Well said, Steve. As one person put it to me at an MX event "You only do it so you can order people around" ::) I don't work at MX events much anymore.
The carparking event that is CD friday is pretty stressful :o
Cheers
Noel
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"You only do it so you can order people around"
I thought that about you too Noel ::).............just kidding, I've copped the exact same comment and it's pretty demoralising.
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I have never been to CD as I am new to VMX
One question can juniors ride? My son is 10 and races and I am sure he could handle the track.
Would be a nice father son event.
Just to clarify: No, Juniors are not allowed to ride at Classic Dirt. While it would be a "nice thing" to be able to do, the extra administrative issues, along with having to have yet another track just make this impossible. And of course, it's bad enough trying to stop old men racing about in the camping area on minibikes, let alone having kids doing so. ;D
FYI, we had a group of young kids racing around the camping area at CD4 and it ended up being very nasty indeed. Frankly, we just don't need the aggro! ;)
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Ok steve and your 6 other mates that i have offended and everyone else who may be lookin in on this.
Sorry for being inappreciative.
I would like like to remove my previous posts, but that would be week as piss also
Cheers Brett
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Apology excepted Bret your welcome to have a beer with us at CD 10
Regards Steve
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Ok steve and your 6 other mates that i have offended and everyone else who may be lookin in on this.
Sorry for being inappreciative.
I would like like to remove my previous posts, but that would be week as piss also
Cheers Brett
Hang on Brett don't be so fast to retract some of what you said. I like all other rides appreciate all the volunteers that give of there time to all meetings. But keep in mind this is a for profit event not put on by the Manly club but the VMX magazine and by giving feedback it will be the only way things will be improved.
I for one question the need for wooden pegs as while being passed by one of the new Suzuki (450's) I was pushed off line (cut down on) and run clear over one off these and put a dent as large as my hand in the front of my GMC pipe (and that is hard to do on one off these), what would have happened if some one fell on one of these???. The QVMX in Queensland use purpose made blue plastic marks (and used to use PVC conduit prior to this which would be as low cost as the timber).
As for the track it was purpose made I am sure to keep the speed down but on a big bore bike lacked a little bit on imagination for sure. I know the event is more for the show case of the vintage movement but as one of the main draw cards is the riding this should not have to take a backwould step on what we have had in previous years.
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Hang on Brett don't be so fast to retract some of what you said. I like all other rides appreciate all the volunteers that give of there time to all meetings. But keep in mind this is a for profit event not put on by the Manly club but the VMX magazine and by giving feedback it will be the only way thinks will be improved.
I for one question the need for wooden pegs as while being passed by one of the new Suzuki (450's) I was pushed off line (cut down on) and run clear over one off these and put a dent as large as my hand in the front of my GMC pipe (and that is hard to do on one off these), what would have happened if some one fell on one of these???. The QVMX in Queensland use purpose made blue plastic marks (and used to use PVC conduit prior to this which would be as low cost as the timber).
As for the track it was purpose made I am sure to keep the speed down but on a big bore bike lacked a little bit on imagination for sure. I know the event is more for the show case of the vintage movement but as one of the main draw cards is the riding this should not have to take a backwould step on what we have had in previous years.
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So what do the purpose built blue plastic track markers look like? Where do you get them from?
Conduit may not be strong enough to support bunting (even tied at the base) from the effects of wind. And if it is secured in the ground that tightly, it surely would pose a greater potential for harm?
I saw some big bores hooting around that track at warp speed, maybe you were one of them.
Surely all the CD's can't be at Connondale?
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XC 83, if you send a PM to Robo 47 who is forum member. He is on the commitee with the QVMX and could answer this.
When we used the conduit it was around 750 high out of the ground and worked fine But as you say wind may be an issue but a lot less than fall on a timber peg!
I did not at any time speak of Conondale (yes it is a bench mark like it or not), but the first and one of the best I went to was Broadford as a purpose built track.
Shane
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Ok steve and your 6 other mates that i have offended and everyone else who may be lookin in on this.
Sorry for being inappreciative.
