OzVMX Forum
Marque Remarks => Yamaha => Topic started by: Tahitian_Red on November 27, 2012, 02:18:13 pm
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How do you ID the three different HL500 builds (Hallman-Lundin,NVT and Pro-Fab)?
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Have you spotted one TR?
I believe Profab made the frames for Hallman so as far as I am aware there were only 2 originals.
They are very similar but can be picked apart by…
Footpegs –
Profab had splined mounts on the frame.
NVT had 2 tapped bosses welded to the lower tube.
Steering stops –
Profab had 2 tubes sticking out just like Husky’s did.
NVT had 2 bits of flat.
And GMC frames all have GMCHL### stamped on the front of the headstock and on top of the swingarm crosspiece and are replica’s of the NVT frames.
Also Frames for the Yamaha engine had a vertical square box backbone behind the engine.
Frames without this will be for Suzuki or Honda engines and both Profab and Curtis made them for these engines. Curtis frames being styled very closely on the NVT frame.
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP1004.jpg)
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/TT010204-076.jpg)
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GMC,
So, I would guess this is an early ProFab with Marzocchi forks? The front motor mount had me wondering, but it has the boxed tube oil tank.
(http://www.vintagemx.us/images/photos/15497616-21909-large.jpg)
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That looks every bit like a Profab.
Tube steering stops.
Flat bar around the headstock. The head gussets will only have a small part that welds to the rear of the headstock.
NVT frames didn’t have the flat bar but the head gussets wrapped around to the front side of the headstock.
Profab frames had a couple of different versions of swingarms.
The brochure even had 2 types on it.
The one on that bike is the most common, it also looks very similar to the 79 NVT arm
78 NVT’s had the ‘banana’ style arm
It looks like it has the right engine mount plates in alloy, it just has some strange black ones on top!!!
Actually the black plates might be the top engine plates, just bolted with the others for safekeeping.
It’s hard to make out the footpegs in that view.
Is it just me or is it the more knowledge you gain on the details of old bikes the more pathetic you feel ::) :D
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a393/gmcloa/GMC%20parts/Hallman-1C.jpg)
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a393/gmcloa/GMC%20parts/Hallman-2C.jpg)
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Is it just me or is it the more knowledge you gain on the details of old bikes the more pathetic you feel
Not just you ::)
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I have not seen a bare Hallman XR/XL Frame,
Does anyone have a photo?
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Is it just me or is it the more knowledge you gain on the details of old bikes the more pathetic you feel
Not just you ::)
mmm, yes, I know what you mean. I am hoping to get an new anorach for Christmas...!!!
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Geoff I think you are right. Having owned a Profab bike that frame is identical as far as I can see in the photos. The engine plates would appear to be the correct alloy front plates and the head stays attached to that.
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP1004.jpg)
Just as well you sold it Paul.
It would have cost a fortune in swingarm pivot sliders to run (and blocks of wood to stand on when sittin' on it)..... ???
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Wonder how Sten Lundin and Torsten Hallman would feel about all these jacked up wonders ???
Can only imagine they would feel like Leonardo De Vinci would feel about these
(http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e204/tmbill/imagesCAYO6O7M.jpg)
(http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e204/tmbill/imagesCAQWZY9W.jpg)
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP1004.jpg)
Just as well you sold it Paul.
It would have cost a fortune in swingarm pivot sliders to run (and blocks of wood to stand on when sittin' on it)..... ???
your still dirty that the maico in the back ground was not for you and i seem to remember that big bores werent for you either! considering you sold the lot after the famous wonthaggie ride in a ambulance incedent
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I was bidding on a 440 just like that one once...... :-\
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I was bidding on a 440 just like that one once...... :-\
i know you were but it take a special type off person to own one
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I always thought that real HL's had a 3 valve head?
Is that true or was it only a few special ones?
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Is it just me or is it the more knowledge you gain on the details of old bikes the more pathetic you feel
It can be a curse ::).
Wonder how Sten Lundin and Torsten Hallman would feel about all these jacked up wonders
Every time I see an HL with 43mm forks and long rear shocks I ask the same question. They are such a cool bike in their original stance.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/HL500_profab_750.jpg)
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/AbergThumper_edit.jpg)
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I always thought that real HL's had a 3 valve head?
Is that true or was it only a few special ones?
A small number of 3 valve heads were produced tested on Bengts race bike as a skunk works R&D project connected to the whole HL500 deal. Finally the moulds and the heads went back to Japan to disappear.... except for 1 head which is still in the Aberg garage from all accounts, we asked Bengt.
