OzVMX Forum
Clubroom => General Discussion => Topic started by: Slakewell on December 28, 2011, 12:50:14 pm
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New bikes bore me to death.
Apart from a few exceptions new bikes are just different colours and have been so for a decade the 2005 CRF looks the same as the 2011 CRF, never before have bikes changed so little or lacked any innovation. Why would anyone update every year anymore when there is mostly just bold new graphics. The Japs have lost the plot I feel the lack of any real works bikes have stalled innovation and dulled down our sport. When was the last time you made a trip to the bike shop to just ogle the new model YZ?
I hope that some of new European makes can bring innovation that brings real change that converts to sales for these makes that hopefully drives the market to inspire new ideas instead of these boring cookie cutter models that most accept these days.
Rant over >:(
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What do you mean, the new CRF450X has, er new footpegs, new injection map and softer fork springs, oh and longer muffler with smaller hole. .... your a hard man to please.
I guess you could blame the cash strapped Japanese R&D departments, or you could say, well where do we go now with the existing technology?..... so you bring some new forward technology to the table with your R&D bucks.
(http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/marcFX_photo/Honda-RC-E-Concept-Bike-2011.jpg)
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It was a legends question at cd.ballard said fuel injected two strokes!!
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New bikes bore me to death.
Apart from a few exceptions new bikes are just different colours and have been so for a decade the 2005 CRF looks the same as the 2011 CRF, never before have bikes changed so little or lacked any innovation. Why would anyone update every year anymore when there is mostly just bold new graphics. The Japs have lost the plot I feel the lack of any real works bikes have stalled innovation and dulled down our sport. When was the last time you made a trip to the bike shop to just ogle the new model YZ?
Rant over >:(
Its coming upto 20 years for me. Thank god for the VMX scene .
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Why would anyone update every year anymore when there is mostly just bold new graphics.
Cause it's cheaper to update than replace almost all of the engine internals and freshen up the tired bits (suspension and brakes) at the end of the season to be ready for the next season.
It was a legends question at cd.ballard said fuel injected two strokes!!
Are we ready for injected 2 strokes - YES
Are we prepared to pay the premium for the technology over a carburettor - NO
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I bought my last new bike (KTM400EXC) in 2000 and can't see myself buying another in my lifetime. As much as I appreciate how much the technology has moved on....I, unfortunately haven't. I'm 61 years old and physically too broken to race any more so seeing that the chances of me using a new bike to its potential are less than slim, my interest level is correspondingly low. As high tech and fantastic to ride as the new rash of bikes are (I have ridden many of the high watermark bikes from recent years), I haven't seen a lot of serious change in recent times. In the seventies and eighties we hung outside bike shops like like Lady Ga Ga fans at the airport itching to see the latest releases from our favourite manufacturer because with only a few exceptions, each new bike was a radical improvement on the previous model. Today's lack of model development is probably driven by the failing economies of the big manufacturers and the factories wanting to get maximum mileage out of the huge research and development costs that go into a new model. If they can stretch the technology out for five or six years, the profits increase.
I agree with Slakey, to me the modern motocross bike is a boring piece of kit because I've seen it all before for the last 10 years. The next big technology jump....the next '98 YZ400F equivalent, will hopefully be a fuel injected two stroke with all sorts of computer controlled porting and gizmos. The public will go mental, the bikes will sell like happy hour schooners and....the technological development will slow down again until in the year 2022 another new idea will come along....maybe an efficient electric racer.
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yep. euro market only and do they have abig market.the fourstroke fuel injection transition wasnt that bad.cheers us2
ps can't make em too good or who will ride our vmx bikes in the future ;D ;)
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aside from the few things mentioned here - fuel injection etc - what else is there to offer - that we want?
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I did have a little hope when Aprilia released these but they where quirky expensive and they didn't seem to have the cash to fix them.
(http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/Gallery/Aprilia%20RXV450%2006.jpg)
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the next '98 YZ400F equivalent, will hopefully be a fuel injected two stroke with all sorts of computer controlled porting and gizmos. The public will go mental, the bikes will sell like happy hour schooners and....the technological development will slow down again until in the year 2022 another new idea will come along....maybe an efficient electric racer.
2 strokes are so 1975..... My moneys on electric racer, Honda and Hitachi has joined forces in regard to battery development for Honda's new E race bike. Honda offered 7 versions of electric bike at Tokyo Show which range from scooters to Superbike. Swigz race bike gives you 240hp from 10" long water cooled super motor, so power is not the issue just weight and battery life.
Honda has made one of their corporate objectives to offer full range of electric bikes. One of the reason is that an electric motor makes it much cheaper to integrate rider aids like traction control and anti wheelie which are bound to be mandatory one day. You may as well be excited about it as the good ole days are not coming back any time soon.
(http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/marcFX_photo/zeromx_sized.jpg)
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(http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/marcFX_photo/zeromx_sized.jpg)
Sorry but the look of this thing just makes me want to vomit :P
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Make the rear sprocket 2" larger in Dia, and you would be to connect the chain directly to rim ;D
Ugly as Sin.
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they are not Bikes, they are some kind of drone android. the whizzing - whirring sound doesn't give me the horn.