I would like like to remove my previous posts, but that would be week as piss also
Cheers Brett
Hey Brett I think it should be ok for riders to speak-up and voice matters that they didn't like, no one is denying the great job that hard working volunteers do but it dosen't hurt for everyone, volunteers included, to hear everyones opinions & ideas. I do a lot of volunteer work in motorcycle sport and I welcome feedback.
With regards to marking out a track, I was thinking about lining a track with a white line on the ground, either paint or white powder, it will stay there long enough for a weekend, it won't hurt anyone to ride over it, plus it will still look cool.
I dislike off-camber corners (I wrecked me hip in one) and I like the occassional jump (no monster doubles!). Maybe a few less off-cambers and a track layout that allows a detour around any soft jumps?
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XC 83, if you send a PM to Robo 47 who is forum member. He is on the commitee with the QVMX and could answer this.
When we used the conduit it was around 750 high out of the ground and worked fine But as you say wind may be an issue but a lot less than fall on a timber peg!
Shane
I've put these in at tracks like Conondale (and ridden over them too on the odd occassion ;D).
What they are is a plastic peg around 700-750mm long with the bottom (approx) 300mm being a plastic spike that is inserted in the ground and the remaining 400-450mm (approx) being a flat marker peg that bends at the junction of the spike and the flat peg .... if that makes sense. I've got a clear picture in my head of what they are but difficult to describe. A picture here would help but I've got nothing.
Whilst they are a hardish plastic, they are also flexible enought to not cause injury. In fact they use a cordless drill with a 25-30mm wood bit fitted to pre-drill the hole to insert them into the ground in harder areas. The 400-450mm flat (in profile) top I mentioned above is flexible enough to bend over when hit yet stiff enough (and profiled) to allow bunting to be tied around it and still stand (mostly) erect.
Not sure that helps without a picture, maybe Noel (NSR) has one as I'm sure he has placed plenty of these in the ground over the years.
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Can’t say I noticed the wooden pegs at CD but I have seen them before at other events and although they do a good job of holding the bunting down and making the track look good I always thought that they would be a recipe for disaster.
Don’t think I would like to land on a piece of PVC tube either.
Shane, if you haven’t repaired the pipe to your satisfaction yet then I can always slip it back in the jig and fit some new sections.
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(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s255/vmx42/Chris_Peris_Macau_zpsd26b83d1.jpg)
Or you could just stay on the track and you won't have any trouble with the track markers [no matter what they are made of...].
Geez you guys like to whinge... :(
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(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s255/vmx42/Chris_Peris_Macau_zpsd26b83d1.jpg)
Or you could just stay on the track and you won't have any trouble with the track markers [no matter what they are made of...].
Geez you guys like to whinge... :(
I'll keep that in mind Jeff (the stay on track bit) and as for the Whinge well I thought in a democratic Society we all had a right to a point of view?? I don't view points of safety as a whinge but I would be whinging if I had landed on one of those stakes!!
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Dear Riders who are unhappy with CD9
First of all you have all waited six months to voice your concerns on a open forum when you could have just as easily sent a PM or email voicing your concerns to Ken Smith.
CD events are not races they are tracks provided for all levels of rider ability to enjoy your old motorbike on. There are tracks all over Australia with jumps and berm's and what ever else you require to get your adrenallin pumping to use the other 363 days of the year.
Its is not very often these days you get a green field site to use so rather than whinging that it was not imaganative ( and I must say I was not going to tell Geoff Ballard his tracks where unimaganative but you can) and I'm sorry you couldn't impress your mates on your 500 overtaking everybody and roosting them as you go by because the hills are straight up and down. The track required a bit more skill and throttle control to ride the off cambers but by no means impossible the track was wide enough for safe overtaking, In fact I think that added to the enjoyment that the riders on the smaller capacity bikes where able to mix it up with the bigger bikes.