Daytona the Japanese perfromance house did high port big valve head for SR500 racing, price is a little ouch though.
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Wonder how Sten Lundin and Torsten Hallman would feel about all these jacked up wonders
Every time I see an HL with 43mm forks and long rear shocks I ask the same question. They are such a cool bike in their original stance.
[/quote]
Not this old Chesnut again, yes true the short travel bikes suit Hobbit size riders. 'Stance' sounds like something they talk about in Live to Ride magazine.
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;D Hobbit size riders
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Wonder how Sten Lundin and Torsten Hallman would feel about all these jacked up wonders
Every time I see an HL with 43mm forks and long rear shocks I ask the same question. They are such a cool bike in their original stance.
Not this old Chesnut again, yes true the short travel bikes suit Hobbit size riders. 'Stance' sounds like something they talk about in Live to Ride magazine.
[/quote]
Yeah Bengt Aberg is Hobbit sized ::) ::) ::)
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Not cheap .
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/15494283-30177-large.jpg)
FOR SALE
Ad # 3205964 November 27, 2012
Brand New - Hallman / Pro Fab - Banana style Aluminum Swing Arm - fits the Yamaha TT500 & XT500 's - has bronze bushing already installed & and ready to go !!!
Profab built swingarms for Hallman / White Brothers / & I believe D&G - and of course sold them under there own name ( Pro Fab ) The Straight Arms were much more comman - The Banana arms were more Rare.
Please conside - this Arm is Absolutley Brand New - its NOT 35 years Old - It hasent been thought 100's or 1000's of MX Battles - It Doesnt have Metal Fatige - Its hasent had the drive chain trying to saw though it for decades.
Its Brand New !!!
I can & will ship over sea's.
$750.
520-270-8188
Mark Palermo
Tucson, AZ, US of A
Phone: 520-270-8188 | Email
Registered Since 1/22/2009 | 1201 Posts
Has anyone ever noticed that this bloke has advertised the same stuff on Marks Swapmeet every week for literally months and never seems to sell anything? He's had the same swingarms, old Jap 4t engines and bikes for months. The late Bob Neilson warned me to never deal with him, I wonder why he bothers?
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I just tentatively sold much nicer White Bros one with the original stay arm that holds the brake cable for $700 NZ and turned it into DR400 White Bros arm.
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(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP1004.jpg)
Anti-squat, like lots of good things, can be taken too far sometimes....... ::)
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its a lot easier to get on when your bike is lowered right ross ;D
there was a lot off swearing going on that day
(http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo263/ozmaico/IMGP3393.jpg)
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The guy with the HL is looking for an air-box for the bike. Anyone know if there are any reproductions being made?
He said he found it listed as a trail bike. :o
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you will have to ask him if it will fit a pro fab frame
http://www.geoffmorrisconcepts.com/23/online-shop/254-Hl-Alloy-Airbox-Polished/
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So, I would guess this is an early ProFab
(http://www.vintagemx.us/images/photos/15497616-21909-large.jpg)
Actually I reckon it could be a late Profab.
Compared to this one from 77, TR's frame has a different bend in the backbone tube and the shock mounts are higher in the frame, Possibly to fit longer shocks for more travel.
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a393/gmcloa/Misc%20bike%20stuff/HLmagazine1.jpg)
If anyone really hates the long travel versions that much then maybe you should send off some angry e-mails to Rick Johnson & Ron Lechien :D
The guy with the HL is looking for an air-box for the bike. Anyone know if there are any reproductions being made?
If I remember correctly my sidecovers and exhaust fit the Profab frames but the airbox doesn't
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Profab has a different hanger-bracket for the airbox than the NVT.
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One way to spot the difference on the NVT compared to ProFab/Aaberg is that the frame is much closer to the engine on the ProFab.
Look at the front engineplate.
ProFab:
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd485/ola_martin/31front.jpg)
NVT:
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd485/ola_martin/8front.jpg)
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Wonder how Sten Lundin and Torsten Hallman would feel about all these jacked up wonders ???
Can only imagine they would feel like Leonardo De Vinci would feel about these
(http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e204/tmbill/imagesCAYO6O7M.jpg)
(http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e204/tmbill/imagesCAQWZY9W.jpg)
When a line up of HLs was put together in France, Sten seem rather happy to see them all lines up (high and mighty) Have a pick of him signing my tank and he seems quite happto to put his name on it.
