OzVMX Forum
Clubroom => Bike Talk => Topic started by: cxs58 on April 10, 2008, 06:38:47 pm
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Don't know if this is the right area for this topic but I need to know what the best 2 stroke oil / fuel mixture is for my 84 Husky 125.
I am assuming that it doesn't vary between motorcycle brands or am I wrong.
I have been told 20:1, 30:1 and 40:1.
I've got no idea - this is my first 2 stroke - so all help would be appreciated.
Craig
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40 TO 1 motul 800 will do fine ;D
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Thanks Russell - much appreciated ..................
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40 TO 1 motul 800 will do fine ;D
40 to 1 maxima 927 smells better, :D
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I still run 25 to 1 Castrol GPS 250cc and 495 but I run 16 to 1 in the 125cc.
If jeted to this will run find.
Oil is Cheap and so is Muffer packing But Pistons and Rod Bearing are Like Rocking horse Shit
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32:1 is the only number i have used on 2smokers unless its the first tank on a piston, and that is regardless of brand of 'normal oil"
err on the little smoky but too much is just as bad as too little, as the oil leans out the fuel also
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A very wise and experience 2T tuner told me "Cheap oil at 20:1 is far better than expensive oil at 40:1" and 555 has it 100% correct there, the harder they rev, more oil is needed.More oil makes less heat and more HP. Rossco try Agip Kart(castor synthetic and 1/2 the price of Maxima)
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most oilmix disasters that I have observed,have been because people get the oil amount wrong due to poor mathmatics.
my motto ---keep it simple
30 to one
take a twenty litre drum put 15 litres petrol and 1/2 litre two stroke oil= easy maths
and that amount is just right for easy pouring out of a twenty litre drum.
we have run this mix in all our bikes(modern and old) using plain old caltex revtex oil and had no problems with component wear or failures
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i didn't answer first up as I knew there were going to be so many different answers - I use Silkolene at 40:1 in all 5 bikes for 3 years now and on every motor inspection everything has been spot on? And never a fouled plug!!!!!
;D
Rossco
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i've always run 30-1 but i'm steadily listening/thinking more about running a richer mix.
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seem to remember the books saying 33:1 for my 240wr water cooled but as you can fathom.. Oils aint oils.
Run as much oil as the ignition can burn.
Id start at 33:1 , do a few laps and see how she ran then gradually bring her to 20:1
Take note of heat as well as lap times and do a few plug chops to get the best ratio for your bike and riding style.
Oil not only lubricates the goodies it also wicks away massive amounts of potentially damaging heat and as said , parts for huskies aint cheap.
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Well thanks lads - I am completely fcuken bambuseled.
I'll start at around 40:1 and ween it down from there - hopefully if anyone is going to Nudgee on the weekend you will see me floundering around there.
Appreciate eveything.............
Craig
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I saw this thread and knew it was gonna be probably controversial or diverse at least.
I'll tell you what I know about two stroke oils and the ratios ::).
1/Many, many, moons ago American Dirt Bike ran an article on oils and they scientifically measured performance as it relates to racing two strokes. It is too long ago to remember or act on the specific conclusions but the general points would hold true. There are big differences in the engineering quality of oils, shear strength, wear prevention etc. (but be guided by price). Oil ratios weren't critical until into the extremes of the range, high and low, are reached. Too much oil can cause seizures :o because oil burn hotter than petrol (their conclusion not mine - could also be caused by varying the ‘effective’ jetting ratios).
2/ A friend, who was a motorcycle mechanic and an old two stroke racer, went racing 100cc Clubman go-karts. To gain competiveness he had a specialist rebuild and ‘blueprint’ his motor (and yes, I was surprised too). Part of the blueprinting was his particular motor was put on a dyno and the oil ratio was varied until they got the best HP, a 2 HP gain. And that’s what he ran.
My conclusions. Oil ratios are like jetting, you can muck with them and get advantage but you better know what you are doing. And you better be prepared to be pedantic, thorough, constantly making adjustments, be prepared to get it wrong and suffer all the consequences e.g. $$$$$’s.
