OzVMX Forum
Marque Remarks => Suzuki => Topic started by: TT on December 21, 2009, 06:50:51 pm
-
Apart from lights and gauges, can anyone tell me what differences there are between the '80 DR400S and the so-called "competition" model?
If any.............. ;D
Thanks in advance.
-
Ok i know a few things but theres probably other guys who can elaborate more.
rear swingarm
rear shocks
front forks - Very similar to 1980/81 PE's, if my memory is correct the are the same as the 1980/81 RS250.
If you look around on the net you should be able to find some photos of the white enduro model
there is some good pics on www.vintagefactory.com - look in past restos section
also try suzukicycles.org and bikepics.com
the competion version is known as the DR400 T and the non comp version is the DR400 ST
i also think theres some photos and discussions about the DR400 on the vinduro.com.au forum and enduro bike talk.com forum
-
(http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg71/marcFX_photo/DR14.jpg)
Alloy gas tank, different side covers, exhaust, frame tabs, no helmet lock, basically S is POS and T is cool.
-
I think the swingarm is identical apart from the missing footpegs. The lights are different with a weird headlamp arrangement with a 15w dip and main bulb.
Both the shocks and forks are longer, but the forks are still weedy 36mm items with 9.1" travel. The gearing is 4 teeth lower [but different country's S versions ran different final gearing] and of course there are no indicators or speedo or rev counter. The carb is identical but runs a 135 mainjet against the S version's 122.5, probably due to the different silencer [pic above is correct]. The top yoke has offset handlebar clamps unlike the S model and there is a 12lb weight difference. UK S models ran ally tanks so that's no different. The sidecovers are identical with slightly altered graphics
Think XT and TT.
There's a big DR topic on this forum
-
Added to above , swing arm is alloy - front wheel runs different hub ( smaller ) -rear hub from Dr 500 ( not released -1981 )- Pe tail light - some came with resevoir rear shocks ( KYB )
Internal motor parts are minor
-
sorry oldfart to differ, swingarm is alloy painted steel ;)
-
Alloy USA and Canada models .
-
yep that is right. The white enduro USA/CAN spec models ( and the few of the enduro models that were specially imported here by the likes of Geoff Udy) had alloy swingarms and the 'S' trail versions had painted steel ones. I Havent check the part number but i think the colour code might be champagne gold and painted the same colour as the 1980 TS swingarms.
There was white trail and Enduro models so dont confuse the 2. The trail model was available in several colours but i have only ever seen the enduro ones in white.
-
Thanks fellas. Lots of good info there.
I just picked up what looks to be a fairly original 1980 'S'.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1063360/DR400_3.jpg)
I've got no plan to race the thing, but thought I'd keep it stock and just trail ride it and the occassional vinduro loop maybe.
I didn't know the suspension was so different, but considering it's planned use, I don't think it will matter much.
Hey oldfart, when you say minor engine parts may be different, what sort of bits are we talking?
-
Alloy USA and Canada models .
I own one as a few also came to NZ, painted steel
-
There was white trail and Enduro models so dont confuse the 2. The trail model was available in several colours but i have only ever seen the enduro ones in white.
Check the photo above it is DR400T, 1980 issue only in white. Swingarm part number will be different as swingarm has different dimensions closer to RM250C, 400T swingarm is longer and still steel.
-
All the USA magazine reports that I have say the production swingarm was steel; though the prototypes were ally, and I think the later model DR500 possibly came with an ally arm at some point. But a lot of people seem to differ on this. Again one mag states the T came with 38mm forks, but it didn't.
The T rear wheel travel was 8.35" as against 7.64" and I forgot to mention that the T version had a decent chain guide, better than the S's flimsy steel loop.
My Suzuki manual has the two engines as identical [As is the SP] but I do have two types of cam, one has a sprocket location peg and one does quite happily without. The GN motor has a marginally lower 4th gear but is otherwise the same. The mags at the time said the T's shocks were poor to start with and once hot stayed even worse.
-
I think the T's swingarm is the same length as the S . It gets the small amount of additional travel from the shock angle being more acute due to longer shocks.
There's no way the T has a shorter swingarm as with the same frame you'd end up with less travel.
Front hub is 130 against S's 150 but the rear hub's the same.
The DR500 used a lot of DR400 parts
-
Tony, carb posted today . Bike looks real tidy for it's age ....good buy
cloogy on to it, cam timing peg - sproket and mag cover changed to 2 piece .
Yes forks are a much debated area , I have only seen 36mm & 35mm versions with long and short legs.
Bought a set of USA ebay a few years back and where tapered @ triples ??? that was when I procured alloy swing arm ... same bike as picture ( white )
Back to shed for another play :)
-
Check the photo above it is DR400T
Yes i know that that bik is an enduro T model. I was only not 100% sure if they were available in other colours. I was pretty sure they were only in white but because i wasnt 100% sure i said so.
Dont always believe magazine articles either. For example many say the PE frames are chromoly but they are not.
35mm seems an odd size for suzukis of that era. Everything 250cc and up was 36 or 38 in the offroad/trail range then.
-
Tony, carb posted today . Bike looks real tidy for it's age ....good buy
cloogy on to it, cam timing peg - sproket and mag cover changed to 2 piece .
Yes forks are a much debated area , I have only seen 36mm & 35mm versions with long and short legs.
