OzVMX Forum
Marque Remarks => Suzuki => Topic started by: Tony T on February 07, 2012, 06:23:27 pm
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I'm looking for some help with a 74 TS250 I've just bought.
Probably jumping the gun a bit as I haven't got it yet, but I figure I may as well ask.
FYI I want to do this one on the cheap. As much as possible anyway.........
1. Can I run a TM or similar pipe? That may cost a bit much for me, so is there a period correct aftermarket pipe that's a good thing instead? Or a more efficient one of another model that fits?
2. Can I remove the oil pump and go premix? I remember reading something about not being about to do this on some Suzukis becasue of the main bearing lubrication? Does that apply to this model?
3. Is there much to be gained by a bigger carby? Any suggestions as to what size and jetting specs?
4. Any other tricks or tips for suspension set up or weight loss would be much appreciated.
Thanks in advance for any words of wisdom. :)
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1 - Fm circle are as cheap as chips @ $250-00 plus postage, you will need to welder as they come in 2 sections for postage purposes
2 - Tony it requires splitting the cases and drilling a hole on LH case to supply oil @ the main bearing - removing slinger and replacing it with a shim ..... One of the main reasons these motor's are so bullet proof is because of their oil pump supply thru the main pin that lubes the big end ;)
3 - Unless it has been ported you are wasting your time - 34mm carbs are the go
4 - Shocks look for a set of TS ER 185
Rear sprocket is more suited for 100mph so you may need to look at a 48 -49 or 50 ;)
Doc may be able to help with fina details
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Thanks a lot for that, Stewart. Helps a lot.
I looked on the Circle F site and they only list for TM250. Is that likely to fit?
It's only listed at 200 bucks, but I think I'll hold off on buying a new pipe until everything else is up to scratch.
At this stage of the game, I reckon 200 bucks is probably better spent on new tyres.
Yeah, I know it's a tight budget but that's what I'd like to stick to as much as I can.
Anyone have any secondhand performance pipes etc to fit this thing?
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Find a big bog hole dive into it and tear up $20 notes, just so you can get the idea what you will be in for. ;D
In addition to what Stew said, cut the slinger down with tin snips, throw some advance at it and away you go
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MY take on it,
leave the oil feeders on ( my TM has and it runs like a clock )
leave pipe till later ( can let you test fit a Circle F, but you would be better of with the standard TM pipe.)
Fit a 32mm carby ( ill give you the jetting specs )
Put some decent tyres on it and tighten the spokes, clean and refit brakes
change spocket up
Buy some paint
Cables, grips, levers
New fork seals and oil ( ask pete hoey for specs he did the TM and the forks look the same )
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Sounds like good advice.
Thanks Freaky.
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Tony, if you try really hard you could probably wedge an SP370 engine into it... ;D
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Now there's an idea!!
Not a good one, but an idea............. ::)
;D
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Tony, TM250 pipe will not fit due to the TS brake pedal swinging under the frame. Left side TS250 kit pipes were available but are very rare..only ever seen 1 in Oz and I grabbed it ;D
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Nothing a oxy and some cones wont fix
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Nothing a oxy and some cones wont fix
Or a big hammer?? 8)
thanks for the info, gentlemen.
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A rear brake will only slow you down Tony. ;D
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Nothing a oxy and some cones wont fix
Boy times have changed. Back in my day kids lit their cones with a match or a lighter...
Oxy would probably work, but you would want a steady hand!! :o
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Nothing a oxy and some cones wont fix
Boy times have changed. Back in my day kids lit their cones with a match or a lighter...
Oxy would probably work, but you would want a steady hand!! :o
Haven't you got some work you should be doing................. :P
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Pot, Kettle... :D
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Pot, Kettle... :D
Hmmmm.........
That would be one all then.......... :-\
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I have matching 74/TS125 here for sale Tony ;) Tim754
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Thanks Tim, but I'm not a 125 kinda guy. ;)
I just picked this one up because I wanted another pre 75 2 stroke and this one looks like a fairly cheap and easy project.
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Are you leaving the engine standard?
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No idea, Lozza.
I know bugger all about these things, so once it's ready to ride as it is, I'll decide what it needs after that.
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Will be a long list ;D
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A TM250J/K cylinder, carb, airbox and Lozza special pipe would be helpful. Then you could fit the ignition from the same and swap the gear clusters to suit. Matter of fact, if you could get your mitts on a TM250 engine it'll bolt straight in..easy peasy :P
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Are there press on gears in that box Doc?
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A TM250J/K cylinder, carb, airbox and Lozza special pipe would be helpful. Then you could fit the ignition from the same and swap the gear clusters to suit. Matter of fact, if you could get your mitts on a TM250 engine it'll bolt straight in..easy peasy :P
Kinda defeats the purpose, I reckon.
I think my money would be better spent on new tyres etc and some training and practice would have a much bigger affect on lap times than horsepower.
Besides, it's far more likely to get a run at a vinduro than motocross at this stage.