Me. I run 24:1 on any quality oil, conservative jetting and concentrate on fitness, suspension, good riding, good lines, pacing myself, controlled aggression and having fun. ;D
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I am completely fcuken bambuseled.
I'll say ;D
I'll start at around 40:1 and ween it down from there
Start at 24:1 and ween down from there if you must ;).
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I've ran Silkolene or Motul at 40:1 in all my oldies and had no trouble. My 390 (with an internal fly-wheel and 40 mm carb) motor revs very hard and still had no probs with lubrication.
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Well thanks lads - I am completely fcuken bambuseled.
I'll start at around 40:1 and ween it down from there - hopefully if anyone is going to Nudgee on the weekend you will see me floundering around there.
Appreciate eveything.............
Craig
Don't guess or figure "near enough is good enough" Check what the factory recommened mix is, then check that your carbie is on stock jetting and start there.
If you need to add more oil, then richen up the jetting as the % oil/fuel leans out as more oil is added
(going from 3%(33:1) to 5%(20:1) means 2% less fuel, if main jet is #250 then go to #260 etc)
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here's my question, having never had an "old" bike in an era when super wasn't available, what fuel do you run and do I need a lead additive?
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mainline,
i just use good old caltex vortex, which is thier premium unleaded with shell oil at 30.1. this weekend i'm going for 25:1 and well see how that goes. i only use the caltex because it's the closest servo to me.
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Whats making you go to 25:1 , are you having issues at 30:1 ? becareful you dont start heating things up.
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absolutely no issues with 30:1
but given Lozza's been on about it for ages, and my old mate the machinist {thats always got bottom ends/top ends/etc of bikes sprawled out all over his workbench} is recommending a richer mixture. basically i've run 30:1 for years and have never had a seizure, but if i never try this richer mix idea, how will i ever know?
so i'll give it a go and see if it makes a diff...
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Well richer dont mean more oil ?
It means bigger jets dont it, to carry more volume but in the same ratios. Unless there is another reason - why do they want you to get more oil ?
Any time i have Run dry if you could call it that is a nip on the ex port side, never on a main bearing. ANd the best solution to get more oil onto the ex side is to drop some bit holes on the piston to carry up the oil. Can you explain where you are going with this more oil thing. im interested in what they are actually asking you to do here, incase its something i should revisit.
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Best read what Grodon Jennings says on the matter,you can google his old Cycle World articles and as the 'father' of scientific 2T tuning,Gordon PROVED(on a dyno and lower lap times) all those years ago that more oil = more HP.Simple innit??? As with mx250's example of the 100cc kart that would have shown the best part of a 10% output increase from changing oil ratio's.It has NOTHING to do with seizures as that is FUEL, or lack there of that causes that. Trapped rings are another thing altogether Freaky that is insufficient exhaust bridge relief and chamfering the ring groove and the oil holes will help that but not eliminate the issue.
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yep read his stuff, is that the one where he takes the Suzuki or Dt motor and runs it on castor oil for days "does more equal less" or somthing like that ? if so what i got out of that was the bore clearances. The oil was oil from what i have read in that regard by him.
HIs big thing that turned the lights on was that 40 thou race clearances were a pile of shit, that you would be in a worse place the more room you gave the piston, even a few jap's did a PHD on that later on and you look at the data and HP was gained by tight tollerances, the heat didnt build up amoung other things keeping the motor in HP and away from heat failures.
well thats was what i got out of that one. I dont remember him talking about thicken up the mix though to get more seal, i remeber the one he did on the Dykes rings etc, that was also interesting. Without rereading the article or another, Im cant comment on the oil thing really, but im not convienced though that thickening the mix in respect to an older bike is going to have such a dramatic effect on performance in this case, i have to agree with MX250 that suspension and other items would play a larger role, if vandy is chasing lap times.
Too much oil will also cut HP through Stanction and the oil drag on the piston so its a fine line if your playing in these levels of gain. I really dont think going to 25: is really going to make much differant to his bike as would a perfectly gapped piston and ring set would.
not sure where you got the ring bit from but i was talking about runing dry so to speak on the ex side when the piston has pulled (not the ring) it either was growing hot or not enough oil, since then i have experimanted with feed hole and put the catch marks on the face, and have never pulled a piston on that side since and relating that info if Vandy was trying to oil up just to get more lubrication, he should perhaps be doing that instead.
any way i guess you answered my Quetion to Vandy anyway, i was trying to get why he was going down into more ratio as it wouldnt be for lubrication which what i though was being aluded to, i needed to understand what was actually behind it.
