OzVMX Forum
Marque Remarks => Maico => Topic started by: Stevo17 on August 27, 2010, 08:55:38 am
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Has anyone fitted a Magura Hydraulic clutch system to their 81 or 82 Maico 490? I have seen pics of them on some US bikes and was wondering what kit they use (maybe a CR, YZ or KXF)? Any knowledge and experience of these systems would be helpful. thanks steve
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Hi Stevo, I was told six years ago, that hydraulic clutches are not permissible in our VMX competition.
It is very EASY to produce a smooth two finger cable operated Maico small clutch, I have produced them since 1973. I am happy to assist.
Although, I am fitting a hydlaulic unit to my 83 490 spider motard, which I have secured this plate for.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/FORUM023.jpg?t=1282876195)
I am also fitting it with a high energy 12volt programmable ignition that I have built and adapted and disc brakes. I am going with the hydraulic clutch, so as to match both sides of the handle bar hard ware.
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Hi Mick, I didn't think that it would be race legal to have a hydraulic clutch - and I totally agree with that principle but it would be a nice mod. I might take you up on that offer of some info on a clutch mod for the Alpha. What clutch are you putting on your Spider? I have one of those also.
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mick how much was the maico plate ,and in nsw do you get to keep them for ever
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If you really want a hyd' clutch Magura probably have a kit for one.
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mick how much was the maico plate ,and in nsw do you get to keep them for ever
Hi Paul, as You know I owned that plate a few years back, but I let it go after doing a budget rationalisation. I hate budgets. So I went and got it back last week.
COSTING was(NSW);
1) $55 online deposit fee.
2) $170 yearly owner fee.
3) $55 storage fee.
4) you have to renew the $170 ownership fee per an-um.
I DESPERATELY NEED AN AUSTRALIAN ADR 490 COMPLIANCE PLATE, OR 81, 82, 83, 84. OR FRAME WITH ONE.
******CASH OR TREASURE******
AND NO NOT THE REED BARREL, UNLESS YOU THROW IN A WEEK END AT HAMILTON ISLAND.
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Why would you bother? :o Are Maico clutches excessively heavy? ??? Use one of those cable oilers from the bike shop for about twenty bucks. :-[
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Why would you bother? :o [
??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? Hi Ross everybody knows a quality hydraulic action is smoother and offers a better feel than even the best mechanically cable offering ::)
Are Maico clutches excessively heavy? ??? [
Everybody knows, and even you Ross, know that all the SMALL Maico clutches from the factory were excessively heavy (your taking the piss, aren,t you mate) :D
Use one of those cable oilers from the bike shop for about twenty bucks. :-[
Why would you bother ??? when a good quality Teflon lined cable will always offer a better feel and performance response than an unlined cable ::)
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Hi Mick, I didn't think that it would be race legal to have a hydraulic clutch - and I totally agree with that principle but it would be a nice mod. I might take you up on that offer of some info on a clutch mod for the Alpha. What clutch are you putting on your Spider? I have one of those also.
Hi Stevo, I have been "elected"(conspiracy) to get my finger out, and cook dinner. I will get a post together for you over the week end, or maybe even tonight. Cheers, Mick.
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mick how much was the maico plate ,and in nsw do you get to keep them for ever
Hi Paul, as You know I owned that plate a few years back, but I let it go after doing a budget rationalisation. I hate budgets. So I went and got it back last week.
COSTING was(NSW);
1) $55 online deposit fee.
2) $170 yearly owner fee.
3) $55 storage fee.
4) you have to renew the $170 ownership fee per an-um.
I DESPERATELY NEED AN AUSTRALIAN ADR 490 COMPLIANCE PLATE, OR 81, 82, 83, 84. OR FRAME WITH ONE.
******CASH OR TREASURE******
AND NO NOT THE REED BARREL, UNLESS YOU THROW IN A WEEK END AT HAMILTON ISLAND.
in real money how much ;D hamilton island hey ,will you stay in a tent :P
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I'm buggered if I know. They need de-compressors 'cause they can't start them :D and hydraulic clutches 'cause they can't get "a nice feel" from the stocker ???
This is the bench-mark for every other motocross bike that was ever made.... :P
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I think some forearms like Arnie Schwarzenegger might be handy with a Maico clutch - there is no feel problem if you cant even pull the bastard in...
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rubbish!!!!!!! :-\ get mick the maico clutch master on the job , 2 finger clutch no probs ,
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guys its easy igot one on my 79 maico ,see the photo on wanted maico ,makes a big difference specially if you got hand problems like arthritus
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Hi Davo, do you know what kit is on yours? Magura only list them for YZ,CR,KX,RM or KTM.
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If your clutch is set up correctly you shouldn't need one. I've got arthritis and all of my Maicos have two finger operation, like Micks.