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it's far more likely to get a run at a vinduro than motocross at this stage
Champion idea. Three Bridges is only a few weeks away, so you'd better get busy! ;)
Tex
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Loz..no pressed on gears from memory ;)
Tony..was just a thought ;D
Here's a pic of a vinduro project I've had tucked away gathering dust for a few years..it's much more complete than what's shown in this pic and I roolly must finish it one day :P
(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7172/6845082325_4c61f16fa3_b.jpg)
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nice work so far Docarer the ts and tm similar in box ratio's as ive got an A model of these bikes and want to do something with it since it was given to me along with its little bro 185A as both were destined for the tip [what a waste]The 250 even had new tyres/chain/spockets and brake shoes fitted as well.
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Yeah, that looks neat, Doc.
But mine's better......... it's got an engine............ ;D ;D
Is that a TS tank?
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Matt, I 'thought' there was a little difference in some of the lower ratios but maybe not. Probably not worth the hassle anyway ;)
Tony..yup, that's the stock TS tank. I have 3 TS250's 1x '73 K and 2x '74 L's (5 in total if you count the TSX and the '69..a glutton for punishment I guess ::)) all that's really missing is the motivation to finish one :D
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well if you have tooooo!!!!!!!!!! many doc you can deliver the 69 to a new home!! don't spose you have lottsa spare for the 69?? i'll be lookin for one to do for a pre70.. after i fin the pe-sp monster project..
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Hey Tony....Here's my old TS/TM. It's basically a '75 TS engine and wheels fitted to a skip bin sourced TM frame. I'll eventually make a return to life in flat track trim. The TS is a really good basis for a poor boy racer/play bike. They're really not that different to the TM racer.
(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/TSSuzuki.jpg)
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Thanks Mark.
I kinda had that one in mind when I grabbed this one.
A poor man's do-it-all pre 75 bike. :D
What did you do for a pipe?
There's a Bassini on eBay that's cheap enough at this stage, but the seller won't send it over here. :(
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Thanks for the PM Tony....I'll give you a return PM tomorrow. I used a Circle F pipe which is pretty good value for the dough.
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:D Tmman, 'if' I were to sell off all the TS250's then the '69 is probably the only one I'd wish to keep :P mind you 'if' I change my mind (which does happen sometimes) I have your number ;) no spares for the '69 by the way..lots for others though ::)
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Reckon i have a TS piston 69 -72 ? $30 can tell you what size though
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Sorry for the dumb questions, but can someone tell me what year pistons interchange?
i.e. what year range of TS250 piston kits I should be looking at.
Thanks. :)
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Tony TS - Tm - RL 70mm piston Std size ( max OB =72mm) 1974 thru to 1981
Just need to drill the oil bridge lube holes ( exhaust port ) if they are not there.
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Jeez, I love this place, sometimes! :D
Thanks a lot for that, Stewy. 8)
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........some old pics (the only ones I have ) of my '72-'74 TM/S project. PE seat, TM wheels, TD ag bike tank, modified DT radial head, it now has an alloy airbox using PE rubbers and cage. Made out of bits that were kickin' around.I have also fitted european style vinyl side covers. ;D ;D ???
(http://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww272/yumastepside/IMGP5245.jpg)
(http://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww272/yumastepside/TSM250002.jpg)
Roger
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I love it, Rog! ;D
The plan for mine is to use any spare bits I've got kicking about to keep the cost down too.
What did you do for footpegs? Mine has still got the stock rubber pegs....... :P
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pritty sure my A model has dirt style f/pegs and their on alot of other models as well,check alphasports for part nunbers.my ts185a has them as well
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From memory the footpegs came of an old YZ125......one thing about building this sort of cheapo bike for vinduros, is that it doesn't matter what parts or models of bike that you get your parts from....as long as its pre '85 ;D ;D
Roger
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(http://i1112.photobucket.com/albums/k495/firko2/TSSuzuki.jpg)
Firko is that a TM tank and what Side cover fitted ?
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Ohh hang on think i aswered my own question, its a tm frame isnt it....
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Sorry to butt into Tony's thread but I've just secured one of these TS250s myself .. before I saw this thread actually :)
Here it is:
(http://i1035.photobucket.com/albums/a438/Simo63/TS250-1.jpg)
I wanted to have another ride at the upcoming Nationals so will now set about turning this into a race ready "weapon" [using the word loosely]
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I was watching that one too, Simo. Looks like a good deal.
Keep us posted on what you do with it.
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Will do mate. It actually belonged to one of my best mates but as I'm in Qld and he's in NE Vic I didn't even know he had it let alone that it was for sale. Just searching through ebay for a 74 or earlier one and spotted it. I recognised the background straight away, then noticed his user ID and called him.
After I won the auction I called him up and he told me he had a second one for spares that I could have for $90 so I grabbed that as well. Apparently it has a really good set of alloy rims on it plus of course the rest of it for spares.