On that note what's the story with chaps pushing port grooves down in the barrells ? never seen that before but come across a few lately that look like they are trying do some kinda barrel boost by joining the inlet ports to the cases from inside the barrell , whats the theory there ? ???
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ohh and as regarding mixing i have always used a graduated 5 lt agricultural jug, they are designed for mixing chemicals so the numbers never rub off or melt you can buy them from those farmer stores and tthe smaller one which i think holds up to 600ml or someting.
So i stick the petrol in the big one and have another little one that i actually melted 5 lines of my own in also and pour the oil in from that. The 5 litlre jug is easy to mix up and you never have too much mixed at any time and you just pour in the oil in the little jug until you get to the line you want ( each line is per ltre) so if i fill with say 3 ltrs i put in oil to 3 lines, its fast and idiot proof and you never have to guess and its perfectly consistant always. then i stir with a 300mm chrome shaft i pulled from an old copier.
If you wanted to change the mix on the day you could alway just add a splash more petrol or oil or use an oxygenator or somthing i guess but your base level would be perfect. I cant say enough how good these jugs are and have been over the years, had the same set over 10 years, and i think they were under $15. NEver had to throw petorol away and never missed a race because i needed a quick 2 lt refill.
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Ive read several articles by Mr Jennings and a few by the guys who scored the world speed record on a rd350 i think it was and they ran heavy heavy on the oil.
How I see it Freaky is the issue with all internal bang engines or any machine is heat and how best to control the heat.
Oil whilst providing needed lubrication also plays a part in transferring heat away from areas like the piston skirt etc.
More oil = more heat transference = more power available not being lost in heat.
Keeping an engine cool is paramount specially for an air cooled 2T engine as it only has the air rushing over the finning and the oil mixed with the fuel. No oil coolers no water jackets.
easy enough way to test the theory is get a dump surplus victa lawn mower and run it flat out on 20:1 and then on 50:1 and see just how hot that engine gets. If your plug wont burn the oil thats prolly your plug or ignition being a bit weak.
Thats pretty well how i see the purpose of oil.
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yeP I LIKE YOUr THINKING POKEY, agree the heat is the differance, you just got to figure out how to lessen it via whatever method.
really i guess what your saying is get it in to a point you cant burn it, and thats you ratio for that bike ? makes sense to me.
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Thats about it Freaky, The name of the game is get rid of the nasty heat and get the engine to optimum temp and keep it there. Thats the basics.
Now just to confuse, Modern synth oils work differently to mineral hence why the manufacturers state ratios like 80:1
I havnt read how Synth oils work to comment as to if the heat theory applies to them except many Synth oils were researched by the outboard makers and thats mainly for californian anti pollution laws not power or engine longevity.
Over all I think you have it. There is no exact ratio as it depends on your bike , oil type and riding style.
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Get a four stroke.......................... :D ;)
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come on you guys, what about oil % to octane ratio?
211
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me again i have run 40 to 1 in all my bikes from a husky74cr400 to a 83kx500 and my rm370
no problems pull them down no wear everything working fine 8)
i remember back in 82 we used to run belray at 50to 1 :o
30 to 1 is also fine i usually run my bikes in on that mix then go to 40 to 1
but you can run 30 to 1 ok
remember the manual always likes more oil in there new bikes in the fuel ;D
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The problem I have with the phrase "I've never had any problem with using ....." is it accounts for 3 parts of SFA.These are just observations from one person's experience. As Doc's aftermarket head test proved facts and figures tend to mess up a good story.I challenge anyone to repeat the tests outlined below with 30, 40 or 50:1.Anyone willing? ;D Synthetics will perform better in Falex Pin and V Block tests but thats about all, after the film breaks down it wears parts much worse.
http://www.bridgestonemotorcycle.com/documents/oilpremix6.pdf
Remember long after I'm gone someone will still be quoting Gordon Jenning's, with good reason.