You all seem to have a problem with the pegs Connondale has a wooden fence running round it in parts. all these other places. that have had CD events are established tracks with facilities that have been built over many years so yo are not comparing apples with apples and it is very unfair to try to do that. While I have noted all your suggestions some are just not practical We are old guys (Laurie Alderton Chris Cater) setting these tracks up and I can tell you now I will not be bending over to to drill holes in the ground to put conduit in for hours on end its bad enough swinging a sledge hammer
At the riders briefing you all sign a bit of paper saying that you understand that motorcycling is dangerous and if you are unhappy with anything go and see the clerk of the course and if you are still unhappy don't ride. Simple no one is making you do it. You are riding a dirt bike on uneven terrain you are going to fall off and you are going to get hurt if you don't except that then you need to find another sport. Lets look at some of the positives no queuing to get on any of the tracks. You could ride as long as you wanted If your bike broke down an ATV would come and take your bike back to the pits
Great spectators area
Close to town and fuel and hotels/pub
Central to people travelling from the North South East and West ( within reason)
The weather was not kind to us Friday night when the main marquee was blown down but the next day everybody mucked in to get the the show back on the road it was great mates helping mates that what VMX is isn't it!
This year will be much better we have learnt by our mistakes but there will be problems and they will be overcome as all ways
Please come and enjoy a green field site as you may not get another chance as our sport is slowly strangled by red tape! (wonder what pegs they use)
Kind regards Steve Baker
I would just like to point out these are my own opinions and comments apart from Ken Smith being a mate I have no connection with VMX magazine
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…as for the Whinge well I thought in a democratic Society we all had a right to a point of view??
Of course you do... and it's my right to post that I disagree and think you are having a bit of a whinge. It is nothing I wouldn't say to you in person.
But the fact is there isn't a single way of marking a track that doesn't have a down side, or a safety issue - NOT ONE!
I don't think you could have found a safer track than the ones that were offered - good soil, smooth surface, loads of run-off, wide, flowing, bucket loads of room to pass, great visibility etc, etc... A rank novice could negotiate them with no trouble at all... Yes they were marked out with wooden stakes... but they have to be marked out with something... Was it perfect... NO, nothing is.
But kept in perspective the wooden stakes were a small, manageable and clearly defined safety hazard - especially [small] when compared to safety hazard presented by 600 lunatics on old motorcycles reliving their childhood dreams.
Gravity can be a real bitch... especially as we get older
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Well said VMX42
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Well for all you slow to keep up with the times Southerners, here's the plastic track markers we use in Qld, these photo's are from the "Conondale Classic" last year....BTW, if you want to ride the "best" track in Aussie, your only chance will be that race meeting....see you there...August 3rd/4th. ;)
(http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz213/mybasil44/DSC_5915.jpg)
Geoff Ballard Dave Armstrong Shane King
(http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz213/mybasil44/DSC_5913.jpg)
James Deacon
(http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz213/mybasil44/DSC_5876.jpg)
Simon Healy James Deacon Dave Armstrong
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Well for all you slow to keep up with the times Southerners, here's the plastic track markers we use in Qld, these photo's are from the "Conondale Classic" last year....BTW, if you want to ride the "best" track in Aussie, your only chance will be that race meeting....see you there...August 3rd/4th. ;)
(http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz213/mybasil44/DSC_5915.jpg)
Geoff Ballard Dave Armstrong Shane King
Thanks John .. like I said a picture would help. Those are the exact ones I was referring to .... very safe compared to stakes and just about anything else.
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Well I am happy to take this offline Jeff and odd1 give me a call on 0412 996 771 or PM me and we can discuss this further if you like.
If this is your attitute toward what is constructive conversation you have a head in the sand mentality and Steve you have missed the point altogether on what I was getting at and point of interest I have not waited six months to voice this I am giving six months notice before the next one (when ever that is??).
That is my last comment on this.
Regards
Shane Wilson
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STW996
Don't take offence. He's Welsh. ;D
Constructive critism can only be helpful to hold a better event next time. I guess GB and co have a lot to consider when laying out tracks, different skill levels, different machines, the terrain and remediation of the land after the event, as well as those project management issues: DA conditions, on time, quality and budget
It's good to get other ideas, learn of new tools for the job. The photos of the blue markers look interesting. Are they practical when you need 2000+ who knows? Worth a look at though.
There may even better ideas out there?
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quote ... "At the riders briefing you all sign a bit of paper saying that you understand that motorcycling is dangerous and if you are unhappy with anything go and see the clerk of the course and if you are still unhappy don't ride. Simple no one is making you do it. You are riding a dirt bike on uneven terrain you are going to fall off and you are going to get hurt if you don't except that then you need to find another sport ".