He rode on in the Beauval Enduro a year or two later on a high HL and smiled all day long, so I dont think he was that dissapointed.
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Not cheap .
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/15494283-30177-large.jpg)
FOR SALE
Ad # 3205964 November 27, 2012
Brand New - Hallman / Pro Fab - Banana style Aluminum Swing Arm - fits the Yamaha TT500 & XT500 's - has bronze bushing already installed & and ready to go !!!
Profab built swingarms for Hallman / White Brothers / & I believe D&G - and of course sold them under there own name ( Pro Fab ) The Straight Arms were much more comman - The Banana arms were more Rare.
Please conside - this Arm is Absolutley Brand New - its NOT 35 years Old - It hasent been thought 100's or 1000's of MX Battles - It Doesnt have Metal Fatige - Its hasent had the drive chain trying to saw though it for decades.
Its Brand New !!!
I can & will ship over sea's.
$750.
520-270-8188
Mark Palermo
Tucson, AZ, US of A
Phone: 520-270-8188 | Email
Registered Since 1/22/2009 | 1201 Posts
Has anyone ever noticed that this bloke has advertised the same stuff on Marks Swapmeet every week for literally months and never seems to sell anything? He's had the same swingarms, old Jap 4t engines and bikes for months. The late Bob Neilson warned me to never deal with him, I wonder why he bothers?
Not cheap? $750 is about £500. That is a piece of art and requires emmense effort, skill and craft to make. Ok, so £500 is £500 and yes that is alot of money, but I dont think it is bad value. (ok so you are saying, it isnt cheap and I am agreeing with you, $100 would be cheap! but $750 is probably fair)
Dont know the seller, so cant comment. Maybe he has a stack of them and a truck load of motors and he is selling them and is just relisting the advert.
I hope people dont think that about my ebay adverts. I always relist and just have multiple items that do sell, and hopefully off ebay as well as I would rather not pay their fees if I dont have to!
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And on the subject of jackd up HLs, I have some new in the box 81 490 Maico shocks that according to the Falcon website are only mm different in length difference.
I took recently took my 490 spec Ohlins off my HL and sold them and will replace them with a new set. If anyone else would like a set PM me. (I know the postage prices to Oz as well, can let you know and if required, get them straight off into the post)
Ohlins even list a spec for the HL (if you look you can find it....)
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I think the main thing here is reputation, not repeted listings, and you Ben has a good one.
Back to the engineplates ::)
On my Huskyframed replica, the frame is also close to the engine, and the ProFab is based on a modded Huskyframe isn't it?
(http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/dd485/ola_martin/engine.jpg)
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I think they would be pretty close, with the Maico having quite a bit more laid down shocks, and the HL beeing quite a bit heavyer bike.
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And on the subject of jackd up HLs, I have some new in the box 81 490 Maico shocks that according to the Falcon website are only mm different in length difference.
I took recently took my 490 spec Ohlins off my HL and sold them and will replace them with a new set. If anyone else would like a set PM me. (I know the postage prices to Oz as well, can let you know and if required, get them straight off into the post)
Ohlins even list a spec for the HL (if you look you can find it....)
Unfortunately Maico shocks and HL are totally different in damping and springrate . They may have a similar lenght ;) By the time you buy new springs and get them revalved they could cost a fair bit more . Our equivalent to the ones you are talking about ,cost incl GST ,in Australia $799 or less when the X mas sale is on .
Agreed. The guts of the shock is also rather important!
It is difficult to build the optimum set of shocks for an HL as they are all so different. People wanting different lengths, running different frames (as per this thread, Profab, NVT modified Husky etc etc) different swinging arms etc etc etc etc. What is a standard specification for an HL?!
The 490 shock is pretty damn good in it’s standard form so is a good universal shock for most people and most applications.
Tuning the shock for optimum length, damping spring rates etc is the way to go if you are lucky enough to be able to get this kind of help. Oz is lucky to have this kind of service.
In the UK there are a number of excellent suspension service centres that can help you set the bike up exactly to your requirements (at a price of course) and you are right that to do that work will cost big bucks, so try and get it right out of the box is the way to go.
For instance I bought 4 Ohlins springs the other day and they were £50 each plus tax ~ even the short ones cost that much, same price as the long ones which I cant understand, so £200+ for a set of shock springs ~that hurt. Even more so when my mate said he didn’t them need them....and sent them back!!