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Lozza....are you saying that older bikes should use mineral oils and not synthetic ones....I have just bought Motul Off road 800 Factory Line synthetic oil....is this not a good idea....ah
Craig
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as far as synthetics go, here's my take on them,
a while back i had a very indepth convo with a bloke that worked in an oil sampling laboritory and he had several bikes both old and new. i mentioned to him i was using one of the new synthetics and asked for his opinion and he went on to say, as far as impurities on a PPM {parts per million} goes, the synthetic is cleaner, but not by as much as they'd have you think. he recommended good old valvoline xld for use in my gearbox, cheap as, and i can pick it up while i'm in
k-mart with the kids. so took his advice i did, have been running valvoline xld in all my gearboxes,mower,car and have never had a problem. cheap, being the big factor for me.
ok, thats gearbox's, but it is kinda synthetic 'V' mineral related.
and Freaky, the only reason i'm contemplating going richer is to prolong engine life. not that i have a problem with it all now but as the number of running engines increases, the less i want to be rebuilding something. so once it's together, i'd like it to stay that way for a long time.
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Vandy010....I too know people who work for the fuel industry....Caltex refinery up here in Brisbane....one bloke in particular backs up your comments....a cheap oil replaced often is better than an expensive oil changed infrequently....its all about cleanliness in the motor and gearbox....regular oil changes mean longer life.
Yes synthetic oils are cleaner than mineral based oils but not as much as the fuel industry lead us to believe.
My Huskys' piston is brand new so I have decided to use the 40:1 ratio....only reason is that I don't know any different and this is my first 2 stroke....if I register lots of slow lap times I can blame the oil fuel ratio....not my riding ability.
Thanks lads - see ya the race....!
Craig
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if your talking about nudgee tomorrow, i'll come and say g'day. if your the bloke i'm thinking of, had a bit of a high-side moment at the nudgee sign on day? i was right behind you when it happened, very impressive!
cheers mate!
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For me I’ts 20 to 1 or what ever the owners manual recommends. Preferably a mineral oil and definitly not synthetic for running in. You gotta remember these vintage bikes are mostly old air cooled motors and are not watercooled. Most of the synthetics have modern water cooled engines in mind. If you talk to anyone whos into ultra light air craft especially in north america and the only oil they trust to keep them up in the air is a mineral Penzoil 2 stroke oil specifically for air cooled engines and you wont hear them using 30, 40, 50 to 1 etc. Unfortunately this oil is not available in Australia.
And its not just Jennings whos against lean ratios. Graham Bell rams it into your head that more oil equals more power, less heat, less wear, longer life etc
So far out of all the people I hear from that use leaner ratios the main reasons I get are
I want to use less oil to save money
My bike smokes less with less oil
I pulled my motor apart and everything seemed to be ok with 40 to 1 so why should I change?
Or everyone else is using less oil so it must be the thing to do these days.
Sorry but I’m with Lozza and the other guys, you wont ever catch me using less oil.
If are going to change the ratio to something other than the owners manual remember you must then alter your jetting. Sound too hard to do, well then don’t change the oil/fuel mix ratio and then you wont have to stuff around with jetting.
Oh one other thing, octane booster definitely works.
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20 to 1 in all my 2 smokers . In the 70s and 80s I used Penzoil - now its Motul 800
My reseason - this is what the factory tested them at, and that was good enough for me :)
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Well after attempting to mix 40:1....I cocked it up and got roughly a 30:1 ratio....bike won't run though because I can't get the carby to stop flooding the cylinder....checked the needle and seat and it won't stop the flow completely so I'll get a new one and see how I go from there....does anyone know the factory ratio or where I can retreive the info....
Thanks everyone....
Craig
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I remember my '84 maico manual stating if using Maico something, something, something oil (can't recall what they called it) to mix at 100:1.............that's what it said! True!
I can hear the bullshit cough from here.
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We've done a lot of work on oils, and it really varies from bike to bike. We couldn't stop a CZ bore glazing up on synthetics. I'd find that by the end of a raceday, I'd be noticeably down on power until we stripped it and honed the bore again. It was literally a mirror finish glaze. Motul, Rock Oil, Silkolene, Castrol R2; all the same result. What's good for modern nicasil, ain't necessarily good for old bikes.