Looks like a lot of fun ..... I'm excited :)
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If you want sell any of the lights etc, send me a pm.
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........some old pics (the only ones I have ) of my '72-'74 TM/S project. PE seat, TM wheels, TD ag bike tank, modified DT radial head, it now has an alloy airbox using PE rubbers and cage. Made out of bits that were kickin' around.I have also fitted european style vinyl side covers. ;D ;D ???
Roger
Nice forward mounted rear shocks. Did you perform the modification yourself ?
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(http://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww272/yumastepside/TSM250002.jpg)
I reckon this bike will look really good when completed. Simple, clean and functional. What more does one need from a trail bike.
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"whats more does one need Topari " ? An unrusted motor i'd say .....
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Will do mate. It actually belonged to one of my best mates but as I'm in Qld and he's in NE Vic I didn't even know he had it let alone that it was for sale. Just searching through ebay for a 74 or earlier one and spotted it. I recognised the background straight away, then noticed his user ID and called him.
After I won the auction I called him up and he told me he had a second one for spares that I could have for $90 so I grabbed that as well. Apparently it has a really good set of alloy rims on it plus of course the rest of it for spares.
Looks like a lot of fun ..... I'm excited :)
Simo if the alloy rims are original its probably a 1976 A model , a much better starting point for a VMX racer ;) I think Suzuki used up all the leff over TM 250 parts on the A models .
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Simo if the alloy rims are original its probably a 1976 A model , a much better starting point for a VMX racer ;) I think Suzuki used up all the leff over TM 250 parts on the A models .
Thanks Bill, that is very interesting. Am I allowed to use the 76 parts (frame etc) on a pre 75 race bike or do I have to stick with a pre 75 stamped frame?
If I can then I was thinking of building 2 bikes, one MX'er and one Vinduro mount.
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I only have a 2008 MOMs book ::) where it says only upto L models ie 74 models .
But i think they were revised recently ( not 100% sure ) to include 76 TS A models in pre 75 ???
Either way run your 74 L model frame as in your photo and motor , but run the A model wheels , footpegs , Engine outer cases , and TM style Rack and pinion clutch actuator ( fitted to A models ) .
The 250 A model ran a different cylinder (electrofusion bore and different porting ) so probably not elidgible for pre 75 .
It sounds confusing but you have a basis of both a good Vinduro mount and a pre 75 250 racer :)
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Either way run your 74 L model frame as in your photo and motor , but run the A model wheels , footpegs , Engine outer cases , and TM style Rack and pinion clutch actuator ( fitted to A models ) .
Thanks TM Bill, sincerely appreciate your advice ;)
It sounds confusing but you have a basis of both a good Vinduro mount and a pre 75 250 racer :)
WIN ;D 8)
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Those TS 250s were over engineered , std thay are a bit heavy but you can shed most of that with a bit of thought :)
But the motors are indestructable ;D
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But the motors are indestructable ;D
Really....... ???
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.........gee, freaky, maybe its a DUMMY motor just for setting up?? ::) ::) ;D
non-dummy Roger ;)
p.s. Tony, those pics are on their way once I work how to zip them
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No problem, Rog.
I don't know how to do that either, so if you want to send via You send It, let me know and I'll give you my log in details. ;)
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.........gee, freaky, maybe its a DUMMY motor just for setting up?? ::) ::) ;D
non-dummy Roger ;)
p.s. Tony, those pics are on their way once I work how to zip them
well it makes the pictures look like a skip pull. At least fit a cover to the clutch. I just dont have any imagination. :D
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...............happy now ? ;D
(http://i727.photobucket.com/albums/ww272/yumastepside/IMGP5279.jpg)
Roger ;)
.......the pipes actually off my MR175, this one will have a downpipe and euro style vinyl side covers
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better thanks
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In the above configuration it's a pre 78 entry ;)
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Stew, unlike vmx the only class requisites for vinduro is the bikes must be pre '85 trail/enduro models although some pre'90 models can sneak in also. Easy peasy ;)
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Looks good Roger, but if you run it w'out bracing the swingarm I dare say it'll soon bend.
DT head really suits. Was it much work to adapt it?
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If you are still interested here is a comparison I did on the TS25 76 gear box against the TM250
After a lot of actual research I can confirm
TS76 Counter shaft is the old version for TM (72)because it only has 12 teeth
1st driven gear same as 74 (29 teeth) not 75 (27 teeth)
2nd drive gear same as 74 (15 teeth)not 75(16 teeth)
2nd driven gear same as 74 (27 teeth)not 75(25 teeth)
4th drive gear same as 74 (21 teeth)not 75 (20 teeth)
5th drive gear same as 74 (23 teeth)not 75 (22 teeth)
Drive shaft is slightly different
Thrust washers are different may be because of the slightly different drive shaft
remove the neutral switch and swap washers accordingly
Primary gear on the clutch is different ?
And remove the taco drive from the oil pump
So much closer to the TM250 74 internal