For most riders an out of the box set of shock will be fine. Start with a quality set of shocks at the beginning then you are off to a winner. If you are GP star and need optimum shocks then that service is available. Better still If you can have a custom built set of shocks then so much the better!
The VMX world is very lucky to have so many options!
Let's get back to the subject ~ HL Yamahas. Mmm nice!
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If anyone else would like a set PM me. (I know the postage prices to Oz as well, can let you know and if required, get them straight off into the post)
I think AJ might be wanting a set Ben. You could throw them in my box. He or I will let you know tomorrow.
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Stefan Everts, Team Belgium , Geoff Ballards etc like the shocks we make . Are things that bad in england that you have to canvass in australia ?
No not at all. England is a bit soggy at the moment after all the rain, but other than that all is well.
Ohlins is a global brand and the world is a very small place these days. Anything can be sent in a box anywhere including Australia.
Riders should have a choice and there is plenty out there.
YSS, are fantastic quality and very well priced. Having them custom built only adds to the attractiveness of the product. Having a good agent to help them at the meetings only strengthens the case. They are more competitively priced than Ohlins, so you have nothing to fear.
Whenever someone is talking of suspension and wants something, why wouldn’t I offer ~ you do all the time and that is fine.
I am always very complimentary to all manufacturers and all providers ~ there is room for everyone.
Riders should be allowed to choose and they can and do; YSS, Works Performance, WP, Eibach and Ohlins of course, plus of course countless others.
(By the way I also have been stupid enough to commission a batch Ohlins for Red Rockets 78-80. So if anyone wants some, let me know, my wife wants them out of the front room! (yes, now that is a pitch!)
Lets get back to the bikes.
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Does anyone know a source for the sidepanels like on bike in post #33
thanks
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I made them from sheet aluminium, and rolled up an edge around the oval with a bead roller.
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I have a brand new (never fitted) OEM set of genuine side panels that wasused to make a mould. Fibreglass replicas can now be made.
The original parts came from the auction when they finally shut the place down. There were quite a few of them and also a brand new bike that I think was sold for £3000! (about 15 years ago which was a bargain then in my book)
I have one pair of yellow (US spec) side panels and one pair in gloss white. I think they are £80 a pair. (but can check if you do want a pair)
As Ola said, his are have handmade and are a magnificent variation on a theme.
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Mine are the opaque plastic similar to DC
I would like to buy at least 3 more sets
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Stefan Everts, Team Belgium , Geoff Ballards etc like the shocks we make . Are things that bad in england that you have to canvass in australia ?
Didn't know that Stefan Everts, Team Belgium were based in Australia ??? ???
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Guess the easiest way is to see if the bike as frame number.
I have genuine 1979 NVT HL500, which was bought direct from factory with documentation.
The first batch of 200 worn TT500 frame numbers which matched the engine, the second batch of only 165 bike had very unique & different number.
Hope this helps.
Dave
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Stefan Everts, Team Belgium , Geoff Ballards etc like the shocks we make . Are things that bad in england that you have to canvass in australia ?
Actually, i had a quick chat to Ballard, he likes his rear shocks! Wonder if he likes the WP product on his latest bike...... Havent had a chance to speak to Everts yet but i reckon he'd have ditched them already if he didnt like them.
Kt
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Guess the easiest way is to see if the bike as frame number.
I have genuine 1979 NVT HL500, which was bought direct from factory with documentation.
The first batch of 200 worn TT500 frame numbers which matched the engine, the second batch of only 165 bike had very unique & different number.
Hope this helps.
Dave
Acording to my info the frame numbers were...
79 prefix was 3K4
78 prefix was 1T1
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HI Guys,
Drooling soooo bad over my PROFAB someone trapped a picture of it EH? The Bare chassis is mine,i found it about 4 years ago. Marzzochii's will stay, you can't see but i have covered the original stickers with tape for their protection. HALLMAN and the decals on the FOX AIRS. I only need small stuff and an oversize header to build an exhaust. I will post some pictures as i go.
Jay in ALBERTA CANADA.
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I only need small stuff and an oversize header to build an exhaust. I will post some pictures as i go.
Jay in ALBERTA CANADA.
Yeah sing out when it is finished, actually yellow Pro Fab HL passed me on the back of a ute on the highway this morning, they are getting dead common ;D
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Can anyone reccomend someone to make me a correct Steering Stem for my Marzzochi's to go onto my EARLY PROFAB hl500 chassis? Thanks, Jay.(http://)