We switched to Castrol A747 and it has worked very well. A lot of you guys would be familiar with this oil, although it's a little harder to find these days. A747 is a castor/synthetic hybrid. The fumes have quite obvious Castrol R qualities, and it works best at the richer end of the mixture range. Castrol recommends where you would run R2 synthetic at 40:1, you'd run 747 at 25:1.
Graham Bell's thinking holds true, especially in two stroke racing like karting. Air cooled sprint karts rev to silly numbers, and we always ran ours at 20:1 on Penrite mineral oil.
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Penrite Synthetic Fortified Mineral Oil is great stuff.
And Penrite is an Australian company.
I went through much trauma when they stopped selling TS40CC.
But I have now gone over to their Hi-Per Synthetic Fortified Mineral Oil.
Run at 24 to 1. Less oil is less power.
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Lozza - your comment regards "i haven't ever had a problem with......" interests me. Most of us are just layman and hence so many questions being asked on this web site and great to see the feedback from so many (be that good or bad). But tell me, I have been running Silkolene Comp Pro 2 SX for 3 years now at 40:1 in 4 different bikes and each time I have pulled a bike down everything looks good. This is the only experience I have to go on and surely is better than saying it is 3/10ths of SFA!! Surely if I said I had been running Bel Ray at 50:1 and seized a motor or two (which happened with the Yamaha boys when I was a lad) that while not qualitative or quantitative should also be taken into consideration.
I am interested in the more oil=more HP comments etc and when my bike arrived I was advised it was running at 50:1 but thought to be on the safe side to drop it down.
And again I am hearing comments of new 2 strokes being made to run at 100:1 to satisfy enviro concerns - surely these oils must be good for temp dispersion as well as the water cooling?
Anyway - same as usual - all good discussion ;D
Rossco
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OK Rossco, first things first,NR555 try Agip Kart cheaper and easier to get hold(from Multispares) of than A747 and outperforms it in every way.Never tried the Penrite is that Castor or Castor/synthetic.Can I get a bottle from Super Shite Auto???
Rossco that phrase is very much subjective, if for instance an ex world champion/GP tuner said "I did such and such and never had a problem" it would carry more weight than some mug punter like myself saying the same thing.
Firstly it's realising just the scant amount of actualy oil needed to keep bearings spinning and not overheating, they ain't 4 bangers.What I would ask you is what would your engines look like if you had been running R30 at 20:1?Would the bike have increased performance?If you never try you will never know.What more oil does is provide a better conductor for heat to travel from the piston crown to the cylinder walls.With the added benefit of less friction hence less wear. It's that simple, and as Jennings and Bell proved with hard emperical data, that more oil made more power and the engine had less wear.
Again the lean oil ratios show just how little oil is actually needed, but a manufacturer getting Euro3 compliant and you having your engine wear less and make more HP are not the same thing.
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that Penrite TS40C 2 stroke oil was V good stuff, i ran it in my TS 185 for years and i felt it was a real good oil. no Lozza its not shit from super cheap auto. it was a mineral oil, not castor. i know it was approved for ultra lights so thats why i knew it was good but then they changed the formula, name, packaging etc and now its says not for use in ultra lights and another person who works in the oil industry said that yes Penrite changed that oil and all the ultra light aircraft guys were spewing about that. ive got nothing bad to say about Peritre and its the main oil i use in all customers bikes except for Mobil in some newer bikes and Belray in 2 strokes now.
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The company I work for is Penrites 2 oldest customer I have used penrite oils in my bikes since 1980 and have found it to be great. I will not use synthetic oil at all you mite as well use water. We have found in truck diffs and gearboxs that mineral oil is best Eg a truck with 650 thousand ks on synthetic compared to an identical truck on same work loads etc the mineral oil box and diffs only need bearings the one with synthetic needs up to six gears replaced and usally a crown wheel and pinion in the diffs.
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Leith Super Shite Auto usually stocks the full range of Penrite Oils that's what I was asking.I'll still be running with castor.