By signing this piece of paper the PROMOTOR still has a duty of care.... and this is the point being made.
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Risk Management is a whole other ball game....
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Yes the promoter does have a duty of care the tracks where inspected by an MA official and passed fit for use so the next line of responsibility is yourself if you are not happy you and only you can make that call.
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Well John, STW and Xl 83, thanks for your comments, thing is I did have a great time at CD9 and and the small issue of moving camp etc was far out weighed by the whole great experience of the weekend 10 times over.
Thanks to the property owner, the organisers (paid or not) and all the volunteers!
And Firko thanks for the kind word also.
Brett Number 85
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I've attended hundreds of riders briefings and often wondered if somebody refused to ride on what they deem as an unsafe track , Do they get a full refund on prepaid ride fees? If so do they get the money on the spot or do they wait for a refund further down the track.
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I went to last years connondale classic and had the best time of my life up there.
If i had a choice of going to either a classic dirt or a connondale classic, sorry but
connondale wins me over buy a mile.
i have been to a few CDs before but you just cant beat the excitement and adrenline rush of
racing against the best riders on one of the best vmx tracks around australia in Queensland.
See you all there again this year. :)
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There may even better ideas out there?
Using the above like Davey Crocket,though made with a four way split poly plumbing pipe.Father in law makes them for a nice price.Keep your eyes peeled at this years Manji 15000 ;D
Have to purchase a small orger to get them in the harder ground or a good crowbar :P
Other natural terrain events in WA use old car tryes,though have to be placed out and collected after each event. :P Tyre business happy for us to take them away. :P :)
For whats it worth West Aust hasnt used wooden stakes for about three years,only on entering and exiting Enduro check points.
ps The track guidelines dont specify requirments for a non comp event.
cheers A
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I did also see these hardwood stakes used at one of the CD events I couldnt believe my eyes .
I think a PVC plastic flexi material put in the ground on a slight down ward angle towards the racing direction. so if some falls on the pvc peg it lays flat no hert done. ( how hard is it ??? )
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Take the time to read ....Appendix 5 of the MOMS ;)
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Over the years I have ridden many enduro special tests and moto cross events with tracks designed by GB, Phil Lovett and Cris Cater, what you always find with their tracks is they include many off camber corners.Why ? because they are always a test of skill,everybody hates them! At the end of the day we ride them and learn from them and leave the event being a better rider! :o
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Well, on the enduro track they made us jump a LOG there was no down ramp or nothing and it was between trees only about 2m apart :o
Geez, MX used to be an extreme sport ::). I guess that’s enduros now, always has been really :P.
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Well, on the enduro track they made us jump a LOG there was no down ramp or nothing and it was between trees only about 2m apart :o
:D I think they call that EnduroX now.... ;) One thing hasnt changed ...OLD BIKES 8)
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Well, on the enduro track they made us jump a LOG there was no down ramp or nothing and it was between trees only about 2m apart :o
I didn't jump that log once.....
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Maybe we should form a club , lets say we call it the Classic Dirt Club.
Then we apply to the state government for a grant.
Then we buy some nice blue track markers , a couple of containers ,some generators , shit lets put a bridge across the road to reduce the opportunity of running some one over.
Really you pricks , grow some balls , its shit like this that make's "men" loose interest in putting on events.
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Hey HVA man, dont have a shot at clubs, alot of people put alot of hard work and money into them....your event (since your defending it) is a money making machine first and foremost.....if the magazine didnt make money it simply wouldnt happen...period!!. We are all learning every time we put an event on and we all make mistakes/forget things/cop shit weather...life goes on....A couple of people voice a few "negative" comments [ in your opinion]and its world war 3......things only get better when things are discussed....look at it as we can improve that next year. Re-read the last line of your post and then go look in a mirror......then go take a couple of moggadon's.
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World war three , now who's exagerating
And thanks for stating the obvious
"alot of people put alot of hard work and money into them"
Motorcycling Club's may be none for profit organisations , however if they dont make some money they also dont exist as result of the non funding issue.