Bought a set of USA ebay a few years back and where tapered @ triples ??? that was when I procured alloy swing arm ... same bike as picture ( white )
Back to shed for another play :)
Thanks oldfart. I'll buy you that Pepsi at CD7. ;)
So it seems that there might be quite a few carry over SP parts. Which is good for me. ;D
I've got a DR400 front end here and it looks identical to the SP. The forks are externally identical and 36mm.
-
Nice original looking bike you got there TT. We might see it at a Vinduro some time then?
Tex
-
I've never seen anything other than a two piece mag and sprocket cover either in print or the flesh. They are bit fragile just by the sprocket, so perhaps there might have been a production change to one piece. I've got 5 or 6 cams , only one is pegged and we didn't get the T in the UK. I'm wondering if it was maybe dropped due to it's inherent unbalance causing the cam journals to wear out quicker.
Suzuki's monoshock USA PE175 ran a different front fork and wheel to the UK model. The USA GN400 was a very different beast to the UK spec. It may well be there were variations in spec according to destination and time, though the DR had a very short production run. They and the SP370 did well at the Dakar.
Marc Joineau bagged 3rd in '83 on a 500; the only twinshock bike in the top ten and also the smallest engine.
http://www.dakardantan.com/paris-dakar-1983/joineau,suzuki+dr+500,41.html
Norbert D'Aboville got 12th in '81 on this bog standard DR400S, even down to the passenger footpegs!
http://www.dakardantan.com/paris-dakar-1981/d-aboville,suzuki+dr+400,19.html
The DR had a full width front hub. The SP's ran a half width, though I think they interchange. The frame is totally different and rear wheel is not intercompatible. In fact just about the only common parts are the engine block, ignition, and foot levers
-
Nice original looking bike you got there TT. We might see it at a Vinduro some time then?
Tex
Thanks Tex.
Yep, that's my New Year's Resolution, to make a far bigger effort to get to as many old dirt bike events as I can. ;D
-
That sounds good Tony me and my dad went to a couple vinduro's great fun will be going next year for sure I need to work on the PE's I would like to have them looking better thanks Michael. :)
-
Suzuki's monoshock USA PE175 ran a different front fork and wheel to the UK model
Would you like to expand on this? As far as i am aware all monoshock PE175's 82-83 have the same 38mm forks and wheel no matter what country. I have friends in UK with 82 175s and they have the same front hub and 38mm forks as the USA and Australian bikes. If you can provide some evidence that differs, please let me know as i would like to document it for the PE group. Thanks.
-
I'll have to do a lot of digging. But the UK magazine test pics I had had them with the earlier type hub and smaller spindle forks whereas the USA model was pictured with the straight pull hub with the bigger axle. Having sold my PE I've lost the links to all this, and don't know where all the stuff I researched is. It may be there was a model change. Or it may be that this was a press model. The pics I had are in a now defunct UK dirt mag
-
I have white DR400T with 36mm forks, full width hub, theres a few things on the DR500T not the same, but good source for 400T headlight, odometer, footpegs and plastics. Tank on DR400 T however is alloy not steel.
The hard part for DR400T are the sidecovers, they were fragile plastic and flew off from new. It seems much harder to get cosmetic parts for than same year RM/PE as no real industry around rebuilding them, Vintage Suzuki white PE guards do pretty well. Motor parts are not such a big deal as plenty of 400S to rob them off.
-
DR 500 came out as a 81 model first not an 80, so there was a DR500 X and a DR500 SX and no DR500 T or ST. The DR500 SX was basically the same as the USA SP500 X. There is an ebay seller called 2wheelsunlimited that i have seen they have had a air bit of NOS DR plastics liek headligth shells/numberplates and sidecovers.
Cloggy, if you can find that 175 info that would be great. Some of the early pre production bikes that magazines had as test bikes were not what the public eventually got though. I can not think of a reason why UK would have kept the 36mm forks and 130mm or 150mm full width hub and 12mm axle from the 81 model though.
-
that's my New Year's Resolution, to make a far bigger effort to get to as many old dirt bike events as I can
Now that's a decent resolution. Far better than giving up booze, or something dull like that!
Marc Joineau bagged 3rd in '83 on a 500;
He was pretty handy that Marc Joineau chap. He picked up 10th in 1980 on an SP370. In fact every time he rode a Suzuki four stroke he finished. If he rode anything else he failed!
Tex
-
He picked up 10th in 1980 on an SP370. In fact every time he rode a Suzuki four stroke he finished. If he rode anything else he failed!
See! I've been telling you blokes for years what good bike the SP370 was. :D :D
-
I'll look for the article over christmas
-
And T model front brake hub is same part number as RM
-
Hey Bazza did part 2 of the Klub Kevlar "Clothing for the Needy" package arrive?
-
http://www.dakardantan.com/forum/suzuki-dr-400-n19-norbert-d-aboville-vt942.html
Gives a few more pics of Norbert.
From Google translation it seems he bought a bog standard S model, slung away the original mirrors and rear light, and roped several plastic cans onto the tank. Armed with a couple of tubes, some tools and spares, he then ran inside the overall top ten until smashing several ribs in Mali. He struggled on to finish top marathon [unsupported] rider and 12th overall.
With the proceeds of his win and with selling his bike and gear at the flea market, he managed to complete the whole event almost in profit. Speaks volumes for both him and the bike.
If you scroll to the bottom of this link
http://www.dakardantan.com/forum/photos-paris-alger-dakar-1983-vt1006-30.html
There's 3 pictures of the third place 1983 DR500, a very different beast