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yeah castor is good but you really gotta be pulling your motor apart regularly and cleaning it as it leaves a lot of deposits right? it also attracts moisture so you should use it all at once and not leave bottles half full of it around the place to use later on down the track.
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If your leaving deposits it's down to jetting and ignition not the oil,if it's hydroscopic then use castor synthetic.
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after reading all the blurb on advertising and this ones got new improved XYZ with fortified bullshit it dont take too long to start questioning and think logically. Synth oils are being manufactured to cater for the environmental aspects not soley for performance as mineral oils obviously are or they wouldnt bloody sell any and companies wouldnt buy it and oil companies wouldnt bother making it...
Yeah some synth are okay in some engines ... same as Ethanol is okay in some engines. Not mine though
Lets face it aircooled MX engines get a lot of issues to contend with. Heat and rapid increase and decreases of revs and I dont want to take the risk with any of my engines as some parts are getting harder to find.
have tried synths and while the performance seems similar i always had glazing on bore and piston even after a few rides. Was a little scoring on the exhaust as well.
I read someplace that the only thing that would save an english bigend is castor. Have used that for a few tanks and it does work well . no heat issues but lots of smoke and i found it a bit gummy if you left fuel in the bike for a while and a lot of coking in the pipe.
minerals for me work and I will continue to use them and tune my bikes for them and run them 20/25:1. Reasonably clean engines minimal scuffing and decent intervals between major services. after all the company designed them for mineral oils. I even use mineral in my car as i trust it to do what its ment to do... protect not just lubricate.
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I've been running Motul M800 at 20:1.
My CT1 wasn't fresh when I got it - to the point that the previous owner strongly suggested that I fit the new rings he supplied before i raced it (I didn't...). I don't know what oil/ratio he ran it on.
After I killed the gearbox at the 07 Nats, I pulled it down. Everything was like new. Impressed and a little surprised, I didn't even bother to fit the new rings.
After a few more race meets, I pulled the top end off again the other night. Still like new - the ring still has the chamfer intact.
All of this is despite running a pod filter that hangs out in the breeze and my discovery that even though the power flattens off, it still revs happily when you're in a desperate situation (like trying to beat the previous owner.... ).
So... I'm happy enough to just keep doing the same.
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My 2 Euros.
After a few months return to VMX racing in '06 and me being the only machine that was smoking when hot on 25:1 Motul, I went down to 40:1 Mobil 2-stroke racing oil from Big-W.
-80's bike are showing no sign of wear.
-MXa is suspended in silence, but I am guessing it is big end.
You can read the manuals, but remember, the fuel is different these days, than 30 years ago.
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http://www.locastros.com/piston_oil_ratios.htm
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Me and Spanky would get on fine
http://www.motocross.com/forum/posts/list/15/16966.page
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33.333333 recurring:1 or 30ml per litre..always have always will run this ratio regardless of the oil brand used. 90% of the time it's TTS or Caltex semi-synthetic if I'm poor ;) R30 smells beautiful and I've a few bottles of A747 in the garage but yet to try it, was thinking it could be nice for dirt track and the constant high rpm :-\
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Lozza,
Great article on oil mix and jetting. I find it hard to understand that many people still link oil mix ratios with lean / rich.
I for one always want to run my two stroke engine with sufficient lurication first, at least I know all the essential parts are getting lubricated as they should.
pmc57
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I never thought about the residual oil in the case before I read that, and the fuel evaporation bit is spot on as fuel has a very low boiling point.Besides he repeated the Jennings/Bell tests and found the exact same things.Best myth busted was the to much oil/plug fouling one.
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i have the original jennings article in a PDf here, if someone can host it , put it up in here as its a good read.
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that motocross.com forum guy sure seems to know his stuff. i guess i was also operating under the misapprehension that reducing the oil in my premix might help fix my plug fouling problem. so back to 32 to 1 i go. i did lower the float bowl before last race, and the plug stayed fine, so that might be a partial (or complete) fix. i'll see how she goes next race, then maybe adjust pilot screw and or lower needle a notch.
but its good news really, if by putting more oil back in, you don't just get longer engine life (obvious) but also better torque and power.
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freakshow, send the pdf to graeme m, he'll put it up (for everyone's benefit). he's that kind of guy.