And whilst we are at it "whats a moggadon ", is this some type of self pleasuring device you use whilst looking in the mirror. "Lighten up old man"
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I loved the tracks ,had a great weekend ,hope its colder and windier this year .Bring it on .I cant wait to get roosted by GB again every 3 laps .Yeehah .Hilly
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Interesting comments coming in on track marking - now there's something I have had a bit to do with . .
No one method is going to please everyone but you can get very close! How much are those blue markers I wonder, $4, $6, more? When you need 2000 they could be exxy.
Over the years we have tried most methods, and found out a few things . . it all depends on the type of event and what you want out of it and how much you can afford.
Non competitive events don't need the "full works" bunting all way round but they sure look good. One method I have been considering for a while and one which John O mentioned is painting lines on the edges of the track. This would look trick, saves a whole lot of pegs and no clean up afterwards! Only need to dress up the corners (parawebbing, hay bales, cones, even some blue markers ;D and you have a good track that would feel pretty good to ride. If you want to be a bit slack, paint one line down the middle and tell the riders to follow it - the track will then mark itself in.
For competition events we find the riders like to "invent" good lines without physical barriers. Bunting (tape) the whole track is a good thing (looks good but loads of work) and seems to be the accepted norm, but wont fully prevent the 'inventive' riders. All you can do is setting up the corner entry and corners well with physical barriers like mentioned above.
There are a bunch of things to consider that CAN and DO go wrong with track marking methods - wind, riders constantly taking out tape, access for officials vehicles / medics / water trucks etc. Having the tape any distance off the ground creates lots of problems, and so do the pegs that hold it there!
We tried very cheap 19mm garden grade poly tubing (soft stuff) - easy to cut with scissors, light to carry, very flexible if hit. We used battery drills with old wood augers in them to drill holes odd1.
I can tell you now I will not be bending over to to drill holes in the ground to put conduit in for hours on end its bad enough swinging a sledge hammer
You can weld extensions to the augers if you like. I can tell you it IS easier than banging in stakes, each hole takes about 10 secs and you work with a mate who pokes them in the holes. Just need plenty of drills / batteries!
The tape in these photos is held by poly pipe. (http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s612/Barra11/Saharacloseup3_zps7ebdb8b5.jpg)
(http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s612/Barra11/Overall_zps2572f583.jpg)
It works really well when you keep the tape close to the ground, they dont pull out if hit by a bike.
(http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s612/Barra11/IMG_2826_zps8bcd35c1.jpg)
(http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s612/Barra11/IMG_3023_zpscbe653ba.jpg)
Of course if you feel the need to go over the top and spend $25,000 on sponsors roller banners you could do this . .
(http://i1308.photobucket.com/albums/s612/Barra11/Calmbefore_zpsb934b12e.jpg)
Sorry 'bout all the photos but thought people might like to see them. Oh, and the photos only show the soft stuff, but 90% of our ground is hard as a goats forehead!
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We use "baynott" like 300mm steel rod about 10mm round with 20mm round welded to the end-push or bang in ground and flexi plastic tube sits in the top 20mm bit
for cost you can use bunting only on corners-colour A on left and colour B on right.
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Geez Barra who paid for that lot :o :o
and for those that dont know why, its not left around after any marked out event.
(http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r259/vmx247/P6250216_zps0c6617d6.jpg)
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The blue track markers that we use at QVMX are made in Sydney....how good is that....Ph 0408 694804.....they cost $4 each for orders under 500 and cheaper if you order more.....and as Barra said, its easier drilling holes in the ground than banging them in and at the end of the day they're easier to pull out.....easy to store and hard too miss when your packing up.....and dont dent pipes. ;D
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Geez Barra who paid for that lot
The sponsors, the club, . . . . . and the spectators. That was the 2005 Oceania MX. We made a loss though, so can any of you guys who went please chip in another $10 and we should break even! ha ha
Sorry for continuing to take this off topic, I'll guess we can blame STW996 for that one :o - but it is an important issue and relevant to CD or any green field event. Hopefully some good ideas get put out there for others to pick up on. Even though wooden stakes are easy, it would be good to see the end of them - or at least to never ever again see another event where they are driven in wrongly i.e. upright!!