(http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/marcFX_photo/zeromx_sized.jpg)
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At least these are not as ugly.
I still feel the need for better batteries to fuel these things but given our thirst for electric gadgets they should be good in 10 years.
Here is some news about batteries
http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/mobiles/apple-iphone-ipad-batteries-to-last-days-or-even-weeks-20111227-1pavi.html
(http://www.electricbikee.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/ktm-electric-bike1.jpg)
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Make the rear sprocket 2" larger in Dia, and you would be to connect the chain directly to rim ;D
Ugly as Sin.
Has no gearbox so one sprocket for all situations and full torque the moment you hit the switch, so real stump puller. I like KTMs take on the e-bike as far as asthetics, interesting they are running real skinny rear tyre.... traction control ?.
I can see some advantages to a bike with stealth capability.
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I guess you could blame the cash strapped Japanese R&D departments, or you could say, well where do we go now with the existing technology?..... so you bring some new forward technology to the table with your R&D bucks.
There are definately options out there, but they don't seem interested. 6-stroke (weird head) four-strokes, direct fuel injection for your 2-stroke maybe with a stratified charge, sleeve-valves could come back, the 5-stroke engine that Honda was developing, electrics are moving forward...
I dunno. Engines are about to get more interesting.
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Old bikes give new bikes perspective and relevance and vice versa. The amount of technological advancements/improvements over the last 30 years has been pretty solid given that motorbikes have been around for some 150 odd years. One wonders if there is a whole lot more advancements to be found. I do agree that the Japanese stables have been very conservative with R & D and making changes to their range. I wonder if that is indicative of the global market and economy. One must also concede that there seems to be a bit of a copycat approach with some brands as opposed to an individualist approach. There are still some pretty smart, high quality bikes available; particularly out of Europe. Finally, I guess manufacturers are in it for making a dollar and running a viable business; they are probably keeping things very conservative to this end.
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The three stroke or six stroke motor has been around for ages. It uses a two stroke piston and crank to act as valves for a four stroke bottom end both piston reach TDC as it fires with the cranks connected via a gears or chain and run 2 to 1 ratio.
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I have tested Zero in a forest, it felt like pushbike. Nice thing, you can use it close to houses, but that wouldnt replace my gasoline bikes, it would be nice add on my garage, thou.
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Marc, it develops torque because of its High Rpm ( at motor) and gearing
I'm sure I don't need to discuss with you how "Force work and Time" works
;)
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Still not interested ::)
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The three stroke or six stroke motor has been around for ages. It uses a two stroke piston and crank to act as valves for a four stroke bottom end both piston reach TDC as it fires with the cranks connected via a gears or chain and run 2 to 1 ratio.
Isn't that how a Harley works.....? ::)
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NO LOL
They work from one crank and are called thee knife and fork con-rod lay out as one lays over the over thou the cycle
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I think it's inevitable that as electric bikes become more efficient they'll be a viable alternative to the internal combustion engine.Because of their outstanding torque and simplicity, they'll be suitable for off road applications. Emission is a dirty word right now but in another decade or two clean power will be accepted as the standard.
Still not interested
I'm not remotely interested either but it won't be us old farts that'll be buying them. In 10-20 years time it'll be another generation of thrill seekers looking for the perfect off-road buzz that will be considering electric power. The motocross racer who'll be buying electric motocross bikes are still playing with Leggo or haven't been born yet so what we think of electric motion today means 3/5 of FA in the whole scheme of things.
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aside from the few things mentioned here - fuel injection etc - what else is there to offer - that we want?
We talk about technology not moving forward on motor bikes, I guess because they have simply got to a point where there is just so much that you can do with an internal combustion engine mounted in a frame with two wheels.
There are however some very high tech advancements on the way. The one that I have been watching relates to the Enduro “competition” market. One of the biggest issues that an Enduro (or) cross country rider/racer faces is the varying terrain and conditions that they race in and trying to match a suspension configuration/setting to match such terrain. At the moment Marzocchi is working on a suspension electronic control system that will see grid coordinates loaded into a sat nav equipped ECU that will alter the suspension settings according to where the bike will be ridden. The other is the launch control and full power shift systems that are currently on road bikes finding their way to the moto-cross models. Kawasaki have been using a launch control system on the KXF-450, albeit a basic system, but expect to see something more substantial on offer in the 2012/2013 models from the other manufactures.
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New Bikes bore me to death as well. I must say i liked the old bikes cause you could personalise them not just fancey graphics and the like to match your raceing kit. as they say back in the day everyone bought the basic bike and made thier racer be it road or mx like cars as well you could fit an alpine or ferris radio cause a lot never came with this trick stuff. you know now everthing you could think of is fitted already. you see aline up of bikes and they are all the same spare the graphics . where as if you got a line up of bikes on the grid everyone was different air caps, no air caps, konis bilstiens marzochi whatever we all had different ideas and our bikes reflected it a TS build against a TM and a pursang even an SL100 bombed up we all raced and all enjoyed and looked at each others trick bits and Marvelled at each others ideas...
Please build a bike that we can try and improve... Please