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The link is on the previous page
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Article (and PDF download) is on http://www.classicscramble.org.au/CSC_Workshop.htm (http://www.classicscramble.org.au/CSC_Workshop.htm) (article near the bottom of the page)
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Yep thats the same 1978 article. could have saved myself all that scanning.
what would have been nice would have been if he elaborated on jets he ended up with when he recalibrated to get the same air/fuel ratio's he says they rejetting all night but it would have been interesting to see the jet movement from one ratio to the next. IHMO
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I know this topic is dead and almost buried but I want to thank y'all for the advice and the great reading - all problems sorted and the mixture is around 30-1.
The Husky goes like a f#@ken rocket - scares the sh!t out of me.
Thanks
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It may have been a dead topic, but thatnks for reposting it, i just went back over the thread and remebered how good it was.
i think this was probally one of THE best topic/ Discussion on this forum.
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Hey here's one for ya
The factory recommendation for my ktm300 is 60:1 :o
Guy at the shop said 50:1, dont use anymore you will foul plugs. I precedeed to tell him that I would certainly be running it with more oil than that and would re - jet if needed. I ran it all dAY at 40:1 with no problems. Next tank will be 32:1.
Are Ktm trying to make money selling rods and pistons??
STU
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G'day Stu,
This is my experience.
i run my KTM300 on Motorex cross power 2T at 50:1 no problems in the 4 years i have had it (got it new), i was old school till then and used to run Castrol TTS at 40:1 in all my bikes. i now run Motorex in the others as well ever since 2005. no issues at all.
i will check the spring colors for the power valve for you. its a 30 second job mate, piece a piss. i'll scan that section of the manual when i get some time today.
sounds like you have the light spring in yours if its peaky.
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Plugs foul because of jetting and heat ranges.They recommend those crazy ratios more for emissions and their own feel good factor.
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Running rich/ lean can mean 2 ways
Either your oil and petrol mix is to rich/lean meaning oil to petrol ratio when you mix your fuel
or your jetting and needle is either rich/lean
50 to 1 = 5 litres of fuel to 100mls of oil Lean
40 to 1 = 4 litres of fuel to 100mls of oil
35 to 1 = 3.5 litres of fuel to 100mls of oil to
30 to 1 = 3 litres of fuel to 100mls of oil rich fuel mixes
Your pilot jet will mostly effect starting and idle and the first 1/8 of throttle
The clip setting on the needle will mostly effect 1/4 to 3/4 throttle ( top clip settng is the leanest and bottom is the richest)
and the main jet moslty effects 3/4 to fully open thottle
and then you have your air screw which you have to balance with the 3 above
If you don't know what you are doing find a mate that does, if you set your bike up to lean with fuel or jetting you can blow your engine big time!!!!
Hope this helps someone
Luke
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Wicked,
Hey hoons are you running a Br7es (recommended) or Br8es (in my bike) plug. appreciate the powervalve info if ya can. I SHOULD HAVE A MANUAL IN A COUPLE OF WEEKS TOO.(BLOODY CAPS BUTTON!!! 50:1 is obviously OK with a good oil hey Hoony. I just can't seem to be able to do it. When it comes to mix time I seem to just go nup, it needs at least 40:1 .
Thanks for the info guys. I am pretty up to speed with jetting. Just shocks me the amount of people at bike shops who think if plugs are fouling use less oil in your premix ???. I was trying to explain to shop guy but he didin't get it. Nice dude though.
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Ok, here we go.
Mid (Standard) power valve spring is part # 546.37.072.300 and is Yellow in color
Soft power valve spring is part # 548.37.072.000 and is Red in color
(peaky aggressive performance)
Hard power valve spring is part # 548.37.072.000 and is Green in color
(smooth power)
I noticed a big difference between standard (yellow) and Red spring when I did back to back testing, there was a bit of difference with the green but not as much over standard.
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.
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BR8ES, 40:1, Mobil 2 Stroke Racing Oil from BigW and Unleaded Prem. Works a treat.
Mind you, for $2.50-$4.50 for a new plug (non gold), you should change every race.
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Hoony,
YOU ROCK!!!!