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How many injuries were recorded at CD9 related to wooden stakes?
To say that they were incorrectly installed I believe is also incorrect.
Cheers
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Geez Barra who paid for that lot
The sponsors, the club, . . . . . and the spectators. That was the 2005 Oceania MX. We made a loss though, so can any of you guys who went please chip in another $10 and we should break even! ha ha
Sorry for continuing to take this off topic, I'll guess we can blame STW996 for that one :o - but it is an important issue and relevant to CD or any green field event. Hopefully some good ideas get put out there for others to pick up on. Even though wooden stakes are easy, it would be good to see the end of them - or at least to never ever again see another event where they are driven in wrongly i.e. upright!!
Thats a good size event to be spending the $$ on then. :o and relavant to all events even the usual club day across OZ.
On the hijack of thread and STW996,you may have missed todays departing of vmx42.Hopefully he'll have a break and return soon.Everyones entitled to there opinion on ozvmx ;D
Thread hijacks are as common as oilin the chain and fillin up your tank.After all, we are all here for the same thing ~ old bikes,dirt and fun.
cheers
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How many injuries were recorded at CD9 related to wooden stakes?
To say that they were incorrectly installed I believe is also incorrect.
Cheers
Sorry XC83, my comments were not pointed to CD 9, I'm sure it was great event. Just saying it would be good for all events that use them that they be put in right. Happy to see you're on the ball, we need to clone you! :D
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The wooden stake debate is a thread hijack, I certainly didn’t mean my opinion to be a slight against CD as they are used at many events and I don’t know what injuries they have ever caused but they make me nervous when I see them.
It’s not just the Greenfield tracks that use these short wooden stakes as the first time I really paid any attention to them was a few years ago at a big meeting at Broadford where they had used them around the whole track to hold the bunting in place.
They do make the track look good by holding the bunting in place which makes for a professional and picturesque track, but at Broadford they were pointing in all directions and even though you could point them away from the direction of travel there is no guarantee that they won’t be nudged throughout the day.
The thought of some one being impaled on them brings a shudder through my spine.
I understand the wooden pegs are cheap and simple and not all events can justify more expenditure but if they can be avoided then all the better.
A couple of years back I rider in front of me hit one of the metre long stakes used to hold the bunting at Harrow which then flew through the air and bounced off my headlight smashing it to pieces before it bounced off my shoulder. It had quite a bit of force to it and while a sore shoulder and a new headlight surround were no big deal to me, fate can sometimes deal cruel blows and if the stake had of been at a different angle when it hit me it may have created a different story.
Yeah I know, we wiz past trees and rocks and all manner of shit all the time and I will continue to do so but safety issues shouldn’t be scoffed at.
I heard that the tyres surrounding Broadford track had to be removed to satisfy the FIM when the GP’s came to town a decade ago (although it may have only been the truck tyres).
And Jeff, while I disagree with you I see no need for you to commit virtual suicide, I look forward to your views whether I agree with them or not.
If everyone I disagreed with left here I would find it lonely by myself.
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How many injuries were recorded at CD9 related to wooden stakes?
Cheers
Hopefully none but do you really think that is a valid arguement? Does the fact that there were none at CD9 mean that there will be none at future events?
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Seeing a bunch of these at some road works made me think of the whole issue of track markers. They retail for around $20, therefore wholesale for around $12-$13 putting the wholesalers cost around $6-$7
I thought they would be easy to use, no drilling/hammering etc and use the bunting tape or rope (with sponsors banners on them). MA could purchase a container (or three) direct from China (I'm sure there is enough people around who deal with China to help with this) and then sell/subsidise (or give ;D) to clubs. Although the cost to mark a whole track may be too expensive.
http://optraffic.en.made-in-china.com/product/WKGJXCsxbEVc/China-Australian-Standard-T-Top-Bollard-NT-TBD-01-.html (http://optraffic.en.made-in-china.com/product/WKGJXCsxbEVc/China-Australian-Standard-T-Top-Bollard-NT-TBD-01-.html)
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That's a very dangerous mix....bikies and bollards :o