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i wish some one would post how to set one up correctly as i read the maico madness article ,had stacker do the clutch motor originally put new plates, in had the basket machined of ridges,measured the washers tried the willsmith spring and it was still heavy , the hydralic lever made it a lot better but its still harder than some others like drakes one , i was told there is a trick to altering the actuale rod thingo that pushes on the clutch itself in the case ,
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i wish some one would post how to set one up correctly as i read the maico madness article ,had stacker do the clutch motor originally put new plates, in had the basket machined of ridges,measured the washers tried the willsmith spring and it was still heavy , the hydralic lever made it a lot better but its still harder than some others like drakes one , i was told there is a trick to altering the actuale rod thingo that pushes on the clutch itself in the case ,
davo you have to learn the secret hand shake first
last time mick showed the secret to a good maico clutch to some one who shall remain nameless the said person then went on tell tell all that would listen the he in fact had worked it out them selves,(right mick) ;)
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last time mick showed the secret to a good maico clutch to some one who shall remain nameless
Not me 8) The great Per Klitland showed me and it's all about using a good teflon lined heavy gauge cable routed the simplest route which means swapping the front wheel around and making a new brake stay with the cable locater in the correct place, de-burring the clutch basket, making sure all of your plates are dead flat, and using different length actuater levers until you get the right feel. I can't remember which I used on my squarie at the moment but I'll have a look a bit later when I get home.
On top of what Per showed me, I use a Magnum forged basket in all of my early Maicos as the old fabricated basket flexes all over the place causing all sorts of problems, especially when they're old and fatigued. I recently moved over to Barnett Kevlar plates but can't report on their usefulness as the old squarie shit itself before I had a chance to try them.
The stacking of the Belville washers is critical as well, I have two different stacking orders which for some reason work in different engines. I don't understand why.
The funny thing with Maico clutches and gearboxes in general is that once you're up and moving you seldom need the clutch. The trans is buylletproof and can easily handle clutchless up and downshifts all day long. When I pulled the old squarie down the gears and dogs scrubbed up like new. For that reason alone I can't see much need for hydraulics.
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Has anyone tried a offset clutch lever from Ballards? I've seen one on a mates IT490 and it is much better than standard. I fitted a set of heavy duty Barnett plates and springs in my SC490, it was still heavy as expected but with a actuating lever extension it was much better. I'm not sure that you can extend the lever on a earlier 490 being a cast lever.
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A “perfect” Maico clutch will only come from making every part of the “clutch system” perfect. We need to accurately determine the condition of every component as we go. If we short cut any part of it, we will cheat ourselves of the best possible clutch.
Like everything we “rebuilt”, we must determine its mechanical condition as we tear it down, so we can “raise” an accurate parts list as we go. The following bike is as purchased and needs maintenance and clutch mods. It can be the “tear down model”.
1) TEST THE CABLE. I prefer to start with a new high quality Teflon lined cable. Don’t judge the one you already have by how shinny it looks, TEST IT. I have several varying lengths of aluminium angle in my toolbox to use for this test.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/FORUM029.jpg?t=1282957064)
I use this to "Block" cable movement at the engine end.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/FORUM028.jpg?t=1282957353)
Then apply pressure to the handlebar clutch lever. If it is rock solid, it is OK.
If your clutch lever can be squeezed in and out and feels like operating one of these excersise springs ??? Discard the cable.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/FORUM030.jpg?t=1282957967)
That will be because mishandling has stretched the “outer cable” and it is now behaving like a long compression spring.
Outer cables are usually stretched because some try to remove and fit them by yanking at them like this.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/FORUM032.jpg?t=1282958641)
or like this
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/FORUM031.jpg?t=1282958809)
I treat all my cables as though they have the fragility of a carbon pile high tension lead. I always unload the tension from the inner cable first, by doing this.
(http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv132/mc125mick/FORUM027-1.jpg?t=1282959021)
Somewhere lurking I have a special tool I made for doing this. But I am sure you get the idea anyhow. If Ji were here, he would have one knocked up in no time.
Obviously testing and treating your front brake cable like this is also the first step in creating a brake that will happily launch you over the bars. Some say Maico front brakes are shit as well, more BS.
I am leaving on a prior commitment now for a few days. Whoohoo. I will finish posting the tear down and rebuild of our dirty model when I return.
Have a good one. Cheers, Mick.
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I added a hydraulic clutch to my 1983 Maico 490.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gn5utBVqu6Q (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gn5utBVqu6Q)
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Has anyone tried a offset clutch lever from Ballards? I've seen one on a mates IT490 and it is much better than standard. I fitted a set of heavy duty Barnett plates and springs in my SC490, it was still heavy as expected but with a actuating lever extension it was much better. I'm not sure that you can extend the lever on a earlier 490 being a cast lever.
Brooksie,
I've had one, and they can make the clutch pull as light as a 125, although on the lightest setting there was abit of drag, as the "throw" on the arm is reduced, although this could have been caused by the cheap flexxy lever bracket. Get a quality unit and the problem may very well go away.